Re: Multitouch (suite...)

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, René Micout wrote:

> The future ?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWz1KbknIZk&feature=player_embedded

Re: the hardware interface -- seems like a a keyless keyboard
Re: the software interface -- seems like reorientation of existing solutions

I would say this solution is as they describe it: building upon the mouse
level of remote interaction with data/content on a display.  It's probably
more of a short term future.

In my view, the long term future of touch would encompass *direct*
manipulation of the data/content, as opposed to remote.  Whether this is
done via 2D or 3D interaction remains to be seen, but the points made in the
video about working for extended periods of time with arms raised, or head
tilted down are valid -- these are not good.  What I would question is their
claim that obstructing the content with hands is a negative aspect of
current multitouch solutions.  I would argue that the current method of
using hands to directly manipulate content provides more substantial
feedback to the user, making them feel more in control of what they are
doing.  This is not something to be quickly discounted.

I don't know if there is a "comfortable" human-computer touch solution out
there that offers direct manipulation of content, but that's what I see as
*future*.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design


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Re: Multitouch

[Richard Gaskin]

Scott Rossi wrote:


Recently, Richard Gaskin wrote:


I just submitted a request in the RQCC for this:
<http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=8446>


Hi Richard:

I went ahead and voted for this but I'm curious how you expect to implement
such a thing?  It's true that OS's are gaining support for the tech, but
folks are going to need specialized hardware to accept input.  Do you expect
many people will ditch their current laptop or flatscreen just to get
gesture input capability?

For myself, I am quite interested in the applications (am waiting for a
small touch screen to do some experiments as I write this) but it seems like
an expensive jump for many "average" users.  Am curious as to what your
expectations are.


I expect Rev to make my toast and coffee in the morning and look good 
doing it!  Is that too much to ask? :)


I recently bought a dirt-cheap netbook from Asus, well under $300, and 
it's  an older model yet it supports multitouch in its Linux-based OS. 
OS X does too, and it's a big part of the Win 7 API.  I'd be surprised 
if the laptop you have now doesn't support it.


Sure, it's hardware-dependent, but so is Rev's multi-monitor support: if 
you only have one monitor you don't get to use it. ;)


Multitouch is becoming so prevalent these days that it seems safe to at 
least take the early steps to explore the similarities of the various 
APIs that are provided by the platforms Rev runs on, and send messages 
from devices that can use those APIs.


Like contextual menus, it may be good during these transitional years to 
have whatever functionality you provide available more than one way. 
It's good practice to have anything in a context menu also appear in the 
menu bar, and if you provide support for, say, multitouch pinch you'll 
probably want to also provide a zoom button for those who don't yet have 
a multitouch-capable system.


But the number of such systems is dwindling, daily (though oddly enough 
the new Droid phone doesn't support multitouch in the US, but the 
Android 2.0 OS supports it and European versions of the device support it).


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World
 Rev training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
 Webzine for Rev developers: http://www.revjournal.com
 revJournal blog: http://revjournal.com/blog.irv
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Re: Multitouch

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> I just submitted a request in the RQCC for this:
> 

Hi Richard:

I went ahead and voted for this but I'm curious how you expect to implement
such a thing?  It's true that OS's are gaining support for the tech, but
folks are going to need specialized hardware to accept input.  Do you expect
many people will ditch their current laptop or flatscreen just to get
gesture input capability?

For myself, I am quite interested in the applications (am waiting for a
small touch screen to do some experiments as I write this) but it seems like
an expensive jump for many "average" users.  Am curious as to what your
expectations are.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design


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Re: Multitouch (suite...)

[Mark Wieder]

Richard-

Friday, November 20, 2009, 8:12:27 AM, you wrote:

> René Micout wrote:

>> The future ?
>> 
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWz1KbknIZk&feature=player_embedded

> I don't know if it's the future, but it represents some very bold 
> thinking in useful directions.  Very provocative.

...as long as the future has a soundtrack featuring a cheesy Casio
organ set on demo mode. That's what initially turned me off to the
whole idea, but once I got to that point:

I notice they don't mention the difficulty of moving both hands from
the touchpanel to the keyboard when you might actually need to start
typing

I much prefer the linux desktop's idea of multiple spaces than the
cluttered windows approach

having used the Sugar interface on the XO device and repeatedly
running into the menu areas at the sides by accident I'm not at all
taken with the idea of the Global operations menu or the application
menu

at 7:50 or so they seem to be taking credit for inventing the dock

...so yes, provocative in that it provoked this rant.

-- 
-Mark Wieder
 mwie...@ahsoftware.net

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Re: Multitouch (suite...)

[René Micout]

I look every day at a french site named Mac4ever (yes it is french !!) :
http://www.mac4ever.com/news/
René

Le 20 nov. 09 à 17:12, Richard Gaskin a écrit :

I don't know if it's the future, but it represents some very bold  
thinking in useful directions.  Very provocative.


How did you come across that?


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Re: Multitouch (suite...)

[Richard Gaskin]

René Micout wrote:


The future ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWz1KbknIZk&feature=player_embedded


I don't know if it's the future, but it represents some very bold 
thinking in useful directions.  Very provocative.


How did you come across that?

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World
 Rev training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
 Webzine for Rev developers: http://www.revjournal.com
 revJournal blog: http://revjournal.com/blog.irv
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Re: Multitouch (suite...)

[Björnke von Gierke]

No

On 20 Nov 2009, at 12:02, René Micout wrote:


The future ?


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Multitouch (suite...)

[René Micout]

The future ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWz1KbknIZk&feature=player_embedded

René___
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Re: Multitouch

[René Micout]

Hello Richard,
I added 5 votes...
Bons souvenirs de Paris
René


Le 18 nov. 09 à 19:50, Richard Gaskin a écrit :


Jim Bufalini wrote:

I submitted a proposal for it to the improve-list a couple weeks  
ago.

Number of replies: 0.
I just searched my email client for the word multitouch on the  
Improve List

and came up with 0 hits. Could this be why you got 0 replies? ;-)


It's in the list archives so it seems to have gone through.  It was  
part of a discussion on group scrolling; not sure if I used the  
work "multitouch" per se, but searching for any of the words in my  
earlier post should bring it up.  It was sent 1 November.


I just submitted a request in the RQCC for this:
<http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=8446>

Feel free to help flesh out the proposed ideas there.

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World
 Rev training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
 Webzine for Rev developers: http://www.revjournal.com
 revJournal blog: http://revjournal.com/blog.irv
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Re: Multitouch

[René Micout]

Le 18 nov. 09 à 18:51, Robert Man a écrit :


I personnaly do not think it is so important for apps,


Hello !
That depends on what applications they are. For my part, I create  
music applications (for my own use) and my goal is to control actions  
on a touch screen (for now I use a pen) ... A bit like  
"Lemur" (french guys) :


http://www.jazzmutant.com/

Bons souvenirs de Paris
René

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Re: Multitouch

[Richard Gaskin]

Jim Bufalini wrote:


I submitted a proposal for it to the improve-list a couple weeks ago.
Number of replies: 0.


I just searched my email client for the word multitouch on the Improve List
and came up with 0 hits. Could this be why you got 0 replies? ;-)


It's in the list archives so it seems to have gone through.  It was part 
of a discussion on group scrolling; not sure if I used the work 
"multitouch" per se, but searching for any of the words in my earlier 
post should bring it up.  It was sent 1 November.


I just submitted a request in the RQCC for this:
<http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=8446>

Feel free to help flesh out the proposed ideas there.

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World
 Rev training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
 Webzine for Rev developers: http://www.revjournal.com
 revJournal blog: http://revjournal.com/blog.irv
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RE: Multitouch

[Robert Man]

Yes! Definitely YES. Good to remind. Although I guess they re' at it somehow.
I personnaly do not think it is so important for apps, but it is as far as
communication is concerned, to my view it s to widden the use of revtalk and
particularly for revlets which are meant to be "grand public".


-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n4.nabble.com/Multitouch-tp623363p623519.html
Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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RE: Multitouch

[Jim Bufalini]

Richard Gaskin wrote:

 
> I submitted a proposal for it to the improve-list a couple weeks ago.
> Number of replies: 0.

I just searched my email client for the word multitouch on the Improve List
and came up with 0 hits. Could this be why you got 0 replies? ;-)

Aloha from Hawaii,

Jim Bufalini

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Re: Multitouch

[René Micout]

Yes ! Yes ! Yes !

Where submit ? or reply ?

René


Le 18 nov. 09 à 14:57, Richard Gaskin a écrit :


I submitted a proposal for it to the improve-list a couple weeks  
ago. Number of replies: 0.



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Re: Multitouch

[Richard Gaskin]

René Micout wrote:


Soon with RunRev ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=va33sU-_Bzk&feature=player_embedded


Nice to see someone else has an interest in seeing multitouch supported.

I submitted a proposal for it to the improve-list a couple weeks ago. 
Number of replies: 0.


-

It may also be worth considering adding new trackpad event types now 
that the world has almost universally moved beyond simple point-and-click.


For example, the OS X API there supports the following gestures:

- Pinching movements (in or out) are gestures meaning zoom out
  or zoom in (also called magnification).
- Two fingers moving in opposite semicircles is a gesture
  meaning rotate.
- Three fingers brushing across the trackpad surface in a
  common direction is a swipe gesture.
- Two fingers moving vertically or horizontally is a scroll gesture.

Their API gives provides these constant names for gestures:

- NSEventTypeGesture
- NSEventTypeMagnify
- NSEventTypeSwipe
- NSEventTypeRotate
- NSEventTypeBeginGesture
- NSEventTypeEndGesture

HC's mouseDown and mouseUp were great and still are, but the modern 
world is increasingly driven by a wider range of gestures.


How cool would it be to be able to write stuff like:

on touchRotate pDegrees
  rotate the target pDegrees
end touchRotate

...or:

on touchMagnify pPercent
  scale the target by pPercent
end touchMagnify


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World
 Rev training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
 Webzine for Rev developers: http://www.revjournal.com
 revJournal blog: http://revjournal.com/blog.irv
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Multitouch

[René Micout]

Soon with RunRev ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=va33sU-_Bzk&feature=player_embedded

René___
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