Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Calc and Base problems.

2011-10-03 Thread Andrew Douglas Pitonyak


On 09/30/2011 08:36 AM, Andreas Säger wrote:
The integration of HSQLDB into a so called database document was 
the biggest mistake ever. Just to be clear: HSQLDB is a great software 
and so is LibreOffice. The way how both products are merged into one 
container format generates a caricature of a database which looks and 
feels a little bit like an MS Access file.


Creating a real HSQLDB and connecting a separate Base document to it 
is very easy. Just set up a HSQLDB server for your local network or 
for the local machine and import the script file of your embedded 
database.
I would argue that it serves a purpose but has little use for a serious 
database system. I expect that it will suffice for most of the people 
that can tell the difference, but, it will sadly fail for some that have 
no idea what the problems can be when they start doing things like 
adding 50MB worth of data (pictures perhaps). I will tacitly refuse to 
say why I know.


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Andrew Pitonyak
My Macro Document: http://www.pitonyak.org/AndrewMacro.odt
Info:  http://www.pitonyak.org/oo.php


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[libreoffice-users] Re: Calc and Base problems.

2011-09-30 Thread Andreas Säger
The integration of HSQLDB into a so called database document was the 
biggest mistake ever. Just to be clear: HSQLDB is a great software and 
so is LibreOffice. The way how both products are merged into one 
container format generates a caricature of a database which looks and 
feels a little bit like an MS Access file.


Creating a real HSQLDB and connecting a separate Base document to it is 
very easy. Just set up a HSQLDB server for your local network or for the 
local machine and import the script file of your embedded database.


[Tutorial] Using registered datasources in Calc

http://ooo-forums.apache.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f=75t=18511

(how to link/copy any type of database to sheet cells)


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Calc and Base problems.

2011-09-30 Thread Don C. Myers

On 09/30/2011 11:29 AM, Andreas Säger wrote:

Am 30.09.2011 16:03, Don C. Myers wrote:

Hi Ian,

First, there are far more knowledgeable people responding here than I
am. But here are a few thoughts from reading this thread. These
suggestions are from my having used a database similar to yours for
years in Open Office, and since roughly 6 months in LibreOffice since I
switched from OpenOffice. I copy my database to 3 other computers
running LibreOffice (I did the same thing when I was using Open Office)
and I've never had any issues at all on any of the computers. So your
doing it should work perfectly fine. I also don't think this is a Java
issue. I'm assuming you have both LibreOffice and Open Office installed.
I've never had both on the same computer at the same time. When I moved
to LibreOffice, before I installed it, I removed Open Office. Maybe
there is a conflict on the second computer since I see ooobuild in the
path below. The second thought is maybe LibreOffice actually isn't
finding your database on the second computer. I would compare your
setup, paths, etc. on the first computer with the one on the second
computer, and make sure on the second computer LibreOffice is looking in
the right place for the database. I always have a folder under
home/documents/Database where I keep my database on all of the 
computers.


Don



Don,

1) I run 5 versions of OOo (2.4.3/3.3/3.4beta) and LibO(3.3/3.4) on 
the same machine without any trouble nor conflict. OOo 2.x, 3.x and 
LibO behave as independent applications so I can run them at the same 
time. If it were a Windows machine I would run MS Office, Word Perfect 
or whatever as well.


First of all you should be aware about the database you are working 
with. No, Base is *not* a database. Your database is indicated in the 
status bar of the connected database document. If it claims to be 
embedded then you need to understand that you are working with a 
kind of plug-in that installs an external database.


2) I was not talking about the folder where to store the so called 
database document. I was talking about the folder where the *true* 
database gets extracted to while you start up your embedded HSQLDB. 
Base is *not* a database program. You never work with Base. You 
*always* utilize some office features in order to work with some 
external database, even when it claims to be an integrated or 
embedded database.
I strongly recommend to abstain from this type of database except for 
demos and drafts.


Demo proposal (1 minute of time):
Look up your temp. folder in ToolsOptionsPaths and open that folder 
in your preferred file manager.
Open any of your integrated database documents (status bar: embedded 
HSQLDB).

Open any object table, query, form or report in your database.
Watch the temp. folder. This is the place where your HSQL database 
actually lives.
Close the integrated database document and watch the database 
disappearing.
The database will be lost when any office component crashes while the 
database gets installed or repackaged respectively. Databases grow 
over time. The larger the database, the more likely you will lose the 
entire database so you need to restore it from backups.


3) In a Windows network I run a HSQLDB server and many clients. Each 
client writes to the very same database simultaniously through 
LibreOffice forms (could be any other database forms as well, Access 
for instance). No matter which component crashes, there can not be any 
data loss except the currently edited records. Of course I run daily 
backups, but only on the server machine. On the clients there is 
nothing to save.





Hi Andreas,

Thank you very much. Yes, I have an embedded data base, and yes, in the 
temp folder when I open a form in the database a new temporary file 
appears and when I close it the file goes away.


You have a much more elaborate system and use than I do. I have about 
2,600 records in mine. I use it for doing some mail merge with writer, 
and basically for keeping information and updates for clients I work 
with. Is there a simple way to use the LibreOffice Front end with my 
form and use another database for the database file without it becoming 
a nightmare in trying to set it up? I'm running Ubuntu 11.04.


Thank you so much!

Don

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[libreoffice-users] Re: Calc and Base problems.

2011-09-30 Thread Andreas Säger

Am 30.09.2011 19:29, Don C. Myers wrote:

Hi Andreas,

Thank you very much. Yes, I have an embedded data base, and yes, in the
temp folder when I open a form in the database a new temporary file
appears and when I close it the file goes away.

You have a much more elaborate system and use than I do. I have about
2,600 records in mine. I use it for doing some mail merge with writer,
and basically for keeping information and updates for clients I work
with. Is there a simple way to use the LibreOffice Front end with my
form and use another database for the database file without it becoming
a nightmare in trying to set it up? I'm running Ubuntu 11.04.

Thank you so much!

Don



Well, your small address db may well kept in the embedded HSQLDB if that 
database is not constantly updated and you keep your daily backups and 
if you can live with the fact that only one user has write access at the 
same time. In case of a crash you would have to rewind the whole thing 
to the last backup.
Our external HSQLDB is constantly updated from several client machines 
at the same time. In case of a crash we would not lose many records (if 
any). All I had to do was installing the HSQLDB server, extract the 
script file from my embedded HSQLDB draft and write a configuration file 
for the HSQL server. Finally I added a 5 log-in users to that database.
Writing configuration options for a server into a plain text file is a 
small piece of work for a Linux user but may be a giant leap for a 
Windows user. Databases are professional tools.



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