Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line 
down of my Table Field "TF"


put "cheese" into column 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"   did not work,

put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"

put "cheese" into the first column preceded by two commas (default 
itemDelimiters).


put tab & tab &"cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"

"worked" insofar as it put "cheese" into column 3, but it also deleted 
other data in columns 1 and 2 . . .


That use of 'tab' seems clunky in the extreme . . .

And, things are "not much good" if on entering data it deletes other 
data elsewhere.


I found something very helpful for getting an Array into a Table Field

[ 
http://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/l/7810-how-do-i-display-an-array-in-a-table-field 
]


but that didn't really help me.

put "Biscuits" & "cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"   gave me 
"Biscuitscheese" in the first column


'obviously'

put "Biscuits" & tab & "cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"

did separate the biscuits from the cheese.

This is "a right pox" as, presumably, if one imports a comma delimited 
data file from outside Livecode one has to
go through a "pretty glorious" rigmarole getting all the stuff into the 
right slots.


---

Of course the easy answer to my post is to do a knee-jerk "datagrid" or 
a "wait for datagrid 2" response,
but not all of us really want the high learning and coding overhead that 
the datagrid involves, especially when

we might be dealing with a simple 10 x 10 table of data.

Richmond.
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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[hh via use-livecode]

> Richmond wrote:
> I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line 
> down of my Table Field "TF"


You could try:

set the itemdelimiter to tab
put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"



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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

Imagine the following scenario:

A text file containing lines of text a bit like this:

Mary Smith 12 Windsor Gardens Slough 45 housewife

now getting those lines into a Table Field is going to involve messing 
around with 'quote' amongst all the "dicing and slicing".


I think I'll be a "right plonker" and give that to my programming pupils 
tomorrow afternoon.


If you never hear from me again start looking for a gravestone in 
Bulgaria with a Table Field on it!


Richmond.

On 6/29/17 10:45 am, Richmond Mathewson wrote:
I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line 
down of my Table Field "TF"


put "cheese" into column 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"   did not work,

put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"

put "cheese" into the first column preceded by two commas (default 
itemDelimiters).


put tab & tab &"cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"

"worked" insofar as it put "cheese" into column 3, but it also deleted 
other data in columns 1 and 2 . . .


That use of 'tab' seems clunky in the extreme . . .

And, things are "not much good" if on entering data it deletes other 
data elsewhere.


I found something very helpful for getting an Array into a Table Field

[ 
http://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/l/7810-how-do-i-display-an-array-in-a-table-field 
]


but that didn't really help me.

put "Biscuits" & "cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"   gave me 
"Biscuitscheese" in the first column


'obviously'

put "Biscuits" & tab & "cheese" into line 3 of fld "TF"

did separate the biscuits from the cheese.

This is "a right pox" as, presumably, if one imports a comma delimited 
data file from outside Livecode one has to
go through a "pretty glorious" rigmarole getting all the stuff into 
the right slots.


---

Of course the easy answer to my post is to do a knee-jerk "datagrid" 
or a "wait for datagrid 2" response,
but not all of us really want the high learning and coding overhead 
that the datagrid involves, especially when

we might be dealing with a simple 10 x 10 table of data.

Richmond.


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

Clever stuff.

Thanks an awful lot for what seemed like a knotty problem.

Also good because this:

settheitemDelimitertotab

put"Biscuits" intoitem 3 ofline 7 offld "TF"

put"Cheese" intoitem 5 ofline 7 offld "TF"

did not delete the "biscuits".

Richmond.

On 6/29/17 10:54 am, hh via use-livecode wrote:

Richmond wrote:
I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line
down of my Table Field "TF"


You could try:

set the itemdelimiter to tab
put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"



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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Lagi Pittas via use-livecode]

I had the same problem when I started using Tables and after I found the
TAB delimiter "trick" as per Hermann, it was obvious (20/20 Hind sight).
The Aha! moment came when using commas messed it up by putting them all in
1 column with the commas intact. I just assumed everybody  knew  and I was
a slow learner- nice to know I was not alone

Regards Lagi

On 29 June 2017 at 09:01, Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Clever stuff.
>
> Thanks an awful lot for what seemed like a knotty problem.
>
> Also good because this:
>
> settheitemDelimitertotab
>
> put"Biscuits" intoitem 3 ofline 7 offld "TF"
>
> put"Cheese" intoitem 5 ofline 7 offld "TF"
>
> did not delete the "biscuits".
>
> Richmond.
>
> On 6/29/17 10:54 am, hh via use-livecode wrote:
>
>> Richmond wrote:
>>> I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line
>>> down of my Table Field "TF"
>>>
>>
>> You could try:
>>
>> set the itemdelimiter to tab
>> put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

One of the reasons you may not be alone is because the documentation
is not much good when it comes to table fields.

I have my suspicions that they have been overlooked; possibly in the mad 
rush towards datagrids.


Richmond.

On 6/29/17 11:13 am, Lagi Pittas via use-livecode wrote:

I had the same problem when I started using Tables and after I found the
TAB delimiter "trick" as per Hermann, it was obvious (20/20 Hind sight).
The Aha! moment came when using commas messed it up by putting them all in
1 column with the commas intact. I just assumed everybody  knew  and I was
a slow learner- nice to know I was not alone

Regards Lagi

On 29 June 2017 at 09:01, Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:


Clever stuff.

Thanks an awful lot for what seemed like a knotty problem.

Also good because this:

settheitemDelimitertotab

put"Biscuits" intoitem 3 ofline 7 offld "TF"

put"Cheese" intoitem 5 ofline 7 offld "TF"

did not delete the "biscuits".

Richmond.

On 6/29/17 10:54 am, hh via use-livecode wrote:


Richmond wrote:

I want to put "cheese" into the third column across of the third line
down of my Table Field "TF"


You could try:

set the itemdelimiter to tab
put "cheese" into item 3 of line 3 of fld "TF"



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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[hh via use-livecode]

Hi all,

closely connected to that, not this much advanced as Bernd's jewel 
modTableField, another 'jewel'-stack by Scott:

http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?p=129767&sid=fbca74cc652e7760ce1f837e482dc57a#p129767

H.
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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

The data grid was created *precicely* because of this very thing. I for one was 
constantly begging for a table object of some sort, imagining that it would 
work like an Excel Spreadsheet, but as many pointed out, there would be 
problems when the data put into a table object was too much for Livecode to 
want to deal with. 

I do not see creating a datagrid as a "knee-jerk" reaction any more than using 
a menu button is when trying to create a popup menu. If you need an object that 
can display a table of data, that can be addressed pretty simply, the DataGrid 
is what you want. 

So here is a bit of code:

set the dgData of group "dgDataGrid" to aArrayData
put the dgDataOfLine [3] into aDataRecord
put aDataRecord ["food type"] && aDataRecord ["topping1"] into tLunchEntree

It's not that difficult. Now if you want to find the record containing 
"biscuit":

dispatch findIndex to group "dgDataGrid" with ""food type", "Biscuit"
put the result into tFoundIndex
put the dgDataOfIndex [tFoundIndex] into aDataRecord

Piece of cake! Here is the DataGrid API link: 
http://lessons.livecode.com/m/datagrid/l/7344-data-grid-api

Bob S


> On Jun 29, 2017, at 24:45 , Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Of course the easy answer to my post is to do a knee-jerk "datagrid" or a 
> "wait for datagrid 2" response,
> but not all of us really want the high learning and coding overhead that the 
> datagrid involves, especially when
> we might be dealing with a simple 10 x 10 table of data.
> 
> Richmond.


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

First of all, tell me the bits of information are delimited by tabs or commas, 
otherwise I am going to go back and ask the source of that information to 
please provide it to me in a form I can use. If the only delimiter is spaces, 
and one of the bits of information has several words, then that is not a format 
anyone can write a program to deal with unless they already know that there are 
only 2 single word fields prior to the address, and only 3 single word fields 
after. If however there is a such thing as cities with more than one word, or 
someone decides to include a middle name, or someone's last name has more than 
one word, you are screwed. 

So this is not a good "example" to demonstrate anything except that there is a 
reason why delimited text is delimited in the first place. In fact, the whole 
reason you are trying to get this into a table field/object is so that the data 
can be managed in an orderly fashion. 

I understand that you don't want to dig through all the tools in your toolbox 
to get to the hammer, when that pipe wrench is sitting right on the top, but 
honestly, you are trying to hammer in a nail. Use the hammer! :-)

Bob S


> On Jun 29, 2017, at 24:56 , Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Imagine the following scenario:
> 
> A text file containing lines of text a bit like this:
> 
> Mary Smith 12 Windsor Gardens Slough 45 housewife


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Richmond Mathewson wrote:

> On 6/29/17 11:13 am, Lagi Pittas wrote:
>> I had the same problem when I started using Tables and after I
>> found the TAB delimiter "trick" as per Hermann, it was obvious
>> (20/20 Hind sight).
>> The Aha! moment came when using commas messed it up by putting them
>> all in 1 column with the commas intact. I just assumed everybody
>>  knew  and I was a slow learner- nice to know I was not alone
>
> One of the reasons you may not be alone is because the documentation
> is not much good when it comes to table fields.
>
> I have my suspicions that they have been overlooked; possibly in the
> mad rush towards datagrids.

Table fields were introduced at least by the mid-90s, possibly as early 
as '92 when the MetaCard/LiveCode engine was born.  The DataGrid is much 
newer.  There was no "rush towards datagrids".


What Lagi experienced is how people learn.

The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in 
conscious memory at any given time.  The User Guide is 627 pages long.


Whether we're learning basketball, piano, or programming, there is no 
book one can read and then expect to be immediately good at the craft.


People learn by practice.  Practice is the art of learning from mistakes.

The value judgment that mistakes are somehow "wrong" or someone else's 
fault or anyone's fault at all is probably the biggest impediment to 
learning I've ever known.


Imperfect performance, in any human endeavor, is simply how we learn to 
move ever closer toward perfection, a journey that moves forward as 
quickly as the number of hours we devote to practice.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[hh via use-livecode]

> RG wrote:
> The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
> conscious memory at any given time.

How did you measure that?

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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

Personally I always take a ruler to bed to:

1. measure how long I sleep.

2. To find out what a night of passion with a crowned head is like.

Richmond.

On 6/29/17 8:49 pm, hh via use-livecode wrote:

RG wrote:
The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
conscious memory at any given time.

How did you measure that?

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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

He doesn't remember. He has 8 other things on his mind. 

Bob S


> On Jun 29, 2017, at 10:49 , hh via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
>> RG wrote:
>> The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
>> conscious memory at any given time.
> 
> How did you measure that?


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

hh wrote:
>> RG wrote:
>> The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
>> conscious memory at any given time.
>
> How did you measure that?

Good question.  It's been so long since I took that cog psy class back 
in college that I'd have to dig up my old text books to describe the 
details of the study that led to that widely-cited rubric.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Tore Nilsen via use-livecode]

> 29. jun. 2017 kl. 21:29 skrev Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
> :
> 
> hh wrote:
> >> RG wrote:
> >> The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
> >> conscious memory at any given time.
> >
> > How did you measure that?
> 
> Good question.  It's been so long since I took that cog psy class back in 
> college that I'd have to dig up my old text books to describe the details of 
> the study that led to that widely-cited rubric.


You will find some information on short term memory here: 
https://www.simplypsychology.org/short-term-memory.html 

See also the references in this article. There seems to be universal agreement 
about the validity of the theory, at least among educators. 

Regards
Tore Nilsen


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

Um:

http://www.bbc.com/news/health-39518580

"So the prevailing idea was that memories are formed in the hippocampus 
and then moved to the cortex where they are "banked".


The team at the Riken-MIT Center for Neural Circuit Genetics have done 
something mind-bogglingly advanced to show this is not the case."


Richmond.


On 6/29/17 10:42 pm, Tore Nilsen via use-livecode wrote:



29. jun. 2017 kl. 21:29 skrev Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
:

hh wrote:

RG wrote:
The human mind can generally hold between three and seven things in
conscious memory at any given time.

How did you measure that?

Good question.  It's been so long since I took that cog psy class back in 
college that I'd have to dig up my old text books to describe the details of 
the study that led to that widely-cited rubric.


You will find some information on short term memory here: 
https://www.simplypsychology.org/short-term-memory.html 

See also the references in this article. There seems to be universal agreement 
about the validity of the theory, at least among educators.

Regards
Tore Nilsen


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Re: Table Fields "and all"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Which is to say, "I think. Therefore... I have no idea what the hell that 
means." ;-)

Bob S


> On Jun 29, 2017, at 12:51 , Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Um:
> 
> http://www.bbc.com/news/health-39518580
> 
> "So the prevailing idea was that memories are formed in the hippocampus and 
> then moved to the cortex where they are "banked".
> 
> The team at the Riken-MIT Center for Neural Circuit Genetics have done 
> something mind-bogglingly advanced to show this is not the case."
> 
> Richmond.


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