Re: Frameworks dropping OSGi support
Sorry I missed the answer from Greg :) I second obviously :) Regards JB On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 1:55 PM Grzegorz Grzybek wrote: > > Hello > > Initially (and more precisely 1-2 years ago) when the javax → jakarta > migration started to get momentum (partially because of Spring Boot 3 / > Spring Framework 6 announcement) I was thinking that the Enterprise OSGi > specifications which touch JakartaEE would have to be released all-at-once > (JPA, Web, transactions, ...) and I thought it'd be vry hard for the > implementations to quickly get new jakarta.* releases. > > I was imagining a lot of problems related to compatibility to existing > libraries. Karaf features cover a lot of dependencies and there is simply not > enough (IMO) manpower to be quick here. > > However recently I was tracking OSGi CMPN progress and for example there > already exist new Whiteboard specification > (https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.servlet.html) > (called "Servlet service" now), so OSGi world is not going to lag behind too > much. > > I think (or I'm biased) that the web parts are the most important here. And > Pax Web doesn't yet have a Jakarta friendly release, so I have a branch ready > (with slow progress). See > https://github.com/ops4j/org.ops4j.pax.web/issues/1802 > > The point is that there will be NO version the ancient HttpService > specification based on jakarta.servlet package. Pax Web has this support deep > in its core, so there's fundamental decision to be made - probably Pax Web's > extension to org.osgi.service.http.HttpService is going to simply swallow the > methods from this interface. > > This interface however is used by CXF (cxf-rt-transports-http) and Jolokia > and Camel Servlet and these will have to switch to Whiteboard (called > "Servlet" in OSGi CMPN 8.1). > > I can't tell anything however about JPA for example. These specs in 8.1 > (which contains migrated Whiteboard specification) do NOT yet moved from > javax to jakarta: > > JPA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jpa.html > Transaction Control: > https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.transaction.control.html > JTA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jta.html > > So it's still the beginning of the road... Not only there are not CMPN > jakarta versions of the above specs, I have no idea about progress at RI side > (Apache Aries). > > I hope this clears at least some of the confusion here. > > regards > Grzegorz Grzybek > > śr., 31 maj 2023 o 13:32 Jochen Walz > napisał(a): >> >> Hello, >> >> Recently, some frameworks have dropped support for OSGi/Karaf in their >> latest versions (CXF 4.0, Vaadin 24.0), because some of their dependencies >> are no longer supported. E.g., servlet 6. >> >> I know that we still have some time left before older versions run out of >> support (March 24 for Vaadin 23, at least when you don't have a commercial >> license). Anyways: does anybody have a crystal ball which tells how that >> story will go, i.e., when OSGi and Karaf will be ready to regain support by >> these frameworks? >> >> Thanks & Regards, >> >> Jochen
Re: Frameworks dropping OSGi support
Hi Jochen, That's a fair question. OSGi group is working on the OSGi version of the spec as part of the cmpn scope. In the past, we also wrapped some specs in ServiceMix Specs bundle. So, even if it's long process, there are several works around the specs that will help CXF, Vaadin, etc. Regards JB On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 1:31 PM Jochen Walz wrote: > > Hello, > > Recently, some frameworks have dropped support for OSGi/Karaf in their latest > versions (CXF 4.0, Vaadin 24.0), because some of their dependencies are no > longer supported. E.g., servlet 6. > > I know that we still have some time left before older versions run out of > support (March 24 for Vaadin 23, at least when you don't have a commercial > license). Anyways: does anybody have a crystal ball which tells how that > story will go, i.e., when OSGi and Karaf will be ready to regain support by > these frameworks? > > Thanks & Regards, > > Jochen
Re: Frameworks dropping OSGi support
Hello Grzegorz, So, in short: some big chunks of work in progress (or yet to be started) in different places. Thanks for the detailed answer! With this, it is at least clear where to look at for checking the progress. Regards Jochen Am 31.05.2023 um 13:55 schrieb Grzegorz Grzybek: Hello Initially (and more precisely 1-2 years ago) when the javax → jakarta migration started to get momentum (partially because of Spring Boot 3 / Spring Framework 6 announcement) I was thinking that the Enterprise OSGi specifications which touch JakartaEE would have to be released all-at-once (JPA, Web, transactions, ...) and I thought it'd be vry hard for the implementations to quickly get new jakarta.* releases. I was imagining a lot of problems related to compatibility to existing libraries. Karaf features cover a lot of dependencies and there is simply not enough (IMO) manpower to be quick here. However recently I was tracking OSGi CMPN progress and for example there already exist new Whiteboard specification (https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.servlet.html) (called "Servlet service" now), so OSGi world is not going to lag behind too much. I think (or I'm biased) that the web parts are the most important here. And Pax Web doesn't yet have a Jakarta friendly release, so I have a branch ready (with slow progress). See https://github.com/ops4j/org.ops4j.pax.web/issues/1802 The point is that there will be NO version the ancient HttpService specification based on jakarta.servlet package. Pax Web has this support deep in its core, so there's fundamental decision to be made - probably Pax Web's extension to org.osgi.service.http.HttpService is going to simply swallow the methods from this interface. This interface however is used by CXF (cxf-rt-transports-http) and Jolokia and Camel Servlet and these will have to switch to Whiteboard (called "Servlet" in OSGi CMPN 8.1). I can't tell anything however about JPA for example. These specs in 8.1 (which contains migrated Whiteboard specification) do NOT yet moved from javax to jakarta: * JPA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jpa.html * Transaction Control: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.transaction.control.html * JTA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jta.html So it's still the beginning of the road... Not only there are not CMPN jakarta versions of the above specs, I have no idea about progress at RI side (Apache Aries). I hope this clears at least some of the confusion here. regards Grzegorz Grzybek śr., 31 maj 2023 o 13:32 Jochen Walz napisał(a): Hello, Recently, some frameworks have dropped support for OSGi/Karaf in their latest versions (CXF 4.0, Vaadin 24.0), because some of their dependencies are no longer supported. E.g., servlet 6. I know that we still have some time left before older versions run out of support (March 24 for Vaadin 23, at least when you don't have a commercial license). Anyways: does anybody have a crystal ball which tells how that story will go, i.e., when OSGi and Karaf will be ready to regain support by these frameworks? Thanks & Regards, Jochen
Re: Frameworks dropping OSGi support
Hello Initially (and more precisely 1-2 years ago) when the javax → jakarta migration started to get momentum (partially because of Spring Boot 3 / Spring Framework 6 announcement) I was thinking that the Enterprise OSGi specifications which touch JakartaEE would have to be released all-at-once (JPA, Web, transactions, ...) and I thought it'd be vry hard for the implementations to quickly get new jakarta.* releases. I was imagining a lot of problems related to compatibility to existing libraries. Karaf features cover a lot of dependencies and there is simply not enough (IMO) manpower to be quick here. However recently I was tracking OSGi CMPN progress and for example there already exist new Whiteboard specification ( https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.servlet.html) (called "Servlet service" now), so OSGi world is not going to lag behind too much. I think (or I'm biased) that the web parts are the most important here. And Pax Web doesn't yet have a Jakarta friendly release, so I have a branch ready (with slow progress). See https://github.com/ops4j/org.ops4j.pax.web/issues/1802 The point is that there will be NO version the ancient HttpService specification based on jakarta.servlet package. Pax Web has this support deep in its core, so there's fundamental decision to be made - probably Pax Web's extension to org.osgi.service.http.HttpService is going to simply swallow the methods from this interface. This interface however is used by CXF (cxf-rt-transports-http) and Jolokia and Camel Servlet and these will have to switch to Whiteboard (called "Servlet" in OSGi CMPN 8.1). I can't tell anything however about JPA for example. These specs in 8.1 (which contains migrated Whiteboard specification) do NOT yet moved from javax to jakarta: - JPA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jpa.html - Transaction Control: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.transaction.control.html - JTA: https://docs.osgi.org/specification/osgi.cmpn/8.1.0/service.jta.html So it's still the beginning of the road... Not only there are not CMPN jakarta versions of the above specs, I have no idea about progress at RI side (Apache Aries). I hope this clears at least some of the confusion here. regards Grzegorz Grzybek śr., 31 maj 2023 o 13:32 Jochen Walz napisał(a): > Hello, > > Recently, some frameworks have dropped support for OSGi/Karaf in their > latest versions (CXF 4.0, Vaadin 24.0), because some of their dependencies > are no longer supported. E.g., servlet 6. > > I know that we still have some time left before older versions run out of > support (March 24 for Vaadin 23, at least when you don't have a commercial > license). Anyways: does anybody have a crystal ball which tells how that > story will go, i.e., when OSGi and Karaf will be ready to regain support by > these frameworks? > > Thanks & Regards, > > Jochen >
Frameworks dropping OSGi support
Hello, Recently, some frameworks have dropped support for OSGi/Karaf in their latest versions (CXF 4.0, Vaadin 24.0), because some of their dependencies are no longer supported. E.g., servlet 6. I know that we still have some time left before older versions run out of support (March 24 for Vaadin 23, at least when you don't have a commercial license). Anyways: does anybody have a crystal ball which tells how that story will go, i.e., when OSGi and Karaf will be ready to regain support by these frameworks? Thanks & Regards, Jochen
