Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Hi :) +1 Regards from Tom :) On 3 February 2017 at 01:57, gordon cooper wrote: > +1 > > Gordon. > > > On 03/02/17 13:12, Remy Gauthier wrote: > >> Euh, I think this thread should be cut and closed. It is becoming more >> and more a senseless discussion on the good or not so good ways of >> moderating a mailing list and as well, and this is what I find >> particularly disturbing, an Anne-ology bashing session. >> >> Thank you. >> >> RG. >> >> >> Le jeudi 02 février 2017 à 17:16 +, Peter Hillier-Brook a écrit : >> >>> Charles, one can only admire your patience, but isn't it time to put >>>> >>> a >> >>> stop to this nonsense with anne-ology (who I'm sure is not the >>> delightful Maureen, despite her use of the "-ology" suffix). >>> >>> Who has the authority to remove her from the moderator role, for >>>> >>> which >> >>> she seems singularly un-qualified? >>> >>> On 02/02/17 13:51, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: >>> >>>> Anne-ology, >>>> >>>> You are right, that is the general meaning of moderation. However, >>>>>> >>>>> when >> >>> we talk about moderation here, we talk about mailing list >>>>>> >>>>> moderation. >> >>> When we talk about moderator, we refer to a mailing list moderator, >>>>>> >>>>> not >> >>> to concepts such as panel moderators. A mailing list moderator has >>>>>> >>>>> a >> >>> specific role, which somewhat relates to the one of a moderator but >>>>>> >>>>> is >> >>> much more strict: it has been described a bit earlier but let me >>>>>> >>>>> restate >> >>> it: A mailing list moderator is in charge of the management of the >>>> >>>>> mailing list. This role mostly includes moderating emails, which >>>>>> >>>>> means: >> >>> - finding legitimate emails of posters who are not subscribed to >>>>>> >>>>> the >> >>> mailing list and moderating them as in publishing them to the list >>>>>> >>>>> (NOT >> >>> REPLYING TO THEM FIRST) >>>> - rejecting incoming illegitimate emails, such as spam. >>>> >>>> Another role of the list moderator usually (but not always) >>>>>> >>>>> involves: >> >>> - adding or unsubscribing email addresses per request of their >>>>>> >>>>> owner >> >>> - helping mailing list subscribers with similar tasks or technical >>>> issues directly related to their mailing list subscription >>>> - reminding everyone to be courteous >>>> >>>>> - following the netiquette (http://www.netiquette.org) and >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> reminding >> >>> mailing list subscribers to comply with it. >>>> >>>> Among all these points only the last two may relate somewhat more >>>>>> >>>>> the >> >>> broader meaning of "moderation". >>>> >>>> In short your daily task is not one moderation but rather one of >>>> >>>>> technical management. It also implies that you know how to post >>>>>> >>>>> properly >> >>> and understand the concept of mailing list discussion threads. From >>>>>> >>>>> my >> >>> perspective it seems you are not familiar with the concept,or that >>>>>> >>>>> you >> >>> perhaps have no desire to become acquainted with these notions >>>>>> >>>>> which >> >>> would be problematic for a mailing list moderator. Hence, there is >>>>>> >>>>> no >> >>> need to "clean" any "cruft from an email. Signs, mentions of date, >>>>>> >>>>> time, >> >>> etc. in an email are part of its information and may form a part of >>>>>> >>>>> the >> >>> thread. We need that. I notice you have managed to start a new >>>>>> >>>>> thread >> >>> "Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ..." that is not integrated &g
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
+1 Gordon. On 03/02/17 13:12, Remy Gauthier wrote: Euh, I think this thread should be cut and closed. It is becoming more and more a senseless discussion on the good or not so good ways of moderating a mailing list and as well, and this is what I find particularly disturbing, an Anne-ology bashing session. Thank you. RG. Le jeudi 02 février 2017 à 17:16 +, Peter Hillier-Brook a écrit : Charles, one can only admire your patience, but isn't it time to put a stop to this nonsense with anne-ology (who I'm sure is not the delightful Maureen, despite her use of the "-ology" suffix). Who has the authority to remove her from the moderator role, for which she seems singularly un-qualified? On 02/02/17 13:51, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: Anne-ology, You are right, that is the general meaning of moderation. However, when we talk about moderation here, we talk about mailing list moderation. When we talk about moderator, we refer to a mailing list moderator, not to concepts such as panel moderators. A mailing list moderator has a specific role, which somewhat relates to the one of a moderator but is much more strict: it has been described a bit earlier but let me restate it: A mailing list moderator is in charge of the management of the mailing list. This role mostly includes moderating emails, which means: - finding legitimate emails of posters who are not subscribed to the mailing list and moderating them as in publishing them to the list (NOT REPLYING TO THEM FIRST) - rejecting incoming illegitimate emails, such as spam. Another role of the list moderator usually (but not always) involves: - adding or unsubscribing email addresses per request of their owner - helping mailing list subscribers with similar tasks or technical issues directly related to their mailing list subscription - reminding everyone to be courteous - following the netiquette (http://www.netiquette.org) and reminding mailing list subscribers to comply with it. Among all these points only the last two may relate somewhat more the broader meaning of "moderation". In short your daily task is not one moderation but rather one of technical management. It also implies that you know how to post properly and understand the concept of mailing list discussion threads. From my perspective it seems you are not familiar with the concept,or that you perhaps have no desire to become acquainted with these notions which would be problematic for a mailing list moderator. Hence, there is no need to "clean" any "cruft from an email. Signs, mentions of date, time, etc. in an email are part of its information and may form a part of the thread. We need that. I notice you have managed to start a new thread "Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ..." that is not integrated with the original thread. This is not correct and you seem to do this for each one of your reply. Below is one page belonging to another community that may be helpful to you: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Hope this helps, Charles (who, by top-posting, does not comply to the netiquette). Le 02.02.2017 01:56, anne-ology a écrit : Do you know what moderation means? moderation := "the avoidance of excess or extremes, especially in one's behavior or political opinions" From: toki Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" On 01/31/2017 01:54 PM, Tom Davies wrote: It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that The correct thing is to _approve_ the message, not _respond_ within the message. As such, it is _always_ possible to do the right thing. That is basic moderation 101 jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Euh, I think this thread should be cut and closed. It is becoming more and more a senseless discussion on the good or not so good ways of moderating a mailing list and as well, and this is what I find particularly disturbing, an Anne-ology bashing session. Thank you. RG. Le jeudi 02 février 2017 à 17:16 +, Peter Hillier-Brook a écrit : > > Charles, one can only admire your patience, but isn't it time to put a > stop to this nonsense with anne-ology (who I'm sure is not the > delightful Maureen, despite her use of the "-ology" suffix). > > > Who has the authority to remove her from the moderator role, for which > she seems singularly un-qualified? > > On 02/02/17 13:51, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > > Anne-ology, > > > > > > You are right, that is the general meaning of moderation. However, when > > > > we talk about moderation here, we talk about mailing list moderation. > > > > When we talk about moderator, we refer to a mailing list moderator, not > > > > to concepts such as panel moderators. A mailing list moderator has a > > > > specific role, which somewhat relates to the one of a moderator but is > > > > much more strict: it has been described a bit earlier but let me restate > > it: A mailing list moderator is in charge of the management of the > > > > mailing list. This role mostly includes moderating emails, which means: > > > > - finding legitimate emails of posters who are not subscribed to the > > > > mailing list and moderating them as in publishing them to the list (NOT > > REPLYING TO THEM FIRST) > > - rejecting incoming illegitimate emails, such as spam. > > > > > > Another role of the list moderator usually (but not always) involves: > > > > - adding or unsubscribing email addresses per request of their owner > > - helping mailing list subscribers with similar tasks or technical > > issues directly related to their mailing list subscription > > - reminding everyone to be courteous > > > > > > - following the netiquette (http://www.netiquette.org) and reminding > > mailing list subscribers to comply with it. > > > > > > Among all these points only the last two may relate somewhat more the > > broader meaning of "moderation". > > > > In short your daily task is not one moderation but rather one of > > > > technical management. It also implies that you know how to post properly > > > > and understand the concept of mailing list discussion threads. From my > > > > perspective it seems you are not familiar with the concept,or that you > > > > perhaps have no desire to become acquainted with these notions which > > > > would be problematic for a mailing list moderator. Hence, there is no > > > > need to "clean" any "cruft from an email. Signs, mentions of date, time, > > > > etc. in an email are part of its information and may form a part of the > > > > thread. We need that. I notice you have managed to start a new thread > > > > "Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ..." that is not integrated with > > > > the original thread. This is not correct and you seem to do this for > > each one of your reply. > > > > > > Below is one page belonging to another community that may be helpful to > > you: > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > > > > Hope this helps, > > > > Charles > > (who, by top-posting, does not comply to the netiquette). > > > > > > > > Le 02.02.2017 01:56, anne-ology a écrit : > > > Do you know what moderation means? > > > > > > > > > > > > moderation := "the avoidance of excess or extremes, especially in > > > one's behavior or political opinions" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: toki > > > Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:40 PM > > > Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... > > > To: > > > > > > > > > Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 01/31/2017 01:54 PM, Tom Davies wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that > > > > > > > > > The correct thing is to _approve_ the message, not _respond_ within the > > > message. As such, it is _always_ possible to do the right thing. > > > > > > That is basic moderation 101 > > > > > > jonathon > > > > -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Charles, one can only admire your patience, but isn't it time to put a stop to this nonsense with anne-ology (who I'm sure is not the delightful Maureen, despite her use of the "-ology" suffix). Who has the authority to remove her from the moderator role, for which she seems singularly un-qualified? On 02/02/17 13:51, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > Anne-ology, > > You are right, that is the general meaning of moderation. However, when > we talk about moderation here, we talk about mailing list moderation. > When we talk about moderator, we refer to a mailing list moderator, not > to concepts such as panel moderators. A mailing list moderator has a > specific role, which somewhat relates to the one of a moderator but is > much more strict: it has been described a bit earlier but let me restate > it: A mailing list moderator is in charge of the management of the > mailing list. This role mostly includes moderating emails, which means: > - finding legitimate emails of posters who are not subscribed to the > mailing list and moderating them as in publishing them to the list (NOT > REPLYING TO THEM FIRST) > - rejecting incoming illegitimate emails, such as spam. > > Another role of the list moderator usually (but not always) involves: > - adding or unsubscribing email addresses per request of their owner > - helping mailing list subscribers with similar tasks or technical > issues directly related to their mailing list subscription > - reminding everyone to be courteous > - following the netiquette (http://www.netiquette.org) and reminding > mailing list subscribers to comply with it. > > Among all these points only the last two may relate somewhat more the > broader meaning of "moderation". > > In short your daily task is not one moderation but rather one of > technical management. It also implies that you know how to post properly > and understand the concept of mailing list discussion threads. From my > perspective it seems you are not familiar with the concept,or that you > perhaps have no desire to become acquainted with these notions which > would be problematic for a mailing list moderator. Hence, there is no > need to "clean" any "cruft from an email. Signs, mentions of date, time, > etc. in an email are part of its information and may form a part of the > thread. We need that. I notice you have managed to start a new thread > "Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ..." that is not integrated with > the original thread. This is not correct and you seem to do this for > each one of your reply. > > Below is one page belonging to another community that may be helpful to > you: > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > > Hope this helps, > > Charles > (who, by top-posting, does not comply to the netiquette). > > > > Le 02.02.2017 01:56, anne-ology a écrit : >> Do you know what moderation means? >> >> >>moderation := "the avoidance of excess or extremes, especially in >> one's behavior or political opinions" >> >> >> >> From: toki >> Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:40 PM >> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... >> To: >> Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" >> >> >> On 01/31/2017 01:54 PM, Tom Davies wrote: >> >>> It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that >> >> The correct thing is to _approve_ the message, not _respond_ within the >> message. As such, it is _always_ possible to do the right thing. >> >> That is basic moderation 101 >> >> jonathon > -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Anne-ology, You are right, that is the general meaning of moderation. However, when we talk about moderation here, we talk about mailing list moderation. When we talk about moderator, we refer to a mailing list moderator, not to concepts such as panel moderators. A mailing list moderator has a specific role, which somewhat relates to the one of a moderator but is much more strict: it has been described a bit earlier but let me restate it: A mailing list moderator is in charge of the management of the mailing list. This role mostly includes moderating emails, which means: - finding legitimate emails of posters who are not subscribed to the mailing list and moderating them as in publishing them to the list (NOT REPLYING TO THEM FIRST) - rejecting incoming illegitimate emails, such as spam. Another role of the list moderator usually (but not always) involves: - adding or unsubscribing email addresses per request of their owner - helping mailing list subscribers with similar tasks or technical issues directly related to their mailing list subscription - reminding everyone to be courteous - following the netiquette (http://www.netiquette.org) and reminding mailing list subscribers to comply with it. Among all these points only the last two may relate somewhat more the broader meaning of "moderation". In short your daily task is not one moderation but rather one of technical management. It also implies that you know how to post properly and understand the concept of mailing list discussion threads. From my perspective it seems you are not familiar with the concept,or that you perhaps have no desire to become acquainted with these notions which would be problematic for a mailing list moderator. Hence, there is no need to "clean" any "cruft from an email. Signs, mentions of date, time, etc. in an email are part of its information and may form a part of the thread. We need that. I notice you have managed to start a new thread "Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ..." that is not integrated with the original thread. This is not correct and you seem to do this for each one of your reply. Below is one page belonging to another community that may be helpful to you: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Hope this helps, Charles (who, by top-posting, does not comply to the netiquette). Le 02.02.2017 01:56, anne-ology a écrit : Do you know what moderation means? moderation := "the avoidance of excess or extremes, especially in one's behavior or political opinions" From: toki Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" On 01/31/2017 01:54 PM, Tom Davies wrote: It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that The correct thing is to _approve_ the message, not _respond_ within the message. As such, it is _always_ possible to do the right thing. That is basic moderation 101 jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Do you know what moderation means? moderation := "the avoidance of excess or extremes, especially in one's behavior or political opinions" From: toki Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: Cc: "users@global.libreoffice.org" On 01/31/2017 01:54 PM, Tom Davies wrote: > It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that The correct thing is to _approve_ the message, not _respond_ within the message. As such, it is _always_ possible to do the right thing. That is basic moderation 101 jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
RE: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
This would assume that posters know that someone is a moderator. It never occured to me that Anne is a moderator here. Virgil Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone Original message From: toki Date: 2/1/17 2:21 PM (GMT-05:00) To: users@global.libreoffice.org Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... On 02/01/2017 02:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote: >> * If nobody else has responded 48 hours later, then, if able to do so, >> address the issue(s) in the message; > ... there is simply no legitimate reason that a moderator should have to > wait 48 hours before replying to a list message just because they The theory, supported by research, is that active moderator participation, results in a reduction in participation by list members, with the highest impact being amongst the low-frequency posters. >> One of the reasons that selecting good list moderators is difficult, is >> that the job, in essence, requires the moderator to stop participating >> in the list. > > Baloney. They can perform moderator duties with one hat, and participate with > another. Well, no. What happens when the moderator is an active participant on the list, is that their messages tend to be seen as "authoritative" by people who can browse list messages. One side effect, is that questioning information provided by the list moderator becomes difficult/awkward. jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
On Wed Feb 01 2017 14:20:18 GMT-0500 (Eastern Standard Time), toki wrote: > The theory, supported by research, is that active moderator > participation, results in a reduction in participation by list members, > with the highest impact being amongst the low-frequency posters. Link(s) please? Regardless, you do know that using identities, it would be entirely achievable for a moderator to interact on the list and 99% of the list participants wouldn;t know they were the same person. > Well, no. Well, yes. > What happens when the moderator is an active participant on > the list, is that their messages tend to be seen as "authoritative" by > people who can browse list messages. Only if they are posting as the moderator. If they post as a simple participant, then most won't even know they are a moderator. > One side effect, is that questioning information provided by the list > moderator becomes difficult/awkward. Not at all, as long as they are civil, and the moderator can hold their god complex in check. -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
On Wed Feb 01 2017 00:13:29 GMT-0500 (Eastern Standard Time), toki wrote: > On 01/31/2017 05:21 PM, anne-ology wrote: >> well, when I think the list might be interested in what's going on, >> I cc to the list; > > On any of the lists I moderate, or used to moderate, doing that would > get me off the list, and my moderation duties revoked, faster than a New > York Second. While I agree with that comment... > The appropriate sequence is: > * Approve the message; > * If nobody else has responded 48 hours later, then, if able to do so, > address the issue(s) in the message; ... there is simply no legitimate reason that a moderator should have to wait 48 hours before replying to a list message just because they approved it. They are free to respond immediately - but only to the LIST message. Anne's mistake is she is replying to the message in the moderation queue before she approves it. Also, she mentioned something about editing a message before approving it. That would also get your list moderator status revoked in my book. Either approve the message or reject it, but never ever edit it then approve it. > One of the reasons that selecting good list moderators is difficult, is > that the job, in essence, requires the moderator to stop participating > in the list. Baloney. They can perform moderator duties with one hat, and participate with another. -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Thank you. Just one point which you - & others - seem to be unaware: if I had merely accepted this 2-day old message then it could have been even longer before the questioner received a reply. Granted some of you may spend all your time on the computer, but I'm in that group which turns off the computer to attend to many off-line activities. I feel that if someone has a query, to which I might be able to help, then it's my duty to do so without further delay. With deepest apologies if my duty-bound attitude offends some, From: Charles-H. Schulz Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 10:39 AM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: users@global.libreoffice.org Hello Tom, It seems that the problem Brian highlighted is a bit different and is a recurring one. Anne-ology does not seem to understand her exact role as a list moderator, even after years of being in that position. What she has to do is first to approve the message so that it can reach the mailing list. Then, she or anyone else here may answer the original poster in public on the list. It is only about the 25th time this happens, but Anne-ology does not seem to want to take any sort of input, however cordial and friendly, into account. You are however correct that Anne-ology did indeed aptly identify the unmoderated post that had been sitting in the moderation queue for several days, and for this she of course did the right thing and should be thanked for that. Best, Charles. Le 31.01.2017 14:54, Tom Davies a écrit : > Hi :) > It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that > Anne-ology was able to "handle it" with courteous intelligence. Clearly > no-one else had figured out how to deal with it as it had been languishing > so long. So it is good that she was able "to go the extra mile". :) > > So, Anne-ology is due many thanks and congratulations but instead receives > admonishment from one who has not dared to take on such work himself, > although he does do a lot of good work in another area, that is also > somewhat under-appreciated. Instead of criticising each other for the > hidden roles they play I think we need more recognition of the good work > done by so many people who are all (imo) unsung heroes&heroines. > > So, many thanks to Anne-ology, Toki, Brian and others - and apologies to > Anne-ology for the ignorant critcism she was subjected to. > Many, many regards from > Tom :) > > > > > On 31 January 2017 at 13:29, toki wrote: > > On 01/30/2017 07:13 PM, anne-ology wrote: >> >> >with all sincerity, & confused by your attitude, >> >> Good list moderators _NEVER_ post messages to the list, except when the >> question specifically is about their moderation practices. >> >> More pointedly, the ideal list moderator is one whom the majority of >> list members have never heard of, and are utterly unaware of their >> presence on the list. >> >> jonathon >> >> >> >> -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
well, when I think the list might be interested in what's going on, I cc to the list; in that way all have the chance to be informed. From: toki Date: Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 7:29 AM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: users@global.libreoffice.org On 01/30/2017 07:13 PM, anne-ology wrote: >with all sincerity, & confused by your attitude, Good list moderators _NEVER_ post messages to the list, except when the question specifically is about their moderation practices. More pointedly, the ideal list moderator is one whom the majority of list members have never heard of, and are utterly unaware of their presence on the list. jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
rather than responding to the fact that one query had been waiting for a couple days before being added to the list, this conversation has become inanely silly. The way I handle e-mails is to eliminate all the wasteful space, including all the computer gibberish, which otherwise makes the e-mail next to impossible to read after a while as the margins become ever wider & the text ever narrower. And since I was the first to respond to that e-mail, there was no 'thread' to follow - other than to show it came from a non-list member. From: James E Lang Date: Mon, Jan 30, 2017 at 9:02 PM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ... To: anne-ology The tool you use to send email replies does not create References or In-Reply-To headers. That is what breaks threads. The best email tools use those headers to create a hierarchical view of a thread. -- Jim From: anne-ology To: Brian Cc: users@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Mon, 30 Jan 2017 11:14 Subject: [libreoffice-users] in response ... ... this message was waiting for 2 days to be released to the list; when I opened it to see if it was junk or not, I was surprised to see that someone had posted a query. Since I thought I might be able to help, I responded to it. I responded to the original message, merely deleting the non-list data, so I really do not understand what thread was broken. with all sincerity, & confused by your attitude, From: Brian Barker Date: Mon, Jan 30, 2017 at 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Access to Libre Office files To: Anne Noname Cc: "Charles-H. Schulz" At 09:43 30/01/2017 -0600, Anne Noname wrote: > From: Gareth Walters >> To: users@global.libreoffice.org >> Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2017 12:11:05 + (GMT) >> Subject: [libreoffice-users] Lacl of Access to Libre Office files >> >> Good morning. ... >> > > maybe I can help - ... > You are doing it again! Please, when you are asked to moderate an incoming message, your choices are to permit it to be posted or not. Whichever you choose, you may, of course, wish to reply yourself. But if you reply to a message that you allow to go to the list, you need to reply to the copy that you will then get from the list, not the original secret copy you received. Doing it the wrong way wrecks the threading and confuses people. You owe it to them to get it right. Would you release the original message, please? Brian Barker - privately -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Hello Tom, It seems that the problem Brian highlighted is a bit different and is a recurring one. Anne-ology does not seem to understand her exact role as a list moderator, even after years of being in that position. What she has to do is first to approve the message so that it can reach the mailing list. Then, she or anyone else here may answer the original poster in public on the list. It is only about the 25th time this happens, but Anne-ology does not seem to want to take any sort of input, however cordial and friendly, into account. You are however correct that Anne-ology did indeed aptly identify the unmoderated post that had been sitting in the moderation queue for several days, and for this she of course did the right thing and should be thanked for that. Best, Charles. Le 31.01.2017 14:54, Tom Davies a écrit : Hi :) It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that Anne-ology was able to "handle it" with courteous intelligence. Clearly no-one else had figured out how to deal with it as it had been languishing so long. So it is good that she was able "to go the extra mile". :) So, Anne-ology is due many thanks and congratulations but instead receives admonishment from one who has not dared to take on such work himself, although he does do a lot of good work in another area, that is also somewhat under-appreciated. Instead of criticising each other for the hidden roles they play I think we need more recognition of the good work done by so many people who are all (imo) unsung heroes&heroines. So, many thanks to Anne-ology, Toki, Brian and others - and apologies to Anne-ology for the ignorant critcism she was subjected to. Many, many regards from Tom :) On 31 January 2017 at 13:29, toki wrote: On 01/30/2017 07:13 PM, anne-ology wrote: >with all sincerity, & confused by your attitude, Good list moderators _NEVER_ post messages to the list, except when the question specifically is about their moderation practices. More pointedly, the ideal list moderator is one whom the majority of list members have never heard of, and are utterly unaware of their presence on the list. jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to- unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] in response ...
Hi :) It is not always possible to "do the right thing" so it is good that Anne-ology was able to "handle it" with courteous intelligence. Clearly no-one else had figured out how to deal with it as it had been languishing so long. So it is good that she was able "to go the extra mile". :) So, Anne-ology is due many thanks and congratulations but instead receives admonishment from one who has not dared to take on such work himself, although he does do a lot of good work in another area, that is also somewhat under-appreciated. Instead of criticising each other for the hidden roles they play I think we need more recognition of the good work done by so many people who are all (imo) unsung heroes&heroines. So, many thanks to Anne-ology, Toki, Brian and others - and apologies to Anne-ology for the ignorant critcism she was subjected to. Many, many regards from Tom :) On 31 January 2017 at 13:29, toki wrote: > On 01/30/2017 07:13 PM, anne-ology wrote: > > >with all sincerity, & confused by your attitude, > > Good list moderators _NEVER_ post messages to the list, except when the > question specifically is about their moderation practices. > > More pointedly, the ideal list moderator is one whom the majority of > list members have never heard of, and are utterly unaware of their > presence on the list. > > jonathon > > > > -- > To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org > Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to- > unsubscribe/ > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be > deleted > -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
