[REQ] Testers needed

[Sean Shao]

In the next few days I will be finishing up development and internal testing 
of a custom listbox object and will be needing testers. Information about 
the listbox object (and a single screen capture) is available at my website.


The listbox object comes with a visual editor to allow you to place controls 
in the row. Controls currently supported are:


- standard buttons
- rectangle buttons
- checkboxes
- radio buttons
- option menus
- label fields
- text fields
- images
- movies (and I guess audio files too)

Other features also include:

- setting the row colour
- setting an alternate colour (ala mac os x)
- setting a mouse enter colour
- setting a selected row colour

--
Sean 

_
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[REQ] Testers needed

[Sean Shao]

In the next few days I will be finishing up development and internal testing 
of a custom listbox object and will be needing testers. Information about 
the listbox object (and a single screen capture) is available at my website.


The listbox object comes with a visual editor to allow you to place controls 
in the row. Controls currently supported are:


- standard buttons
- rectangle buttons
- checkboxes
- radio buttons
- option menus
- label fields
- text fields
- images
- movies (and I guess audio files too)

Other features also include:

- setting the row colour
- setting an alternate colour (ala mac os x)
- setting a mouse enter colour
- setting a selected row colour

-Sean

_
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Re: Making the move...

[Richard K. Herz]

> I had the pleasure of serving tiramisu

A gracious host, Richard G. is! Thanks for your full meal of a post as 
well as your deserts.


Rich
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 8:01 PM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I hope this means you are coming.

Yes, as a fine southern gentleman I know said, "God willin' and the creek
don't rise."

> Thanks for taking another stab at this.

You're welcome.  You didn't note whether it worked for you.  Did it?

> Looks like Jim Hurley's turtle graphics has gotten a hold of you as well.

Long ago, it was Logo's turtle graphics that got hold of me.  Jim's
implementation enabled the simple solution.  Thanks, Jim.

-- Dick


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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Jim Ault]

One note of caution:
you might want to make the first three lines of the script

  repeat with x = the number of graphics down to 1
delete graphic x
  end repeat

otherwise redoing/redrawing will keep adding graphics and give slower and
slower performance.

Happy you found a solution... and I will be tuning in to see what you come
up with and add it to my Syntax Lib !!

Jim Ault
Las Vegas


On 3/17/06 2:24 PM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Dick Kriesel, your solution worked extra perfectly as it even set up
> for the inner diameter, outer circumference, and the line size.
> Thanks to you as well.  I decided to use this solution for my project.
> 
> on drawAstig pInnerDiameter,pOuterDiameter,pLineSize
>repeat with i = 0 to 345 step 15
>  create graphic
>  set the style of it to "oval"
>  set the height of it to pOuterDiameter
>  set the width of it to pOuterDiameter
>  set the angle of it to i
>  set the arcangle of it to 15
>  set the opaque of it to "true"
>  set the lineSize of it to pLineSize
>end repeat
>create graphic
>set the style of it to "oval"
>set the height of it to pInnerDiameter
>set the width of it to pInnerDiameter
>set the opaque of it to "true"
>set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
>create graphic
>set the style of it to "oval"
>set the height of it to pOuterDiameter+5
>set the width of it to pOuterDiameter+5
>set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
>set the lineSize of it to pLineSize + 4
> end drawAstig


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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Geoff Canyon]

Do you want them even though they are commented, or do you not want  
them?


For Navigator I don't care about commented handlers although I  
suppose maybe I should.


Since a comment relieves you of syntax requirements, this line is  
perfectly legitimate:


-- I've commented out this handler: on doSomething

I'm going to ignore such handlers, since they're just annoying. ;-)

That leaves two possibilities:

 -- on doSomething
 --on doSomething

So change the statement below to:

  if (word 1 of L is among the items of \
  "on,function,getprop,setprop,--on,--function,--getprop,--setprop"  
and...etc.) \

  or (word 1 of L is "--" and \
  word 2 of L is among the items of "on,function,getprop,setprop"  
and...etc.)


regards,

Geoff


On Mar 17, 2006, at 9:09 AM, Mark Smith wrote:

Lucid and thorough, as usual. And we'd all forgotten about 'Prop'  
handlers.
However, to nitpick, and raise a question from earlier in the  
thread, what about handlers that are commented out?


hmmm..not as simple as it might seem...

Mark

On 17 Mar 2006, at 16:16, Geoff Canyon wrote:



On Mar 16, 2006, at 5:25 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

But, I would like to get just one of the handlers from a script  
via script:put handler "FooBar" of the script of card "Foo"  
into tBar


Most of the solutions presented so far make assumptions. For  
example, there can be more than one space between "on" and the  
handler name.


In Navigator I use this to retrieve a list of the handler names:

repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  if word 1 of L is among the items of  
"on,function,getprop,setprop" then

put L & cr after tMenuText
  end if
end repeat

So to get the handler you would be doing something like:

put 0 into tLineNumber
put false into tEnteredHandler
repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  add 1 to tLineNumber
  if word 1 of L is among the items of  
"on,function,getprop,setprop" and \

word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tStartLineNumber
put true into tEnteredHandler
  end if
  if tEnteredHandler and \
word 1 of L is "end" and \
word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tEndLineNumber
exit repeat
  end if
end repeat

-- if tEnteredHandler is false, we didn't find the handler
-- if tEnteredHandler is true, tStartLineNumber is where it starts,
-- tEndLineNumber is where it ends

regards,

Geoff
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Mark Talluto]

On Mar 17, 2006, at 6:32 PM, Dick Kriesel wrote:


On 3/17/06 2:24 PM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

One things is for sure, I owe each of you a drink of your choice  
at the RevCon

in Monterey this year.


With positive reinforcement like that, I'll do even better:

on mouseUp
  drawAstig 50,200,225,2
end mouseUp

on drawAstig  
pSpokeRadiusInner,pSpokeRadiusOuter,pLabelRadius,pLineSize

  go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/StopTurtles.rev";
  start using stack "stopTurtles" -- note: thanks, Jim Hurley
  create stack
  set the width of it to 600
  set the height of it to 600
  go to it
  lock screen
  set the textSize of the templateField to 16
  set the margins of the templateField to 1,7,0,0
  startTurtle
  setH 75 -- note: set heading
  repeat with i = 1 to 24
penUp
forward pSpokeRadiusInner
penDown
forward pSpokeRadiusOuter - pSpokeRadiusInner
penUp
if i mod 2 = 0 then
  forward pLabelRadius - pSpokeRadiusOuter
  label i div 2
  set the width of last field to the formattedWidth of last field
  set the height of last field to the formattedHeight of last  
field

  back pLabelRadius
else
  back pSpokeRadiusOuter
end if
right 15
  end repeat
  stopTurtle
  set the lineSize of last graphic to pLineSize
  unlock screen
end drawAstig

RevConWest is sounding better and better...


I hope this means you are coming.  Thanks for taking another stab at  
this.  Looks like Jim Hurley's turtle graphics has gotten a hold of  
you as well.I have been playing with all the solutions and have  
learned a lot from each.  Thanks again and the drink still stands!



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Mind mapping in Rev ?

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 6:20 PM, "Kresten Bjerg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Has anyone been experimenting with implementing elementary mind-mapping
> functions in Rev ?

Yes, I have, although I'd have to emphasize elementary.

A user creates graphic objects like ovals to represent concepts, and
connects them using the mouse to draw arrows.  When the user moves the mouse
over a concept graphic, the graphic changes color, and a field appears
showing custom text, like a tool tip, but with arbitrarily long text.  When
the user moves the mouse over an arrow graphic, the arrow and the concepts
it connects change color and show their custom text.  When the user clicks
custom text, it's unlocked and selected, so the user can edit it.  When the
user moves a graphic that has arrows to it or from it, the arrows move too.

What do you want?

By the way, according to conceptDraw.com, which offers a product called
MINDMAP 4, Mind Mapping® and Mind Map® are registered trademarks of the
Buzan Organization.

-- Dick


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Re: Making the move...

[Chipp Walters]

Interesting topic.

I've probably logged over 30 trips to Japan since 1986. I once had the 
good fortune to meet with a Dr. Sasaki, the father of computer science 
in Japan for lunch. He was an original member of the ENIAC team here in 
the US.


I mentioned to him that many years before, Japan had a reputation for 
cheap products, then they proved it wrong by creating high-quality 
products. I then mentioned the fact people said Japan couldn't create 
steel, to which they ended up virtually owning the steel industry. I 
furthered on with topics on consumer electronics, computers parts, 
computers, cars, etc..each time with Japan ultimately proving to the 
world their mastery of such industries.


Finally, I said, the current knock on Japan was they couldn't develop 
software, and would they again prove the naysayer wrong? To my 
astonishment, he answered 'NO', the naysayers were correct. Japan would 
never be a great software development country. I asked him this 10 years 
ago, and didn't believe his answer.


He gave 3 reasons for this:

1) The culture. Great software is typically created by a small group of 
only a few developers-- not the Japanese way of throwing manpower at a 
problem. Furthurmore, typcially good developers are not very social and 
can be obstinate (duh!), which again flys against the culture. And, the 
program all night when on a roll, then sleep all day type would never 
fly in a Japanese corporation.


2) It is very difficult for startup companies to begin in Japan. There 
are huge incorporation fees, plus it's almost impossible to go public, 
so it's difficult to find investors, Because the 'equity' of a software 
startup is not 'tangible', it's very difficult to get banks to become 
involved, and a good banking relationship is very important to startups.


3) Lastly, the best computer languages were based in English, and very 
different from the way Japanese read and write.


I imagine much of this has changed in the past 10 years or so since we 
last talked, but I still believe many of his concerns have some 
validity. Of course, as recently as a couple of years ago, I toured a 
new CG Manga studio where people slept on the floor under the desks in 
makeshift tent-beds and generally had a more 'western' feel like many 
game studios do today.


Of course, as they say, the proof is in the pudding. And, we've yet to 
see any big mainstream programs come out of Japan. But, there are some. 
I believe Shade 3D is a Japanese program (Lynn, you may know about this?).


-Chipp

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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 2:24 PM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> One things is for sure, I owe each of you a drink of your choice at the RevCon
> in Monterey this year.

With positive reinforcement like that, I'll do even better:

on mouseUp
  drawAstig 50,200,225,2
end mouseUp

on drawAstig pSpokeRadiusInner,pSpokeRadiusOuter,pLabelRadius,pLineSize
  go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/StopTurtles.rev";
  start using stack "stopTurtles" -- note: thanks, Jim Hurley
  create stack
  set the width of it to 600
  set the height of it to 600
  go to it
  lock screen
  set the textSize of the templateField to 16
  set the margins of the templateField to 1,7,0,0
  startTurtle
  setH 75 -- note: set heading
  repeat with i = 1 to 24
penUp
forward pSpokeRadiusInner
penDown
forward pSpokeRadiusOuter - pSpokeRadiusInner
penUp
if i mod 2 = 0 then
  forward pLabelRadius - pSpokeRadiusOuter
  label i div 2
  set the width of last field to the formattedWidth of last field
  set the height of last field to the formattedHeight of last field
  back pLabelRadius
else
  back pSpokeRadiusOuter
end if
right 15
  end repeat
  stopTurtle
  set the lineSize of last graphic to pLineSize
  unlock screen
end drawAstig

RevConWest is sounding better and better...

-- Dick


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Mind mapping in Rev ?

[Kresten Bjerg]

Has anyone been experimenting with implementing elementary mind-mapping 
functions
in Rev ?
In our development of a  global freeware e-diary tool we would like to include 
at least 
some options for users to build and update their own mind-maps, without having 
to pay 
many hundreds meals of rice for themselves or their kids to do it?

But a search on this site hardly has a clue. 
 If the INSPIRATION people could do it many many years ago, it shouldnt be that 
complicated ?

And with the 100 dollar MIT laptop to Africa it might fit into a linux context !

Kresten Bjerg


www.psy.ku.dk/bjerg/diary.htm   - user site: "Phenomenalog"  under name: Kresten
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Re: Making the move...

[J. Landman Gay]

Lynn Fredricks wrote:


 Until Jacque
finishes her time travel stack, there isnt much that can be done with
history :-) 


2006 will be a good year for Runtime as a company and Revolution as a
product platform. 


Playing with the beta again, are  you? ;)

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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RE: Making the move...

[Lynn Fredricks]

> I agree with what you say, Mark, but I think it isn't the 
> whole picture. In the early 80s, a guy at a Japanese steel 
> company explained to me how his time was being taken up with 
> visiting Americans determined to learn the secrets of 
> Japanese TQC.  He felt they were wasting their time. Not 
> because they were incapable of learning, but because there 
> was nothing to learn. He said that Westerners will debate and 
> evaluate various methods until they decide on the best 
> approach. Japanese corporations, on the other hand, will take 
> any method, good or bad, and make it work. Having 
> subsequently worked with a number of large Japanese 
> corporations, I think his comments were very shrewd. In other 
> words, it's not that Japanese methods transferred to the west 
> are doomed to failure, but rather that any method adopted by 
> Japanese corporations is doomed to success. (But that was in 
> the 80s, and plenty has changed since then.)

That's true - I don't think the mentality has changed since that time,
though economic shifts did have its social impact. Failure really isn't an
option - they make it work. But it is possible to use Japanese methods and
have strong, cohesive, quality minded teams, even with a few Americans
walking on the tatami mats with muddy shoes ;-) It is just extremely hard to
achieve.

Best regards,


Lynn Fredricks
Worldwide Business Operations
Runtime Revolution, Ltd


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Re: Pass - is it really needed

[James Spencer]

On Mar 17, 2006, at 5:30 PM, Sarah Reichelt wrote:


I agree. There is a very small list of handlers where I usually have a
pass: openStack, preOpenStack, openCard, preOpenCard. Apart from that
I almost never use pass, so I would  prefer it if Constellation left
it out and I added it manually when needed.

You could add another preference:
  add pass to all new handlers
  add pass to system messages only
  never add pass


... and to be really perfect, a fourth preferences to add pass to  
system handlers selected from a list!


Seriously, an option to add pass to system messages only would be  
very nice.


Spence

James P. Spencer
Rochester, MN

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

"Badges??  We don't need no stinkin badges!"

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RE: Making the move...

[Lynn Fredricks]

Hi all,

I must have missed the fuse on this thread, sorry - I only caught it from
Mark's response to Kaizen - sorry, Marielle, I accidentally deleted your
list of concerns but have now a copy to review. Some of it Id like to
discuss off list.

Lets step away from the impending flames of non-product issues. Until Jacque
finishes her time travel stack, there isnt much that can be done with
history :-) 

2006 will be a good year for Runtime as a company and Revolution as a
product platform. There is a limit to the amount of detail I can go into in
a public venue. There are some things we can discuss in more detail at
RevCon West. I hope to all see you there. In the spirit of the season,
please allow the baby bird to hatch out :-)

Best regards,


Lynn Fredricks
Worldwide Business Operations
Runtime Revolution, Ltd


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Re: Integrating Revolution and Flash

[Pierre Sahores]

Hi Pradeep,

First, i would say yes, as long as flash can be handled trough  
javascript calls we can bind to transcript handlers (i do that* all  
the time, for my own *.js stored/used as global vars from inside my  
rev-based web applications servers).
Second, i would recommand to use AJAX (prototype.js framework and  
accessories) as long as AJAX let us code all what can be managed from  
within flash without making us depend from the Macromedia proprietary  
solution.


Just as a small example illustration of the AJAX potential www2.sahores-conseil.com/puzzle.html>


All the Best to You and Albert,

Le 17 mars 06 à 10:14, MITTAL Pradeep Kumar a écrit :


Hello,

Is there any way to integrate revolution and flash ?

Some way of placing  Flash UI on top of Rev Card.
On top of revolution Object (lets say button ) one can put the flash
button. And when one clicks then revoluion button script is called.
Rev can create the XML file and then XML Data can be sent to flash swf
and vice versa.

What do you think ? Is there anyone who has tried integrating rev an
flash?

Best Regards
Pradeep




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--
Pierre Sahores
www.sahores-conseil.com


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Re: Pass - is it really needed

[Sarah Reichelt]

> > I was thinking of putting a "-- pass [sys msg name]" in every blank
> > system message handler Constellation creates. That way the user
> > could un-comment the "pass". Like Chipp, most of the time I find
> > the "pass" in a default handler unneeded.
>
>
> I would be one of those that would like it to just put the end
> [handler name] for me.  On the rare occasions that I want parameters
> or pass or anything else, I'll just type them in myself.
>

I agree. There is a very small list of handlers where I usually have a
pass: openStack, preOpenStack, openCard, preOpenCard. Apart from that
I almost never use pass, so I would  prefer it if Constellation left
it out and I added it manually when needed.

You could add another preference:
  add pass to all new handlers
  add pass to system messages only
  never add pass

Cheers,
Sarah
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Re: Making the move...

[Dave Cragg]

On 17 Mar 2006, at 18:26, Mark Wieder wrote:


Marielle-

Friday, March 17, 2006, 4:44:16 AM, you wrote:


many Japanese management concepts such as Total Quality Control,
Quality Control circles, small group activities, labor relations. Key
elements of Kaizen are quality, effort, involvement of all employees,
willingness to change, and communication.


Having been involved with Total Quality initiatives, Quality Control
Circles, etc, on this side of the pond I can say from experience that
they are doomed to failure because of underlying cultural differences.
Labor and social relationships are not structured in western societies
to provide the level of trust and support required to allow them to be
effective.



Like Lynn, I've spent a long time in Japan, and my life still carries  
the trappings.


I agree with what you say, Mark, but I think it isn't the whole  
picture. In the early 80s, a guy at a Japanese steel company  
explained to me how his time was being taken up with visiting  
Americans determined to learn the secrets of Japanese TQC.  He felt  
they were wasting their time. Not because they were incapable of  
learning, but because there was nothing to learn. He said that  
Westerners will debate and evaluate various methods until they decide  
on the best approach. Japanese corporations, on the other hand, will  
take any method, good or bad, and make it work. Having subsequently  
worked with a number of large Japanese corporations, I think his  
comments were very shrewd. In other words, it's not that Japanese  
methods transferred to the west are doomed to failure, but rather  
that any method adopted by Japanese corporations is doomed to  
success. (But that was in the 80s, and plenty has changed since then.)


Cheers
Dave
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Re: Pass - is it really needed

[Mark Talluto]

On Mar 17, 2006, at 2:05 PM, Jerry Daniels wrote:

I was thinking of putting a "-- pass [sys msg name]" in every blank  
system message handler Constellation creates. That way the user  
could un-comment the "pass". Like Chipp, most of the time I find  
the "pass" in a default handler unneeded.



I would be one of those that would like it to just put the end  
[handler name] for me.  On the rare occasions that I want parameters  
or pass or anything else, I'll just type them in myself.



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Thousands Separator on OSX

[Flavel Steve]

Thanks for all the help on this

It appears to be a feature needed in Rev.

However, I have found out that in Sweden, the decimal symbol and   
thousands separator used for numbers is not the same as those used  
for currency.  On XP it appears that  sDecimalSep, sMonDecimalSep
 and sThousandSep, sMonThousandSep provide this discrimination.  But  
I return empty for


 put queryRegistry("HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\International 
\sDecimalSep") into gDecimalPoint
put queryRegistry("HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\International 
\sThousandSep") into gThousandsSeparator


I have two questions.

1. For XP, is it possible to get sDecimalSep and sThousandSep in Rev?
2. What is the story with OS X, is it possible to have this type of  
number discrimination at the system level?


I am using OS X and compiling for Windows and Macintosh.

Steve Flavel
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Mark Talluto]

Wow!  Thanks for the quick help on this.  Man...my math is really  
lacking.  I'll be dissecting all the solutions below for some time.   
For the time being, I decided to bring all the solutions together for  
others to use and manipulate for your needs.  One things is for sure,  
I owe each of you a drink of your choice at the RevCon in Monterey  
this year.  I'll be the crazy guy walking around asking for each of you.



Malte, your solution worked great!

on mouseUp
  put item 1 of the loc of this cd into centerX
  put item 2 of the loc of this cd into centerY
  put 40 into isRadius
  put 60 into spokeLength
  repeat with isAngle=0 to 360 step 15
put centerX+cos(isAngle*pi/180)*isRadius into isNewX1
put centerY+sin(isAngle*pi/180)*isRadius into isNewY1
put centerX+cos(isAngle*pi/180)*(isRadius+spokeLength) into isNewX2
put centerY+sin(isAngle*pi/180)*(isRadius+spokeLength) into isNewY2
put round(isNewX1),round(isNewY1)&cr after pointlist
put round(isNewX2),round(isNewY2)&cr&cr after pointlist
  end repeat
  set the points of grc "wheel" to pointlist
end mouseUp

+

Dick Kriesel, your solution worked extra perfectly as it even set up  
for the inner diameter, outer circumference, and the line size.   
Thanks to you as well.  I decided to use this solution for my project.


on drawAstig pInnerDiameter,pOuterDiameter,pLineSize
  repeat with i = 0 to 345 step 15
create graphic
set the style of it to "oval"
set the height of it to pOuterDiameter
set the width of it to pOuterDiameter
set the angle of it to i
set the arcangle of it to 15
set the opaque of it to "true"
set the lineSize of it to pLineSize
  end repeat
  create graphic
  set the style of it to "oval"
  set the height of it to pInnerDiameter
  set the width of it to pInnerDiameter
  set the opaque of it to "true"
  set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
  create graphic
  set the style of it to "oval"
  set the height of it to pOuterDiameter+5
  set the width of it to pOuterDiameter+5
  set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
  set the lineSize of it to pLineSize + 4
end drawAstig

+

Jim Hurley, ahh yes...turtle graphics!  This is now in my bag of  
tricks as well!  Thanks!


on mouseUp
  startTurtle
  put 12 into tNumSpokes
  put 100 into tLengthSpokes
  repeat 360/tNumSpokes
forward tLengthSpokes
back tLengthSpokes
left 360/tNumSpokes
  end repeat
  stopTurtle
end mouseUp


Paste this handler into a button in the stack:

go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/StopTurtles.rev";

Or if you want something like the clock in your graphic;

go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/Build_a_clock.rev";


+

Jim Ault, your solution worked as well. Thanks for your help!

Could you take a single line png, make copies, and
rotate.positionAboutTheCenter them?
Jim Hurly and Scott Rossi are far ahead of me in doing this sort of work
(ballClock, windowShape, bezier curves, circles, polygon offsets)   
More than
shaking my head,  I'm rattling my brain and rolling my eyes... shake  
rattle

and roll :-)

See you all in Monterey!



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Pass - is it really needed

[Jerry Daniels]

Actually, I thought of a serious answer to this dilemma.

I was thinking of putting a "-- pass [sys msg name]" in every blank  
system message handler Constellation creates. That way the user could  
un-comment the "pass". Like Chipp, most of the time I find the "pass"  
in a default handler unneeded.


The other approach is to include a pass on those system message  
handlers where it is likely to  be needed--those being the ones that  
the Rev IDE counts on your passing, in particular.


Jerry

Buy Constellation from Runtime Revolution!
http://revstudio.runrev.com/section/revselect/constellation/



On Mar 17, 2006, at 1:37 AM, Chipp Walters wrote:

Yep, I'd prefer Constellation not place a 'pass' automatically in  
handlers. I'm sure Jerry will add it as a preference some day :-)


-Chipp

But, you gotta love the tabbed browsing AND the GREAT debugger  
which doesn't flake out for no apparent reason. Jerry's told me  
he's worked really hard on making the debugger as robust as  
possible..and it shows.


Thomas McGrath III wrote:
That is correct. I finally see how powerful Constellation is in  
my  work flow.

On Mar 17, 2006, at 12:22 AM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

Thomas McGrath III wrote:

The reason I ask is that when I insert a new command it throws  
in  a  pass with that commands name by default.



This isn't native Revolution behavior. Are you using Constellation?


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Re: set the graphic "G" to x,y,....

[Malte Brill]

Mark Waddingham wrote:


We've noticed this here too and are looking into it. I've filed bug
3397 about it for reference.


Hi Mark,

while you´re at it, any chance of speeding up: set the angle of image 
"myImage" to (any number that is not a multiple of 45)


That would be really cool. :-)

All the best,

Malte

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Re: Zoom/maximize box

[Mark Smith]

I have a dim memory of something like this, and I think the solution  
was  introducing a small delay before invoking my own resizing handlers.


So if you have all your code in an 'on resizeStack' handler, try  
moving it into an 'on customResize' handler, and then make your  
resizeStack handler:


on resizeStack
  send "customResize" to me int 20 millisecs
  pass resizeStack
end resizeStack

This may or may not help, but I think something like it worked for me...

Mark

On 17 Mar 2006, at 19:48, Jon Seymour wrote:


Hi all,

In my app I manipulate screen elements when the user resizes the  
window. For scaling Rev objects, the Geometry manager works well. I  
do intercept and pass the resizeStack message to do a couple of  
things, for example, reset the tabstops in a field, and redraw the  
altBrowser pane. I use liveResizing simply out of personal  
preference. It all works!


Except...when I click that darn zoom box. On both Mac and Win  
platforms, this causes my resizeStack handlers to fail. The  
Geometry manager works, and I can see in the Message Watcher that  
resizeStack is being sent, but for some reason there is no action.  
When I click the box again to toggle back to the old size, BOOM,  
the items are redrawn too big, reflecting the prior window size.  
The minute I grab and drag the resize area in the lower right of  
the window, everything snaps back to normal.


So, what am I missing? Is there a message sent or some other way to  
know specifically when the zoom box has been clicked?


Thanks,

Jon
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 10:26 AM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I need a little help drawing spokes to a wheel.  This is actually
> used in a vision test.  I have an image here to help illustrate the
> madness.  I am sure someone like Jim Ault is shaking his head right
> now.  
> 
> I have been using an image, but would like to offer the ability to
> adjust the line length and thickness.  The new antialiasing feature
> will also be handy.  Thanks for any input.

Here's another way to draw the spokes:

on drawAstig pInnerDiameter,pOuterDiameter,pLineSize
  repeat with i = 0 to 345 step 15
create graphic
set the style of it to "oval"
set the height of it to pOuterDiameter
set the width of it to pOuterDiameter
set the angle of it to i
set the arcangle of it to 15
set the opaque of it to "true"
set the lineSize of it to pLineSize
  end repeat
  create graphic
  set the style of it to "oval"
  set the height of it to pInnerDiameter
  set the width of it to pInnerDiameter
  set the opaque of it to "true"
  set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
  create graphic
  set the style of it to "oval"
  set the height of it to pOuterDiameter+5
  set the width of it to pOuterDiameter+5
  set the foregroundColor of it to "white"
  set the lineSize of it to pLineSize + 4
end drawAstig

Applying the hour numbers seems to require a different approach.  If you use
turtle graphics, you can probably both draw the spokes and accurately
position label fields containing the hour numbers.

-- Dick


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Re: Zoom/maximize box

[Sarah Reichelt]

> In my app I manipulate screen elements when the user resizes the
> window. For scaling Rev objects, the Geometry manager works well. I
> do intercept and pass the resizeStack message to do a couple of
> things, for example, reset the tabstops in a field, and redraw the
> altBrowser pane. I use liveResizing simply out of personal
> preference. It all works!
>
> Except...when I click that darn zoom box. On both Mac and Win
> platforms, this causes my resizeStack handlers to fail. The Geometry
> manager works, and I can see in the Message Watcher that resizeStack
> is being sent, but for some reason there is no action. When I click
> the box again to toggle back to the old size, BOOM, the items are
> redrawn too big, reflecting the prior window size. The minute I grab
> and drag the resize area in the lower right of the window, everything
> snaps back to normal.
>
> So, what am I missing? Is there a message sent or some other way to
> know specifically when the zoom box has been clicked?

This works for me, but I don't use any Geometry Manager settings, I
always do all my own resizing.

Do you have the resizeStack message using it's parameters for the new
width & height or are you getting them from the stack's properties?
Maybe the properties aren't updated until after the maximize is
finished, but using the parameters works fine here.

There is an "iconifyStack" message sent when you minimize, but I don;t
think there is a message for maximizing apart from resizeStack.

Cheers,
Sarah
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Jim Hurley]

Message: 10
Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 10:26:30 -0800
From: Mark Talluto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Draw spokes on a wheel
To: Revolution use Revolution 
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed

Hello everyone,

I need a little help drawing spokes to a wheel.  This is actually 
used in a vision test.  I have an image here to help illustrate the 
madness.  I am sure someone like Jim Ault is shaking his head right

now.  

I have been using an image, but would like to offer the ability to 
adjust the line length and thickness.  The new antialiasing feature 
will also be handy.  Thanks for any input.



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com



Mark,

You  may be able to guess what my  solution might be; that's right 
Turtle Graphics.


on mouseUp
  startTurtle
  put 12 into tNumSpokes
  put 100 into tLengthSpokes
  repeat 360/tNumSpokes
forward tLengthSpokes
back tLengthSpokes
left 360/tNumSpokes
  end repeat
  stopTurtle
end mouseUp


Paste this handler into a button in the stack:

go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/StopTurtles.rev";

Or if you want something like the clock in your graphic;

go url "http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/Build_a_clock.rev";

There are lots of variations possible.

Jim

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Re: Making the move...

[Mark Wieder]

Marielle-

Friday, March 17, 2006, 4:44:16 AM, you wrote:

> 2) Rich and easy to access documentation

> If you want to use a java library written by somebody else, simple,
> you get access to the API online and you know what method to call and
> how. You don't need to know *anything* about the inner workings of  
> the library. Why is it? Because some some conventions have been  
> created which let you comment your script in a very efficient way,  
> where the API doc can be automatically generated from these comments.
> http://java.sun.com/j2se/javadoc/. There is *NOTHING* even close to
> this in revolution. Here, if you want to find your way through

...sure there is. You have to roll your own, but it's not that much
transcript code. My libraries generate their own documentation through
a javadoc-like mechanism. Check out, for example, my ArchiveSearch
plugin on revonline and open the libDispatcher library. Click on the
API button.

And the ECMI document was developed as a way to provide library
developers with a standardized way of documenting the api, among other
things. If library developers don't follow this then it's no different
from java developers not supplying javadoc comments or providing api
documentation online. They're just conventions that have become fairly
universally adopted. Not knowing *anything* about the internal
workings of a library can cause much more pain in java than in rev,
especially in areas of throwing exceptions and threading.

-- 
-Mark Wieder
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps?

[Chipp Walters]

John,

You can right your own handlers to manage popup windows, that's what the
callback is for.

Again, you can reach us directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED]

best,

Chipp

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Re: Making the move...

[Chipp Walters]

Marielle,

Most of us know, you have a running feud with those at RunRev. If you 
aren't happy with the tool, then just don't use it. It's that simple.


Perhaps there aren't as many libraries available for Transcript, but who 
says using only reusable libraries is the only way to code quickly? I 
can still develop my apps significantly faster than enterprise customers 
who code in Java and .NET (even with all their free libraries!).


As Richard has implied over and over, it's about ROI for the client. If 
I can program some apps faster than another developer, then I provide 
value for my client. It really is that simple.


This is not to say Revolution is the perfect application framework for 
every type of project --though I've personally yet to find a project 
which it won't work for. Projects which require large teams of 
programmers (like Operating Systems for instance) are not a good match 
for Runtime Revolution. But for small groups who need fast results, 
Runtime Revolution works great...libraries or not.


And for the record, Richmond was not 'banished' from this list for his 
views on Open Source. The first time, I believe he was banished for his 
choice of cursed language, and RR let him back on only to have him post 
to this list a hack to the RR website (which many of us would have only 
forwarded directly to RR).


Your effort here to cast RR in a poor light regarding Richmond, Xavier 
and others is a disservice to those who don't know the whole story.


-Chipp

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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Jim Ault]

just recalled that there was a very good exchange about points on a polygon
in the archives relating to the Rossi "ballclock" and the last revision I
think is ballclock4.rev

This could still be on his download site.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas


On 3/17/06 10:26 AM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> 
> I need a little help drawing spokes to a wheel.  This is actually
> used in a vision test.  I have an image here to help illustrate the
> madness.  I am sure someone like Jim Ault is shaking his head right
> now.  
> 
> I have been using an image, but would like to offer the ability to
> adjust the line length and thickness.  The new antialiasing feature
> will also be handy.  Thanks for any input.
> 
> 
> Mark Talluto


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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Malte Brill]

Hi Mark,

here is a quicky. Make sure that the style of the grc accepts points 
(e.g=curve or line)


on mouseUp
  put item 1 of the loc of this cd into centerX
  put item 2 of the loc of this cd into centerY
  put 40 into isRadius
  put 60 into spokeLength
  repeat with isAngle=0 to 360 step 15
put centerX+cos(isAngle*pi/180)*isRadius into isNewX1
put centerY+sin(isAngle*pi/180)*isRadius into isNewY1
put centerX+cos(isAngle*pi/180)*(isRadius+spokeLength) into isNewX2
put centerY+sin(isAngle*pi/180)*(isRadius+spokeLength) into isNewY2
put round(isNewX1),round(isNewY1)&cr after pointlist
put round(isNewX2),round(isNewY2)&cr&cr after pointlist
  end repeat
  set the points of grc "wheel" to pointlist
end mouseUp

All the best,

Malte
--
ArcadeEngine - prepare to WOW your audience within minutes
http://www.runrev.com/section/revselect/arcadeengine
http://www.derbrill.com/arcadeengine/forum 
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Re: AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps?

[John Patten]

Thanks for the quick reply!

I had been trying AltBrowser 2.0 in Rev 2.7. I'm not sure if that's the 
problem. But when I saw Chris's reply about using 2.6 I went back, downloaded 
the demo again, and opened it up in 2.6.  

The first time I pointed the "Demo Browser" to writely.com I was able to log 
in, however when I went to edit a previously created document in Writely it 
through up an answer box, "link trying to open in new window: 
http://www.writely.com/DOC.aspx?id=bdcwwm88rvd"; and "OK." After clicking OK Rev 
quit.

So i thought maybe the problem had to do with the fact that I was trying to 
access a previoulsy created Writely document. So, I created a new document, and 
was able to edit, update , log off and log on to edit with no problem.  

Then I logged back in and and tried to access one of those previously created 
Writely documents, and everything worked. Oh, well there went that theory. :-)

I haven't tried in 2.7 again, I was just happy that it worked! 

Thanks!

---
-- 

Message: 9 
Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2006 12:23:29 -0600 
From: chris bohnert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Subject: Re: AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps? 
To: How to use Revolution  
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed 

Hi John, 

  I just tried this with writely and the altbrowser demo and was able to 
login and create a new document on both the mac an pc.  I'm using XP/OS 
10.4.5 in rev 2.6.1. 

I launched the demo..clicked "launch browser" on the first card and then 
went directly to "http://www.writely.com";. 

You can get us directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or me in particular at 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-- 
cb 

John Patten wrote: 
> Hi all And Chip... 
> 
> I had a question regarding Chip's AltBrowser 2.0 external... 
> 
> Is it possible to use the external with web sites such as Writely 
> (www.writely.com)?  I attempted using the demo browser in the new 2.0 version 
> and was not successful. On the Windows version, it would kill Rev, and with 
> the Mac it would bring up the page, allow login, but you could not edit 
> anything (change text style, font, etc.) 
> 
> My guess is maybe this is due to the fact that Writely opens up multiple 
> windows and AltBrowser 2.0 does not support sites with multiple windows...??? 
> Or, maybe the demo browser doesn't...? 
> 
> Can anyone shed any light on using AltBrowser with something like Writley? 
> 
> Thank you! 
> 
> John Patten 
> Sylvan Union School District 
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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Mark Talluto]

On Mar 17, 2006, at 11:01 AM, Jim Ault wrote:


Could you take a single line png, make copies, and
rotate.positionAboutTheCenter them?
Jim Hurly and Scott Rossi are far ahead of me in doing this sort of  
work
(ballClock, windowShape, bezier curves, circles, polygon offsets)   
More than
shaking my head,  I'm rattling my brain and rolling my eyes...  
shake rattle

and roll :-)


Hi Jim,

I'll take a stab at your suggestion and see how it goes.  It has been  
tricky to get this right.  I have been digging around on math sites  
for some trig solutions.


Thanks for the reference to the clock.  I'll go over that code and  
see what I can pull from them.  I had forgotten all about them.  I  
bet what I need is in there.


Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Making the move...

[Richard Gaskin]

Marielle wrote:
What you get with Java, Ruby, Ajax that you don't get with runrev is  
the following.


1) Re-usable LIBRARIES.

Honestly what I have read recently on how revolution is so much  
superior to Director or Java is just a *BIG* joke. Agreed, revolution  
let  you write stuff rapidly. But you have to write the same stuff  
again and again and again and again. But what java does is let you  
write it ONCE and REUSE it again and again and again.


Coding for reuse is a choice. There's a lot of Java out there that can
barely be used, let alone reused. :)

I rarely write the same routine in Transcript more than once, and every 
app I write is completed with considerably higher ROI than the last 
because of the ease of reusing code libraries.  In my most recent 
project I would estimate that some 70% of the code base is in reusable 
libraries.


There's even a Scripter's Scrapbook that Hugh Senior wrote in Rev to 
encourage even greater code reuse (with a jaw-droppingly complete 
feature set) at .


Stephen McConnell's "Code Complete 2" offers a great insight into coding
for reuse (among many other things), and just about anything from him is
chock full o' good ideas.

I've touched on reuse in my presentations at Rev conferences, and it
would probably be useful to also address this in greater depth at
revJournal.

In the meantime, "Extending the Runtime Revolution Message Path" at

introduces the mechanics of implementing libraries, and my Handy
Handlers series at 
discusses the style side of crafting handlers with an emphasis on
generalized reuse.

It should be noted that while the specifics of coding for reuse in
Transcript often rely on mechanisms unique to the language, those
mechanisms are simple to work with (e.g. "start using libMyStuff") and 
the patterns governing reuse are pretty much the same as for other 
procedural languages (error-checking params, conscious source-to-dest 
param order, useful defaults for optional params, etc.).


Any developer thinking ahead and exercising a little self-discipline can
get the same level of benefit of code reuse in Transcript as in just
about any procedural language, arguably more so in many cases given
Transcript's self-documenting nature and the simplicity of using library
stacks.

That said, there's a fine line being drawn here.  On the one hand you
seem to request a professional level of self-discipline from those who
publish libraries, while elsewhere suggesting that Rev be used by more
newcomers and non-professionals.  As long as there are people who
haven't yet made a million mistakes, they will code in ways that don't
prevent them. :)



2) Rich and easy to access documentation

If you want to use a java library written by somebody else, simple,  
you get access to the API online and you know what method to call and  
how. You don't need to know *anything* about the inner workings of  
the library. Why is it? Because some some conventions have been  
created which let you comment your script in a very efficient way,  
where the API doc can be automatically generated from these comments.  
http://java.sun.com/j2se/javadoc/. There is *NOTHING* even close to  
this in revolution.


Again, this is a matter of choice on the part of the developer.  Some
are simply more diligent documenters than others.

While the number of lines needed to extract APIs from a Java code base
is so great that Sun needs to provide a tool for it, getting a list of
handlers from a script in Transcript can be done in just a few lines
(see the MC IDE's Script Editor or Geoff Canyon's post at
).
 Modifying those routines to also include params would be trivial.

But for such extraction to be useful the key is to provide meaningful
parameter names.  Remember that Java's a typed language so the
prototypes will tell you more about a param than its name alone will.
So again, this is a choice and some do it better than others. K&R-style
single-letter arguments won't tell you very much. :) (A few tips on
naming conventions are shared at
).

Taking this notion one step further, the Rev Interoperability Project
(RIP) at  offers guidelines 
for libraries to include API documentation, and in a way that makes it 
relatively simple for a single doc-reader stack to easily display the 
API for any RIP-savvy library.


Conventions exist for both Java and Rev; they're only as useful as they 
are adopted, and Java is used by more professionals for whom the 
benefits of self-discipline pay bigger dividends.




3) Member's sense of investment in making their work freely available

Yes, you can do fantastic stuff with revolution. But you have to  
start from 

Re: Rev 2.7 needs to close

[Stephen Barncard]

Rob:

We may have 2 bug numbers for the same bug...

sqb: 
clicking or dragging text randomly fatally crashes rev. Sometimes 
core dump dialog appears.

*Confirmed with 2 apple debug dumps sent to runrev.

Rob: 


is this possible?


Hi Preston,

My Rev Studio 2 quits unexpectedly about once an hour. This seems 
to happen only when selecting or moving text in a script. Has 
anyone else experienced this waker-upper and is there a way to 
avoid it. I'm getting kinda old for this s**t !




--
stephen barncard
s a n  f r a n c i s c o
- - -  - - - - - - - - -
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Re: imagedata in Word XML

[Gordon Tillman]

Henk I wrote an exporter for JasperReports that can save to WordML  
format.  This is in Java, no no help with RunRev.  But I can tell you  
that the information is not in pure imageData format.  The  
information in WordML is a base-64 encoded PNG or JPEG, or whatever.


Well, even though you decode the information from the WordML file,  
now you have a binary representation of a PNG or JPEG, etc., and that  
is not in a format proper for imageData, which is an array of 4-byte  
integers, each integer representing one pixel.  You will have to  
base-64 decode the information in the WordML file and then read it in  
as if you were reading an image file off a disk, etc.  This will  
decompress the information that is encoded in the file and then you  
can use the result as imageData.


--gordy

On Mar 17, 2006, at 13:50, Henk van der Velden wrote:


Good day all,

Word 2003 and newer can save as XML. If there is an image in the  
doc, it's binary data are saved in one of the nodes of an XML tree  
(body/p/r/pict/binData).


Now I want a Revolution stack to read these XML documents. I  
assumed the binary image data to be base-64 encoded. But when I  
decode the content of the node containing the binary image data,  
and set the imageData of an image in the Rev stack to it, I get a  
messy picture.
I have also tried to base-64 encode the imageData of an image in a  
Rev stack and paste it into a node containing binary image data in  
a Word XML file. But then Word doesn't understand the data.


Is there anyone who knows how Word's binary image data can be used  
in Rev?


Kind regards,
Henk
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Re: Rev 2.7 needs to close

[Stephen Barncard]

They're working on it.. and it's confirmed... please vote
http://support.runrev.com/bugdatabase/show_bug.cgi?id=3359



My Rev Studio 2 quits unexpectedly about once an hour. This seems to 
happen only when selecting or moving text in a script. Has anyone 
else experienced this waker-upper and is there a way to avoid it. 
I'm getting kinda old for this s**t !


--
stephen barncard
s a n  f r a n c i s c o
- - -  - - - - - - - - -
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imagedata in Word XML

[Henk van der Velden]

Good day all,

Word 2003 and newer can save as XML. If there is an image in the doc,  
it's binary data are saved in one of the nodes of an XML tree (body/p/ 
r/pict/binData).


Now I want a Revolution stack to read these XML documents. I assumed  
the binary image data to be base-64 encoded. But when I decode the  
content of the node containing the binary image data, and set the  
imageData of an image in the Rev stack to it, I get a messy picture.
I have also tried to base-64 encode the imageData of an image in a  
Rev stack and paste it into a node containing binary image data in a  
Word XML file. But then Word doesn't understand the data.


Is there anyone who knows how Word's binary image data can be used in  
Rev?


Kind regards,
Henk
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Zoom/maximize box

[Jon Seymour]

Hi all,

In my app I manipulate screen elements when the user resizes the  
window. For scaling Rev objects, the Geometry manager works well. I  
do intercept and pass the resizeStack message to do a couple of  
things, for example, reset the tabstops in a field, and redraw the  
altBrowser pane. I use liveResizing simply out of personal  
preference. It all works!


Except...when I click that darn zoom box. On both Mac and Win  
platforms, this causes my resizeStack handlers to fail. The Geometry  
manager works, and I can see in the Message Watcher that resizeStack  
is being sent, but for some reason there is no action. When I click  
the box again to toggle back to the old size, BOOM, the items are  
redrawn too big, reflecting the prior window size. The minute I grab  
and drag the resize area in the lower right of the window, everything  
snaps back to normal.


So, what am I missing? Is there a message sent or some other way to  
know specifically when the zoom box has been clicked?


Thanks,

Jon
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Re: script help

[Klaus Major]

Hi Ben,

I have a stack that with 141 cards.  40 of the cards have images  
set on a timer :


on openCard
wait 2 seconds
hide image "img1"
end openCard

I need to make an openStack script that will set the images to  
"show".  My usual lowbrow, untrained approach is to hard code it,  
which gets tedious:

on closeCard
show img "img1"
end closeCard


Use "preopencard" that will happen BEFORE a card is drawn on the screen,
see below...
I want to make a stack script for this easy problem, so that all  
images are set to "visible = true" or "show".  I just can't get it  
right.


on preOpenStack
put the number of cds into cardCount
repeat with x = 1 to cardCount
end repeat
put the number of images into imageCount
repeat with y = 1 to imageCount
end repeat
put the ID of image y of cd x into imageNameList --(something is  
wrong here)

repeat for each line Joe in imageNameList
set the visible of image q to true
end repeat
end preOpenStack


Let me see if I get you right:

You want to hide every image on every card before you go to that card?
And have this in the stackscript?

In that case put this "preopencard" handler into the stackscript!

on preopencard
  repeat with i = 1 to the num of imgs
hide img i
  end repeat
end preopencard

I think part of my problem is that I don't really understand the  
repeat syntax.


1) is there any design flaw using the wait/hide format?


"hide" is immediate, but "wait" will halt the application for the  
time you wait,

means you cannot click buttons etc. in this time.

But you can force the "wait" clause to NOT halt the whole app by adding:

on openCard
   wait 2 secs WITH MESSAGES
   hide image "img1"
end openCard

Now you can enter text into fields, click buttons etc... during these  
2 seconds.



2) How can I re-write the preOpenStack script to do what I want?


See above...


 I'll eagerly read any pointers.


Hope that helps...


Thanks for any help,

Ben


Regards

Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de

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Re: script help

[Rob Cozens]

Hi Ben,

I have a stack that with 141 cards.  40 of the cards have images set 
on a timer :


on openCard
wait 2 seconds
hide image "img1"
end openCard

I need to make an openStack script that will set the images to "show".


Are you sure?  If no runtime changes to the stack need be saved, simply 
set destroyStack to true and close the stack without saving it.  The 
next time it is opened the images will all show if the stack was last 
saved that way.


If it is compiled as a standalone, it _will_ retain the original state 
of the images when the standalone was built.


My usual lowbrow, untrained approach is to hard code it, which gets 
tedious:

on closeCard
show img "img1"
end closeCard

I want to make a stack script for this easy problem, so that all 
images are set to "visible = true" or "show".  I just can't get it 
right.


How about (in the stack script):

on preOpenCard
  repeat with x = 1 to the number of images
show image x
  end repeat
end preOpenCard

?

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)

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Re: Rev 2.7 needs to close

[Rob Cozens]

Hi Preston,

My Rev Studio 2 quits unexpectedly about once an hour. This seems to 
happen only when selecting or moving text in a script. Has anyone else 
experienced this waker-upper and is there a way to avoid it. I'm 
getting kinda old for this s**t !




Go to  and 
add your vote(s) and any comments...especially if you're not running 
Windows.



Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)

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script help

[Ben Bock]

I have a stack that with 141 cards.  40 of the cards have images set on a timer 
: 

on openCard
wait 2 seconds
hide image "img1"
end openCard

I need to make an openStack script that will set the images to "show".  My 
usual lowbrow, untrained approach is to hard code it, which gets tedious:
on closeCard
show img "img1"
end closeCard

I want to make a stack script for this easy problem, so that all images are set 
to "visible = true" or "show".  I just can't get it right.

on preOpenStack 

put the number of cds into cardCount 

repeat with x = 1 to cardCount 

end repeat

put the number of images into imageCount

repeat with y = 1 to imageCount

end repeat 

put the ID of image y of cd x into imageNameList --(something is wrong here) 

repeat for each line Joe in imageNameList 

set the visible of image q to true

end repeat

end preOpenStack 



I think part of my problem is that I don't really understand the repeat syntax. 



1) is there any design flaw using the wait/hide format?

2) How can I re-write the preOpenStack script to do what I want?



 I'll eagerly read any pointers.



Thanks for any help,



Ben




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Re: The long answer on when to use a function vs command

[Thomas McGrath III]

Geoff,

Great read,

Thanks for this,

Tom


On Mar 17, 2006, at 10:57 AM, Geoff Canyon wrote:



On Mar 14, 2006, at 8:31 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

Can someone give the long answer on when is it best to use a  
function versus a command? I have a lot to write of both commands  
and functions and have been overly confusing myself. Please give  
at least two examples each with parameters and how to call/use them.


I wrote an article about this. It's at:

http://inspiredlogic.com/articles/functions.html

It gives several examples.

I can summarize it as: Functions Good, Handlers Bad (much of the  
time). ;-)


regards,

Geoff
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Thomas J McGrath III
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Lazy River Software™ - http://www.lazyriversoftware.com

Lazy River Metal Art™ - http://www.lazyriversoftware.com/metal.html

Meeting Wear™ - http://www.cafepress.com/meetingwear

Semantic Compaction Systems - http://www.minspeak.com

SCIconics, LLC - http://www.sciconics.com/sciindex.html







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RE: Making the move...

[Lynn Fredricks]

> > many Japanese management concepts such as Total Quality Control, 
> > Quality Control circles, small group activities, labor 
> relations. Key 
> > elements of Kaizen are quality, effort, involvement of all 
> employees, 
> > willingness to change, and communication.
> 
> Having been involved with Total Quality initiatives, Quality 
> Control Circles, etc, on this side of the pond I can say from 
> experience that they are doomed to failure because of 
> underlying cultural differences.
> Labor and social relationships are not structured in western 
> societies to provide the level of trust and support required 
> to allow them to be effective.

Putting on my Proactive (http://www.proactive-intl.com) hat here on one of
my favorite topics :-)

Ill preface this by saying I lived in Japan for six years, have an office in
Japan, Japanese spouse and bi-lingual family household. We have a good mix
of Japanese staff. My kid has been cleaning my clock in spoken and written
Japanese for years :-(

I think almost all Japanese initiatives fail in the US for the same reason
why many foreign endeavors don't make it in Japan - they werent adapted into
processes towards a specific goal. And they apply differently in different
industries, because there is a different mindset by industry - the
automobile industry vs software is a perfect one.

Total Quality Management didn't originate in Japan, but it is worshipped
there. Japanese society is built around cooperation, unity, and fair
treatment within the group - and you disappoint and fail the group if your
product doesn't improve. It doesn't nourish creativity however, though the
government has taken steps in their education system to help rectify that.

There are some very good software products from Japan, but it isnt a culture
that nurtures a maverick mentality that can result in lots of super
programmers. You could point to console games as an industry dominated by
the Japanese, but I think if you really looked at the way most of those
games are structured (and that they license a lot of foreign 3D technology),
you would be less impressed.

But to go back to the point - adaptions Ive seen have been terrible - either
self defeating or utterly silly. I think there are quality measures that can
be gleaned and adapted to a certain point, with good results. Its just
extremely rare.


Best regards,


Lynn Fredricks
Worldwide Business Operations
Runtime Revolution, Ltd



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Re: Draw spokes on a wheel

[Jim Ault]

Could you take a single line png, make copies, and
rotate.positionAboutTheCenter them?
Jim Hurly and Scott Rossi are far ahead of me in doing this sort of work
(ballClock, windowShape, bezier curves, circles, polygon offsets)  More than
shaking my head,  I'm rattling my brain and rolling my eyes... shake rattle
and roll :-)

Glad I don't have to solve this one.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas


On 3/17/06 10:26 AM, "Mark Talluto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> 
> I need a little help drawing spokes to a wheel.  This is actually
> used in a vision test.  I have an image here to help illustrate the
> madness.  I am sure someone like Jim Ault is shaking his head right
> now.  
> 
> I have been using an image, but would like to offer the ability to
> adjust the line length and thickness.  The new antialiasing feature
> will also be handy.  Thanks for any input.
> 
> 
> Mark Talluto


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Re: AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps?

[Chipp Walters]

Hi John,

It appears you've already received the answer, directly from Chris, the 
developer of the altBrowser external.


Feel free to contact us directly with any questions about altBrowser at:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Chipp

John Patten wrote:

Hi all And Chip...

I had a question regarding Chip's AltBrowser 2.0 external...


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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Arthur Urban]

mea culpa. Your example works just fine. I changed variable names in the 
send syntax without initializing them first. This caused the variable 
name to be sent as a string and not it's contents. Thank you for helping 
me discover this!


Dick Kriesel wrote:

On 3/17/06 12:47 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

  

I'm sure it evaluates literals just fine, but it does not
evaluate containers.



This works here:

on mouseUp
  put 1 into t
  send "foo t,t+1"
end mouseUp

on foo
  ask the params
end foo


Do you have a counter-example?

-- Dick


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Re: DRM for Images and Text in Stacks

[Mark Talluto]

On Mar 17, 2006, at 8:57 AM, Stephen Barncard wrote:

Why can't you protect the access online to the files on a secure  
server rather than try to protect the media? Who or what are the  
'bad guys'??


sqb



Can the files be outside the application in a "data" folder perhaps?   
If so, you could just encrypt them with a setup app.  Your player or  
media app would then import the encrypted file, decrypt it, and then  
show it.  All the while, the download media is encrypted and safe.



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Making the move...

[Mark Wieder]

Marielle-

Friday, March 17, 2006, 4:44:16 AM, you wrote:

> many Japanese management concepts such as Total Quality Control,
> Quality Control circles, small group activities, labor relations. Key
> elements of Kaizen are quality, effort, involvement of all employees,
> willingness to change, and communication.

Having been involved with Total Quality initiatives, Quality Control
Circles, etc, on this side of the pond I can say from experience that
they are doomed to failure because of underlying cultural differences.
Labor and social relationships are not structured in western societies
to provide the level of trust and support required to allow them to be
effective.

-- 
-Mark Wieder
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Draw spokes on a wheel

[Mark Talluto]

Hello everyone,

I need a little help drawing spokes to a wheel.  This is actually  
used in a vision test.  I have an image here to help illustrate the  
madness.  I am sure someone like Jim Ault is shaking his head right  
now.  


I have been using an image, but would like to offer the ability to  
adjust the line length and thickness.  The new antialiasing feature  
will also be handy.  Thanks for any input.



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps?

[chris bohnert]

Hi John,

 I just tried this with writely and the altbrowser demo and was able to 
login and create a new document on both the mac an pc.  I'm using XP/OS 
10.4.5 in rev 2.6.1.


I launched the demo..clicked "launch browser" on the first card and then 
went directly to "http://www.writely.com";.


You can get us directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or me in particular at 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


--
cb

John Patten wrote:

Hi all And Chip...

I had a question regarding Chip's AltBrowser 2.0 external...

Is it possible to use the external with web sites such as Writely 
(www.writely.com)?  I attempted using the demo browser in the new 2.0 version 
and was not successful. On the Windows version, it would kill Rev, and with the 
Mac it would bring up the page, allow login, but you could not edit anything 
(change text style, font, etc.)

My guess is maybe this is due to the fact that Writely opens up multiple 
windows and AltBrowser 2.0 does not support sites with multiple windows...??? 
Or, maybe the demo browser doesn't...?

Can anyone shed any light on using AltBrowser with something like Writley?

Thank you!

John Patten
Sylvan Union School District
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Re: Icon for OS X compiled .app not showing :-(

[Mark Talluto]

On Mar 16, 2006, at 9:41 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:


Garrett Hylltun wrote:

But after the standalone was saved, the icons I made are not being  
used at all for the .app in finder.  It's using the default icon  
from OS X as if mine didn't exist or something.


As you know now, Mark's suggestion works. So does zipping and then  
unzipping the standalone, which is what I always used to do. But  
the coolest trick was just posted here within the last week or so,  
and I thought it was Mark Talluto's trick too (if I remember  
right.) Anyway, you do a "get info" on the file, select the icon,  
and choose "Delete" from the Edit menu. Bingo. I have now changed  
my ways.


I seem to change my method every few months.  I know use the Path  
Finder's touch command to get things straight.  Who knows what method  
will be used in a few months.  Maybe I'll write a plugin to do the  
job for me.  :)



Mark Talluto
--
CANELA Software
http://www.canelasoftware.com

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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Jim Ault]

Also consider there is more than one way to legally comment out lines of
code.  The author should choose and be consistent.

I used to have a routine in HCard that would find all the
"on,  function,  --on , --function" handlers & "global" declaration lines in
a stack script container and build a directory at the top of that script
container for all stacksinuse.  This way I could print the first page and
have them documented.

As you may recall, HCard had a 32K script container limit and the workaround
was to do several 'stacksinuse' to build a working library.

-- comment
# comment

/*
... block of comments
on thisFunction val

end thisFunction val

on thisOther val

end thisOther val
*/

If I were to do this on a consistent basis, I would copy each of my stacks
into 'mysearchscript' folder, then use BBEdit file search and RegEx to Find
All in that folder of stacks, then scan the search result, double clicking
the hit line to go to that code.  This works because the scripts in a stack
are visible.  What you do not get is what object has the code, and you do
get a few false or ghost hits.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas

On 3/17/06 9:09 AM, "Mark Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Lucid and thorough, as usual. And we'd all forgotten about 'Prop'
> handlers.
> However, to nitpick, and raise a question from earlier in the thread,
> what about handlers that are commented out?
> 
> hmmm..not as simple as it might seem...
> 
> Mark
> 
> On 17 Mar 2006, at 16:16, Geoff Canyon wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On Mar 16, 2006, at 5:25 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:
>> 
>>> But, I would like to get just one of the handlers from a script
>>> via script:put handler "FooBar" of the script of card "Foo"
>>> into tBar
>> 
>> Most of the solutions presented so far make assumptions. For
>> example, there can be more than one space between "on" and the
>> handler name.
>> 
>> In Navigator I use this to retrieve a list of the handler names:
>> 
>> repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
>>   if word 1 of L is among the items of
>> "on,function,getprop,setprop" then
>> put L & cr after tMenuText
>>   end if
>> end repeat
>> 
>> So to get the handler you would be doing something like:
>> 
>> put 0 into tLineNumber
>> put false into tEnteredHandler
>> repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
>>   add 1 to tLineNumber
>>   if word 1 of L is among the items of
>> "on,function,getprop,setprop" and \
>> word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
>> put tLineNumber into tStartLineNumber
>> put true into tEnteredHandler
>>   end if
>>   if tEnteredHandler and \
>> word 1 of L is "end" and \
>> word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
>> put tLineNumber into tEndLineNumber
>> exit repeat
>>   end if
>> end repeat
>> 
>> -- if tEnteredHandler is false, we didn't find the handler
>> -- if tEnteredHandler is true, tStartLineNumber is where it starts,
>> -- tEndLineNumber is where it ends
>> 
>> regards,
>> 
>> Geoff
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Rev 2.7 needs to close

[Preston Shea]

My Rev Studio 2 quits unexpectedly about once an hour. This seems to happen 
only when selecting or moving text in a script. Has anyone else experienced 
this waker-upper and is there a way to avoid it. I'm getting kinda old for this 
s**t !
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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Mark Smith]

Lucid and thorough, as usual. And we'd all forgotten about 'Prop'  
handlers.
However, to nitpick, and raise a question from earlier in the thread,  
what about handlers that are commented out?


hmmm..not as simple as it might seem...

Mark

On 17 Mar 2006, at 16:16, Geoff Canyon wrote:



On Mar 16, 2006, at 5:25 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

But, I would like to get just one of the handlers from a script  
via script:put handler "FooBar" of the script of card "Foo"  
into tBar


Most of the solutions presented so far make assumptions. For  
example, there can be more than one space between "on" and the  
handler name.


In Navigator I use this to retrieve a list of the handler names:

repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  if word 1 of L is among the items of  
"on,function,getprop,setprop" then

put L & cr after tMenuText
  end if
end repeat

So to get the handler you would be doing something like:

put 0 into tLineNumber
put false into tEnteredHandler
repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  add 1 to tLineNumber
  if word 1 of L is among the items of  
"on,function,getprop,setprop" and \

word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tStartLineNumber
put true into tEnteredHandler
  end if
  if tEnteredHandler and \
word 1 of L is "end" and \
word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tEndLineNumber
exit repeat
  end if
end repeat

-- if tEnteredHandler is false, we didn't find the handler
-- if tEnteredHandler is true, tStartLineNumber is where it starts,
-- tEndLineNumber is where it ends

regards,

Geoff
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AltBrowser 2.0 Extension and Web 2.0 Web Apps?

[John Patten]

Hi all And Chip...

I had a question regarding Chip's AltBrowser 2.0 external...

Is it possible to use the external with web sites such as Writely 
(www.writely.com)?  I attempted using the demo browser in the new 2.0 version 
and was not successful. On the Windows version, it would kill Rev, and with the 
Mac it would bring up the page, allow login, but you could not edit anything 
(change text style, font, etc.)

My guess is maybe this is due to the fact that Writely opens up multiple 
windows and AltBrowser 2.0 does not support sites with multiple windows...??? 
Or, maybe the demo browser doesn't...?

Can anyone shed any light on using AltBrowser with something like Writley?

Thank you!

John Patten
Sylvan Union School District
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Re: DRM for Images and Text in Stacks

[Stephen Barncard]

Why can't you protect the access online to the files on a secure 
server rather than try to protect the media? Who or what are the 'bad 
guys'??


sqb


FYI, setting a customProp with the compressed image data actually 
increases the size of the stack if those images were resized to 
larger than their original incoming size (that's expected behavior) 
This presents somewhat of a conundrum. Since the import of a 3 X 5 
jpeg whose original resolution was 72 DPI  (all that is needed for 
the screen) and if is scaled up, storing it as image data (even 
compressed) bloats the stack. Since the "quest" is internet 
delivery, one is looking for the opposite effect: smaller stack 
sizes. So, one gets caught between a rock and a hard place: you want 
to deliver media efficiently but protect them from "theft" but then 
to protect them from theft you have to make a stack that is so big 
that delivery is difficult. hmmm...


I would still opt for a new feature to protect stacks in the IDE. Then you
Sivakatirswami


--
stephen barncard
s a n  f r a n c i s c o
- - -  - - - - - - - - -
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Re: How does 'Create Folder' give its result?

[Jim Ault]

Another approach that might be better for you.


put "c:/oragamiFolder/" into pathh
create folder pathh
if there is not a folder pathh then
   answer "Hmm, " & pathh &"  does not exist"
end if


On 3/17/06 8:02 AM, "Graham Samuel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Thanks to all who replied about this. I think Jacque must have been
> right about my somehow delaying looking at 'the result' - it really
> happened but now I can't reproduce it. Anyway, Jim Ault's suggestion
> 
>> Try this snippet and see what you get
>> 
>>  create folder "cde:/illegal:name/"
>>   get the result
>>   if it is not empty then
>> beep
>> put it
>> answer error it -->"can't create that directory"
>>   end if
> 
> Worked exactly as advertised. So what I described was an unexplained
> glitch, possibly something to do with the IDE. The cause of the error
> in the first place is something of a mystery to me, and I wondered if
> it was something to do with the way the RR engine translates path
> strings from Unix-style to Windows-style on the fly. As happens to me
> all too often, a search of the documentation didn't reveal anything
> about this...
> 
> Richard G asked
> 
>> The hard part is determining exactly what went wrong.  When a file or
>> folder creation error happens, in most cases all the result says is
>> "can't create file" or "can't create folder" with no further
>> explanation.  How do you advise your users?
> Basically, I tell them to pick a folder for themselves rather than
> letting the app create one for them, as it's failed to do this. It's
> a crude approach and I'm not sure how it's going to play when the
> public (UK teachers) gets hold of it. It's about to go on a
> controlled beta, so we'll see.
> 
> As to 'try', as suggested by Stephen Barncard apparently is
> inappropriate. I've never used 'try', so I might do so in another
> context if I can get my head round it (reading about it once wasn't
> enough for me to get the idea, but I learn more slowly these days). I
> guess it comes from a context I don't know.
> 
> Graham
> 
> Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK and France
> 
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Re: The long answer on when to use a function vs command

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Nice article. Thanks.


On Mar 17, 2006, at 10:57 AM, Geoff Canyon wrote:



On Mar 14, 2006, at 8:31 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

Can someone give the long answer on when is it best to use a  
function versus a command? I have a lot to write of both commands  
and functions and have been overly confusing myself. Please give  
at least two examples each with parameters and how to call/use them.


I wrote an article about this. It's at:

http://inspiredlogic.com/articles/functions.html

It gives several examples.

I can summarize it as: Functions Good, Handlers Bad (much of the  
time). ;-)


regards,

Geoff
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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Geoff Canyon]

Not that I disagree with your syntax suggestion -- it looks good to  
me. But:


To avoid the problem stated below, change Jacque's code to:

  insert script of btn "source" into front
  put calc(varA,varB) into localResult
  remove script of btn "source" from front

That way nothing else can intercept the message.

I just posted in another thread an article I wrote on functions:

http://inspiredlogic.com/articles/functions.html

If your functions are written without side effects (they should be)  
then functions can be at whatever level of the message hierarchy they  
need to be, so the issue of how to call them becomes moot -- move  
them to the script of the mainstack if need be.


regards

Geoff


On Mar 17, 2006, at 12:17 AM, Arthur Urban wrote:

Yeah, thought about that too, but I'm tired of accommodating  
transcript's ideosyncracies. A language should accommodate the  
developer at every turn. The problem I see with the solution below,  
is that if any layer in the message path has an identically named  
function, the one I want invoked will be intercepted early, and  
screen the one I actually want. It also kinda obviates the entire  
strategy of invoking a method in another object. :)


You probably already considered these side-effects, but I spelled  
them out for anybody else following along, trying to learn this  
language.


J. Landman Gay wrote:


Or there's a really ugly way too, but it's short:

  insert script of btn "source" into back
  put calc(varA,varB) into localResult
  remove script of btn "source" from back

I know, I know...but it works.


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Re: Is the list down?

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Oops, I forgot about that.  Let me run to my guiness.1


On Mar 17, 2006, at 11:11 AM, Andy Calloway wrote:


St. Patrick's day, we're all drunk.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 17 March 2006 15:32
To: How to use Revolution
Subject: Is the list down?


Haven't seen any posts in 2+ hours...
___


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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Geoff Canyon]

On Mar 16, 2006, at 5:25 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

But, I would like to get just one of the handlers from a script via  
script:put handler "FooBar" of the script of card "Foo" into tBar


Most of the solutions presented so far make assumptions. For example,  
there can be more than one space between "on" and the handler name.


In Navigator I use this to retrieve a list of the handler names:

repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  if word 1 of L is among the items of "on,function,getprop,setprop"  
then

put L & cr after tMenuText
  end if
end repeat

So to get the handler you would be doing something like:

put 0 into tLineNumber
put false into tEnteredHandler
repeat for each line L in tText -- tText is the script
  add 1 to tLineNumber
  if word 1 of L is among the items of "on,function,getprop,setprop"  
and \

word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tStartLineNumber
put true into tEnteredHandler
  end if
  if tEnteredHandler and \
word 1 of L is "end" and \
word 2 of L is tHandlerName then
put tLineNumber into tEndLineNumber
exit repeat
  end if
end repeat

-- if tEnteredHandler is false, we didn't find the handler
-- if tEnteredHandler is true, tStartLineNumber is where it starts,
-- tEndLineNumber is where it ends

regards,

Geoff
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RE: Is the list down?

[Andy Calloway]

St. Patrick's day, we're all drunk. 

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 17 March 2006 15:32
> To: How to use Revolution
> Subject: Is the list down?
> 
> 
> Haven't seen any posts in 2+ hours...
> ___

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Re: How does 'Create Folder' give its result?

[Graham Samuel]

Thanks to all who replied about this. I think Jacque must have been  
right about my somehow delaying looking at 'the result' - it really  
happened but now I can't reproduce it. Anyway, Jim Ault's suggestion



Try this snippet and see what you get

 create folder "cde:/illegal:name/"
  get the result
  if it is not empty then
beep
put it
answer error it -->"can't create that directory"
  end if


Worked exactly as advertised. So what I described was an unexplained  
glitch, possibly something to do with the IDE. The cause of the error  
in the first place is something of a mystery to me, and I wondered if  
it was something to do with the way the RR engine translates path  
strings from Unix-style to Windows-style on the fly. As happens to me  
all too often, a search of the documentation didn't reveal anything  
about this...


Richard G asked


The hard part is determining exactly what went wrong.  When a file or
folder creation error happens, in most cases all the result says is
"can't create file" or "can't create folder" with no further
explanation.  How do you advise your users?
Basically, I tell them to pick a folder for themselves rather than  
letting the app create one for them, as it's failed to do this. It's  
a crude approach and I'm not sure how it's going to play when the  
public (UK teachers) gets hold of it. It's about to go on a  
controlled beta, so we'll see.


As to 'try', as suggested by Stephen Barncard apparently is  
inappropriate. I've never used 'try', so I might do so in another  
context if I can get my head round it (reading about it once wasn't  
enough for me to get the idea, but I learn more slowly these days). I  
guess it comes from a context I don't know.


Graham

Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK and France

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Re: The long answer on when to use a function vs command

[Geoff Canyon]

On Mar 14, 2006, at 8:31 PM, Thomas McGrath III wrote:

Can someone give the long answer on when is it best to use a  
function versus a command? I have a lot to write of both commands  
and functions and have been overly confusing myself. Please give at  
least two examples each with parameters and how to call/use them.


I wrote an article about this. It's at:

http://inspiredlogic.com/articles/functions.html

It gives several examples.

I can summarize it as: Functions Good, Handlers Bad (much of the  
time). ;-)


regards,

Geoff
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Re: [OT] Major Flood in Kauai - Swami??

[Rob Cozens]

All,

The salinity measurements between the tropical latitudes has spiked, 
so, all that evaporated water..it's got to come down somewhere... 
someone said they had 24 free of snow in the midwest somewhere...never 
happened before in their lifetime.   It's happening folks; we were 
warned... this list is not the place to say more, suffice it to say: 
the show begins.




I've seen the PowerPoint presentation on ocean warming that was 
presented to the U.S. Congress by Woods Hole Oceanographic Institute, 
and predict we'll be experiencing more and increasingly severe bad 
weather in the future.


Rob Cozens, Staff Conservator
Mendonoma Marine Life Conservancy

"[T]he international community would require us to prove to them that 
the climate change is adversely affecting us and what impacts it might 
have on our economics and what steps can be taken by us before they 
might consider to act.  This is arrogance at its worst  We are 
where we are because of the excessive consumption needs and greed of 
the developed and more powerful countries.  They, the developed 
countries, must accept their responsibility and take the consequences 
of their actions on others more seriously."


 -- Bikenibeu Paeniu, Prime Minister of the atoll nation of Tuvalu, 1998
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Is the list down?

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Haven't seen any posts in 2+ hours...
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Re: Pass - is it really needed

[Jerry Daniels]

I would like Constellation to read my mind and KNOW when to put in a  
pass and when not.


Jerry

Buy Constellation from Runtime Revolution!
http://revstudio.runrev.com/section/revselect/constellation/



On Mar 17, 2006, at 1:37 AM, Chipp Walters wrote:

Yep, I'd prefer Constellation not place a 'pass' automatically in  
handlers. I'm sure Jerry will add it as a preference some day :-)


-Chipp

But, you gotta love the tabbed browsing AND the GREAT debugger  
which doesn't flake out for no apparent reason. Jerry's told me  
he's worked really hard on making the debugger as robust as  
possible..and it shows.


Thomas McGrath III wrote:
That is correct. I finally see how powerful Constellation is in  
my  work flow.

On Mar 17, 2006, at 12:22 AM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

Thomas McGrath III wrote:

The reason I ask is that when I insert a new command it throws  
in  a  pass with that commands name by default.



This isn't native Revolution behavior. Are you using Constellation?


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Re: Making the move...

[Marielle Lange]

The missing link is the killer app made with it.  RoR was virtually  
unheard of before BaseCamp took off, showing the world how powerful  
and flexible RoR is.  If we had an app of similar scope and appeal  
I have no doubt that as long as the engine is free for such uses  
and the scripts are open source it would attract considerable  
attention.


The possibilities have been there for about 10 years.

So why is it that Java is now in position 1 and Ruby in position 22  
of the most popular programming languages and that none of xtalk,  
hypertalk, transcript is mentioned anwhere in the 100 most popular  
ones (though RealBasic and SmallTalk are)?

http://www.tiobe.com/tpci.htm

Yes, runrev product is great in the sense that it is easier to use by  
beginner programmers than many other things on the market. It is also  
great in the sense that it let advanced programmers do more in less  
time (but not necessarily *better*). It is also great in the sense  
that it let you do out of the box what would take hours if not days  
to set up in other environments.


On this list, all discussions always come back to the same thing.  
This product is so great, this is so evident that everybody should  
adopt it... Runrev too has appeared to think that  to have a great  
product is enough and they had to do nothing but let it sell itself.  
I am afraid, to have a great product is not enough.


What you get with Java, Ruby, Ajax that you don't get with runrev is  
the following.



1) Re-usable LIBRARIES.

Honestly what I have read recently on how revolution is so much  
superior to Director or Java is just a *BIG* joke. Agreed, revolution  
let  you write stuff rapidly. But you have to write the same stuff  
again and again and again and again. But what java does is let you  
write it ONCE and REUSE it again and again and again.



2) Rich and easy to access documentation

If you want to use a java library written by somebody else, simple,  
you get access to the API online and you know what method to call and  
how. You don't need to know *anything* about the inner workings of  
the library. Why is it? Because some some conventions have been  
created which let you comment your script in a very efficient way,  
where the API doc can be automatically generated from these comments.  
http://java.sun.com/j2se/javadoc/. There is *NOTHING* even close to  
this in revolution. Here, if you want to find your way through  
revolution it is by checking up the list as much as you can and post  
your questions on the list (which is an important problem for non  
English speaking persons). These nice little chats on the list are  
without doubt helping both the sender and the receiver feel very good  
about themselves, so priviledged to be in such a great community.  
Let's face it. This way of doing is plain inefficient compared to the  
way of doing in ruby or java communities.



3) Member's sense of investment in making their work freely available

Yes, you can do fantastic stuff with revolution. But you have to  
start from zero and do everything by yourself.
Because of all the effort, it is only worth it if you plan to sell  
your application to a small numbers of high-paying clients.


So Richard, why is it that sourceforge project you are admin of is  
still empty? It was registered in 2001.

http://sourceforge.net/projects/opn-repository
"A project to create a publicly accessible library of handlers for  
the xTalk family of languages. The immediate aim of this project is  
to create a robust library of handlers for the cross platform  
Metacard/RunRev xTalk family of products."
I had a chance to see David's (Bovil) library of handlers: Very  
impressive.


So, Lynch, if you have written such nice and reusable libraries for  
providing better table objects, why not share it with others? Maybe  
then, rather than have each one of us repeat your work, we may be  
able to start, collaboratively, construct tools of this quality:

http://jcharts.sourceforge.net/samples/bar.html
http://big.faceless.org/products/graph/index.jsp
http://www.jfree.org/jfreechart/samples.php
http://www.eteks.com/jeks/index.html
http://www.thechiselgroup.org/projects


4) Structure that encourages and facilitates collaboration

You can, in fact turn your work into reusable libraries, with a bit  
of experience in writing such stacks. People like Eric, Scott, and  
many others have very generously contributed high quality demo  
stacks, but the number of libraries available is just ridiculous  
compared to the ones on rubyforge/sourceforge. In sharp contrast with  
the ruby and java community, these libraries are not shared, there is  
nothing like rubyforge or sourceforge where you can easily provide  
information about your project and receive feedback on them. There is  
nothing like rubyforge or sourceforge where you can get to know of  
the existing projects and get to propose your collaboration.


On top, though it is possible to write libr

Report Builder

[liamlambert]

How do I add Report Builder to the tool menu in 2.7
It is there in a file ToolSet but does not show up in the
tool menu
thanks
Liam Lambert
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
IRELAND


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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Mark Smith]

Commenting would only affect things if the wholeMatches is set to  
true - normally, lineOffset will get the right line even if it's  
commented out, no?


Mark

On 17 Mar 2006, at 12:06, David Burgun wrote:


Hi,

Of course none of the solutions so far work if the function is  
commented out. To make the code 100% foolproof is a lot of work. I  
was doing something similar and found that comments made life  
really difficult.


All the Best
Dave

On 17 Mar 2006, at 11:42, Robert Brenstein wrote:


Perhaps using

set the wholematches to true
put lineOffset("on" && pHandlerName, pScript) into tStart
if tStart is 0 then put lineOffset("function" && pHandlerName,  
pScript) into

tStart
put (lineOffset("end" && pHandlerName, pScript) +1 into tEnd


answer tStart & cr & tEnd

Jim Ault
Las Vegas



Unfortunately, wholematches can't be used, at least for the first  
lineoffset, because there are likely some parameters further in  
that line. The alternative to lineOffset is to use regex.


A truly generic function would need to know whether it searches  
for command or function, because it is possible to have one of  
each with the same name.


Robert
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Re: Get a handler from a script

[David Burgun]

Hi,

Of course none of the solutions so far work if the function is  
commented out. To make the code 100% foolproof is a lot of work. I  
was doing something similar and found that comments made life really  
difficult.


All the Best
Dave

On 17 Mar 2006, at 11:42, Robert Brenstein wrote:


Perhaps using

set the wholematches to true
put lineOffset("on" && pHandlerName, pScript) into tStart
if tStart is 0 then put lineOffset("function" && pHandlerName,  
pScript) into

tStart
put (lineOffset("end" && pHandlerName, pScript) +1 into tEnd


answer tStart & cr & tEnd

Jim Ault
Las Vegas



Unfortunately, wholematches can't be used, at least for the first  
lineoffset, because there are likely some parameters further in  
that line. The alternative to lineOffset is to use regex.


A truly generic function would need to know whether it searches for  
command or function, because it is possible to have one of each  
with the same name.


Robert
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Re: Get a handler from a script

[Robert Brenstein]

Perhaps using

set the wholematches to true
put lineOffset("on" && pHandlerName, pScript) into tStart
if tStart is 0 then put lineOffset("function" && pHandlerName, pScript) into
tStart
put (lineOffset("end" && pHandlerName, pScript) +1 into tEnd


answer tStart & cr & tEnd

Jim Ault
Las Vegas



Unfortunately, wholematches can't be used, at least for the first 
lineoffset, because there are likely some parameters further in that 
line. The alternative to lineOffset is to use regex.


A truly generic function would need to know whether it searches for 
command or function, because it is possible to have one of each with 
the same name.


Robert
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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Mark Smith]

I may be misunderstanding the problem, but is it really a message  
passing problem?


This, in a buttons script will fail:

on mouseUp
  put "1+2" into n1
  put "2+2" into n2
  calc n1,n2
  put the result
end mouseUp

on calc n1,n2
  return n1 + n2
end calc

So if you pass quoted expressions to a handler as parameters, they  
don't get evaluated in the handler unless you evaluate them yourself:


on calc n1,n2
  return value(n1) + value(n2)
end calc

Mark


On 17 Mar 2006, at 09:58, Dick Kriesel wrote:


On 3/17/06 12:47 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


I'm sure it evaluates literals just fine, but it does not
evaluate containers.


This works here:

on mouseUp
  put 1 into t
  send "foo t,t+1"
end mouseUp

on foo
  ask the params
end foo


Do you have a counter-example?

-- Dick


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Re: DRM for Images and Text in Stacks

[Sivakatirswami]

FYI, setting a customProp with the compressed image data actually  
increases the size of the stack if those images were resized to  
larger than their original incoming size (that's expected behavior)  
This presents somewhat of a conundrum. Since the import of a 3 X 5  
jpeg whose original resolution was 72 DPI  (all that is needed for  
the screen) and if is scaled up, storing it as image data (even  
compressed) bloats the stack. Since the "quest" is internet delivery,  
one is looking for the opposite effect: smaller stack sizes. So, one  
gets caught between a rock and a hard place: you want to deliver  
media efficiently but protect them from "theft" but then to protect  
them from theft you have to make a stack that is so big that delivery  
is difficult. hmmm...


I would still opt for a new feature to protect stacks in the IDE.  
Then you simply store images in a substack which are obviously  
unavailable if driven from a standalone player. Another developer  
then tries to open your substack in the IDE and he can't, without a  
password. You shouldn't need push the image data around thru hoops to  
get your DRM.


Without this, we are "stuck with PDF's" as a container for delivery  
of content where DRM is mission critical. We're not talking little  
gif graphics here but high end photos with strict copyright-usage  
issues.


Musings: PDF's are very efficient and one can set security on the  
images to block another Acrobat Professional user from accessing the  
"extract images" menu item (it will be dimmed), but this "act of  
protection" does not impact the size of the container...(the PDF  
still has the images stored in "lo-quality" jpg form). So I'm looking  
to see how that model can be implemented in Rev, but efficiently in  
terms of the final stack file size. The name of the game is getting  
from the vertical rect of the old print world to the horizontal rect  
of the digital revolution. It's actually a very hard nut to crack.


 We recently exported some Key notes with embedded media to Power  
Point: file sizes were so large that internet delivery was  
unthinkable. one would have to put them on DVD disk and sell them to  
cover costs. We are just interested in deploying content, not making  
money on most of this content, and would rather avoid the whole burn  
it, package it, warehouse it, catalog it, sell it, cycle.  We're  
looking into recording the screen thru a whole presentation and  
turning these into movies, but for a full 600X800 rect the  
resulting.mov file will also be enormous, even as an MPEG or h.264...  
It means burning disks again, and packaged-postal delivery. No matter  
how well you do this, that paradigm dramatically decreases  
distribution compared to a web download.


 I'm sitting there knowing full well that the same content deployed  
as a revolution stack could be packaged in 1/20 the space...or  
incrementally delivered in a few separate stacks...and the media  
wants to in the stack (at least photos)  and come very, very close to  
the equivalent files sizes for the same content packaged as PDF's.  
(if not smaller)  Besides-- the compress and decompress thing was  
very sluggish... So secure PDF's of printed pages with vertical  
orientation still rules... and users must scroll and zoom and scroll  
and zoom and scroll and zoom.there is a lot of resistance to this  
among a certain strata of users... InDesign has some great export to  
XML options and with a little standardization on templates in Rev, it  
would not be hard parse a print magazine article-page file and get it  
all repackaged into a horizontal rect. But it comes back to DRM- 
security on the images or substack. Without that, the exercise is  
pointless.


OK , 'nuf said... I'm copying this to support at Rev as a feature  
request. Oh... and text wrap around photos would also be dynamite!


Sivakatirswami
Himalayan Academy Publications
at Kauai's Hindu Monastery
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org
www.Hindu.org


On Mar 07, 2006, at 9:05 AM, Sivakatirswami wrote:



Here's a simple example using compress/decompress:

SETUP:
set the uStuff of this card to compress(the imageData of img 1)
put "" into img 1

PLAYBACK:
set the imageData of img 1 to decompress(the uStuff of this card)


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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 12:47 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I'm sure it evaluates literals just fine, but it does not
> evaluate containers.

This works here:

on mouseUp
  put 1 into t
  send "foo t,t+1"
end mouseUp

on foo
  ask the params
end foo


Do you have a counter-example?

-- Dick


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Re: set the graphic "G" to x,y,....

[Mark Waddingham]

Hi Thierry,


Hi all,

Testing  Rev27 on Win32,  with my demoStack,
i found that the command :

set the graphic "G" to listPoints

is 5 times slower on Rev27 than on  Rev21.

because, i'm using this command in a loop it's really not too  
good :-(


the anti-aliasing is off.

Does anyone saw that and has a clue or is this a bug ?

Regards,
thierry


We've noticed this here too and are looking into it. I've filed bug  
3397 about it for reference.


Warmest Regards,

Mark.

--
 Mark Waddingham ~ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ http://www.runrev.com
   Runtime Revolution ~ User-Centric Development Tools



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Re: Integrating Revolution and Flash

[Jim Ault]

Just a quick response for now, but take a look at AltBrowser2 by Altuit

from Chipp
For those of you who still have not taken a minute to tryout the
altBrowser2 demo all you have to do is launch Revolution and and copy
and paste the below script into your message box:

go URL "http://www.gadgetplugins.com/altbrowser/altBrowserLauncher.rev";



Thomas McGrath III wrote:

> Anyway, bravo to Chipp and team on a superb product, definitely worth
> the effort and you can't beat the price.

On 3/17/06 1:14 AM, "MITTAL Pradeep Kumar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> Hello,
>  
> Is there any way to integrate revolution and flash ?
>  
> Some way of placing  Flash UI on top of Rev Card.
> On top of revolution Object (lets say button ) one can put the flash
> button. And when one clicks then revoluion button script is called.
> Rev can create the XML file and then XML Data can be sent to flash swf
> and vice versa.
>  
> What do you think ? Is there anyone who has tried integrating rev an
> flash?
>  
> Best Regards
> Pradeep


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Integrating Revolution and Flash

[MITTAL Pradeep Kumar]

Hello,
 
Is there any way to integrate revolution and flash ? 
 
Some way of placing  Flash UI on top of Rev Card. 
On top of revolution Object (lets say button ) one can put the flash
button. And when one clicks then revoluion button script is called.
Rev can create the XML file and then XML Data can be sent to flash swf
and vice versa.
 
What do you think ? Is there anyone who has tried integrating rev an
flash?
 
Best Regards
Pradeep
 
 
 
 
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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Jim Ault]

Agreed about only the simplest commands illustrated.
Many is the time what I wanted to do was not covered.  Not even close.
I suppose if the dictionary was the great, all -encompassing resource, this
list would be much smaller and quieter.

I would be really lonely then.  As it is, now I can pretend I have friends.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas


On 3/17/06 12:47 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I've discovered that the dictionary does not always tell the whole
> story. I'm sure it evaluates literals just fine, but it does not
> evaluate containers. Unfortunately the dictionary tends to illustrate
> the simplest of scenarios for a command, not the most likely ones you
> will find yourself using. :)
> 
> The dictionary entry for "send" says:
>> Any parameters are evaluated before they are passed to the send command. For
>> example, the following statement sends the mouseUp message with 2 as the
>> first parameter:
>> 
>>   send "mouseUp 1+1" to button "Example"
>>   


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Re: Making the move...

[Jim Ault]

Hey Dan, thanks for the quick note.
I think I get now.  8080 is already open.  Launch this and the metacard
stack listens without changing any control panel stuff.

Just tried the following:

Safari
http://localhost:8080/~jault/
=== stack running as an app (dbl clk) no problems


Explorer from a Windows XP computer on my local network
Firewall OFF
http://192.168.15.100:8080/~jault/
=== stack running as an app (dbl clk) CRASHED metacard

Exception:  EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)
Codes:  KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x




>From FireFox on the same Mac
http://192.168.15.100:8080/~jault/
=== CRASHED metacard
EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)
KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x


>From Safari on the same Mac
http://192.168.15.100:8080/~jault/
=== CRASHED metacard
Safari can¹t open the page ³http://192.168.15.100:8080/~jault/². The error
was: ³lost network connection² (NSURLErrorDomain:-1005)

now I am confused.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas


On 3/16/06 11:48 PM, "Dan Shafer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Well, at least from the mc stack, you just run it and it seems to intercept
> the call on the designated port. You can manually change the port in the
> launch stack as well.
> 
> PRetty cool stuff.
> 
> 
> On 3/16/06, Jim Ault <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/16/06 6:54 PM, "Richard Gaskin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> The default port in mchttpd is 8080 -- on my Mac I use:
>>> 
>>>  http://localhost:8080/
>> 
>> Woiks very good... cool.
>> 
>> 
>> Is there a tutorial about how to put this in action on my G4 that has a
>> static IP?  I know that Apache would be the default receiver of 8080
>> traffic
>> and I am definitely not a config-mechanic.
>> 
>> 
> --
> ~~
> Dan Shafer, Information Product Consultant and Author
> http://www.shafermedia.com
> Get my book, "Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought"
>> From http://www.shafermediastore.com/tech_main.html
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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Arthur Urban]

I've discovered that the dictionary does not always tell the whole 
story. I'm sure it evaluates literals just fine, but it does not 
evaluate containers. Unfortunately the dictionary tends to illustrate 
the simplest of scenarios for a command, not the most likely ones you 
will find yourself using. :)


The dictionary entry for "send" says:

Any parameters are evaluated before they are passed to the send command. For
example, the following statement sends the mouseUp message with 2 as the
first parameter:

  send "mouseUp 1+1" to button "Example"
  

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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Jim Ault]

>"transcript's ideosyncracies "

I guess the basic issue is that the messaging hierarchy is designed so that
there are several ways of building your functions/procedures into libraries,
script containers, and objects so that they are 'available' in the message
path and yet be dynamic.

You have chosen to put a function in one of the few places it is more
difficult to "call".  You could put this in a background group script or
stack script just as easily and not have the ugly.

 This is "idiosyncracy" is actually fundamental to the "on mouseup" handler
working.. imagine if the button and field objects did NOT have the current
message path... that would be ugly scripting indeed, requiring an id for
everything and no longer being a rapid development environment.

If you do not want to code according to the way
Revolution/Metacard/Supercard/Hypercard is set up, then I agree that you
will generate several instances of ugly code.

>" It also kinda obviates the entire strategy of invoking a method in
>another object."
Depends on the object, since you have many to choose from.  Putting a
function in a button or a field will have the advantage that it won't be
accidentally called by another handler.  This is very useful for user
interfaces, menus, etc.

It is this a dynamic nature of XTalk that gives it avenues of richness.
You can set the scripts of objects, reset them, move them in and out of the
hierarchy over to different stacks, into back or front script position and
more.  Move card to card and have different features and functions on each
one.

You could EVEN have most all of your scripts in text files and set the
script containers of flds, btns, cards, etc when the stack is opened.

Jim Ault
Las Vegas

On 3/17/06 12:09 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> The problem with this solution is that varA and varB are not evaluated.
> In order to use your syntax it would need to be:
> 
> send "calc" && varA & comma & varB to btn "source"
> or
> send merge( "calc [[varA]], [[varB]]" ) to btn "source"
> 
> I find both inelegant readability wise. I think there is a great burden
> on language developers to create a language that goes as far as it can
> toward self-documentation. I feel that the message passing mechanisms
> are a sore spot in transcript. I do not understand why Rev would be
> unable to parse my proposed syntax.
> 
> Thank you for your suggestion, however!
> 
> Andre Garzia wrote:
>> Err...
>> 
>> can't you make it a Handler use send and check for the result???
>> 
>> send "calc VarA, VarB" to btn "source"
>> put the result into localResult
>> 
>> of course calc is not a function but a handler with a return statement.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> andre
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mar 17, 2006, at 2:55 AM, Jim Ault wrote:
>> 
 I'm not sure that this is the right direction for any language to be
 headed. Please explain why we can't have the following syntax:
 
   put calc(varA,varB) of btn "source" into localResult
 
>> 
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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Arthur Urban]

Thanx for the alternate examples you provided. I addressed their 
shortcomings in other posts in the thread, so I won't reiterate. :)


While I will continue to entertain other "solutions", the main thrust of 
my initial post was to propose a new, clearer syntax for message 
calling. One I think Rev could handle easily.


As function:

 put calc(varA,varB) of btn "source" into localResult

As command/message

 send calc varA,varB to btn "source"

Clearly, everything between 'send' and 'to' is the message followed by it's 
arguments; very simple to parse. Why send appears to be limited to a single 
string argument (under the hood), is odd to me. Even if varA was a chunk 
expression (char 1 to 2), Rev is smart enough to know that you can't send a 
message to a chunk expression, ergo keep looking for an object reference when 
parsing.

I think if developers and casual coders could easily assemble complex messages, 
they would be more inclined to keep the behavior with the data, leading to 
greater reusability. I imagine I'm a voice in the wilderness here.


Jim Ault wrote:

Ooops, I got the wrong idea from your use of value(merge... etc

You can use the 'send' or 'call' commands to use a function outside the
message hierarchy, even in another stack.

As Andre has shown

send "calc VarA, VarB" to btn "source"
put the result into localResult

where...
on calc VarA, VarB
...do work here
return theVal
end calc

or

insert the script of btn "source" into back
--now the handler(s) are in the message hierarchy
 put calc(varA,varB) into localResult
remove the script of btn "source" from back --now or later

Jim Ault
Las Vegas

On 3/16/06 9:43 PM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

  

I think a new syntax needs to be made available for calling functions
outside the message hierarchy. The existing mechanism does not lend
itself to high readability or maintainability. Consider the following,
if you will:

  put 1 into varA
  put 2 into varB
  put value( merge("calc([[varA]],[[varB]]))", btn "source" ) into
localResult

further, if I need to protect the integrity of the variable passed it
begins to look like this:

  put "1,2,3" into varA
  put 4 into varB
  put value( merge("calc([[quote&varA"e]],[[varB]]))", btn "source"
) into localResult

I'm not sure that this is the right direction for any language to be
headed. Please explain why we can't have the following syntax:

  put calc(varA,varB) of btn "source" into localResult

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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/17/06 12:09 AM, "Arthur Urban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> The problem with this solution is that varA and varB are not evaluated.
>
> Andre Garzia wrote:
>> send "calc VarA, VarB" to btn "source"

The dictionary entry for "send" says:

Any parameters are evaluated before they are passed to the send command. For
example, the following statement sends the mouseUp message with 2 as the
first parameter:

  send "mouseUp 1+1" to button "Example"


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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Dick Kriesel]

On 3/16/06 10:32 PM, "J. Landman Gay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Or there's a really ugly way too, but it's short:
> 
>insert script of btn "source" into back
>put calc(varA,varB) into localResult
>remove script of btn "source" from back
> 
> I know, I know...but it works.

One person's ugly is another person's beauty, it seems. The technique very
simply solved a current problem for me.

On 3/16/06 11:39 PM, "Chipp Walters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I really like 'call' as it doesn't create a context for the
> handler/function.

My problem was that "call" and "value()" change the target, breaking some of
my handlers.

Thanks to Jacque and Jim.

-- Dick


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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Arthur Urban]

Yeah, thought about that too, but I'm tired of accommodating 
transcript's ideosyncracies. A language should accommodate the developer 
at every turn. The problem I see with the solution below, is that if any 
layer in the message path has an identically named function, the one I 
want invoked will be intercepted early, and screen the one I actually 
want. It also kinda obviates the entire strategy of invoking a method in 
another object. :)


You probably already considered these side-effects, but I spelled them 
out for anybody else following along, trying to learn this language.


J. Landman Gay wrote:


Or there's a really ugly way too, but it's short:

  insert script of btn "source" into back
  put calc(varA,varB) into localResult
  remove script of btn "source" from back

I know, I know...but it works.


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Re: Developer Annoyance #1

[Arthur Urban]

The problem with this solution is that varA and varB are not evaluated. 
In order to use your syntax it would need to be:


send "calc" && varA & comma & varB to btn "source"
or
send merge( "calc [[varA]], [[varB]]" ) to btn "source"

I find both inelegant readability wise. I think there is a great burden 
on language developers to create a language that goes as far as it can 
toward self-documentation. I feel that the message passing mechanisms 
are a sore spot in transcript. I do not understand why Rev would be 
unable to parse my proposed syntax.


Thank you for your suggestion, however!

Andre Garzia wrote:

Err...

can't you make it a Handler use send and check for the result???

send "calc VarA, VarB" to btn "source"
put the result into localResult

of course calc is not a function but a handler with a return statement.

Cheers
andre



On Mar 17, 2006, at 2:55 AM, Jim Ault wrote:


I'm not sure that this is the right direction for any language to be
headed. Please explain why we can't have the following syntax:

  put calc(varA,varB) of btn "source" into localResult



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