Help for total newbie making a dissertation application

[Ben Bock]

Hello, complete newbie here.  I purchased Revolution Studio for creating an 
application to use in my doctoral dissertation.  This is a research project, 
not a commercial project.  I have a limited time to make things work.  Trying 
to figure things out on my own, and making slow progress.  I have no 
programming experience.

Here are the simplified objectives for a standalone application to be 
individually administered to research participants.

1. I have a series of .mpg files ~ 60 sec in duration that I want my 
participants to view, with no input from them needed.
2.  The participants will complete a series of different questionnaires that I 
will need to present in Revolution, and input their "yes-no" answers on the 
screen using a mouse.
3.  I want their answers to be stored for each individual so that I can place 
the answers in a statistical spreadsheet.  If I can get the answers to Excel, 
that will be all I need to get them where I need them, but the destination is a 
Windows stats package, SPSS.  I know what a database is, but have never worked 
with one.

I think my needs are simple, but there is a foundation needed that I simply 
don't yet have.  I am looking for similar applications that I might borrow from 
to make this project work, but I will cheerfully accept any suggestions or 
advice, to help me distinguish my ass from a teakettle in this new landscape.  
I am still working thru the video tutorials that came with my Studio disk.

My email is [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Thank you for any help in this,

Ben
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

RE: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[John Tregea]

Hi Greg,


> I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's 
> world of application creation.

You and many millions or others I suspect

> What kind of application do you want to make?

Having something worthwhile to achieve is a driving force in all the good
applications I have ever written. If I couldn't feel the worth, I couldn't
"code" as you call it. 

> What kind of appication like you want to make is already out there by 
> the dozens?

I don't think there are dozens of GOOD applications Greg, but there are
thousands of average ones. The good ones gather a following of passionate
people and can live on for years past the originator steps away from his or
her creation (e.g. Revolution, metacard, supercard, hypercard) {and the
heritage from people like Bill Atkinson at Apple that was the lead on the
original HyperCard project at Apple and his work was in response to
visionaries from the forties and fifties that conceived of hypertext linking
etc.})

> Why make a duplicate of an application that exists and already does most 
> of what you want?

So many people use so little of the features in even one application, if you
can select out the USEFUL bits and give a craftsman the tools to do a job in
their field without wasting time (and money on useless [to them] features)
that can be good for both you and the craftsperson.

> Why spend months/years learning to develop something that you could buy 
> for relatively little money from someone else?

Why have a portrait painted when you can have a polaroid taken? For the love
of the medium, the subject, the time it takes, the care involved, the way it
reflects the light from the open fireplace (for those of us in cold
garages):) 

> Is your idea really that much better than one that has already been put 
> into code?

It is the strength of execution of your idea in the medium that creates the
value surely. Our Managing Director is a creative writer and she expects the
medium to have its own strengths and weaknesses. Your (or my) ability to
know and work with the strengths and weaknesses of this medium (or any
other) is what makes our work a genuine communication of the essence of the
actual idea that started us on the journey (or not). 


> Why "code" at all?

Coding isn't a "better" way of communicating knowledge; it is a "different"
way. It is different from television or cinema or radio or theatre or novels
or directories or reference books. It is more suited to some activities and
less to others.

BUT

You don't ask a cinematographer to make a movie, you ask them to use the
tools which are their craft to be a part of a team, to follow (hopefully)
good direction, to help visualise their dimension of what is ALWAYS a
multi-dimensional communication task.

> Has the wheel really been invented over and over again?

There are "Genre's" of software just as there are genre's of movies or
novels etc. A good piece of work within a genre can raise the "minimum
expectations" of the users of a particular genre and therefore raise the bar
for everyone else coding in that area.


> Why is it so hard to make an application without re-inventing something 
> that has already been made thousands of times?

If you know how and why things have been done before you won't re-invent,
you will make use of... I think there is a quote about "Standing on the
shoulders of giants" to see a new horizon. Well this industry is not full of
giants, but we have had them, the same as each other new "technology".
People that saw further and moved the horizon back for everyone else. 

> With all of this talk about object oriented, reusable code, why does it 
> still take so long to produce anything really useful or unique?

How long did it take you to master whatever medium you use for your art now?


Oh, my... I better stop.


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Thomas McGrath III]

Yeah but I hate working in the Garage. It's too damn cold. Maybe if I  
lived in a warmer climate I wouldn't mind.
It is a shame to realize I won't be changing the world because my  
garage is too cold, Damn.


Tom

P.S. It does have WiFi though. (So when I am working on a metal  
sculpture in the warmer months I can use my laptop to see my sketches  
down there)


On Nov 20, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

Two guys in a garage founded Hewlett Packard, revolutionizing the  
tech industry.


Two guys in an apartment used HP parts to found Apple Computer,  
revolutionizing the computer industry.


Two guys in a house a few hundred miles north used Apple computers  
to make Myst, revolutionizing the game industry.


The next revolution is waiting to be discovered, perhaps by two  
readers of this list in a garage somewhere.


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Thomas McGrath III]

Greg,

I am an artist. I am a creative person and I feel comfortable around  
computers. This does not make me a 'programmer'. I started out with  
scripting languages because the tools I was using would not do what I  
wanted to do and so I started learning how to make my own. I actually  
hate coding. I hate having to get syntax right. I hate having to  
remember the 'rules' of syntax. But I love solving problems and I  
love the rewards in building something myself. I love using the code  
and designing a usable interface "That acts like it is supposed to  
act". I hate when engineers with no common sense throw something into  
a software in an illogical way. I like logical attractive and usable  
interfaces with code that does what is should.


Scripting languages look more like english and as such are so much  
easier to read through.


I don't do programming, I do interface design that happens to include  
some code. I hire programmers to write C, C#, C++ code when I am done  
quickly creating a usable interface. This I like to call Rapid  
Prototyping and Rev is great for that. I can get a functional visual  
idea out to the people that then optimize it for public release.


Does this sound like you?
If so Rev is for you. Start out slow and read through every available  
script you can find to see how things are done by others. I am a  
visual person and learn better by doing rather than by studying. So  
download some stacks and start tearing them apart. Try and break  
them. Try and make them do something different than what they do now.  
I find this to be the best way to learn.


Good luck

Tom McGrath
Lazy River Software®

On Nov 20, 2005, at 5:56 PM, Martin Baxter wrote:



Why can't most artists learn to code?  Why don't most artists even  
want to try to learn to code?
I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do  
something", but I loathe programming, what can I do, anyway?  Can  
Revolution help me?




___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: revCommon library not part of app

[Roger . E . Eller]

> Hi All,
> 
> I have a weird problem at the moment. I have an app that works
> perfectly in the IDE, but fails when built. After many tests, I found
> that the scripts just stopped running when they encountered either
> revChangeWindowSize or revMacFromUnixPath. Both these commands are
> part of the revCommon library, but it seems that the library is not
> being compiled into my app.
> 
> Does anyone know how I can check the existance of this library in my
> app? The docs mention a hidden group, so I guess I could add a test
> button that listed all the groups.
> 
> Does anyone know what I could be doing that is stopping the library
> coming in, or have any suggestions about what to try next? The
> standalone settings don't allow you to select the common library
> specifically, so I guess it is supposed to be in every app.
> 
> BTW, this app has been under construction for some time now and this
> has never been a problem until now, although these commands have been
> used all along. I have tried a fresh insallation of Rev just in case I
> had messed up the library somehow, but that had no effect.
> 
> TIA,
> Sarah

Hi Sarah,

I recently had a similar problem in 2.6.1 where setting the 
systemFileSelector to false "used to" include a unix-style file selector 
dialog in the build. I ended up having to build my standalone with 2.5.1 
in order for this to work. I think these are bugs in 2.6.1 where critical 
"used" libraries/stacks are somehow being ommitted during the build 
process. I liked the older versions where you could select each component 
that you wanted to include into the build.

Best regards,
Roger Eller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: lock screen doesn't!

[Tracey Griffith]

On 11/20/05 1:20 PM, "Ken Ray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On 11/20/05 8:26 AM, "Raymond E. Griffith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
>> I wonder if adding the following might achieve what you are looking for:
>> 
>>  on mouseUp
>>open invisible stack "OtherStack" to false
> 
> Actually you don't need the "to false" part of this (I'm sure it was a
> copy/paste error)... but Raymond's right that this would be a good way to
> get the data you need... here's how it works:

Yup. Something like that. You know how programming is. You go in one
direction, then you realize you know something else, so you start to change
what you had done and bam! You wind up going in two directions at once.

I *was* setting the visible of the stack to false before opening it. Then I
realized I could open invisible.

That's what I like about Rev. Lots and lots of ways to do things, and many
of them as right as anything else.

> 
> If you execute 'open invisible stack "OtherStack"', Rev will open the stack
> and make it the stack that has the focus, so you can then use phrases like
> "this stack" to refer to it.
> 
> So I think if you change your "go" to "go invisible" (or "go inv") you can
> accomplish what you're looking for, and take out the lock screens, so it
> looks like this:
> 
> on mouseUp
>      push cd
>      go inv stack "OtherStack"
> -- do what you want to do with "OtherStack"
>      pop cd
> end mouseUp
> 
> 
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 

Regards,

Raymond E. Griffith


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

revCommon library not part of app

[Sarah Reichelt]

Hi All,

I have a weird problem at the moment. I have an app that works
perfectly in the IDE, but fails when built. After many tests, I found
that the scripts just stopped running when they encountered either
revChangeWindowSize or revMacFromUnixPath. Both these commands are
part of the revCommon library, but it seems that the library is not
being compiled into my app.

Does anyone know how I can check the existance of this library in my
app? The docs mention a hidden group, so I guess I could add a test
button that listed all the groups.

Does anyone know what I could be doing that is stopping the library
coming in, or have any suggestions about what to try next? The
standalone settings don't allow you to select the common library
specifically, so I guess it is supposed to be in every app.

BTW, this app has been under construction for some time now and this
has never been a problem until now, although these commands have been
used all along. I have tried a fresh insallation of Rev just in case I
had messed up the library somehow, but that had no effect.

TIA,
Sarah
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Richard Gaskin]

Happy musings for a Sunday; seems like a good time, I'll bite:

Greg Smith wrote:
What kind of appication like you want to make is already out there by 
the dozens?
Why make a duplicate of an application that exists and already does most 
of what you want?


versiontracker.com and download.com will tell you how saturated the 
market is for the type of app you want to make.  That a market may seem 
saturated may not necessarily be the case if you can bring something 
compellingly unique to the table.



Why spend months/years learning to develop something that you could buy 
for relatively little money from someone else?


If it's truly something you can but off the shelf, don't do it unless 
you do for the sake of doing it.  If it's just for the sake of having it 
you can usually have it for less off the shelf.


I make a lot of my own stuff because I have special needs.  For example, 
there are several hundred text editors out there, but I've tried them 
all and none of them do everything I want so I'm making my own.  Part of 
the benefit of making my own is that it give me lots of parts I can 
reuse in other apps for clients, so it has an exponential long-term 
benefit as well as the satisfaction of a tool that thinks exactly like I do.



Why "code" at all?


Some of us can't NOT code.  It's like writing, or painting, or anything 
else:  the ones who can't stop themselves from doing it tend to do well, 
if for no other reason than they're not doing anything else. :)



Has the wheel really been invented over and over again?


That's what the they thought until they made a turbine out of it and 
called it a jet engine.  There's always room for innovation.  It's 
bounds are as limitless as the human imagination.


Two guys in a garage founded Hewlett Packard, revolutionizing the tech 
industry.


Two guys in an apartment used HP parts to found Apple Computer, 
revolutionizing the computer industry.


Two guys in a house a few hundred miles north used Apple computers to 
make Myst, revolutionizing the game industry.


The next revolution is waiting to be discovered, perhaps by two readers 
of this list in a garage somewhere.



Why is it so hard to make an application without re-inventing something 
that has already been made thousands of times?


...or a painting that hasn't already been painted, or a story that 
hasn't already been told


With all of this talk about object oriented, reusable code, why does it 
still take so long to produce anything really useful or unique?


Two reasons:

1. C++ isn't portable, no matter how many academic papers were written 
about that in the '80s.


2. Code isn't where creativity comes from; it's the other way around.



Why does everyone keep inventing new database software?


If you think about it, any collection of things with common properties 
is a database.  There are a lot of things in this world, and only so 
many ways to describe and manage them.


I've been working on my own simple database engine because I needed 
something that works everywhere Rev works, had zero licensing fees, and 
was simple to plug in and use. It doesn't do well with large data sets, 
but then again most of the things I need to manage never come close 
50,000 items; most are just a few thousand, or a few hundred, or a dozen.


So having a single way to define, store, and retrieve data has been a 
worthwhile investment for me, since just about every app needs to store 
and retrieve data.


You start off with generalized read/write routines, then add handlers 
for defining and managing different types of data (file references, 
image data, dates, etc.), and before you know if you've written a modest 
DBMS. :)


And storage is only part of a complete breakfast, the other half being 
binding it to controls for display.  Apple's Core Data handles that well 
-- on OS X only.  Rolling my own storage mechanism with a binding sysem 
lets me get through the day as easily as an XCode programmer, but for 
every platform Rev supports.


So that's why I did it.  Maybe folks who make DB engines are all just 
crazy and have too much time on our hands. :)




Why don't game creators usually finish what they start?


Myst I through V are done, as is Alida (which was ported to Rev for OS X 
and Windows).  I don't really play a lot of other games, but I see a lot 
shipping so someone's finishing them.



Why don't more people use Revolution to develop modern style games?


Most modern games use specialized engines that take years to develop and 
cost several million dollars.


But there are many types of games, and just as Myst showed us something 
technologically simple that turned the industry upside down, there are 
several dozen categories of games that have yet to be invented



Why can't most artists learn to code?  Why don't most artists even want 
to try to learn to code?


I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do something", 
but I loathe programming, what can I do, an

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Jim Ault]

I suppose one way to answer you is to ask a few questions in return
I am a programmer-type of guy so I have these questions for you.

> I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's
> world of IMAGE creation.
> 
> What kind of GRAPHIC do you want to make?
> 
> What kind of graphic like you want to make is already out there by
> the dozens?
> 
> Why make a duplicate of an graphic that exists and already does most
> of what you want?
> 
> Why spend months/years learning to develop something that you could buy
> for relatively little money from image supplier?
> 
> Is your image really that much better than one that has already been put
> into graphic excellence?
> 
> Why modify/create graphics at all?
> 
> Has the image really been invented over and over again?
> 
> Why is it so hard to make an image without re-inventing something
> that has already been made thousands of times?
> 
> Why does everyone keep inventing new graphic manipulation software?
> 
> Why can't most people learn to make good graphics?  Why don't most programmers
even want to try to learn to Photohsop, tiff, gif, color spaces, filters, bezier
curves,  layers, cymk, vector graphics, Pantone, transparency, masking, fonts,
timelines, audio sync, sound formats, players? and spend months/years learning?
> 
> How come I can't think like a someone who makes things look really good?
> 
> Well, there it is.
> 
Jim Ault
Las Vegas


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Martin Baxter]

Greg Smith wrote:
I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's 
world of application creation.




It would be strange if you did not feel lost in it ;-) It's a very large 
place.

But if you don't want to stir up a debate - why post :-) ?


Why does everyone keep inventing new database software?



Either to persecute us, or possibly because they would like to be as 
rich as Larry Ellison.



Why don't more people use Revolution to develop modern style games?



Perhaps there are better tools for that.

Why can't most artists learn to code?  Why don't most artists even want 
to try to learn to code?


I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do something", 
but I loathe programming, what can I do, anyway?  Can Revolution help me?




Maybe but not overnight, not without effort, and not if you expect the 
medium to behave as something other than itself.



How come I can't think like a machine?


Well, there it is.

Greg Smith


Because machines don't think. ;-)

Maybe you would be interested in Michael Atavar's e-says 
. They are mainly simple web-based text pieces, 
some more successful than others. They are interesting and stimulating 
to me because they use the medium of the web-page for what it is, 
creatively exploiting its intrinsic virtue, without trying to make it be 
like television or something it is not, which is what almost everybody 
else seems to want to do. One piece of his, "DUOLC" was commissioned by 
a .org that I was part of. 
Michael's work seems simple, but I think Michael takes on technology and 
wins by refusing to be overawed by it, using the parts of it that he can 
relate to, and insisting that it serve his creative message.


Martin Baxter
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: Either You Think Graphically or You Don't

[Greg Smith]

Pierre:

Very inspiring.  I'll have to look into it.

Thank you,

Greg Smith

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Sarah Reichelt]

On 11/21/05, Greg Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's
> world of application creation.
>
> What kind of application do you want to make?
>
> What kind of appication like you want to make is already out there by
> the dozens?
>
-- snip --
>
> I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do something",
> but I loathe programming, what can I do, anyway?  Can Revolution help me?
>
> How come I can't think like a machine?
>
>

Hi Greg,

You raise some interesting points, but I believe there are answers to
most of them. I don't know about the other people on this list, but
most of my programming time goes into developing customised business
software. There are lots of general packages around, but they can
almost never be tailored to a specific business model without making a
lot of compromises. I can write a program specifically for a company's
needs. The users don't have to learn to work their way around the
unwanted features of a major package and they don't have to jump
through hoops to make the software do what they actually need to do
every day.

Apart from that, the main focus of my programming is utilities that
may only be used once, but make my job or someone else's job, easier.

Why does it take so long to produce anything? That depends on your
experience as well as your needs - I can make a single use utility in
a few minutes, but I wouldn't want anyone else to have to use it as it
will contain no error trapping, no documentation and the interface
will be a complete mess. Making a complete application takes a lot
longer. There will be sections of the code that I can grab from
previous projects or from examples on this list, but a lot will have
to be written from scratch. Since there is virtually no limit to the
different tasks a program can be asked to do, it is not possible to
have all the sections pre-assembled like Lego bricks, especially if
trying to produce something "unique". Testing, documenting and
allowing for user error in all it's possible forms will take a long
time and must be done well if you are hoping to produce a quality
product.

Part of the reason people keep inventing new database software is that
the existing software doesn't meet their exact needs. I would qualify
this as "new database interface software" rather than new database
software as there are a few really good database engines available now
which can be used in multiple ways if people write interfaces for
them.

As regards games, I would dearly love to write games, but although I
enjoy playing games, I don't have the imagination to design a game
that would repay my efforts, so I stick to business & utility software
where I know I have the skills to make a living.

Finally, most of us are here because we love it. Programming is the
ultimate puzzle and solving different parts of it every day gives
great pleasure. If you are not one of those people who enjoys this
sort of thing, then I recommend that you find yourself a partner.
Programmers are often not very artistic as can be seen from some of
the interfaces that have been designed. Why don't you stick to the
design side of things and find a programmer to make it "do something"?

And finally, the reason you can't think like a machine is because you
aren't one :-) You are something much better - a creative, reasoning
human being.

HTH,
Sarah
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Garrett Hylltun]

On Nov 20, 2005, at 11:33 AM, Greg Smith wrote:

I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's  
world of application creation.


It's called human nature.  Just because one person climbed the  
mountain, doesn't mean you can't climb the same mountain.  It's a  
challenge for our own nature to try and improve upon what already exist.


Why do we see new cars every year, because someone came up with a new  
design and better features.


Hey, where there's a will, there's a way :-)

Personally, it's more a challenge for my mind, food for my brain.   
It's a hobby for me and not a business.  Most people like to sit in a  
recliner and watch a movie for relaxation, or read a book, but I pump  
out graphics and source codes for relaxation.


If you see no purpose, then you should find something else that gives  
you purpose.  Maybe at one time you felt you had purpose in  
programming, but if it's since left you, then don't try to force  
yourself to stick with it, it'll only give you a distaste for  
programming.


-Garrett
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: [slightly OT] using sudo -S via shell

[Ken Ray]

On 11/20/05 12:50 PM, "Mark Wieder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Ken-
> 
> Saturday, November 19, 2005, 11:01:52 AM, you wrote:
> 
>> Here's how... in this case I'm using sudo to kill a process (the id of which
>> is in tPID):
> 
>> put "#!/bin/sh" & cr into tScript
>> put "pw="&tPassword & cr into tScript
>> put "echo $pw | sudo -S kill -9" && tPID & cr after tScript
>> get shell(tScript)
> 
> And, obviously, that second line should say "after" tScript...

Actually it's funny you mention that... it has worked for me with that error
in place, so perhaps the default shell I've been using works just as well as
sh anyway, you're right though - it should be "after".

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Eric Chatonet]

Hi Greg,

Don't confuse ideas and means :-)
Have an Idea without thinking of the means needed to realise it.
The Idea id the only thing that counts.
Check it against the market. If it does exist, that a bad idea.
When you will have got the idea that does not exist yet and that  
makes you insomniac then search the best tool to make it a reality.

Could be Rev...

Best Regards from Paris,

Eric Chatonet.

Le 20 nov. 05 à 20:33, Greg Smith a écrit :

I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's  
world of application creation.


What kind of application do you want to make?

What kind of appication like you want to make is already out there  
by the dozens?


Why make a duplicate of an application that exists and already does  
most of what you want?


Why spend months/years learning to develop something that you could  
buy for relatively little money from someone else?


Is your idea really that much better than one that has already been  
put into code?


Why "code" at all?

Has the wheel really been invented over and over again?

Why is it so hard to make an application without re-inventing  
something that has already been made thousands of times?


With all of this talk about object oriented, reusable code, why  
does it still take so long to produce anything really useful or  
unique?


Why does everyone keep inventing new database software?

Why don't game creators usually finish what they start?

Why don't more people use Revolution to develop modern style games?

Why can't most artists learn to code?  Why don't most artists even  
want to try to learn to code?


I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do  
something", but I loathe programming, what can I do, anyway?  Can  
Revolution help me?


How come I can't think like a machine?


Well, there it is.

Greg Smith



So Smart Software

For institutions, companies and associations
Built-to-order applications: management, multimedia, internet, etc.
Windows, Mac OS and Linux... With the French touch

Free plugins and tutorials on my website

Web sitehttp://www.sosmartsoftware.com/
Email[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
Phone33 (0)1 43 31 77 62
Mobile33 (0)6 20 74 50 86


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

You Either Think Graphically or You Don't

[Greg Smith]

I really don't want to stir up a debate, but I feel lost in today's 
world of application creation.


What kind of application do you want to make?

What kind of appication like you want to make is already out there by 
the dozens?


Why make a duplicate of an application that exists and already does most 
of what you want?


Why spend months/years learning to develop something that you could buy 
for relatively little money from someone else?


Is your idea really that much better than one that has already been put 
into code?


Why "code" at all?

Has the wheel really been invented over and over again?

Why is it so hard to make an application without re-inventing something 
that has already been made thousands of times?


With all of this talk about object oriented, reusable code, why does it 
still take so long to produce anything really useful or unique?


Why does everyone keep inventing new database software?

Why don't game creators usually finish what they start?

Why don't more people use Revolution to develop modern style games?

Why can't most artists learn to code?  Why don't most artists even want 
to try to learn to code?


I'm an artist and an animator who wants to make his art "do something", 
but I loathe programming, what can I do, anyway?  Can Revolution help me?


How come I can't think like a machine?


Well, there it is.

Greg Smith

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: [slightly OT] using sudo -S via shell

[Mark Wieder]

Ken-

Saturday, November 19, 2005, 11:01:52 AM, you wrote:

> Here's how... in this case I'm using sudo to kill a process (the id of which
> is in tPID):

> put "#!/bin/sh" & cr into tScript
> put "pw="&tPassword & cr into tScript
> put "echo $pw | sudo -S kill -9" && tPID & cr after tScript
> get shell(tScript)

And, obviously, that second line should say "after" tScript...

-- 
-Mark Wieder
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: lock screen doesn't!

[Ken Ray]

On 11/20/05 8:26 AM, "Raymond E. Griffith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I wonder if adding the following might achieve what you are looking for:
> 
>  on mouseUp
>open invisible stack "OtherStack" to false

Actually you don't need the "to false" part of this (I'm sure it was a
copy/paste error)... but Raymond's right that this would be a good way to
get the data you need... here's how it works:

If you execute 'open invisible stack "OtherStack"', Rev will open the stack
and make it the stack that has the focus, so you can then use phrases like
"this stack" to refer to it.

So I think if you change your "go" to "go invisible" (or "go inv") you can
accomplish what you're looking for, and take out the lock screens, so it
looks like this:

on mouseUp
     push cd
     go inv stack "OtherStack"
-- do what you want to do with "OtherStack"
     pop cd
end mouseUp


Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: ANN: TreeView in Revolution!!

[Alex Tweedly]

Bob Hutchison wrote:



Hi,

I'm new to Revolution (like today new) and I have to admit that I was  
a bit surprised that there is no tree view in Revolution. Lack of a  
tree isn't going to kill me, but it would be nice. I'm also a little  
surprised that nobody has commented on this post... what am I missing?


At any rate, the URL below doesn't seem to work for me. Is there an  
alternative URL?


I have a vague feeling there was a follow-up with another URL - but 
can't track it down.


There are a couple of other treeview controls  I haven't used any of 
them, so can't recommend any one over the others.



/ Does anyone know where I can get a stack or external that implements a
/>/ treeview control? I've seen references on the various runrev  
/>/ resources sites

/>/ but cannot seem to pinpoint an example.
/>/
/
Scroll to the bottom of the page to find Marielle Lange's Tree View

OR


where you can find the Altuit XML TreeView List Control.
 



--
Alex Tweedly   http://www.tweedly.net

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.4/175 - Release Date: 18/11/2005
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

ANN: TreeView in Revolution!!

[Bob Hutchison]

Hi,

I'm new to Revolution (like today new) and I have to admit that I was  
a bit surprised that there is no tree view in Revolution. Lack of a  
tree isn't going to kill me, but it would be nice. I'm also a little  
surprised that nobody has commented on this post... what am I missing?


At any rate, the URL below doesn't seem to work for me. Is there an  
alternative URL?


Thanks,
Bob



I just got an email from Luis L. Rodíguez Oro,
who asked me to offer his stack to the list. I
guess he feels  his English isn't good enough.

I don't know about that - looks fine to me - but
anyway his stack "TreeView in Revolution" was
nicely done, and my normally crusty self felt I
owed it to the list to get it out there.

It's a remarkable, well-written and visually
pretty Tree View in Revolution, with routines to
import tab delimited text files.
Well-commented code, but of course in Spanish. Reads pretty easy  
anyway.


For now I'll place it on my server at this URL. You'll need to  
unstuff it.


http://upload.barncard.com/TreeView2.5.zip


>From: Luis L. Rodíguez Oro 
>Subject: TreeView in Revolution!!
>Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2005 15:19:29 -0500
>
>Hello.
>
>Could you send the attachment to your revolution
>List? I don't speak much english! :(
>Report the Bugs to my emails
>
>Thank you very much
>
>Best Regard
>Luis L. Rodríguez Oro
>darkroll0x001 at yahoo.es
>
--
stephen barncard
s a n  f r a n c i s c o
- - -  - - - - - - - - -



Bob Hutchison  -- blogs at 
Recursive Design Inc.  -- 
Raconteur  -- 


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: Apache Server with RunRev stacks doing the processing?

[Pierre Sahores]

Dear Kee,

Many Thanks for this all ! It's yet online, because your usefull  
rewritting and kind help. Let me know what you expect to build in  
using Rev's applications distibued apps. If some help in about  
detailled Tiger or Linux set-up can let you speed-up your  
deployments, just ask. I provided such kind of services before, even  
in configuring remote servers from ground in tunneled ssh2/admin mode.


We can realy hope that your work will help more of our XTalker's  
community to investigate the power of Rev in about rock-solid web and  
rich-media "n-tier" sockets driven apps.


The next steeps ? Going head in mixing AJAX  blog's front-end portals  
(DotClear is, there, a first class candidate tool), Rev application's  
servers, PostgreSQL, Ka-Map/Mapserver, DSS,... powerfull back-ends.


Kind Regards,
Pierre :-)


"A partir du moment où on évolue dans une activité où il n'y a pas de  
place pour la fanfaronnade, on est obligé de tomber sur des  
personnages d'exception. Tous ces gens sont au limiteur." Pierre  
Dupasquier





On Nov 19, 2005, at 4:26 PM, Pierre Sahores wrote:


Hi Kee,

It would be very kind from you to provide such an english language  
version of this tutorial.


Attached


Be sure that i will update the site with your translation and  
personal credit if you decide to gohead with your project.


:-) I do not have the knowledge that you have so it is possible  
that I altered some text and changed it's meaning so that the words  
are now wrong. You might want someone else to read through it just  
to make sure I didn't harm what you were saying. It's OK if you  
want to say I harmed your words :-) but you do not have to.


I would really appreciate your help in making Revolution best  
wieved as a rock-solid alternative to best knowed "n-tier"  
professional-grade developpment solutions. As web application's  
server, Revolution let us fly around Tomcat's or JBoss based  
solutions successfully, even about security tasks (proxy apps),  
PostgreSQL access or the amount of supported connections/seconds.


I agree.
Thanks,
kee




Best Regards from the old Europ ;-)

Thank you for your web site. Would you mind if I edited the  
english language version and sent it back to you? It's a very  
good tutorial.

Kee Nethery


On Nov 19, 2005, at 6:54 AM, Pierre Sahores wrote:


Kee,

Perhaps would you be interested in having an eye on the tutorial  
i wrote sometimes ago about the subject you are querying about :




All my apologies about the "english-like" issue ;-)

Regards,


Le 19 nov. 05 à 14:36, kee nethery a écrit :

I'm looking for a way to have an Apache server catch a request  
(will be using SOAP which is basically just a bunch of XML),  
feed it to a RunRev stack that I can debug using the RunRev  
development environment (ie not using a text file with XTalk in  
it), and then format a reply (more XML) and feed it back to the  
client that sent the request. I want to be able to watch the  
stack visually process the request so that I can step through  
the code as it processes a request and debug it quickly.


My preference is to run this on Mac OS X if that makes a  
difference and my preference is to use HTTPS as the transport  
method, not HTTP (which means I really do need to use Apache as  
the web server). Is anyone doing something like this OR does  
anyone have suggestions on how I might implement this.


I'm assuming I'd set up HTTPS on Apache to catch the SOAP  
requests if that is possible. The question is how do I transfer  
the data that Apache receives to a RunRev stack and then how do  
I send it back? I do this today with Hypercard using Jason  
Sendman's acgiDispatcher that feeds Apache gathered data via  
AppleScript to an application stack but if there is a more  
elegant way to do this without going through AppleScript, that  
would be better. The main thing is I want to retain the RunRev  
development environment so that I can quickly modify and  
troubleshoot the code.


Suggestions and links welcome. Be happy to pay someone to walk  
me through this setup if that gets me up and running quickly.


Kee Nethery

___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your  
subscription preferences:

http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



--
Bien cordialement, Pierre Sahores

100, rue de Paris
F - 77140 Nemours

[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

GSM:   +33 6 03 95 77 70
Pro:  +33 1 64 45 05 33
Fax:  +33 1 64 45 05 33



WEB/VoD/ACID-DB services over IP
"Mutualiser les deltas de productivité"



___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/us

Re: Apache Server with RunRev stacks doing the processing?

[Gordon Tillman]

Glenn you are very welcome,

On Nov 20, 2005, at 08:17, Glenn E. Fisher wrote:


Gordy,
Thanks for your post.  It works great on my old system G4 450 MHz  
OSX 10.3.9.

It's post like this that is what it is all about.
Thanks again,
Glenn


Gotta tell ya: You take all the cool stuff that comes already  
installed in an OS X machine and combine that with RR being just drop- 
dead easy to use, there ain't no end to the things you can crank out...


--gordy
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: lock screen doesn't!

[Raymond E. Griffith]

I wonder if adding the following might achieve what you are looking for:

 on mouseUp
   open invisible stack "OtherStack" to false
 end mouseUp

I don't think you'd need to lock or unlock the screen. Being invisible, you
would not see the stack, so no flash, and no need to push or pop the card
(though you might loose focus on your stack -- you might have to click on
something to get it back, as in
   click at 1,1  )

Unfortunately I can't test it. My iMac is having its hard drive replaced (a
pain in the pattotie, I assure you). But opening a stack invisible loads it
into memory, and prepositioning it to do whatever task you have for it.

There are other ways to handle access to data stored in other stacks,
though.

For example, 

  start using stack "OtherStack"

gives you access to its main script (not the other scripts, I understand).

But you can access its data with a script unique to the stack it is in,
something on the order of

 function AccessOtherStack fieldname,tcardname
   return field(fieldname) of card(tcardname) of stack(OtherStack)
 end AccessOtherStack

You could make it more sophisticated, of course. But there are lots of ways
to have access to stacks without making them visible to others.

I wish you well on your project.

Raymond E. Griffith


On 11/20/05 7:05 AM, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> In a message dated 11/19/05 11:58:23 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> I'm using Mac OSX. Why is it that when I use the following script I get
>> a
> flash of stack "otherStack"? I thought lock screen wouldn't allow that
>> to
> happen.
> 
> on mouseUp
>      lock screen
>      push cd
>      go stack "OtherStack"
>      pop cd
>      unlock screen
> end mouseUp
 
 Lock screen is really "lock window" and so only affects changes to the
 current stack. What is the effect you're trying to achieve? Is
>> "OtherStack"
 another mainstack, or is it a substack? Is it open or closed at the time
>> you
 run this code?
 
 Hi Ray,
>>> 
>>> "OtherStack" is another mainstack. It might be open or closed at the time
>> I
>>> use the handler. Does that make a difference?
>> 
>> Not really, but I'm still not sure what effect you're trying to achieve...
>> if you're in stack A, push the current card, open stack "B" with "go" (which
>> puts "B" on top of "A") and then pop the card, you go back to stack "A",
>> with stack "B" behind "A". Is this what you're trying to accomplish? The
>> appearance of a stack opening *behind* another stack?
>> 
> 
> Hi Again Ray,
> 
> No, I go to other mainstacks frequently to collect data for insertion into
> the starting stack. I don't want to display the other mainstack though while
> this is going on. I can't just refer to these other stacks though because I
> have 
> to organize the data first. I don't think I can do that remotely. Things like
> marking and sorting stacks that aren't open aren't possible, are they?
> 
> Joe
> ___
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution


___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: Apache Server with RunRev stacks doing the processing?

[Glenn E. Fisher]

Gordy,
Thanks for your post.  It works great on my old system G4 450 MHz OSX 
10.3.9.

It's post like this that is what it is all about.
Thanks again,
Glenn


OK, got a sample posted for you here:

http://homepage.mac.com/gordyt/FileSharing14.html

It's the one called rr_test.  After you download and extract it you 
will see two files:


rr.php
rr_backend.rev

Make sure you have enabled PHP on your Mac.  Very simple to do. PHP is 
already installed.  Put the rr.php file somewhere you can get to it 
with your browser, for example, in your ~/Sites folder.


Open the rr_backend.rev stack in RR and click the Start Listening 
button.


Then, using your web browser, load the rr.php file.  You can do it any 
number of ways.  For example, you can pass in arguments in the get 
string like this:


http://localhost/rr.php?name=gordon&age=48&location=humble

Or you can create another page with a form on it and have the form 
invoke the rr.php script.


This should get you started.  Both the php and the rr is very simple 
and you should be able to adapt it to any type of function that you 
need.


--gordy

P.S. - holler if questions


--
Glenn E. Fisher University of Houston - Retired
22402 Diane Dr. Spring, Tx 77373
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.uh.edu/~fisher
http://home.houston.rr.com/thegefishers/
http://homepage.mac.com/gefisher
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Re: lock screen doesn't!

[AbilityForms]

In a message dated 11/19/05 11:58:23 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


> >>> Hi everyone,
> >>>
> >>> I'm using Mac OSX. Why is it that when I use the following script I get 
> a
> >>> flash of stack "otherStack"? I thought lock screen wouldn't allow that 
> to
> >>> happen.
> >>>
> >>> on mouseUp
> >>>      lock screen
> >>>      push cd
> >>>      go stack "OtherStack"
> >>>      pop cd
> >>>      unlock screen
> >>> end mouseUp
> >>
> >> Lock screen is really "lock window" and so only affects changes to the
> >> current stack. What is the effect you're trying to achieve? Is 
> "OtherStack"
> >> another mainstack, or is it a substack? Is it open or closed at the time 
> you
> >> run this code?
> >>
> >> Hi Ray,
> >
> > "OtherStack" is another mainstack. It might be open or closed at the time 
> I
> > use the handler. Does that make a difference?
> 
> Not really, but I'm still not sure what effect you're trying to achieve...
> if you're in stack A, push the current card, open stack "B" with "go" (which
> puts "B" on top of "A") and then pop the card, you go back to stack "A",
> with stack "B" behind "A". Is this what you're trying to accomplish? The
> appearance of a stack opening *behind* another stack?
> 

Hi Again Ray,

No, I go to other mainstacks frequently to collect data for insertion into 
the starting stack. I don't want to display the other mainstack though while 
this is going on. I can't just refer to these other stacks though because I 
have 
to organize the data first. I don't think I can do that remotely. Things like 
marking and sorting stacks that aren't open aren't possible, are they?

Joe
___
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution