Re: [SHALE] Are we there yet?
On 8/25/05, Walton, Kaleb (ISS Southfield) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Just subscribed to dev list which should also help me to develop a > conception of the speed of development. Cool. > > I would assume I was talking about 35066 since it was related to the > dialog state. In my usual trial/error testing I removed an h:outputText > tag and replaced it with some straight text and it spat out an error (if > you want the stacktrace I can bring up my box and provide it to you). I > had to restart resin to be able to continue my poking :). > I know of some things (related to 35066) that will certainly break with the current implementation -- for example, using frames with separate active dialogs, or using the back button at all. What would be most helpful is straightforward examples of problem areas -- stuff we could build in to a test case -- so that once the functionality is updated we can test to avoid regressions. > Regarding the statuses within the JavaDocs - excuse me if I am > misunderstanding something simple - from what I gather, I should be > weary of heavily developing with anything that isn't in Evolving+ state > as there might be backwards-incompatible changes? > Your degree of being wary should entirely depend on your willingness to deal with potential future changes, balanced by your desire to use the features in a particular package. I can't make that judgement call for you :-). I can tell you, though, that if nobody ever experiments with the more "on the edge stuff", the bugs will never get found, therefore they'll never get fixed, therefore the fixes will never get released ... if you (generic you as in "the world") want solid code, somebody's got to be willing to test it -- and the best way to test something like a web app framework is to build apps on top of it and see what works, and what doesn't. > Thanks again for the speedy response! > > Regards, > Kaleb > Craig - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [SHALE] Are we there yet?
Just subscribed to dev list which should also help me to develop a conception of the speed of development. I would assume I was talking about 35066 since it was related to the dialog state. In my usual trial/error testing I removed an h:outputText tag and replaced it with some straight text and it spat out an error (if you want the stacktrace I can bring up my box and provide it to you). I had to restart resin to be able to continue my poking :). Regarding the statuses within the JavaDocs - excuse me if I am misunderstanding something simple - from what I gather, I should be weary of heavily developing with anything that isn't in Evolving+ state as there might be backwards-incompatible changes? Thanks again for the speedy response! Regards, Kaleb -Original Message- From: Craig McClanahan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:11 PM To: Struts Users Mailing List Subject: Re: [SHALE] Are we there yet? On 8/25/05, Walton, Kaleb (ISS Southfield) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > A similar question has been asked once since I joined this list - so I > apologize in advance if this question has been asked numerous times > before. > > A colleague of mine and I are researching Shale for potential use in a > production environment. Our timeline is pretty open - we're looking to > implement some set of frameworks within the next year or so. Shale > piqued our interest as it integrated and supported many of the > frameworks we are looking to introduce (Spring, Spring WebFlow, JSF, > JUnit tests, validation, etc). > > I actually have a few questions: > > 1) Is Shale development still at full tilt, or has it weaned in leiu > of Java conferences coming to an end or not as much developer time > available? It proceeds apace, subject (as with all open source efforts) to vagaries of day job schedules and travel. There's a roadmap for a 1.0 milestone release posted on the Wiki: http://wiki.apache.org/struts/ShaleRelease100 which I see needs to be updated ... Gary just checked in fixes for a bunch of the Clay issues last night (part of the delay was waiting for his new committer capabilities to be set up on the ASF infrastructure). > 2) I've been actively following the development of Shale for the past > few months and haven't found many news updates recently (hopefully > that means the developers are busy developing and have no time to post > updates). Are there any other more frequently updated resources that I > may not be aware of? I currently check the Shale Wiki, David Geary's > Blog, Craig's Blog, struts.apache.org and general googling. You'll see blog entries occasionally, but the best way to keep track of what's going on is actually to subscribe to the Struts developer list (to subscribe send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]) and watch the SVN commit messages and Shale-related Bugzilla updates that go by. > 3) When's the next big regurgitation of code into the trunk ? :) > > What I have read and seen (just yesterday we built and brought up the > use-cases under Resin 3.0.12) I have been very excited about. Although > I noticed a bug right off the bat (probably the state bug related to > the ViewController as outlined in the wiki), I'm still very interested > in using this framework for our product. Are you talking about issue 35066? If not, which one? For 35066 in particular, I'm thinking that we should defer that to a 1.0.1 milestone, because pretty much everything else has been taken care of. > > I think the Shale framework is very promising and I applaud the speed > in which it has gone from conceptual to tangible. My only fear is that > we'll need to move to a new set of frameworks before Shale becomes > dependable for production use :). Regarding the API stability of the various packages, you'll definitely want to go to the Core Library javadocs: http://people.apache.org/~craigmcc/shale-core-javadocs/ and scroll down to the "API Package Target Audiences and Stability Ratings" section. Application developers should use only the APIs in packages targeted to "Developer", and the table lists the projected stability of the APIs. For instance, the view controller stuff is marked "Evolving", which means we're paying attention to backwards compatibility (for that package) even before a General Availability release. > > Thanks! > > Regards, > Kaleb Walton > > Craig - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [SHALE] Are we there yet?
On 8/25/05, Walton, Kaleb (ISS Southfield) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > A similar question has been asked once since I joined this list - so I > apologize in advance if this question has been asked numerous times > before. > > A colleague of mine and I are researching Shale for potential use in a > production environment. Our timeline is pretty open - we're looking to > implement some set of frameworks within the next year or so. Shale > piqued our interest as it integrated and supported many of the > frameworks we are looking to introduce (Spring, Spring WebFlow, JSF, > JUnit tests, validation, etc). > > I actually have a few questions: > > 1) Is Shale development still at full tilt, or has it weaned in leiu of > Java conferences coming to an end or not as much developer time > available? It proceeds apace, subject (as with all open source efforts) to vagaries of day job schedules and travel. There's a roadmap for a 1.0 milestone release posted on the Wiki: http://wiki.apache.org/struts/ShaleRelease100 which I see needs to be updated ... Gary just checked in fixes for a bunch of the Clay issues last night (part of the delay was waiting for his new committer capabilities to be set up on the ASF infrastructure). > 2) I've been actively following the development of Shale for the past > few months and haven't found many news updates recently (hopefully that > means the developers are busy developing and have no time to post > updates). Are there any other more frequently updated resources that I > may not be aware of? I currently check the Shale Wiki, David Geary's > Blog, Craig's Blog, struts.apache.org and general googling. You'll see blog entries occasionally, but the best way to keep track of what's going on is actually to subscribe to the Struts developer list (to subscribe send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]) and watch the SVN commit messages and Shale-related Bugzilla updates that go by. > 3) When's the next big regurgitation of code into the trunk ? :) > > What I have read and seen (just yesterday we built and brought up the > use-cases under Resin 3.0.12) I have been very excited about. Although I > noticed a bug right off the bat (probably the state bug related to the > ViewController as outlined in the wiki), I'm still very interested in > using this framework for our product. Are you talking about issue 35066? If not, which one? For 35066 in particular, I'm thinking that we should defer that to a 1.0.1 milestone, because pretty much everything else has been taken care of. > > I think the Shale framework is very promising and I applaud the speed in > which it has gone from conceptual to tangible. My only fear is that > we'll need to move to a new set of frameworks before Shale becomes > dependable for production use :). Regarding the API stability of the various packages, you'll definitely want to go to the Core Library javadocs: http://people.apache.org/~craigmcc/shale-core-javadocs/ and scroll down to the "API Package Target Audiences and Stability Ratings" section. Application developers should use only the APIs in packages targeted to "Developer", and the table lists the projected stability of the APIs. For instance, the view controller stuff is marked "Evolving", which means we're paying attention to backwards compatibility (for that package) even before a General Availability release. > > Thanks! > > Regards, > Kaleb Walton > > Craig - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
