Re: [Neo] Neo in a cluster?
I forgot to mention that if implementing JPA/JDO it'd provably good to do it
as a Datanucleus store for example
http://www.datanucleus.org/plugins/store.db4o/index.html
2010/1/1 Raul Raja Martinez
> Hi Peter,
>
> Yes we looked at jo4neo and found it very interesting and it probably
> suits most people use cases.
> In our particular case these are the reasons why we didn't choose it.
>
> 1. jo4neo is tightly couple to neo4j, our implementation is based on neo4j
> but the interface impls are defined so that they can be swapped for other
> graph based storage in case we decide to not use neo4j in some other
> project.
>
> 2. Our implementation never handles transactions directly, jo4neo does.
> jo4neo does not allow control over transactions and creates a transaction
> per operation
> http://jo4neo.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/jo4neo/src/main/java/jo4neo/DeleteOpertation.java
>
> For a webapp we provide a filter that wraps the request in a transaction,
> allowing to groups operations, and we also plan to support Callbacks that
> allow you to group operations ina transactional context. We also integrate
> with Spring and we are working on the @Transactional support
>
> 3. jo4neo loads all properties for a bean even when these are not queried
> or used. We enforce the use of interfaces not beans and we create a dynamic
> proxy that implements the interface so that calls to properties and
> relationships are proxied and delegated to the underlying nodes without the
> need to use reflection. So when you load a Object by id nothing we do not
> load all its properties or relationships unless you use them, and even when
> you use them they don't get cached in the proxy so it saves memory. We trust
> that neo4j caches the nodes and properties that are used the most.
>
> As far as JPA is concerned... Yes and No. I think you'd gain more
> acceptance if you implement JPA, on the other hand the JPA spec pretty much
> assumes the storage is based on a relational database, they say... The
> Java Persistence API deals with the way relational data is mapped to Java
> objects ("persistent entities"), the way that these objects are stored in a
> relational database so that they can be accessed at a later time, and the
> continued existence of an entity's state even after the application that
> uses it ends. In addition to simplifying the entity persistence model, the
> Java Persistence API standardizes object-relational mapping.
>
> So I'd be great to have a partial JPA impl for basic querying and
> annotations but neo4j approach to persistence is much more flexible and not
> constrained by the relational model.
>
> 2010/1/1 Peter Neubauer
>
> Raul,
>> thanks for the info! Have you looked at Taylor's jo4neo,
>> http://code.google.com/p/jo4neo/ which is taking a similar approach,
>> and do you think there would be value in having a JPA adapter for
>> Neo4j? We would be happy to hear about your experience there!
>>
>> Happy New Year!
>>
>> /peter neubauer
>>
>> COO and Sales, Neo Technology
>>
>> GTalk: neubauer.peter
>> Skype peter.neubauer
>> Phone +46 704 106975
>> LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer
>> Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer
>>
>> http://www.neo4j.org- Relationships count.
>> http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com- PageRank in 2 lines of code.
>> http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Raul Raja Martinez
>> wrote:
>> > Hi Johan,
>> >
>> > It does and we're very excited about Neo4j. Can't wait for your
>> clustering
>> > support.
>> > We have developed a annotation based sytem on top of Neo based on
>> interfaces
>> > and java dynamic proxies that allows you to delegate all state lookup
>> and
>> > relationship to the neo store such as
>> >
>> > @Node
>> > public interface Person {
>> >
>> > @Id
>> > Long getId();
>> >
>> > @Property(indexed=true,unique=true,fulltext=true)
>> > String getName();
>> >
>> > void setName(String name);
>> >
>> > @Relationship
>> > City getCity();
>> >
>> > @Relationship
>> > List getFriends();
>> >
>> > @Traverser(returnableEvaluator=Whatever.class)
>> > List getAllFriendsCloseBy();
>> >
>> > }
>> >
>> > It's lazy lookup based system that wraps the underlying nodes and
>> delegates
>> > calls to the right operations on the node. It supports Date, Enums and
>> any
>> > arbitrariy types that can be configured through converters. We're going
>> to
>> > run it in a prod system in the next few months and plan to release it
>> open
>> > source.
>> >
>> > We have extensive experience with hibernate, and other jpa based
>> > implementations and the ease of use and speed with neo4j so far is
>> better
>> > when it comes to complex relaationships or operation that require
>> multiple
>> > joins in a fully normalized relational model.
>> >
>> > Our current challenge is returning ordered relationships when displaying
>> the
>> > data since it requires the n
Re: [Neo] Does anyone have Prefuse (not flare) with Neo4j sample code?
We've found that Jung works very well and has been superior to Prefuse for our use. Prefuse hasn't been under active development for a while whereas Jung is being actively maintained. Some of the particularly attractive features of Jung are its ability to handle disconnected graphs (ie multiple root nodes) more easily than with Prefuse along with its many layout algorithms. http://jung.sourceforge.net/ Thanks, D On Jan 1, 2010, at 7:03 PM, Todd Stavish wrote: > Thanks Peter. Can anyone recommend any other java graph viz toolkits? > > Regards, > Todd > > > > > > On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 5:17 PM, Peter Neubauer > wrote: >> Todd, >> has been a while since I played around with Prefuse for quite a while. >> Last I checked it had no dynamic adding of more data, so you had to >> read in the whole graph upfront, not suitable for bigger data sets - >> but that might have changed? >> >> Cheers, >> >> /peter neubauer >> >> COO and Sales, Neo Technology >> >> GTalk: neubauer.peter >> Skype peter.neubauer >> Phone +46 704 106975 >> LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer >> Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer >> >> http://www.neo4j.org- Relationships count. >> http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com- PageRank in 2 lines of code. >> http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale. >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Todd Stavish wrote: >>> In particular, how to use their graph reader class or custom mapping? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Todd >>> ___ >>> Neo mailing list >>> User@lists.neo4j.org >>> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user >>> >> ___ >> Neo mailing list >> User@lists.neo4j.org >> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user >> > ___ > Neo mailing list > User@lists.neo4j.org > https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user ___ Neo mailing list User@lists.neo4j.org https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
Re: [Neo] Neo in a cluster?
Hi Peter,
Yes we looked at jo4neo and found it very interesting and it probably suits
most people use cases.
In our particular case these are the reasons why we didn't choose it.
1. jo4neo is tightly couple to neo4j, our implementation is based on neo4j
but the interface impls are defined so that they can be swapped for other
graph based storage in case we decide to not use neo4j in some other
project.
2. Our implementation never handles transactions directly, jo4neo does.
jo4neo does not allow control over transactions and creates a transaction
per operation
http://jo4neo.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/jo4neo/src/main/java/jo4neo/DeleteOpertation.java
For a webapp we provide a filter that wraps the request in a transaction,
allowing to groups operations, and we also plan to support Callbacks that
allow you to group operations ina transactional context. We also integrate
with Spring and we are working on the @Transactional support
3. jo4neo loads all properties for a bean even when these are not queried or
used. We enforce the use of interfaces not beans and we create a dynamic
proxy that implements the interface so that calls to properties and
relationships are proxied and delegated to the underlying nodes without the
need to use reflection. So when you load a Object by id nothing we do not
load all its properties or relationships unless you use them, and even when
you use them they don't get cached in the proxy so it saves memory. We trust
that neo4j caches the nodes and properties that are used the most.
As far as JPA is concerned... Yes and No. I think you'd gain more acceptance
if you implement JPA, on the other hand the JPA spec pretty much assumes the
storage is based on a relational database, they say... The Java Persistence
API deals with the way relational data is mapped to Java objects
("persistent entities"), the way that these objects are stored in a
relational database so that they can be accessed at a later time, and the
continued existence of an entity's state even after the application that
uses it ends. In addition to simplifying the entity persistence model, the
Java Persistence API standardizes object-relational mapping.
So I'd be great to have a partial JPA impl for basic querying and
annotations but neo4j approach to persistence is much more flexible and not
constrained by the relational model.
2010/1/1 Peter Neubauer
> Raul,
> thanks for the info! Have you looked at Taylor's jo4neo,
> http://code.google.com/p/jo4neo/ which is taking a similar approach,
> and do you think there would be value in having a JPA adapter for
> Neo4j? We would be happy to hear about your experience there!
>
> Happy New Year!
>
> /peter neubauer
>
> COO and Sales, Neo Technology
>
> GTalk: neubauer.peter
> Skype peter.neubauer
> Phone +46 704 106975
> LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer
> Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer
>
> http://www.neo4j.org- Relationships count.
> http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com- PageRank in 2 lines of code.
> http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Raul Raja Martinez
> wrote:
> > Hi Johan,
> >
> > It does and we're very excited about Neo4j. Can't wait for your
> clustering
> > support.
> > We have developed a annotation based sytem on top of Neo based on
> interfaces
> > and java dynamic proxies that allows you to delegate all state lookup
> and
> > relationship to the neo store such as
> >
> > @Node
> > public interface Person {
> >
> > @Id
> > Long getId();
> >
> > @Property(indexed=true,unique=true,fulltext=true)
> > String getName();
> >
> > void setName(String name);
> >
> > @Relationship
> > City getCity();
> >
> > @Relationship
> > List getFriends();
> >
> > @Traverser(returnableEvaluator=Whatever.class)
> > List getAllFriendsCloseBy();
> >
> > }
> >
> > It's lazy lookup based system that wraps the underlying nodes and
> delegates
> > calls to the right operations on the node. It supports Date, Enums and
> any
> > arbitrariy types that can be configured through converters. We're going
> to
> > run it in a prod system in the next few months and plan to release it
> open
> > source.
> >
> > We have extensive experience with hibernate, and other jpa based
> > implementations and the ease of use and speed with neo4j so far is better
> > when it comes to complex relaationships or operation that require
> multiple
> > joins in a fully normalized relational model.
> >
> > Our current challenge is returning ordered relationships when displaying
> the
> > data since it requires the node/entities returned in a specific order
> based
> > on node property values.
> >
> > Anyway thanks for your responses and good job with Neo4J
> >
> > 2009/12/31 Johan Svensson
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 5:07 PM, Raul Raja Martinez >
> >> wrote:
> >> > Hi everybody,
> >> >
> >> > We're evaluating neo4j and we're very pleased with it so fa
Re: [Neo] Does anyone have Prefuse (not flare) with Neo4j sample code?
Thanks Peter. Can anyone recommend any other java graph viz toolkits? Regards, Todd On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 5:17 PM, Peter Neubauer wrote: > Todd, > has been a while since I played around with Prefuse for quite a while. > Last I checked it had no dynamic adding of more data, so you had to > read in the whole graph upfront, not suitable for bigger data sets - > but that might have changed? > > Cheers, > > /peter neubauer > > COO and Sales, Neo Technology > > GTalk: neubauer.peter > Skype peter.neubauer > Phone +46 704 106975 > LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer > Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer > > http://www.neo4j.org - Relationships count. > http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com - PageRank in 2 lines of code. > http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale. > > > > On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Todd Stavish wrote: >> In particular, how to use their graph reader class or custom mapping? >> >> Thanks, >> Todd >> ___ >> Neo mailing list >> User@lists.neo4j.org >> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user >> > ___ > Neo mailing list > User@lists.neo4j.org > https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user > ___ Neo mailing list User@lists.neo4j.org https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
Re: [Neo] Does anyone have Prefuse (not flare) with Neo4j sample code?
Todd, has been a while since I played around with Prefuse for quite a while. Last I checked it had no dynamic adding of more data, so you had to read in the whole graph upfront, not suitable for bigger data sets - but that might have changed? Cheers, /peter neubauer COO and Sales, Neo Technology GTalk: neubauer.peter Skype peter.neubauer Phone +46 704 106975 LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer http://www.neo4j.org- Relationships count. http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com- PageRank in 2 lines of code. http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale. On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Todd Stavish wrote: > In particular, how to use their graph reader class or custom mapping? > > Thanks, > Todd > ___ > Neo mailing list > User@lists.neo4j.org > https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user > ___ Neo mailing list User@lists.neo4j.org https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
Re: [Neo] Neo4j + Django 'wishlist'
Hi Steve!
Good list. I'll use it to add to my tasklist.
Happy new year!
/Tobias
On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Steve Jalim wrote:
> Hi Tobias, Peter, everyone
>
> After finding some time to have an initial play around with the Neo and
> Django integration, I'm pretty excited.
>
> I discussed bits with Tobias on IRC the other day and we thought that a
> quick 'wish list', communicated via this mailinglist, would be useful to
> help steer development of the integration.
>
> So, I thought I'd start the ball rolling with some notes I made while
> playing around earlier, in no particular order of priority. If anyone
> agrees/disagrees, please do join in the discussion. These are all in
> addition to the forthcoming features already listed in Tobias's blog post (
> http://journal.thobe.org/2009/12/seamless-neo4j-integration-in-django.html
> ).
>
> - __unicode__ / Python list representations of NodeQuerySets to make it
> easier to explore things in the shell.
>
>
> - Full support for the queryset API. Details are all here
>
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.1/ref/models/querysets/#ref-models-querysets
> ,
> but headline bits incude:
> - queryset.filter() on attributes/properties - eg
> MyNodeModel.objects.filter(name="baz"). Plus, SQL-like operators, if
> possible such as foo__contains="bar", foo__icontains="BAR" and
> foo__iexact="Bar" (These calls methods will most likely be
> needed for full
> Django Admin support anyway, to allow for the in-Admin search
> facility, and
> I know Tobias already has Admin support on his list)
> - queryset.values() method for querysets, to get just certain values
> back. This is often used for better ORM performance in Django,
> but will it
> make much difference in Neo4j?
> - queryset.order_by('attribute_name') - again, probably essential for
> Django-admin support
>
>
> - Control over traversals -- this is non-RDBMS-Django ORM functionality,
> but am really looking forward to it!
>
>
> - Support for Managers for models (
>
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.1/topics/db/managers/#topics-db-managers
> ),
> so one can extend a model's standard API methods with custom ones.
> Indeed,
> this seems a neat way to acccess Neo traversals via the Django ORM.
>
>
> - Typed fields, rather than just Property(), or perhaps better, simply
> the facility to specify a custom Django form field for it - eg:
>
> class Member(model.NodeModel):
> ...
> email_address =
> model.Property(form_field=django.forms.fields.EmailField)
>
> - Support for django.contrib.auth (already on Tobias's list).
> Indeed, it'll be very interesting to see how much extra neo4j-python work
> might be required when trying to use common pluggable Django (or Pinax
> www.pinaxproject.com) apps. Once support for django.contrib.auth is in,
> then we'll be able to experiment.
>
> That's the lot for now. Forgive me if this seems too demanding, or if I'm
> not appreciating the power of Neo in my request for typed fields, or if I'm
> asking for stuff that's already there but I've missed :o)
>
> Hope it helps keep things moving. I'll play with it all more in the coming
> week, I hope, and can chip in more as and when required, and would be v
> interested to hear opinions from other Djangonauts on this list.
>
> Cheers
>
> Steve
> ___
> Neo mailing list
> User@lists.neo4j.org
> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
>
--
Tobias Ivarsson
Hacker, Neo Technology
www.neotechnology.com
Cellphone: +46 706 534857
___
Neo mailing list
User@lists.neo4j.org
https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
[Neo] Neo4j + Django 'wishlist'
Hi Tobias, Peter, everyone
After finding some time to have an initial play around with the Neo and
Django integration, I'm pretty excited.
I discussed bits with Tobias on IRC the other day and we thought that a
quick 'wish list', communicated via this mailinglist, would be useful to
help steer development of the integration.
So, I thought I'd start the ball rolling with some notes I made while
playing around earlier, in no particular order of priority. If anyone
agrees/disagrees, please do join in the discussion. These are all in
addition to the forthcoming features already listed in Tobias's blog post (
http://journal.thobe.org/2009/12/seamless-neo4j-integration-in-django.html
).
- __unicode__ / Python list representations of NodeQuerySets to make it
easier to explore things in the shell.
- Full support for the queryset API. Details are all here
http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.1/ref/models/querysets/#ref-models-querysets,
but headline bits incude:
- queryset.filter() on attributes/properties - eg
MyNodeModel.objects.filter(name="baz"). Plus, SQL-like operators, if
possible such as foo__contains="bar", foo__icontains="BAR" and
foo__iexact="Bar" (These calls methods will most likely be
needed for full
Django Admin support anyway, to allow for the in-Admin search
facility, and
I know Tobias already has Admin support on his list)
- queryset.values() method for querysets, to get just certain values
back. This is often used for better ORM performance in Django,
but will it
make much difference in Neo4j?
- queryset.order_by('attribute_name') - again, probably essential for
Django-admin support
- Control over traversals -- this is non-RDBMS-Django ORM functionality,
but am really looking forward to it!
- Support for Managers for models (
http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.1/topics/db/managers/#topics-db-managers),
so one can extend a model's standard API methods with custom ones. Indeed,
this seems a neat way to acccess Neo traversals via the Django ORM.
- Typed fields, rather than just Property(), or perhaps better, simply
the facility to specify a custom Django form field for it - eg:
class Member(model.NodeModel):
...
email_address = model.Property(form_field=django.forms.fields.EmailField)
- Support for django.contrib.auth (already on Tobias's list).
Indeed, it'll be very interesting to see how much extra neo4j-python work
might be required when trying to use common pluggable Django (or Pinax
www.pinaxproject.com) apps. Once support for django.contrib.auth is in,
then we'll be able to experiment.
That's the lot for now. Forgive me if this seems too demanding, or if I'm
not appreciating the power of Neo in my request for typed fields, or if I'm
asking for stuff that's already there but I've missed :o)
Hope it helps keep things moving. I'll play with it all more in the coming
week, I hope, and can chip in more as and when required, and would be v
interested to hear opinions from other Djangonauts on this list.
Cheers
Steve
___
Neo mailing list
User@lists.neo4j.org
https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
[Neo] Does anyone have Prefuse (not flare) with Neo4j sample code?
In particular, how to use their graph reader class or custom mapping? Thanks, Todd ___ Neo mailing list User@lists.neo4j.org https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
Re: [Neo] Neo in a cluster?
Raul,
thanks for the info! Have you looked at Taylor's jo4neo,
http://code.google.com/p/jo4neo/ which is taking a similar approach,
and do you think there would be value in having a JPA adapter for
Neo4j? We would be happy to hear about your experience there!
Happy New Year!
/peter neubauer
COO and Sales, Neo Technology
GTalk: neubauer.peter
Skype peter.neubauer
Phone +46 704 106975
LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/neubauer
Twitter http://twitter.com/peterneubauer
http://www.neo4j.org- Relationships count.
http://gremlin.tinkerpop.com- PageRank in 2 lines of code.
http://www.linkedprocess.org - Computing at LinkedData scale.
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Raul Raja Martinez wrote:
> Hi Johan,
>
> It does and we're very excited about Neo4j. Can't wait for your clustering
> support.
> We have developed a annotation based sytem on top of Neo based on interfaces
> and java dynamic proxies that allows you to delegate all state lookup and
> relationship to the neo store such as
>
> @Node
> public interface Person {
>
> �...@id
> Long getId();
>
> �...@property(indexed=true,unique=true,fulltext=true)
> String getName();
>
> void setName(String name);
>
> �...@relationship
> City getCity();
>
> �...@relationship
> List getFriends();
>
> �...@traverser(returnableEvaluator=Whatever.class)
> List getAllFriendsCloseBy();
>
> }
>
> It's lazy lookup based system that wraps the underlying nodes and delegates
> calls to the right operations on the node. It supports Date, Enums and any
> arbitrariy types that can be configured through converters. We're going to
> run it in a prod system in the next few months and plan to release it open
> source.
>
> We have extensive experience with hibernate, and other jpa based
> implementations and the ease of use and speed with neo4j so far is better
> when it comes to complex relaationships or operation that require multiple
> joins in a fully normalized relational model.
>
> Our current challenge is returning ordered relationships when displaying the
> data since it requires the node/entities returned in a specific order based
> on node property values.
>
> Anyway thanks for your responses and good job with Neo4J
>
> 2009/12/31 Johan Svensson
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 5:07 PM, Raul Raja Martinez
>> wrote:
>> > Hi everybody,
>> >
>> > We're evaluating neo4j and we're very pleased with it so far.
>> >
>> > I have a few questions/concerns as far as it scalability beyond a single
>> > machine.
>> >
>> > 1. Can a Neo4J store be accessed from different machines? I'm aware of
>> > remote neo but I read I'd be slow a in a production environment.
>>
>> Yes. Our solution for this (HA 1.0) is currently in development but if
>> you just need availability and scaling reads you can either roll your
>> own solution or make use of read-only Neo4j instances and
>> online-backup (alpha) http://wiki.neo4j.org/content/Online_Backup_HA
>>
>> >
>> > 2. If it can, what would the WRITE/READ model look like? Is there the
>> > concept of master/slave clustered stores
>>
>> HA 1.0 will have a master/slave setup but all slaves can be written
>> to. Writes will be synchronized with the master and the master will
>> then eventually make sure other slaves gets updated.
>>
>> >
>> > 3. Is there Terracotta support or has anybody ever looked into in?
>>
>> No support for Terracotta and we have not really looked into it (but
>> from what I remember everything breaks down once you need to be a real
>> database and not just a "cache").
>>
>> >
>> > 4. Are there plans to support clustering in Neo4j? If so is there a road
>> > map?
>> >
>> > I think it is realistic to assume that many server side projects that
>> > support multiple concurrent users run in production with more than one
>> J2EE
>> > server even if it is for balancing http load. It is still unclear to me
>> how
>> > to get data from a neo store if the front end is distributed among
>> servers.
>>
>> Right now we are fully focused on the Neo4j 1.0 release that will be
>> out in January. After that focus will shift to HA 1.0 and we aim to
>> get a first version out in Q1/Q2. Since we are an embedded database
>> the architecture when running multiple machines is a bit different
>> then from the typical J2EE setup. Instead of having your separate DB
>> cluster machines put the full stack on each machine (http layer+BL+DB
>> layer) and run a load balancer in front.
>>
>> Hope this answers some of your questions.
>>
>> Regards,
>> -Johan
>> ___
>> Neo mailing list
>> User@lists.neo4j.org
>> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Raul Raja
> ___
> Neo mailing list
> User@lists.neo4j.org
> https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
>
___
Neo mailing list
User@lists.neo4j.org
https://lists.neo4j.org/mailman/listinfo/user
