Re: WAR ON BUGS [WAS Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev, would do this?)]
Thanks Jacque! :-* Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WAR ON BUGS [WAS Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev, would do this?)]
Bob Warren wrote: When you mentioned "the roadmap" I was taken aback. What roadmap? "Enterprise" license holders and those who have the money to travel to conferences are undoubtedly more in the know because they are paying for it, but ordinary "Studio" license holders such as myself have little idea of what Rev plans to do. Right. Enterprise users are under NDA and so they get more info. It's one of the perks. Conference attendees also sign an NDA. I guess the best that Studio and Media users can do is trust others when they say that things are going along according to plan. 1. Is there a need for regular Rev updates or not? Sure there is. Runtime generally releases 4 to 6 updates per year, which is quite a lot for a multi-OS-compatible program. That's one every two to three months. 2. To know that a bug has been "fixed" doesn't help if the fix cannot be implemented within a reasonable time. Is "turnaround" in this sense anywhere near adequate at the moment? You can tell which bugs have been fixed by searching the Quality Control center, using the "advanced" search option to look for bugs that have been fixed since a particular date. Those fixes will be in the next release, which will generally be within 3 months or so of the last one. If you tell me that such wonderful things are already in the pipeline, then I am very pleased. But Rev didn't tell me. Nor should they. Few companies release details on upcoming release timelines or what's included in them until the release is actually out. Can you tell me when the next update of Photoshop is due out and what will be in it? -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WAR ON BUGS [WAS Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev, would do this?)]
Stephen Barncard wrote: At 4:12 PM -0300 6/7/07, Bob Warren wrote: 1. RR should provide feature releases on a regular basis. We pay for them. And we'll be getting them. It's in the roadmap, and Kevin is sticking to it. >2. We do not pay for bugfixes. The manufacturer is just putting >right what he has done wrong. We didn't pay for bug fixes. Runrev extended their free upgrade policy to customers for over a year while the WOB was going on. >The other day, I put forward a model under the thread "A glimpse of >the future" which was totally ignored. I must therefore presume that >in the opinion of all I don't think we're ignoring you, we're just exhausted from the negative. I feel Rev has emerged from a dark buggy period into the light. We've had a few 'Rev outa do this' emails lately where the poster seemed to go on and on and complain that Rev isn't doing enough to please him, and he takes the stand of 'demanding customer'. Arguments about 'bug free is impossible' vs 'it must be bug free, screw the new features' ensues. These threads go on for weeks, then die down, then another person (who didn't read the ones before) takes over. (I won't name names...) I will mention Bill Marriot was once a big complainer (with good reason)... but the difference is that he joined the Rev team, started a 'War On Bugs!' and made a difference. I'm glad Rev exists, and if a few bumps along the road are there, I won't complain as long as I know there's work being done on my wishes. They are not Microsoft and cannot deliver the manpower in the same way. Actually they have enlisted many of us in their efforts to improve the product, and I think that's far better than Microsoft. How can you help? When you see a bug, take the time to describe it enough to repeat it, or make a movie, or demo stack and send all of it to Quality Control. It will get fixed. I've seen it happen in days. - Thanks for that, Stephen. First of all, I think that Rev have been doing rather well lately, that's why I feel inspired enough to put forward some suggestions for further improvement. Do you think I should stop? How does one point out limitations in the current practice of the system without being "negative" as you suggest? When you mentioned "the roadmap" I was taken aback. What roadmap? "Enterprise" license holders and those who have the money to travel to conferences are undoubtedly more in the know because they are paying for it, but ordinary "Studio" license holders such as myself have little idea of what Rev plans to do. It is therefore very difficult for us to arrange our programming lives. I didn't say we paid for bugfixes. I really don't know what we actually pay for, either directly or indirectly. It's not clear to me. What I did suggest is that upgrades should be (well) paid for and that they should not be for the purpose of bugfixing. Bugfixing should be done constantly in between releases. Certainly, this would make the situation a bit clearer. As for the rest of your post, the only thing I will say is that I feel there is no need to put me into the category of the various stereotypes you mention, since they are all negative and you are obviously "bugged" about something. I am not one of your bugs, so please try and trust my intentions a little more. Let me just ask you a few questions. In relation to current practices as they are seen by ordinary users: 1. Is there a need for regular Rev updates or not? 2. To know that a bug has been "fixed" doesn't help if the fix cannot be implemented within a reasonable time. Is "turnaround" in this sense anywhere near adequate at the moment? If you tell me that such wonderful things are already in the pipeline, then I am very pleased. But Rev didn't tell me. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WAR ON BUGS [WAS Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)]
At 4:12 PM -0300 6/7/07, Bob Warren wrote: 1. RR should provide feature releases on a regular basis. We pay for them. And we'll be getting them. It's in the roadmap, and Kevin is sticking to it. 2. We do not pay for bugfixes. The manufacturer is just putting right what he has done wrong. We didn't pay for bug fixes. Runrev extended their free upgrade policy to customers for over a year while the WOB was going on. The other day, I put forward a model under the thread "A glimpse of the future" which was totally ignored. I must therefore presume that in the opinion of all I don't think we're ignoring you, we're just exhausted from the negative. I feel Rev has emerged from a dark buggy period into the light. We've had a few 'Rev outa do this' emails lately where the poster seemed to go on and on and complain that Rev isn't doing enough to please him, and he takes the stand of 'demanding customer'. Arguments about 'bug free is impossible' vs 'it must be bug free, screw the new features' ensues. These threads go on for weeks, then die down, then another person (who didn't read the ones before) takes over. (I won't name names...) I will mention Bill Marriot was once a big complainer (with good reason)... but the difference is that he joined the Rev team, started a 'War On Bugs!' and made a difference. I'm glad Rev exists, and if a few bumps along the road are there, I won't complain as long as I know there's work being done on my wishes. They are not Microsoft and cannot deliver the manpower in the same way. Actually they have enlisted many of us in their efforts to improve the product, and I think that's far better than Microsoft. How can you help? When you see a bug, take the time to describe it enough to repeat it, or make a movie, or demo stack and send all of it to Quality Control. It will get fixed. I've seen it happen in days. sqb -- stephen barncard s a n f r a n c i s c o - - - - - - - - - - - - ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
