Re: me vs. this?

2005-08-07 Thread Victor Eijkhout


On Aug 7, 2005, at 8:06 AM, Charles Hartman wrote:

There's a logical "this" group, field, etc., when one is selected,  
clicked . . .


So "this" makes sense in any piece of code that is in, or was called  
by a handler.


V.
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Re: Infinite-precision arithmetic

2005-05-25 Thread Victor Eijkhout


On May 24, 2005, at 3:49 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Doesn't the Gnu Scientific Library have this stuff?
   No. While the GSL includes an admirably wide range of functions 
(and I may
steal some of their algorithms...), every last one of them is of 
strictly
*finite* precision, i.e. it's only good for a *finite* number of 
places of

accuracy. See above for the whole point of what I'm doing here.



Ok, how abou the Gnu Multi-Precision library: http://www.swox.com/gmp/

I thought it was part of GSL.

V.

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Re: Infinite-precision arithmetic

2005-05-24 Thread Victor Eijkhout


On May 24, 2005, at 5:02 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   I've just started to work on a suite of handlers for 
infinite-precision

calculations.


Wouldn't it be easier to interface to an existing bigint library? 
Doesn't the Gnu Scientific Library have this stuff?


V.

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Re: To Rev or not to Rev

2005-04-30 Thread Victor Eijkhout
On Apr 30, 2005, at 10:31 AM, Derek Bump wrote:
What programming language is not object oriented? Everything is an 
object.
Object-oriented refers to programmatic objects. Classes, inheritance, 
polymorphism. RR has very little of that.

V.
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Re: [ANN] Reminder - online scripting conferences

2005-04-29 Thread Victor Eijkhout
On Apr 29, 2005, at 4:59 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:
11.30am EST (3.30pm GMT)
I thought EST was GMT-5.
V.
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RE: Looking for kind soul...

2003-09-24 Thread Victor Eijkhout
The seem to have jumped .7
10.2.7 was a release that only shipped with the first G5s.
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Re: Best way to set up an idle timer

2003-08-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout

I once tried using this "send" trick for time critical stuff, but 
that doesn't work if the machine goes to sleep.
I wonder what is a good way to make sure there is a wake up.  Or if 
there is one.
There must be, though system dependent. I've seen an mp3 alarm clock 
which could wake up my Mac to wake me up.

And it was coded in Real Basic.

Oo them's fightin' words :-)
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Re: Best way to set up an idle timer

2003-08-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout
	send "logoutMessage" to me in 300 seconds
If the machine goes to sleep before the 300 seconds are over this 
doesn't wake it up, right?

I once tried using this "send" trick for time critical stuff, but 
that doesn't work if the machine goes to sleep. What's more, I get 
the impression that after the machine wakes up, the sleep period is 
not counted in the specified interval.
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RR & binary formats (Re: Reading MP3 tags

2003-08-03 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Fortunately the spec makes it pretty easy.
Mp3 is a binary format. Is that header you are reading 7-bit ascii? 
Would RR be able to handle 8-bit data?

I was wondering the other day if I could use revolution to write an 
sf2 (soundfont) editor. Just splitting up and combining existing 
soundfonts. Naively I thought that RR wouldn't be able to handle 
binary data. Maybe it could.

Anyone any thoughts?
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Re: [ANN] News Reader Stack Available

2003-06-18 Thread Victor Eijkhout
this project started me thinking about the
development of specialized Web browsers or "MiniBrowsers" whose goal is to
access and display publicly available HTML in focused and unique ways.
Hm... Sherlock? Watson?
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Re: standalone has plainly readable transcript

2003-06-13 Thread Victor Eijkhout
As a documentation professional,
Hmmm Amateur with delusions of grandeur? (Actually, on my private 
web page you find my main claim to fame.)

surely you recognize the dynamic that
occurs once the meme of "the docs are inadequate" grows legs:
Yeah. Point taken, and apologies for the overly broad generalisation.

Given your experience, what specific remedies would you
recommend?
I haven't started working with version 2 yet, so with the proviso 
that I haven't seen the updated docs: I think a lot of complicated 
systems are complicated partly because of the interactions between 
the parts, not the number of parts or any intrinsic property of them 
as such. Thus I favour a style of explanation where the explanation 
by command/keyword or even by category is secondary to one by topic. 
As an alternative to "topic", think "environment", taking that word 
fairly in the abstract. An environment is only partly a distinct part 
of the system, it is also a mode of working, or a set of common 
idioms to work with. Identifying these topics/environments is a good 
way to bring together conceptually related commands and keywords.

Remember the "I should have made the connection" comment that 
triggered my initial post? I think the big advantage to this approach 
is that you make a number of these connections for the reader. 
Instead of emphasis on desrcribing commands and keywords you get an 
emphasis on describing common "idioms", ready-made connections 
between the commands and keywords. Of course you can't give all 
possible connections in a manual, but giving a number of them gives 
the reader a more operative definition, rather than a dictionary 
definition.

Anyway, that's my opinion as only a some-time tech writer. (Check out 
http://www.eijkhout.net/tbt for my credentials.)
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Re: standalone has plainly readable transcript

2003-06-12 Thread Victor Eijkhout
 I should have made the connection
Any time you say that, it really indicates a deficiency in the 
manual. As a manual writer myself, I don't approve of the "you can't 
say it wasn't there" style of technical writing.
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Re: Consonants (was How to open Richmond's bits of fluff....)

2003-06-12 Thread Victor Eijkhout
a guy like me who has negative language aptitude for language.
QED

:-)

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Re: Books on RunRev

2003-06-01 Thread Victor Eijkhout
In the extensive discussions regarding Nine to Five Reports I 
haven't noticed the mention of one incredibly important feature - 
that it came with a truly amazing online manual numbering some 1700+ 
pages which not only provided detailed explanations use and 
scripting examples of all of the special functions they had 
implement in their related products (Reports, Index, & Letters) but 
full documentation on Hypercard itself and extensive discussion on 
scripting,
Quite. I never used the 925 reports, but I had this manual (did they 
give it away for free?) and used it as my main Hypercard reference.
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Re: Is there a way to interrupt a stack?

2003-04-01 Thread Victor Eijkhout
command + period?
I thought that didn't work, but that was because I couldn't get one 
in between two "answer" dialogs. In the end that did it, though.

So you can not break out of an answer dialog, it seems.
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Is there a way to interrupt a stack?

2003-03-31 Thread Victor Eijkhout
I'm running a stack inthe development environment, and it's stuck in 
an endless loop. Is there a way of stopping it?

To make this fun, it's popping up an endless stream of "answer" 
dialogs, so I don't have much of an opportunity of interrupting it.
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Re: Matrix inversion

2003-03-30 Thread Victor Eijkhout
For anyone who does numerical work I highly recommend the Numerical 
Recipes books.
I think you'll find almost anyone doing numerical work professionally 
disagreeing with that :-)

Anyway, it looks like a factorisation with partial pivoting, so 
that's not too bad from a pov of stability. However, coding systems 
solution (the standard answer to "how do I invert a matrix" is "you 
don't; you probably only need to solve a system") in an interpreted 
language wil be very slow compared to even a straight Fortran or C 
code, let alone an optimised code. If you are going to do this with 
matrices of any macroscopic size, you'd better figure out how to 
interface RR to a fortran or c object file.
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I don't understand error messages

2003-03-30 Thread Victor Eijkhout
 * There was an Execution Error at 12:15:11 PM
Error description:  Function: error in function handler
Object: field id 1357 of card id 1002 of stack "/TiBook hard 
drive/Users/victorle/Documents/Revolution programming/ATC.rev"

--answer "create" && nam,i,j,alt,idir,jdir

Value: is_exit

This seems to claim that there is an error in a commented line?!
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RE: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one.

2003-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout
 It seems
more logical to always assume variables will be evaluated prior to script
execution.
Yes, but the man page doesn't say that it's a variable: it says that 
the property thing in the "set" statement is the name of a 
property. The name. Not "a variable evaluating to a name". And I 
think that needs to be pointed out explicitly, because the obvious 
possibilities are 1/ only the actual name is allowed 2/ any 
expression giving a name. I don't understand at all why here only a 
name or a variable is allowed.
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RE: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one.

2003-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Yes it's a feature and it's a very powerful one
Ok, I'll accept that.

But the man page is wrong: it says (and I still don't know how to 
cut/paste from the documentation; is that possible?) "The 
property is a built-in property name or a custom property 
name."

That should be "is a property name, or a variable or parameter having 
a property name as value".

Agree?

Or does this follow from some statement in the manual that I haven't found yet?
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Re: Rev math

2003-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Yes.  Use 14.  (49 bits floating point)  Use less if you need exact
equality.
Thanks, Dar. So, does that mean we can take numbers of any length, 
go ahead and perform the operation, and then trust the result to 14 
digits,
Well, the usual roundoff error analysis of floating point arithmetic 
still applies. You can always come up with computations that 
completely lose your accuracy. For instance, suppose that
a=0.12345678901234 is the result of a computation and is accurate to 
these 14 digits, and
b=0.12345678901233 is likewise accurate to 14 digits, then a-b is 
0.10 times 10-to-the-minus-fourteen, but it's only 
accurate to one digit.

 or do we first have to first preprocess the operands to a certain 
number of digits according to the type of operation?
No, you must avoid operations that are inherently inaccurate. For 
instance, in the formula for the solutions of a quadratic equation 
only one of the plus/minus possibilities is guaranteed to be 
accurate. For a stable computation of the second you need to use a 
different formula completely.

Numerical accuracy is not trivial. Most people don't see it until 
they take a (graduate?) course in numerical mathematics or 
computational computer science.
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Re: T-Shirts now available

2003-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Greetings!

By the power of popular demand, you have achieved Revolution T-Shirts! You
can now order these, and a range of other products, from
http://www.cafeshop.com/runrev
Not found, and cafeshop itself is up for sale...

Google-de-google

Ah.

http://www.cafeshops.com/runrev
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Re: Launch Command

2003-03-16 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Thanks  to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works!  I've tried:

Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app"
Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app"
Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app"
What's the name of your drive? "Hard Disk", "HD", or "Macintosh HD"? 
Whichever it is, the other two of course won't work.

If it's a name with a space, just for the heck of it try escaping the 
space: "Macintosh\ HD".
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Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of expansion

2003-03-16 Thread Victor Eijkhout
This bug took me an hour or two to find. I don't think I like it.

on tt arg
  put arg
end tt
on t
  set the aaa of me to "a"
  put 1 into a
  send "tt" && the aaa of me to me
end t
Guess what the outcome of `send "t" to field "whatever" is...

Reading the man page for "send". It says (I couldn't manage to 
cut/paste from the dictionary. is that possible?) "If the message is 
more than one word, it must be enclosed in double quotes". That is 
clearly not true in the above case.

It also says "Any parameters are evaluted", giving  as example. That is less than the whole truth: based on this I 
would write  which of course is completely 
incorrect.

Anyway, solution:

send "tt" && quote & the aaa of me & quote

I guess the correct statement would be

"send expr to  :

the "expr" is an expression that yields a string of the form "command 
arg1,arg2,...". The "argn" expressions are evaluated in the corrent 
context, and the resulting command is sent to the whatever handler."

Ok, quiz time: what is the output of

on t arg1,arg2
  put arg1
end t
on tt
  set the aa of me to 3,4
  send "t" && the aa of me to me
end tt
(I guess, for clarity, another clause is could be added in the above 
definition.)
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Re: Is there a reverse video mode for text in fields?

2003-03-14 Thread Victor Eijkhout
The man page for "textstyle" lists a couple of possibilities, but 
not inverse video. The keywords "inverse" and "reverse" don't seem 
to apply to text.
Flip "backgroundcolor" and "foregroundcolor".

And don't misspell it "colour".

We apologise for the interruption.

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Is there a reverse video mode for text in fields?

2003-03-14 Thread Victor Eijkhout
The man page for "textstyle" lists a couple of possibilities, but not 
inverse video. The keywords "inverse" and "reverse" don't seem to 
apply to text.
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Pricing.

2003-03-12 Thread Victor Eijkhout
But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the
researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite affordable.
Hm? The educational (single user) price is 1.5 times the small 
business price. I'm a university educator, but the affordable ($99) 
price is only for K12 educators.

It seems the only option for me, a educational / hobby / freeware 
programmer is the $300 a year for a small business license. I bought 
1.1.1 as a HC crossgrade more than a year ago. I've sent RR about a 
dozen stacks that crash their system. I have not seen any bug fix 
releases, so I guess I can hack my way around the bugs, or pay $300. 
I! do! not! like! this!
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Re: license issues (was mystery exception)

2003-03-12 Thread Victor Eijkhout
There was a whole generation of AI researchers and LISP programmers 
who learned that self-modifying code is a way to do some pretty cool 
stuff.
Not to mention anonynous lambda expressions. I can easily see myself 
writing a 10 line dynamically compiled function if I got back into 
that style of programming again.
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Re: Can I call a function that is in a different script?

2003-03-10 Thread Victor Eijkhout
At 0:50 -0800 2003/03/10, Jan Schenkel wrote:
Why not just use the 'value' function ?
That's what the sons of thunder suggested. It works for me.
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Re: Can I call a function that is in a different script?

2003-03-09 Thread Victor Eijkhout
At 12:01 -0500 2003/03/09, Richard Gaskin wrote:
 > Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call
 it from a handler in another field's script?
See the call commond.
That seems to be for handlers; I needed a function because I need the 
return result.

In fact, "call" is almost like "send", and in my case "call" would be 
precisely wrong, because I want a function result based on local data 
of the other handler, not of the calling handler, the way "call" 
would imply.

The Son of Thunder had the winning idea on 
http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/scrp001.htm
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Can I call a function that is in a different script?

2003-03-08 Thread Victor Eijkhout
Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call 
it from a handler in another field's script?

(I tried finding this in the docs, but no luck. "Function" doesn't 
seem to appear in the development guide, at least for as far as I 
could discern. I couldn't figure out how to search through the 
development guide.)
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How do I measure character width?

2003-03-06 Thread Victor Eijkhout
I want to put some characters in a field, equally spaced horizontally 
and vertically. Meaning, my lines are "A  B  C  D" etc, and want the 
vertical distance between lines the same as the horizontal distance 
between A and B. I'm using a monospaced font.

I've found the textHeight parameter. Now how do I measure the width 
of a string such as "A  " so that I can set the text height to that?
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Can I wake a sleeping Mac?

2003-02-24 Thread Victor Eijkhout
I'm trying to write an alarm clock. So I send a wake message to a 
handler in so many ticks.

Unfortunately my Mac goes to sleep, and the ongoing tick count gets 
delayed until it wakes up. Which is after *I* wake it.

Irony written all over this story, I know.

So, can runrev wake a sleeping computer? I know that it is possible 
in principle, because Apple's software can do it, and I've seen 
RealBasic programs that did it.
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Re: Card Size

2002-04-26 Thread Victor Eijkhout

Just a consideration or two:

video projectors often don't go beyond 800x600, so if you need to 
give a presentation, don't go beyond that.

The other day I needed to install some software on my Mac and it 
conflicted with something. When I started up without extensions, the 
monitor came up in default 800x600 resolution, and I couldn't hit the 
OK button on the installer because it was not on my screen.

In other words: my vote is for 800x600.

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Re: Nasty script stays disobedient

2002-04-08 Thread Victor Eijkhout

At 12:03 -0400 8/4/2002, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>This look like a bug.
>
>It should work, but doesn't, even with the latest version...
>
>Please bug-report it.

I did. Several weeks ago. I'm underwhelmed that it wasn't fixed in 
the final release.

Here's the workaround:

At 21:45 -0800 5/4/2002, Geoff Canyon wrote:
>send "choose browse tool" to me in 1 tick


>  > Should I spank it? If so, how and where?
>
>Yes, hard and "op de bloote kunt" ;-)

Ahem.

s/u/o/ if you please.

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How can I foreground an app?

2002-04-01 Thread Victor Eijkhout

(With my apologies for that case of verbing in the subject :-)

I'm writing an alarm clock. When the alarm goes off it would be nice 
if the app became foremost, so that the user could hit the Any Key to 
snooze the alarm.

So how do I tell an app that's not foremost, or maybe even hidden to 
become foremost?
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Re: Editing buttons (fields, ... ) in browse mode

2002-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout

At 12:09 -0500 17/3/2002, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Try control clic on the object, a pop up menu gives you access to the
>propertiesŠ

Not Mac OSX, 1.1.1b1, objects with mouseup handle. Those simply 
activate the mouseup handler.

I do get such a popup if the pointer tool is active, but I would like 
to investigate the custom properties while in browse mode.

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Can I resize properties > field?

2002-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout

I want to take a look at the contents of a field in the properties 
box. Problem is that the lines in the field are pretty long, and the 
properties box is pretty narrow, so it's hard to read because of the 
wrapping.

It seems I can only resize the properties dialog vertically, not 
horizontally, if I'm looking at the field contents. (Why? After all I 
resize both ways when I'm looking at the script.) I've tried resizing 
while holding every modifier key and combo on my keyboard but no 
luck. Help?

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Editing buttons (fields, ... ) in browse mode

2002-03-17 Thread Victor Eijkhout

Ok, with Option-Command I can open the script of a button while I'm 
in browse mode. But why doesn't hte properties box show me the other 
properties, such as the custom properties. I can edit the custom 
properties of a stack while in browse mode. What do I need to do to 
edit the properties of a button while in browse mode?

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Can I get the stack window over the error/properties windows?

2002-03-08 Thread Victor Eijkhout

A simple click in the title bar doesn't do the trick. (OSX, in case it matters)
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Can I edit button scripts in browse mode?

2002-03-08 Thread Victor Eijkhout

If RunRev is in browse mode, you can still hit command-K to get to 
the stack script. However, for reasons that I don't get (hint: 
explain it to me, please) the popup there gives me only the stack 
scripts. To get to a popup list of button (field...) scripts I need 
to go out of browse mode, click a button, blah blah. (And the list of 
button &c scripts does not list the stack scripts. Why?)

I would like to edit button scripts in browse mode without having to 
click 500 objects. Is that possible?

If not, is there a reason for this?
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Is there a traceback?

2002-03-08 Thread Victor Eijkhout

(I may have asked this before, but don't remember seeing an answer)

Is there a way to get a list of "through what handler calls did I get 
here" if I run into an error?
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re: Is there a message watcher?

2002-02-26 Thread Victor Eijkhout

>From: Devin Asay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: Is there a Message Watcher
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>One of my favorite HC development tools is the Message Watcher.  I've
>looked for this but haven't found anything equivalent in Rev.  Am I
>just overlooking something?


That, and how do I get a traceback of handles if an error occurs.

I can open the script. Great. But how did I get there?

Is debugging with breakpoints possible? (Man, I love gdb...)
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Re: "remove from memory" doesn't

2002-01-21 Thread Victor Eijkhout

>  > I have a stack in file "foo.rev". Revolution is open; I save the
>  > stack and do "close and remove from memory".
>>
>>  In the finder I copy foo.rev => foo copy.rev; I drag this stack onto
>>  Revolution.
>>
>>  Now if I click a button for editing I get a message "A stack with the
>>  same name as the one you are trying to load is already open"
>
>What really is happening here is that the "name" of the file is not the name
>of the stack. So both 'foo.rev' and 'foo copy.rev' are probably called "foo"
>in RR. That confuses both RR and us humans.
>
>The solution is that you purge the stack in the application manager before
>opening the copy.

Ok. But what on earth does "close and purge from memory" do? It 
sounds pretty definite to me. It sounds like it would close it and 
purge it from memory.
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What is the difference between clicking and "send mouseup"

2002-01-06 Thread Victor Eijkhout

What is the difference between clicking ona  button with a "mouseup" 
handler, and typing  in the message 
box, the latter divided up in cases where the hand and the pointer 
tool are enabled?

Here's the behaviour that I see:
message box, pointer tool enabled: nothing happens
message box, hand tool enabled: error message
Script compile error:
Error description:
clicking on the button: it works, or sometimes rev crashes

I have no idea even where to start analysing this situation.
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"create" command jumps from "run" to "edit" mode

2001-12-29 Thread Victor Eijkhout

If I'm developing a stack in Rev, issuing the "create" command makes 
Rev jump from "run" to "edit" mode.

For example, I have a button with script
on mouseup
  create field "test"
end mouseup

I click on the hand, I click on the button, and now the pointer is 
the active tool.

What's happening here?
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match{chunk,text} problem

2001-12-29 Thread Victor Eijkhout

I'm going out of my mind.

on mouseup
   put "a/b/c" into fn
   put 0 into n1
   put 0 into n2
   matchchunk(fn,"([^/]*)$",n1,n2)
   put n1 && n2
end mouseup

  * There was a Script Compile Error at 4:07:01 PM
Error description:  Expression: missing ')' before factor
Object: field id 1239 of card id 1002 of stack "/Macintosh 
HD/Users/victorle/Documents/Revolution programming/alarm.rev"

matchchunk(fn,"([^/]*)$",n1,n2)
----
Value:

What obvious thing am I overlooking?

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First impressions (never mind that previous post)

2001-12-29 Thread Victor Eijkhout

The error was entirely mine.

I would like to know though what I'm doing that Revolution crashes so often.

It seems like a problem with trying to create buttons &c with names 
that already exist, but I can't pinpoint it exactly.
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Scripts do not get saved with crash

2001-12-29 Thread Victor Eijkhout

If I save my stack, and then Revolution crashes (which it does every 
5 minutes), the changes I last made do somehow not get saved. Or 
maybe changes to the main stack script get saved, but not the ones to 
a button script.

Is this a known phenomenon?
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