RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

You are correct.
Snapshots remain visible in the GUI and can be removed.

Thanks, that explains it.

Best Regards,
Jordan 

-Original Message-
From: Slavka Peleva  
Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2021 3:42 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with XCP-NG. I rechecked your steps, and there 
isn't a call to delete a volume snapshot. I think that destroying a VM works 
almost the same for all hypervisors, and the volume snapshots won't be deleted 
automatically. Can you check if they are visible in the UI?

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 3:03 PM Yordan Kostov  wrote:

> Hey Slavka,
>
> Deployment is 4.15.2 + XCP-NG 8.2 utilizing fiber channel SAN 
> as primary storage.
>
> Regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Slavka Peleva 
> Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:54 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hi Yordan,
>
> can you share what are you using for primary storage? In some cases, 
> the deletion of snapshots on secondary isn't implemented. According to 
> the code, the cleanup of the snapshots is only for the DB, not for 
> cleaning the secondary storage.
>
> Best regards,
> Slavka
>
> On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 2:37 PM Vivek Kumar  .invalid>
> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > You can check the the snapshot status in - snapshots table in DB. 
> > You can also verify the status in  table called - 
> > snapshot_store_ref. Yes cloudStack runs a cleanup job, timings 
> > depends what you have defined in global setting  -
> >
> > storage.cleanup.delay   Determines how long (in seconds) to wait before
> > actually expunging destroyed volumes. The default value = the 
> > default
> value
> > of storage.cleanup.interval.Advanced
> > 86400
> >
> > storage.cleanup.enabled Enables/disables the storage cleanup thread.
> > Advanced
> > true
> >
> > storage.cleanup.intervalThe interval (in seconds) to wait before
> > running the storage cleanup thread.Advanced
> > 86400
> >
> >
> >
> > Vivek Kumar
> > Sr. Manager - Cloud & DevOps
> > IndiQus Technologies
> > M +91 7503460090
> > https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.indiqus.com__;!!A6UyJA!3CYjCk
> > -6 
> > l_RJxlZSVAgmTqt2LJFeWODa5bdiKclS7xGT1weD16tUBUGwVHeDrYKQpLoahZ_meJ1V
> > $
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On 21-Oct-2021, at 4:38 PM, Yordan Kostov 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Here is another thing I noticed.
> > > - have a VM with a volume snapshots
> > > - Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
> > > - check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.
> > >
> > > Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the 
> > > orphaned
> > backups will remain?
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Jordan
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: benoit lair 
> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
> > > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> > >
> > >
> > > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello Yordan,
> > >
> > > I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1
> > >
> > > The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the
> > snapshot
> > >
> > > That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me 
> > > possibility
> > to do some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an 
> > SDS which could give me block storage or at least file storage and 
> > acting as a proxy between my iscsi array and my xcp-ng
> > >
> > > Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if 
> > > the
> > plugin will be compatible with xcp-ng
> > >
> > > Regards, Benoit
> > >
> > > Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  
> > > a
> > écrit :
> > >
> > >> Hello Benoit,
> > >>
> > >>Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from 
> > >> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> > >>- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> > >>- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero 
> > >> >
> > >> test_file1 )then the file was removed s

Re: Size of the snapshots volume

[Slavka Peleva]

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with XCP-NG. I rechecked your steps, and
there isn't a call to delete a volume snapshot. I think that destroying a
VM works almost the same for all hypervisors, and the volume snapshots
won't be deleted automatically. Can you check if they are visible in the UI?

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 3:03 PM Yordan Kostov  wrote:

> Hey Slavka,
>
> Deployment is 4.15.2 + XCP-NG 8.2 utilizing fiber channel SAN as
> primary storage.
>
> Regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Slavka Peleva 
> Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:54 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hi Yordan,
>
> can you share what are you using for primary storage? In some cases, the
> deletion of snapshots on secondary isn't implemented. According to the
> code, the cleanup of the snapshots is only for the DB, not for cleaning the
> secondary storage.
>
> Best regards,
> Slavka
>
> On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 2:37 PM Vivek Kumar  .invalid>
> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > You can check the the snapshot status in - snapshots table in DB. You
> > can also verify the status in  table called - snapshot_store_ref. Yes
> > cloudStack runs a cleanup job, timings depends what you have defined
> > in global setting  -
> >
> > storage.cleanup.delay   Determines how long (in seconds) to wait before
> > actually expunging destroyed volumes. The default value = the default
> value
> > of storage.cleanup.interval.Advanced
> > 86400
> >
> > storage.cleanup.enabled Enables/disables the storage cleanup thread.
> > Advanced
> > true
> >
> > storage.cleanup.intervalThe interval (in seconds) to wait before
> > running the storage cleanup thread.Advanced
> > 86400
> >
> >
> >
> > Vivek Kumar
> > Sr. Manager - Cloud & DevOps
> > IndiQus Technologies
> > M +91 7503460090
> > https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.indiqus.com__;!!A6UyJA!3CYjCk-6
> > l_RJxlZSVAgmTqt2LJFeWODa5bdiKclS7xGT1weD16tUBUGwVHeDrYKQpLoahZ_meJ1V$
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On 21-Oct-2021, at 4:38 PM, Yordan Kostov 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Here is another thing I noticed.
> > > - have a VM with a volume snapshots
> > > - Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
> > > - check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.
> > >
> > > Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the orphaned
> > backups will remain?
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Jordan
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: benoit lair 
> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
> > > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> > >
> > >
> > > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello Yordan,
> > >
> > > I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1
> > >
> > > The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the
> > snapshot
> > >
> > > That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me
> > > possibility
> > to do some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an SDS
> > which could give me block storage or at least file storage and acting
> > as a proxy between my iscsi array and my xcp-ng
> > >
> > > Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the
> > plugin will be compatible with xcp-ng
> > >
> > > Regards, Benoit
> > >
> > > Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a
> > écrit :
> > >
> > >> Hello Benoit,
> > >>
> > >>Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from
> > >> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> > >>- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> > >>- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
> > >> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
> > >>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size
> is
> > >>    - VM1 -  2.3G
> > >>- VM2 -  41G
> > >>- Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk
> > >> again
> > >> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
> > >>- scheduled backup goes

RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

Hey Slavka,

Deployment is 4.15.2 + XCP-NG 8.2 utilizing fiber channel SAN as 
primary storage.

Regards,
Jordan

-Original Message-
From: Slavka Peleva  
Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:54 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hi Yordan,

can you share what are you using for primary storage? In some cases, the 
deletion of snapshots on secondary isn't implemented. According to the code, 
the cleanup of the snapshots is only for the DB, not for cleaning the secondary 
storage.

Best regards,
Slavka

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 2:37 PM Vivek Kumar 
wrote:

> Hello,
>
> You can check the the snapshot status in - snapshots table in DB. You 
> can also verify the status in  table called - snapshot_store_ref. Yes 
> cloudStack runs a cleanup job, timings depends what you have defined 
> in global setting  -
>
> storage.cleanup.delay   Determines how long (in seconds) to wait before
> actually expunging destroyed volumes. The default value = the default value
> of storage.cleanup.interval.Advanced
> 86400
>
> storage.cleanup.enabled Enables/disables the storage cleanup thread.
> Advanced
> true
>
> storage.cleanup.intervalThe interval (in seconds) to wait before
> running the storage cleanup thread.Advanced
> 86400
>
>
>
> Vivek Kumar
> Sr. Manager - Cloud & DevOps
> IndiQus Technologies
> M +91 7503460090
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.indiqus.com__;!!A6UyJA!3CYjCk-6
> l_RJxlZSVAgmTqt2LJFeWODa5bdiKclS7xGT1weD16tUBUGwVHeDrYKQpLoahZ_meJ1V$
>
>
>
>
> > On 21-Oct-2021, at 4:38 PM, Yordan Kostov  wrote:
> >
> > Here is another thing I noticed.
> > - have a VM with a volume snapshots
> > - Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
> > - check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.
> >
> > Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the orphaned
> backups will remain?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jordan
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: benoit lair 
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
> > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> >
> >
> > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >
> >
> > Hello Yordan,
> >
> > I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1
> >
> > The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the
> snapshot
> >
> > That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me 
> > possibility
> to do some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an SDS 
> which could give me block storage or at least file storage and acting 
> as a proxy between my iscsi array and my xcp-ng
> >
> > Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the
> plugin will be compatible with xcp-ng
> >
> > Regards, Benoit
> >
> > Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a
> écrit :
> >
> >> Hello Benoit,
> >>
> >>Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from 
> >> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> >>- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> >>- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
> >> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
> >>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
> >>- VM1 -  2.3G
> >>- VM2 -  41G
> >>- Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk 
> >> again
> >> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
> >>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
> >>- VM1 - 2.3G
> >>- VM2 - 88G
> >>
> >>Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no 
> >> less than the size of the whole disk.
> >>May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Jordan
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Yordan Kostov 
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
> >> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume
> >>
> >>
> >> [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >>
> >>
> >> Hello Benoit,
> >>
> >>Unfortunately no.
> >>When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.
> >>
> >&

Re: Size of the snapshots volume

[Slavka Peleva]

Hi Yordan,

can you share what are you using for primary storage? In some cases, the
deletion of snapshots on secondary isn't implemented. According to the
code, the cleanup of the snapshots is only for the DB, not for cleaning the
secondary storage.

Best regards,
Slavka

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 2:37 PM Vivek Kumar 
wrote:

> Hello,
>
> You can check the the snapshot status in - snapshots table in DB. You can
> also verify the status in  table called - snapshot_store_ref. Yes
> cloudStack runs a cleanup job, timings depends what you have defined in
> global setting  -
>
> storage.cleanup.delay   Determines how long (in seconds) to wait before
> actually expunging destroyed volumes. The default value = the default value
> of storage.cleanup.interval.Advanced
> 86400
>
> storage.cleanup.enabled Enables/disables the storage cleanup thread.
> Advanced
> true
>
> storage.cleanup.intervalThe interval (in seconds) to wait before
> running the storage cleanup thread.Advanced
> 86400
>
>
>
> Vivek Kumar
> Sr. Manager - Cloud & DevOps
> IndiQus Technologies
> M +91 7503460090
> www.indiqus.com
>
>
>
>
> > On 21-Oct-2021, at 4:38 PM, Yordan Kostov  wrote:
> >
> > Here is another thing I noticed.
> > - have a VM with a volume snapshots
> > - Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
> > - check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.
> >
> > Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the orphaned
> backups will remain?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jordan
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: benoit lair 
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
> > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> >
> >
> > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >
> >
> > Hello Yordan,
> >
> > I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1
> >
> > The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the
> snapshot
> >
> > That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me possibility
> to do some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an SDS which
> could give me block storage or at least file storage and acting as a proxy
> between my iscsi array and my xcp-ng
> >
> > Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the
> plugin will be compatible with xcp-ng
> >
> > Regards, Benoit
> >
> > Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a
> écrit :
> >
> >> Hello Benoit,
> >>
> >>Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from
> >> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> >>- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> >>- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
> >> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
> >>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
> >>- VM1 -  2.3G
> >>- VM2 -  41G
> >>- Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk
> >> again
> >> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
> >>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
> >>    - VM1 - 2.3G
> >>- VM2 - 88G
> >>
> >>Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no
> >> less than the size of the whole disk.
> >>May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Jordan
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Yordan Kostov 
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
> >> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume
> >>
> >>
> >> [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >>
> >>
> >> Hello Benoit,
> >>
> >>Unfortunately no.
> >>When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Jordan
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: benoit lair 
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
> >> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> >>
> >>
> >> [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >>
> >>
> >> Hello Jordan,
> >>
> >> Could you proceed to your tests ?

Re: Size of the snapshots volume

[Vivek Kumar]

Hello, 

You can check the the snapshot status in - snapshots table in DB. You can also 
verify the status in  table called - snapshot_store_ref. Yes cloudStack runs a 
cleanup job, timings depends what you have defined in global setting  - 

storage.cleanup.delay   Determines how long (in seconds) to wait before 
actually expunging destroyed volumes. The default value = the default value of 
storage.cleanup.interval.Advanced
86400

storage.cleanup.enabled Enables/disables the storage cleanup thread.
Advanced
true

storage.cleanup.intervalThe interval (in seconds) to wait before 
running the storage cleanup thread.Advanced
86400



Vivek Kumar
Sr. Manager - Cloud & DevOps 
IndiQus Technologies
M +91 7503460090 
www.indiqus.com




> On 21-Oct-2021, at 4:38 PM, Yordan Kostov  wrote:
> 
> Here is another thing I noticed.
> - have a VM with a volume snapshots
> - Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
> - check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.
> 
> Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the orphaned backups 
> will remain?
> 
> Regards,
> Jordan 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: benoit lair  
> Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
> 
> 
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
> 
> 
> Hello Yordan,
> 
> I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1
> 
> The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the snapshot
> 
> That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me possibility to do 
> some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an SDS which could 
> give me block storage or at least file storage and acting as a proxy between 
> my iscsi array and my xcp-ng
> 
> Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the plugin 
> will be compatible with xcp-ng
> 
> Regards, Benoit
> 
> Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :
> 
>> Hello Benoit,
>> 
>>Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from 
>> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
>>- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
>>- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
>> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
>>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
>>- VM1 -  2.3G
>>- VM2 -  41G
>>- Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk 
>> again
>> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
>>- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
>>- VM1 - 2.3G
>>- VM2 - 88G
>> 
>>Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no 
>> less than the size of the whole disk.
>>    May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> Jordan
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Yordan Kostov 
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume
>> 
>> 
>> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>> 
>> 
>> Hello Benoit,
>> 
>>Unfortunately no.
>>When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> Jordan
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: benoit lair 
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
>> 
>> 
>> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>> 
>> 
>> Hello Jordan,
>> 
>> Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?
>> 
>> Regards, Benoit Lair
>> 
>> Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a 
>> écrit
>> :
>> 
>>> Here are a few considerations:
>>> 
>>> - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
>>> - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
>>> - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete 
>>> data from disk.
>>> 
>>> As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning 
>>> threats it as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. 
>>> So the full snap that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
>>> 
>>> I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
>>> 
>>> Best regards,
>

RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

Here is another thing I noticed.
- have a VM with a volume snapshots
- Expunge the VM so the disk is removed also
- check the Secondary Storage - backup still remains.

Does anyone knows if Cloudstack does a cleanup later or the orphaned backups 
will remain?

Regards,
Jordan 

-Original Message-
From: benoit lair  
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 1:22 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hello Yordan,

I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1

The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the snapshot

That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me possibility to do 
some thin provisionning with XCP-NG I was thinking about an SDS which could 
give me block storage or at least file storage and acting as a proxy between my 
iscsi array and my xcp-ng

Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the plugin will 
be compatible with xcp-ng

Regards, Benoit

Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :

> Hello Benoit,
>
> Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from 
> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> - VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> - VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
> - scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
> - VM1 -  2.3G
> - VM2 -  41G
> - Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk 
> again
> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
> - scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
> - VM1 - 2.3G
> - VM2 - 88G
>
> Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no 
> less than the size of the whole disk.
> May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Yordan Kostov 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hello Benoit,
>
> Unfortunately no.
> When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -----Original Message-
> From: benoit lair 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hello Jordan,
>
> Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?
>
> Regards, Benoit Lair
>
> Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a 
> écrit
> :
>
> > Here are a few considerations:
> >
> > - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
> > - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
> > - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete 
> > data from disk.
> >
> > As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning 
> > threats it as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. 
> > So the full snap that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
> >
> > I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Jordan
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Florian Noel 
> > Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
> > To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
> > Subject: Size of the snapshots volume
> >
> >
> > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack
> >
> > When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the 
> > secondary storage.
> > Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.
> >
> > Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
> > We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its 
> > size is 20GB on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.
> >
> > We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse 
> > and
> fat.
> > The results are the same.
> >
> > We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in 
> > iSCSI on the hypervisors XCP.
> >
> > Thanks for your help.
> >
> > Best regards.
> >
> >
> > [Logo Web et Solutions]<
> > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit

Re: Size of the snapshots volume

[benoit lair]

Hello Yordan,

I had same results with xcp-ng 8.2 and ACS 4.15.1

The max filled during the life of the disk will be the size of the snapshot

That's why i looking towards SDS with a solution giving me possibility to
do some thin provisionning with XCP-NG
I was thinking about an SDS which could give me block storage or at least
file storage and acting as a proxy between my iscsi array and my xcp-ng

Linstor could be a solution, but for the moment i don't know if the plugin
will be compatible with xcp-ng

Regards, Benoit

Le mar. 19 oct. 2021 à 11:46, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :

> Hello Benoit,
>
> Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from
> template - Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
> - VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
> - VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero >
> test_file1 )then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
> - scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
> - VM1 -  2.3G
> - VM2 -  41G
> - Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk again
> - cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
> - scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
> - VM1 - 2.3G
> - VM2 - 88G
>
> Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no less
> than the size of the whole disk.
> May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Yordan Kostov 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hello Benoit,
>
> Unfortunately no.
> When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -----Original Message-
> From: benoit lair 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hello Jordan,
>
> Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?
>
> Regards, Benoit Lair
>
> Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a écrit
> :
>
> > Here are a few considerations:
> >
> > - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
> > - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
> > - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete
> > data from disk.
> >
> > As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning threats
> > it as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. So the full
> > snap that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
> >
> > I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Jordan
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Florian Noel 
> > Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
> > To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
> > Subject: Size of the snapshots volume
> >
> >
> > [X] This message came from outside your organization
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack
> >
> > When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the
> > secondary storage.
> > Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.
> >
> > Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
> > We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its size
> > is 20GB on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.
> >
> > We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse and
> fat.
> > The results are the same.
> >
> > We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in
> > iSCSI on the hypervisors XCP.
> >
> > Thanks for your help.
> >
> > Best regards.
> >
> >
> > [Logo Web et Solutions]<
> > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> > 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> > v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDzCgMKxZAoq
> > vlt4NqCVlovo0bn9PcMUWFMak1jGIGRgGg==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mf
> > o8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCye42DjJ$
> > >
> >
> > [Facebook]<
> > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> > 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
&

RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

Hello Benoit,

Here are some results - 4.15.2 + XCP-NG. I made 2 VMs from template - 
Centos 7, 46 GB hdd, 4% full
- VM1 - root disk is as full as template.
- VM2 - root disk is made full up to ~90%  ( cat /dev/zero > test_file1 
)then the file was removed so the used space is again 4%.
- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. First snapshot size is
- VM1 -  2.3G
- VM2 -  41G 
- Then on VM2 this script was run to fill and empty the disk again - 
cat /dev/zero > /opt/test_file1; sync; rm /opt/ test_file1.
- scheduled backup goes through both VMs. All snapshots size is:
- VM1 - 2.3G
- VM2 - 88G

Once the disk is filled you will get a snapshot with size no less than 
the size of the whole disk. 
May be there is a way to shrink it but I could not find it.

Best regards,
Jordan

-Original Message-
From: Yordan Kostov  
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:58 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: RE: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hello Benoit,

Unfortunately no.
When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.

Best regards,
Jordan

-Original Message-
From: benoit lair 
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hello Jordan,

Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?

Regards, Benoit Lair

Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :

> Here are a few considerations:
>
> - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
> - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
> - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete 
> data from disk.
>
> As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning threats 
> it as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. So the full 
> snap that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
>
> I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Florian Noel 
> Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
> To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
> Subject: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack
>
> When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the 
> secondary storage.
> Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.
>
> Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
> We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its size 
> is 20GB on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.
>
> We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse and fat.
> The results are the same.
>
> We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in 
> iSCSI on the hypervisors XCP.
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Best regards.
>
>
> [Logo Web et Solutions]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDzCgMKxZAoq
> vlt4NqCVlovo0bn9PcMUWFMak1jGIGRgGg==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mf
> o8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCye42DjJ$
> >
>
> [Facebook]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDyIo6EwBskR
> 6pg3M12nuwExu8D-tkYDv5BE1h2dA1rTOfbHIEta8XTaUC0Et-KgDBM=__;!!A6UyJA!zY
> KJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC9_z
> SGk3$
> >
>
> [Twitter]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDxVGISVA_Rn
> Jl21WVuzHCTH_v3e4PfK5YBq_Q228Kqxog==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mf
> o8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC36OFkHl$
> >
>
> [LinkedIn]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDz5UNyOTEm_
> EvRFXdshn5-xaylm0Ysa1fuL9vCg5uDKfouGPQSgwbQq28Nl7_fXFIA=__;!!A6UyJA!zY
> KJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCzzS
> Dj-d$
> >
>
> [Youtube]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f

RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

Hello Benoit,

Unfortunately no. 
When I do it I will make sure to drop a line here.

Best regards,
Jordan

-Original Message-
From: benoit lair  
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:40 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hello Jordan,

Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?

Regards, Benoit Lair

Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :

> Here are a few considerations:
>
> - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
> - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
> - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete 
> data from disk.
>
> As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning threats 
> it as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. So the full 
> snap that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
>
> I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Florian Noel 
> Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
> To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
> Subject: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack
>
> When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the 
> secondary storage.
> Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.
>
> Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
> We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its size 
> is 20GB on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.
>
> We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse and fat.
> The results are the same.
>
> We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in 
> iSCSI on the hypervisors XCP.
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Best regards.
>
>
> [Logo Web et Solutions]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDzCgMKxZAoq
> vlt4NqCVlovo0bn9PcMUWFMak1jGIGRgGg==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mf
> o8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCye42DjJ$
> >
>
> [Facebook]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDyIo6EwBskR
> 6pg3M12nuwExu8D-tkYDv5BE1h2dA1rTOfbHIEta8XTaUC0Et-KgDBM=__;!!A6UyJA!zY
> KJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC9_z
> SGk3$
> >
>
> [Twitter]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDxVGISVA_Rn
> Jl21WVuzHCTH_v3e4PfK5YBq_Q228Kqxog==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mf
> o8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC36OFkHl$
> >
>
> [LinkedIn]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
> v9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDz5UNyOTEm_
> EvRFXdshn5-xaylm0Ysa1fuL9vCg5uDKfouGPQSgwbQq28Nl7_fXFIA=__;!!A6UyJA!zY
> KJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCzzS
> Dj-d$
> >
>
> [Youtube]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e
> 5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_e
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> HFrm2U65Sd5oXm55IjnZsXt1s4eREvsJGMpsgNaX2L3OdByrUM3b4Xg=__;!!A6UyJA!zY
> KJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC3f1
> vTjU$
> >
>
> Florian Noel
>
> Administrateur Systèmes Et Réseaux
>
> [
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://storage.letsignit.com/icons/design
> er/v2/phone-1.png__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOv
> qs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCxqW91pG$
> ] 02 35 78 11 90
>
> 705 Avenue Isaac Newton
>
> 76800 Saint-Etienne-Du-Rouvray
>
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> 92296e8c02bf93d4f9aa?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_ev
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> 8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCyft4U9I$
> >
>
>
>
>

Re: Size of the snapshots volume

[benoit lair]

Hello Jordan,

Could you proceed to your tests ? Have you got the same results ?

Regards, Benoit Lair

Le lun. 4 oct. 2021 à 17:59, Yordan Kostov  a écrit :

> Here are a few considerations:
>
> - First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
> - XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin.
> - Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete data
> from disk.
>
> As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning threats it
> as full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. So the full snap
> that will be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.
>
> I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.
>
> Best regards,
> Jordan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Florian Noel 
> Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
> To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
> Subject: Size of the snapshots volume
>
>
> [X] This message came from outside your organization
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack
>
> When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the
> secondary storage.
> Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.
>
> Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
> We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its size is
> 20GB on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.
>
> We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse and fat.
> The results are the same.
>
> We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in iSCSI
> on the hypervisors XCP.
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Best regards.
>
>
> [Logo Web et Solutions]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_ev9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDzCgMKxZAoqvlt4NqCVlovo0bn9PcMUWFMak1jGIGRgGg==__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHCye42DjJ$
> >
>
> [Facebook]<
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://cloud.letsignit.com/collect/bc/60e5c62f48323abd316580a3?p=NCQXXscJv3N-mDjmqdZzYH59ppVbYP3afFkR7SxQ1JaS_ev9TYs06R5yG_cSPe6tLuS3Bgn1EjTO39P6hIWtNhqUZ5n-wh878kG0mKc-TDyIo6EwBskR6pg3M12nuwExu8D-tkYDv5BE1h2dA1rTOfbHIEta8XTaUC0Et-KgDBM=__;!!A6UyJA!zYKJBkzZPANfqT6kPkY_Mfo8xu_hnCJDzEIYjPMOvqs3MwyZUs0N9FX1Ln1zICtHKJKHC9_zSGk3$
> >
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RE: Size of the snapshots volume

[Yordan Kostov]

Here are a few considerations:

- First snapshot of volume is always full snap.
- XenServer/XCP-NG backups are always thin. 
- Thin provisioning calculations never go down. Even if you delete data from 
disk.

As you filled the disk of the VM to top the thin provisioning threats it as 
full VM from that moment on even if data is deleted. So the full snap that will 
be migrated to NFS will always be of max size.

I am not 100% certain as I am yet to start running backup tests.

Best regards,
Jordan

-Original Message-
From: Florian Noel  
Sent: Monday, October 4, 2021 6:22 PM
To: 'users@cloudstack.apache.org' 
Subject: Size of the snapshots volume


[X] This message came from outside your organization


Hi,

I've a question about the snapshots volume in Cloudstack

When we take a snapshot of a volume, this create a VHD file on the secondary 
storage.
Snapshot size doesn't match volume size used.

Imagine a volume of 20GB, we fill the volume and empty it just after.
We take a snapshot of the volume from Cloudstack frontend and its size is 20GB 
on the secondary storage while the volume is empty.

We've made the same test with volume provisioning in thin, sparse and fat. The 
results are the same.

We use Cloudstack 4.15.1 with XCP-NG 8.1. The LUNs are connected in iSCSI on 
the hypervisors XCP.

Thanks for your help.

Best regards.


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