Re: Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
On May 6, 2005, at 11:44 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Dennis Brown wrote: This brings up a good point that has been bugging me for years. It is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS that the Rev documentation built in to the IDE is so full of errors. How many repeat questions and confusion by folks trying to learn Rev are the result of wrong or missing documentation. I hear you loud and clear. Back when I was learning C, starting with externals using Gary Bonds' X-Command book seemed like a good start. I found myself spending a lot of time double-checking everything and rarely got anything to actually run. That was one of several experiences that made me appreciate xTalk, but a couple years ago I was telling that story to a good friend who's an expert in C on Mac (he's been known to make Apple engineers ask How'd you do that?) and he told me it was too bad I let it discourage me as the problem wasn't me at all -- he reports that most of the C examples in that book simply don't work. :( Missing stuff take time to address. I've not seen a product yet where people didn't complain about the docs every day until a variety of third-party books became available. Don't know why that is, just reporting what I've seen. It seems the only remedy is to track what's reported as missing and add it as soon after as possible. This mail list is addressing missing stuff every day. Unfortunately, in a couple of weeks I have seen the same stuff rehashed already. That must be because it is not obvious to the newbe how to find the info he needs. Being able to capture the valuable info on this list, without having to go through the painful task of searching for a term and wading through all the discussion to find the nugget in the archives would be ideal. It has the making of a great tutor. But errata should of course always be a high priority. Which erroneous entries have you found, and what are there Bugzilla IDs so we can draw attention to them? #2778 #2753 are the ones I entered. However, I found so many minor issues with the docs that I just gave up on trying to report them. Seeing the priority given to these issues, and the amount of time I would invest in documenting the errors, it just did not seem to be a productive use of my time. With the web notes, I will reconsider. It would be nice to be able to ask a question about the missing or wrong info in the web notes, and have someone respond right in the note with the corrected or expanded info. I was encouraged by Kevin's chat today when he mentioned addressing the BZ issues and response delays. I believe Monte does a fair job of reviewing BZ for errata reports, and has a track record of addressing them promptly. Getting them into your hands is a different matter (what should Check for updates... do?), but at least Monte does his part in a very timely manner. However, if RunRev would empower us, we could do great stuff about the docs. Just from being on this list for a few weeks, I can see the quality of the user community and know that it could work -- especially if it were sponsored and monitored by RunRev. Go ahead, make my day... tell me it is already in the works ;-) Would already in place be better? See the WebNotes feature. It's not my favorite implementation of the idea, but it's a good start toward a mechanism for community-ehnanced docs. I did not realize that notes I put there would be visible by everyone. Ok I just put in the note on the numbered variables. However, I would have preferred to have it done in such a way that others would look at what I added and make sure my fix is right before someone else is led astray. Does anyone get notified when a note goes in, to check that it is not spam or worse. Because this doc issue has come up before, why did nobody else put a note in? Isn't anyone using this feature? A search on web notes in the ref doc did not produce any hits. This feature could be made to work with a few tweaks --like update and downloading notes to local, or a flag that says a note is available for this topic. How about new topics that can be added to the doc also. This could work much better than BZ for noting the errors, adding missing content and examples --if it were made into the standard method for addressing these issues by RunRev. Dennis ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
Brian, This brings up a good point that has been bugging me for years. It is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS that the Rev documentation built in to the IDE is so full of errors. How many repeat questions and confusion by folks trying to learn Rev are the result of wrong or missing documentation. Don't get me wrong, I really like the built in Doc. It is just that even I can read through it and find error after error. It seems like it would be so easy for an informed Rev programmer at RunRev to step through and fix up the doc in a matter of a week or two. It takes ten times as much work to make BZ reports about the errors than it does to just fix them. I bet a Wiki style doc file that the users could input to and that could be downloaded to the IDE if desired could cure the problem. It would probably greatly expand the How Do I and simple examples also. It seems like lots of people have tried to improve on the docs in various places on the web, but I don't want to go searching through ten sites and discussion lists to find a bit of info that should be part of the built-in docs. Stupid Doc errors AND small bugs in the IDE that are ignored (because GOOD programmers can find an undocumented workaround) make a bad impression about the quality of Revolution. It is even more damaging to DreamCard which is aimed at a less sophisticated users. As users we can't do much about the programming problems, except complain. However, if RunRev would empower us, we could do great stuff about the docs. Just from being on this list for a few weeks, I can see the quality of the user community and know that it could work -- especially if it were sponsored and monitored by RunRev. Go ahead, make my day... tell me it is already in the works ;-) Dennis On May 6, 2005, at 12:31 AM, Brian Yennie wrote: It is not a scripting error if you are following the Reference Documentation supplied with Rev: Right... I meant it was an obvious scripting error by the folks at RunRev in their documentation, not that it was an obvious error by you who was just following the docs =)! - Brian ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
Dennis Brown wrote: Stupid Doc errors AND small bugs in the IDE that are ignored (because GOOD programmers can find an undocumented workaround) make a bad impression about the quality of Revolution. I agree. I tried fixing errors or problems way back when using MetaCard and when RunRev first came out, but now I have such a hard time editing the environment to suit my needs that I've just given up on it. The thing that blows my mind the most is that if you Show Invisible Objects and open the docs...you can see all of the docs invisible objects. But alas, my programming is not perfect either. :) Derek Bump Dreamscape Software ___ Compress Images Easily with JPEGCompress http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
[I am resending this message, because it seems to have been lost in the mail] Brian, This brings up a good point that has been bugging me for years. It is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS that the Rev documentation built in to the IDE is so full of errors. How many repeat questions and confusion by folks trying to learn Rev are the result of wrong or missing documentation. Don't get me wrong, I really like the built in Doc. It is just that even I can read through it and find error after error. It seems like it would be so easy for an informed Rev programmer at RunRev to step through and fix up the doc in a matter of a week or two. It takes ten times as much work to make BZ reports about the errors than it does to just fix them. I bet a Wiki style doc file that the users could input to and that could be downloaded to the IDE if desired could cure the problem. It would probably greatly expand the How Do I and simple examples also. It seems like lots of people have tried to improve on the docs in various places on the web, but I don't want to go searching through ten sites and discussion lists to find a bit of info that should be part of the built-in docs. Stupid Doc errors AND small bugs in the IDE that are ignored (because GOOD programmers can find an undocumented workaround) make a bad impression about the quality of Revolution. It is even more damaging to DreamCard which is aimed at a less sophisticated users. As users we can't do much about the programming problems, except complain. However, if RunRev would empower us, we could do great stuff about the docs. Just from being on this list for a few weeks, I can see the quality of the user community and know that it could work -- especially if it were sponsored and monitored by RunRev. Go ahead, make my day... tell me it is already in the works ;-) Dennis On May 6, 2005, at 12:31 AM, Brian Yennie wrote: It is not a scripting error if you are following the Reference Documentation supplied with Rev: Right... I meant it was an obvious scripting error by the folks at RunRev in their documentation, not that it was an obvious error by you who was just following the docs =)! - Brian ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
Wow, that was weird. The new Tiger mail.app suddenly decided that mail from me or on this subject was Junk. I found my message and responses along with several good messages in my junk mail folder just now. Sorry for the resend. Tiger users, watch you junk mailbox. Dennis On May 6, 2005, at 11:01 AM, Dennis Brown wrote: [I am resending this message, because it seems to have been lost in the mail] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Documentation Errors [Was: naming variables...]
Dennis Brown wrote: This brings up a good point that has been bugging me for years. It is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS that the Rev documentation built in to the IDE is so full of errors. How many repeat questions and confusion by folks trying to learn Rev are the result of wrong or missing documentation. I hear you loud and clear. Back when I was learning C, starting with externals using Gary Bonds' X-Command book seemed like a good start. I found myself spending a lot of time double-checking everything and rarely got anything to actually run. That was one of several experiences that made me appreciate xTalk, but a couple years ago I was telling that story to a good friend who's an expert in C on Mac (he's been known to make Apple engineers ask How'd you do that?) and he told me it was too bad I let it discourage me as the problem wasn't me at all -- he reports that most of the C examples in that book simply don't work. :( Missing stuff take time to address. I've not seen a product yet where people didn't complain about the docs every day until a variety of third-party books became available. Don't know why that is, just reporting what I've seen. It seems the only remedy is to track what's reported as missing and add it as soon after as possible. But errata should of course always be a high priority. Which erroneous entries have you found, and what are there Bugzilla IDs so we can draw attention to them? I believe Monte does a fair job of reviewing BZ for errata reports, and has a track record of addressing them promptly. Getting them into your hands is a different matter (what should Check for updates... do?), but at least Monte does his part in a very timely manner. However, if RunRev would empower us, we could do great stuff about the docs. Just from being on this list for a few weeks, I can see the quality of the user community and know that it could work -- especially if it were sponsored and monitored by RunRev. Go ahead, make my day... tell me it is already in the works ;-) Would already in place be better? See the WebNotes feature. It's not my favorite implementation of the idea, but it's a good start toward a mechanism for community-ehnanced docs. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation __ Rev tools and more: http://www.fourthworld.com/rev ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: naming variables...
It is not a scripting error if you are following the Reference Documentation supplied with Rev: Right... I meant it was an obvious scripting error by the folks at RunRev in their documentation, not that it was an obvious error by you who was just following the docs =)! - Brian ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
naming variables...
Hello all, how does it come that the simple How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? example does not work in 2.5.1 ? I badly need to collect contents of flds into variables which are used later in the script... repeat with x = 1 to 20 put fld (ax) into (myVar x) end repeat -- returns error : bad destination ??? So how do I manage this ? Thanks for any help, Christian from Luxembourg (11° C, rainy weather -- the weather widget in Tiger is awesome ;-) ) Mac OS X 10.4, iMac G4, 1.25MHZ, 1 Gb RAM ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: naming variables...
Moyen Christian, Finally another Lulu Rev partner? try this get fld (Ax) do put it into myVar X cheers Xavier (i dont need Tiger to get the weather in Luxembourg, I live it daily : )) On 04.05.2005 13:26:51 use-revolution-bounces wrote: Hello all, how does it come that the simple How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? example does not work in 2.5.1 ? I badly need to collect contents of flds into variables which are used later in the script... repeat with x = 1 to 20 put fld (ax) into (myVar x) end repeat -- returns error : bad destination ??? So how do I manage this ? Thanks for any help, Christian from Luxembourg (11° C, rainy weather -- the weather widget in Tiger is awesome ;-) ) Mac OS X 10.4, iMac G4, 1.25MHZ, 1 Gb RAM ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution - Visit us at http://www.clearstream.com IMPORTANT MESSAGEInternet communications are not secure and therefore Clearstream International does not accept legal responsibility for the contents of this message.The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. Any views expressed in this e-mail are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of Clearstream International or of any of its affiliates or subsidiaries.END OF DISCLAIMER ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: naming variables...
Me too, but often I'm in my computer cellar, Grins ;-) Christian Le 4 mai 05 à 13:34, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Moyen Christian, Finally another Lulu Rev partner? try this get fld (Ax) do put it into myVar X cheers Xavier (i dont need Tiger to get the weather in Luxembourg, I live it daily : )) On 04.05.2005 13:26:51 use-revolution-bounces wrote: Hello all, how does it come that the simple How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? example does not work in 2.5.1 ? I badly need to collect contents of flds into variables which are used later in the script... repeat with x = 1 to 20 put fld (ax) into (myVar x) end repeat -- returns error : bad destination ??? So how do I manage this ? Thanks for any help, Christian from Luxembourg (11° C, rainy weather -- the weather widget in Tiger is awesome ;-) ) Mac OS X 10.4, iMac G4, 1.25MHZ, 1 Gb RAM ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution - Visit us at http://www.clearstream.com IMPORTANT MESSAGEInternet communications are not secure and therefore Clearstream International does not accept legal responsibility for the contents of this message.The information contained in this e- mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. Any views expressed in this e- mail are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of Clearstream International or of any of its affiliates or subsidiaries.END OF DISCLAIMER ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: naming variables...
Yikes. I hope RunRev fixes this- I've seen it come up at least twice now on the list and it's an obvious scripting error. The solution is to use the do command. This is similar to the eval function you find in many other languages- basically you dynamically generate the line of code, and then do will execute it at runtime. ## do something repeat with x=1 to 20 put (fld ax into myVarx) into myCode ## myCode = the string put fld a1 into myVar1 do myCode end repeat One cool sidenote- you can also use the do command to execute code from any other OSA scripting language installed if you are on MacOS, which usually means AppleScript. The other way to access outside code is to use shell() in order to run command-line commands, but now I'm straying... HTH, Brian Hello all, how does it come that the simple How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? example does not work in 2.5.1 ? I badly need to collect contents of flds into variables which are used later in the script... repeat with x = 1 to 20 put fld (ax) into (myVar x) end repeat -- returns error : bad destination ??? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: naming variables...
It is not a scripting error if you are following the Reference Documentation supplied with Rev: --- How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? To easily create a set of variables with similar names (such as myVar1, myVar2,...,myVar20), you can use the concatenation operator . The following example shows how to use a set of variables named myVar1, myVar2,...,myVar20: repeat with x = 1 to 20 put empty into (myVar x) end repeat ---' Notice no mention of the do command. This is what tripped me up. I entered a BZ for it: #2753 Dennis On May 4, 2005, at 8:09 AM, Brian Yennie wrote: Yikes. I hope RunRev fixes this- I've seen it come up at least twice now on the list and it's an obvious scripting error. The solution is to use the do command. This is similar to the eval function you find in many other languages- basically you dynamically generate the line of code, and then do will execute it at runtime. ## do something repeat with x=1 to 20 put (fld ax into myVarx) into myCode ## myCode = the string put fld a1 into myVar1 do myCode end repeat One cool sidenote- you can also use the do command to execute code from any other OSA scripting language installed if you are on MacOS, which usually means AppleScript. The other way to access outside code is to use shell() in order to run command-line commands, but now I'm straying... HTH, Brian Hello all, how does it come that the simple How do I create and use a numbered set of variables? example does not work in 2.5.1 ? I badly need to collect contents of flds into variables which are used later in the script... repeat with x = 1 to 20 put fld (ax) into (myVar x) end repeat -- returns error : bad destination ??? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
