Re: How to make a Live USB running "from RAM"?
On 18 April 2010 09:56, Roberto Ragusa wrote: > Hi, > > I successfully created a Live USB bootable pen drive by using > my custom kickstart file, livecd-creator, livecd-iso-to-disk, > as explained here: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_create_and_use_Live_USB > > Everything works, but I would like to be able to remove the > USB pen after boot and run everything from RAM. > The machine has 2GiB of RAM and the img is 300MiB, so it is > certainly doable. > > For what I want to do, one free USB port is more valuable than > 300MiB of disk cache. > > Is there a way to obtain this? > Add "live_ram" to the editable boot prompt at runtime or in your kickstart use: bootloader --append=live_ram These are hidden poweruser options use with care ;-) ...dex -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
From: "Patrick O'Callaghan"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 16:18
> On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 15:32 -0700, jdow wrote:
>>
>> Needed or not, I personally believe it is "wise" to use them. And if
>> you feel ClamAV is inappropriate do mention tools that are appropriate
>> such as chkrootkit and rkhunter.
>
> This is the last time I'm going to say it: I wasn't then and am not now
> engaging in a general discussion of threats against Linux. I was
> answering a specific question about the usefulness of ClamAV. Nothing
> I've seen in this thread has made me change my mind. My original answer
> expresses my position very clearly and I stand by it.
>
> As far as I'm concerned this thread is now over.
>
> poc
Then you made a Microsoft answer, correct (as you see it) and useless.
{^_^}
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Re: Upgrade from FC10 to FC11 Going Badly
philb...@ptd.net writes: Hi, My upgrade from FC10 to FC11 is going badly. Upgrade was going ok until an unrecoverable error occurred during CD 3 that forced an immediate reboot. I ran rescue environment, then received a message to run command 'chroot /mnt/sysimage', which I did. Then rebooted and FC11 displays these messages: Warning -- SELinux targeted policy relabel is required. Relabeling could take a very long time, depending on file system size and speed of hard drives. After 5 minutes or so, I get a blue desktop with the fedora 'f' in the middle of the screen and it just sits there. Any ideas? Immediately when boot starts, press Esc to cancel out rhgb and switch to the normal system console. Hopefully, any error messages on the system console will point you to further clues. pgpItCLb4TsZD.pgp Description: PGP signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
RE: DVD Authoring
>I've frequently used DeVeDe and it works pretty well. Didn't know about that one, fantastic! Thanks, jlc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Upgrade from FC10 to FC11 Going Badly
Hi, My upgrade from FC10 to FC11 is going badly. Upgrade was going ok until an unrecoverable error occurred during CD 3 that forced an immediate reboot. I ran rescue environment, then received a message to run command 'chroot /mnt/sysimage', which I did. Then rebooted and FC11 displays these messages: Warning -- SELinux targeted policy relabel is required. Relabeling could take a very long time, depending on file system size and speed of hard drives. After 5 minutes or so, I get a blue desktop with the fedora 'f' in the middle of the screen and it just sits there. Any ideas? Please advise as to next steps, thank you! Phil Brogan Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
thank and a screen problem
Thank you for helping me with my root password. I now have root. I used a f12 dvd as a rescue cd to do it. the upgrade one. it only gave me a 800x600 screen resolution. that didn't bother me until I used the dvd to upgrade my f11 to f12. Now it bothers me for I still have the same resolution. going into the display area of system, I cannot change the resolution. Any suggestions, please. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: power saving, monitor poweroff
On Monday April 19 2010 02:12:14 Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > Dj YB writes: > > is the blanking also power down the graphic card? > > I can't really measure that very easily. I understand some cards do > have provisions for running at a lower clock speed and lower voltage, > but I have no idea if X11 (or some other mechanism) makes use of that > yet. Sorry. > > -wolfgang thanks. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 03:36 PM, jdow wrote:
> From: "Michael Miles"
> Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 14:39
>
> ...
>
>
>> Has been nuked
>> Got rid of wine all together
>> Virtualbox as well.
>> If I am going to run windows products I will do it in it's own PC and
>> that's that.
>>
>>
>> Too bad I really liked virtualbox
>>
>> Re ran scans with Avira , Bitdefender for unices and Clamav
>>
>> All clear for now
>>
>> Thank you all for your input and I hope these machines stay clear
>>
> That is an expected result. I'd check periodically, nonetheless.
> It can hurt, although it might lower your SETI at home score.
>
> {^_^}
>
Not by much with the s...@home score
I average 6000 a day
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Re: DVD Authoring
On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 1:35 PM, Joseph L. Casale wrote: > Anyone know of an authoring suite that takes care of all the transcoding > needed if attempting to author from a source file such as an mkv? I've frequently used DeVeDe and it works pretty well. Richard -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 14:39 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > Virtualbox as well. > If I am going to run windows products I will do it in it's own PC and > that's that. > > > Too bad I really liked virtualbox VB (and VMware, and KVM) are entirely different from Wine. Perhaps you need to understand the concept of a virtual machine, which Wine is not. The risks of running Windows under one of these environments are no greater than those of running it on a separate physical machine. Naturally I run AV software on my Windows VMs, but I'm completely sanguine about any of the nasties getting through to the Linux host. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 15:32 -0700, jdow wrote: > > Needed or not, I personally believe it is "wise" to use them. And if > you feel ClamAV is inappropriate do mention tools that are appropriate > such as chkrootkit and rkhunter. This is the last time I'm going to say it: I wasn't then and am not now engaging in a general discussion of threats against Linux. I was answering a specific question about the usefulness of ClamAV. Nothing I've seen in this thread has made me change my mind. My original answer expresses my position very clearly and I stand by it. As far as I'm concerned this thread is now over. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: power saving, monitor poweroff
Dj YB writes: > is the blanking also power down the graphic card? I can't really measure that very easily. I understand some cards do have provisions for running at a lower clock speed and lower voltage, but I have no idea if X11 (or some other mechanism) makes use of that yet. Sorry. -wolfgang -- Wolfgang S. Rupprecht If the airwaves belong to the public why does the public only get 3 non-overlapping WIFI channels? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
From: "Steven W. Orr"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 14:46
...
Another thing ClamAV does on an email scan is pick off a goodly number
of phishes, some of which are really well done. It helps mitigate a
wetware failure mechanism.
{o.o}
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Re: Clamav
From: "Michael Miles"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 14:39
...
> Has been nuked
> Got rid of wine all together
> Virtualbox as well.
> If I am going to run windows products I will do it in it's own PC and
> that's that.
>
>
> Too bad I really liked virtualbox
>
> Re ran scans with Avira , Bitdefender for unices and Clamav
>
> All clear for now
>
> Thank you all for your input and I hope these machines stay clear
That is an expected result. I'd check periodically, nonetheless.
It can hurt, although it might lower your SETI at home score.
{^_^}
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Re: Clamav
From: "Patrick O'Callaghan"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 14:27
> On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:28 -0700, Michael Miles wrote:
>> If the virus definitions from Clamav is written for linux based
>> viruses and not windows based then what real good is it.
>
> You seem to be rather confused about ClamAV. AFAIK it's designed to trap
> Windows viruses in email, since these are the ones that actually matter.
> Perhaps it looks for some other stuff, I wouldn't know, but I'm pretty
> sure Windows malware is its main focus.
Just as a point here their web page does not imply this. Although email
injection is not as common with Linux there are still some other injection
routes that get discovered from time to time.
The nice thing about Linux is that you can run several products of that
type easily. ClamAV might be setup to filter email, at least. Then it
can be used for periodic scans. So can other tools.
Needed or not, I personally believe it is "wise" to use them. And if
you feel ClamAV is inappropriate do mention tools that are appropriate
such as chkrootkit and rkhunter. They only go after specific types of
threats. These threats seem to be the most common nasties Linux users
get saddled with.
{o.o}
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Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 14:12 -0700, jdow wrote:
> the question becomes, how did they get there?
> Michael says he hardly used it. It also is an infection that has appeared
> on a Linux system. "GNU/Linux" is not bulletproof.
>
> {^_^}
>
99% of the cases the interference between the chair and the keyboard.
Calin
Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857
=
I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.
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Re: Clamav
I have this feeling that most people are missing the point of why CLAMAV is a useful tool. If you do it to protect yourself against a virus then that's the wrong reason. We can debate this till we're blue in the face, but AFAICT there is no threat of a virus against anything other than Windows. I started running my home sendmail server and all was good. Then someone invented spam and things have escalated ever since. My sendmail installation now runs spamassassin from spamass-milter and I reject all messages that are tagged as spam before reception completes. I used to run a bunch of RBLs from inside sendmail but I learned that spamassassin never got the opportunity to *learn* from the rejected messages, so now all the RBL activity is enabled from inside spamassassin. I added the tests to use CLAMAV from inside spamassassin, not to protect myself from viruses, but as an adjunct to being able to decide what is spam and what is not. If there's a virus in the message then it simply counts as a contributory weight to my decision to reject it. In addition, there are messages that spamassassin has not caught but I found a dandy tool called scamp that adds another 20+K signatures to the clamav database. The scamp stuff is not looking for viruses but it does a good job of picking up a lot of spam that the rest of the system might miss. I don't know why, but people love to think all computers are susceptible to viruses, but more viruses target windows because there are more of them. There may be a virus out there that could hurt a linux of os/x platform, but I haven't seen one yet. At least not since the Morris Worm of '81? Windows gets viruses because they are architecturally open to such things. People who run Windows tend to run with full admin privs. Windows has gone out of their way to make programs that run under DOS be compatible with running under Windows 7. And last but not least, people who run Windows are frequently not even aware of the concept of the difference between code and data. It's an attachment. You just *open* it. And *opening* an attachment could be a jpg that is displayed with something trusted or running some nasty binary that could do literally anything. So yes, I run clamav and it does good things for me. -- Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like a banana. Stranger things have .0. happened but none stranger than this. Does your driver's license say Organ ..0 Donor?Black holes are where God divided by zero. Listen to me! We are all- 000 individuals! What if this weren't a hypothetical question? steveo at syslang.net signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 02:28 PM, Craig White wrote: > On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 13:58 -0700, jdow wrote: > > >>> I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines >>> considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet >>> proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If >>> you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance. >>> I am not sure how it happened but it did. >>> >>> >>> The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install >>> >> To be fair we've not determined exactly whether the files are something >> wine installed rather than a virus. If wine has not been used much, >> particularly for browsing or email, then I'd suspect "rpm -qf" on those >> files would show that they are part of wine. >> > > not possible because 'drive_c' is actually created when you execute wine > for the first time (or subsequent user creation) and thus... > > $ rpm -qf /home/craig/.wine/drive_c/windows/twain_32.dll > file /home/craig/.wine/drive_c/windows/twain_32.dll is not owned by any > package > > is the only answer that one could ever have. > > Seems as though it must have something to do with something that he > did/has on his Windows files/network or as I really suspect, a false > alarm and alterations caused by some anti-virus program and this is all > just mental masturbation of the kind that seems peculiarly unique to > Windows. > > Craig > > > Has been nuked Got rid of wine all together Virtualbox as well. If I am going to run windows products I will do it in it's own PC and that's that. Too bad I really liked virtualbox Re ran scans with Avira , Bitdefender for unices and Clamav All clear for now Thank you all for your input and I hope these machines stay clear -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 16:57 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:28 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > > If the virus definitions from Clamav is written for linux based > > viruses and not windows based then what real good is it. > > You seem to be rather confused about ClamAV. AFAIK it's designed to trap > Windows viruses in email, since these are the ones that actually matter. > Perhaps it looks for some other stuff, I wouldn't know, but I'm pretty > sure Windows malware is its main focus. more than e-mail though... the database patterns are of course Windows but the various clam implementations are suitable for file server as well as e-mail. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 13:58 -0700, jdow wrote: > > I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines > > considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet > > proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If > > you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance. > > I am not sure how it happened but it did. > > > > > > The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install > > To be fair we've not determined exactly whether the files are something > wine installed rather than a virus. If wine has not been used much, > particularly for browsing or email, then I'd suspect "rpm -qf" on those > files would show that they are part of wine. not possible because 'drive_c' is actually created when you execute wine for the first time (or subsequent user creation) and thus... $ rpm -qf /home/craig/.wine/drive_c/windows/twain_32.dll file /home/craig/.wine/drive_c/windows/twain_32.dll is not owned by any package is the only answer that one could ever have. Seems as though it must have something to do with something that he did/has on his Windows files/network or as I really suspect, a false alarm and alterations caused by some anti-virus program and this is all just mental masturbation of the kind that seems peculiarly unique to Windows. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: mobile mail push
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 13:40 -0400, paul s wrote: > hi - > > do we support pushing mail to mobile devices vs. using tradition fetch? > > any documentation someone can point me to? some best solutions, > practices, experiences with packages would be a great starting point for > me... IMAP IDL mode is probably your best bet. Supported on Cyrus and some other IMAP servers. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:28 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > If the virus definitions from Clamav is written for linux based > viruses and not windows based then what real good is it. You seem to be rather confused about ClamAV. AFAIK it's designed to trap Windows viruses in email, since these are the ones that actually matter. Perhaps it looks for some other stuff, I wouldn't know, but I'm pretty sure Windows malware is its main focus. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 11:37 -0700, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: > > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question is "why do you > need > > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running mail servers > for > > users who access them from Windows. > Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans w-dozs, > regardless of the pathways to infection? You want proof of a negative? Dream on. Proof of security does not exist anywhere in the real world. I've mentioned my own anecdotal evidence (that in over 3 decades of use I have never seen a single Linux virus). It's my belief that this is the experience of the overwhelming majority of Linux users. Given that I answered a question from a Linux novice, I gave the best advice I could based on my experience, and I stand by it. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 10:39 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > My point is if wine is part of a Fedora install because it installs > with Fedora automatically it is part of the system in general. Wine is not installed automatically. In no sense is it "part of the system". Anyone who installs Wine should take the same precautions as they would when running Windows. Is that clear enough? poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
From: "Gene Heskett"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 13:39
> On Sunday 18 April 2010, Craig White wrote:
>>On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:37 -0700, Michael Miles wrote:
>>> One other weird thing i forgot to mention.
>>>
>>> I install xp via wine 2 months ago.
>>> Have not touched it since.
>>>
>>> Started scanning just to see a week ago.
>>>
>>> The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago,
>>> according to time stamps.
>>>
>>> So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that
>>> is
>>> when it attacked.
>>>
>>> Now that's wild
>>
>>
>>from your description it sounds as if the other AV program identified
>>and renamed the files - whether it is a real positive or a false
>>positive is probably debatable.
>>
>>Sometimes I think the Windows AV products like to 'find' things to
>>demonstrate that they are working and have some value.
>>
>>Craig
>>
> For a change we are in agreement Craig.
For the larger Windows AV vendors that does not seem to be the case.
Of course, at least one of them behaves, itself, more like a virus
than an anti-virus with regards to system stability. (And one printer
manufacturer has addon software for windows that seems to fall under
that rubric.)
{^_-}
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Re: Clamav
From: "Gene Heskett"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 12:00
> On Sunday 18 April 2010, Antonio Olivares wrote:
>>--- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote:
>>> From: Daniel B. Thurman
>>> Subject: Re: Clamav
>>> To: "Community support for Fedora users"
>>> Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM
>>> On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick
>>>
>>> O'Callaghan wrote:
>>> > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles
>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper
>>>
>>> instruction as I really
>>>
>>> >> do not know enough about this OS
>>> >
>>> > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question
>>>
>>> is "why do you need
>>>
>>> > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running
>>>
>>> mail servers for
>>>
>>> > users who access them from Windows.
>>>
>>> Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans
>>> w-dozs,
>>> regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is
>>> not just for
>>> email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The
>>> effectiveness
>>> of virus detection is only as good as the design and the
>>> latest virus
>>> database, and even then, there is no guarantee against
>>> newly created
>>> viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if
>>> you do, damned
>>> if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the
>>> chances of
>>> infection,
>>> than none at all'?
>>>
>>> > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's
>>>
>>> extremely unlikely
>>>
>>> > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix
>>>
>>> and then Linux,
>>>
>>> > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a
>>>
>>> proof-of-concept demo.
>>>
>>> Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the
>>> data, please.
>>>
>>> > po
>>>
>>> I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including
>>> clamav,
>>> spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus
>>> infected
>>> incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be
>>> happy to
>>> post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember.
>>> Most of my
>>> viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via
>>> incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking
>>> about AV,
>>> not malware or other modes of attacks.
>>>
>>> As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected
>>> local
>>> files but of course that does not mean there are NO
>>> viruses,
>>> just undetected ones, if any.
>>>
>>> And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this
>>> Linux email
>>> system and it has a separate public IP address apart from
>>> another
>>> email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public
>>> IP address.
>>> Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or
>>> another, nor
>>> overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is
>>> interesting to watch
>>> which of the two are infected and which is not.
>>>
>>> FWIW,
>>> Dan
>>
>>Dan,
>>
>>The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV
>> did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you
>> have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan
>> incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well.
>>
>>It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured
>> properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not
>> entirely 100% safe :(
>>
>>Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned it
>> up DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Antonio
>>
> I have hoped that this thread would self-destruct. IMO it has no business
> on
> a linux oriented mailing list considering that this company has no
> visible,
> runs on linux products. To me, all it amounts to is tons of free
> advertising > because some less than attentive person hosed his wine
> install with a windows > virus. Excrement happens. Shrug.
Forget the advertising aspect. Read the company's name as "an AV vendor's
product running under wine". Then before going off the cliff let's decide
the files really do represent a virus or not. They MIGHT be part of the
wine installation. If not, the question becomes, how did they get there?
Michael says he hardly used it. It also is an infection that has appeared
on a Linux system. "GNU/Linux" is not bulletproof.
{^_^}
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Re: Clamav
From: "Antonio Olivares"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 11:48
>
> --- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote:
>
>> From: Daniel B. Thurman
>> Subject: Re: Clamav
>> To: "Community support for Fedora users"
>> Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM
>> On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick
>> O'Callaghan wrote:
>> > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper
>> instruction as I really
>> >> do not know enough about this OS
>> >>
>> > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question
>> is "why do you need
>> > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running
>> mail servers for
>> > users who access them from Windows.
>> Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans
>> w-dozs,
>> regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is
>> not just for
>> email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The
>> effectiveness
>> of virus detection is only as good as the design and the
>> latest virus
>> database, and even then, there is no guarantee against
>> newly created
>> viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if
>> you do, damned
>> if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the
>> chances of
>> infection,
>> than none at all'?
>> > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's
>> extremely unlikely
>> > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix
>> and then Linux,
>> > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a
>> proof-of-concept demo.
>> >
>> Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the
>> data, please.
>> > po
>>
>> I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including
>> clamav,
>> spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus
>> infected
>> incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be
>> happy to
>> post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember.
>> Most of my
>> viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via
>> incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking
>> about AV,
>> not malware or other modes of attacks.
>>
>> As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected
>> local
>> files but of course that does not mean there are NO
>> viruses,
>> just undetected ones, if any.
>>
>> And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this
>> Linux email
>> system and it has a separate public IP address apart from
>> another
>> email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public
>> IP address.
>> Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or
>> another, nor
>> overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is
>> interesting to watch
>> which of the two are infected and which is not.
>>
>> FWIW,
>> Dan
>>
>> --
>
> Dan,
>
> The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV
> did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you
> have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan
> incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well.
They existed on disk and should have been detected. ClamAV has a disk scan
mode. ClamAV is not a total bust. Therefore another check to make sure the
files in question were not part of the wine install is worthwhile. I'd
expect ClamAV to avoid false alarms on wine. I'd not expect avira to
cater to a wine environment.
> It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured
> properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not
> entirely 100% safe :(
100% is beyond reach on complex systems. We may be at the 99.% level and
are adding more 9s as suffixes. The question is how many 9s do you want
to spend CPU cycles on? That's a personal cost benefit tradeoff.
{^_^}
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Re: Clamav
From: "Michael Miles"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 10:13
> On 04/17/2010 07:54 PM, jdow wrote:
>> From: "Sam Sharpe"
>> Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 13:20
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 17 April 2010 21:05, jdow wrote:
>>>
From: "Sam Sharpe"
Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 02:25
> On 17 April 2010 10:17, jdow wrote:
>
>> <> How many people get frustrated with SELinux and simply disable it?
>>
> I don't know, but stupidity appears to be an infinite resource. I tend
> to believe that if you disable SELinux and you get exploited by
> something that SELinux would prevent, then the only thing at fault is
> *you*.
>
> However in this case, both a sysctl and SELinux prevent what this
> attack claims to do, so if you disable SELinux it still won't work.
>
Are you sanguine to declare Linux cannot be taken over by malware
given that the most recent rather dramatic hole found is less than a
year old AND new features (hence bugs) are being introduced every
day? How much is the data on the machine worth to you?
>>> You seem to have a general problem with comprehension. That is not
>>> what I said - I simply said that the exploit you referred to wouldn't
>>> work.
>>>
>>>
If it means nothing, then why not run Windows wide open and make
yourself
a hero to the botnet operators? {^_-}
>>> Don't be an idiot.
>>>
>> I simply gave the extremes. And this discussion is not all that silly
>> considering "J. Random User" yclept Michael Miles has found a way to
>> get a virus on his machine that ClamAV might have detected on its way
>> in or from a scan.
>>
>> When giving advice it's best to presume the user is going to do something
>> unusual, such as run Wine, and receive an infection. A Wine install needs
>> ClamAV. Without Wine I'd suggest chkrootkit and rkhunter, at the least. I
>> have seen too many perhaps careless people ask "is this an infection?"
>> And
>> in more than a few cases the answer has been yes. Linux is ahead in the
>> arms race. Windows is behind. Nonetheless, some protection is worthwhile
>> depending on how important your system's function, your relationship with
>> your ISP, and your data might be. I happen to be biased towards "very".
>> So I bristle when somebody suggests, intentionally or not, that Linux is
>> probably safe. So is flying, unless you happened to be on the last flight
>> of Pan Am 103, for example. Low probability of a high value loss - what
>> you
>> do is your call.
>>
>> {^_^}
>>
>>
> I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines
> considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet
> proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If
> you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance.
> I am not sure how it happened but it did.
>
>
> The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install
To be fair we've not determined exactly whether the files are something
wine installed rather than a virus. If wine has not been used much,
particularly for browsing or email, then I'd suspect "rpm -qf" on those
files would show that they are part of wine.
{^_^}
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Re: Virus Suspect
From: "Michael Miles"
Sent: Sunday, 2010/April/18 10:03
> On 04/17/2010 07:45 PM, jdow wrote:
>> From: "Michael Miles"
>> Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 10:14
>>
>>> this is what I find with avira
>>> I'm just scanning and not doing anything with this file or files
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/twain.dll
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/dosx.exe.XXX
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>> file:
>>> /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/dsound.vxd.XXX
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>> file:
>>> /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/ddhelp.exe.XXX
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system/ddeml.dll.XXX
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/winhelp.exe.XXX
>>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032
>>> bytes
>>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>>> ALERT-URL:
>>> http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>>
>>>
>>> Are these false alerts or are they real?
>>>
>>> Considering they are all the same trojan I would suspect false alert.
>>>
>>> I could be wrong...Avira and Bitdefender both found these Clamav did
>>> not find any.
>>>
>> If you haven't installed an XP set of files under Wine for your
>> winhelp.exe
>> and the like - I do believe you have been infected - somehow. What do you
>> run in your Wine? And do you know what the .XXX added to the files is?
>> Double check that they don't track back to the wine install. And if they
>> don't nukem or reinstall wine.
>>
>> Those are files with standard Windows names and .XXX suffixes. They
>> probably found their way into your wine setup. I don't know if they have
>> been unpacked and installed except for twain.dll. They all have the same
>> modified date. That is suggestive of having a malware infection.
>> (Twain.dll
>> on a fully up to date XP Pro install is dated back in 2004/08/04 and is
>> 93k on disk.)
>>
>> {^_^}
>>
>>
> I set up win xp in wine but did not install any software other than that.
> I just did not like the way wine worked and then used Virtualbox for win
> 7 instead.
>
> I did leave the xp installation there.
>
> I have used both xp and win 7 on this machine as a native os and there
> were no infections present on Win machines.
>
> Clearly there is an infection on Fedora 12 in wine now.
> It just figures that the powers to be would incorporate windows
> vulnerabilities into Fedora through wine.
>
> I had Clamav running the entire life of Fedora 12 on this computer and
> the virus made it by there.
>
> Clam av will not even pick up these viruses now and they are still there.
>
> Avira sees them no problem.
I'd do an "rpm -qf" on each of the files and see if they are things
wine thinks it owns.
{^_^}
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USB power-off
I am using Fedora 12 (and 13) installed on an external USB hard disk. Sometimes the disk powers off and Fedora stalls until power is restored... Is it a bug in the kernel??? -- Antonio Montagnani Skype : amontag52 SIP: antoniomon...@ekiga.net -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sunday 18 April 2010, Craig White wrote: >On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:37 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: >> One other weird thing i forgot to mention. >> >> I install xp via wine 2 months ago. >> Have not touched it since. >> >> Started scanning just to see a week ago. >> >> The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago, >> according to time stamps. >> >> So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that >> is >> when it attacked. >> >> Now that's wild > > >from your description it sounds as if the other AV program identified >and renamed the files - whether it is a real positive or a false >positive is probably debatable. > >Sometimes I think the Windows AV products like to 'find' things to >demonstrate that they are working and have some value. > >Craig > For a change we are in agreement Craig. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) You know, Callahan's is a peaceable bar, but if you ask that dog what his favorite formatter is, and he says "roff! roff!", well, I'll just have to... -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sunday 18 April 2010, Michael Miles wrote: >On 04/18/2010 12:00 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: >> On Sunday 18 April 2010, Antonio Olivares wrote: >>> --- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: From: Daniel B. Thurman Subject: Re: Clamav To: "Community support for Fedora users" Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper instruction as I really >> do not know enough about this OS > > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question is "why do you need > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running mail servers for > users who access them from Windows. Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans w-dozs, regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is not just for email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The effectiveness of virus detection is only as good as the design and the latest virus database, and even then, there is no guarantee against newly created viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if you do, damned if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the chances of infection, than none at all'? > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's extremely unlikely > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix and then Linux, > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a proof-of-concept demo. Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the data, please. > po I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including clamav, spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus infected incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be happy to post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. Most of my viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking about AV, not malware or other modes of attacks. As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected local files but of course that does not mean there are NO viruses, just undetected ones, if any. And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this Linux email system and it has a separate public IP address apart from another email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public IP address. Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or another, nor overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is interesting to watch which of the two are infected and which is not. FWIW, Dan >>> >>> Dan, >>> >>> The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case >>> ClamAV did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. >>> If you have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to >>> scan incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well. >>> >>> It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured >>> properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not >>> entirely 100% safe :( >>> >>> Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned >>> it up DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Antonio >> >> I have hoped that this thread would self-destruct. IMO it has no business >> on a linux oriented mailing list considering that this company has no >> visible, runs on linux products. To me, all it amounts to is tons of >> free advertising because some less than attentive person hosed his wine >> install with a windows virus. Excrement happens. Shrug. > >One other weird thing i forgot to mention. > >I install xp via wine 2 months ago. >Have not touched it since. > >Started scanning just to see a week ago. > >The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago, >according to time stamps. > >So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that is >when it attacked. > >Now that's wild > Chuckle, bit of advice: Never take a knife to a gunfight. Question is, what did you do between that xp install and the attack? If it sat dormant for all that time, then the obvious conclusion is that the src of your xp install is itself hosed. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) You know, Callahan's is a peaceable bar, but if you ask that dog what his favorite formatter is, and he says "roff! roff!", well, I'll just have to... -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 12:53 PM, Craig White wrote: > On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:37 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > >> One other weird thing i forgot to mention. >> >> I install xp via wine 2 months ago. >> Have not touched it since. >> >> Started scanning just to see a week ago. >> >> The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago, >> according to time stamps. >> >> So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that >> is >> when it attacked. >> >> Now that's wild >> > > from your description it sounds as if the other AV program identified > and renamed the files - whether it is a real positive or a false > positive is probably debatable. > > Sometimes I think the Windows AV products like to 'find' things to > demonstrate that they are working and have some value. > > Craig > > > No, I did not do any action from Avira when they were found because that is what I assumed they were, false positive. Maybe Clamav did automatically but there was no notification and Clamav reported no virus at all so I would have to discount it. I do think the virus renamed files The only thing Clamav caught was the test virus that comes with it. I removed wine and virtual box installations and re ran the scan. Clean as a whistle -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 12:37 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > One other weird thing i forgot to mention. > > I install xp via wine 2 months ago. > Have not touched it since. > > Started scanning just to see a week ago. > > The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago, > according to time stamps. > > So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that > is > when it attacked. > > Now that's wild from your description it sounds as if the other AV program identified and renamed the files - whether it is a real positive or a false positive is probably debatable. Sometimes I think the Windows AV products like to 'find' things to demonstrate that they are working and have some value. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: power saving, monitor poweroff
On Sunday April 18 2010 22:18:18 Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > Dj YB writes: > > I am considering the best ways to save power while I am off the pc and > > in general. my question, is thee a difference in terms of powersaving > > between manually shutting down the monitor (pushing the button) and > > the screensaver monitor powering off. moreover, is the graphic card > > keep on working the same when the screensaver poweroff the monitor? > > The power on monitors I've tested is the same when using the > front-pannel soft-off button or when the computer does a soft-off over > the DVI or VGA connector. Note, soft off on many monitors leaves some > circuits powered, so the power draw is still a few watts (mine all seem > to be around 5 watts). Using the hardwired power supply off switch on > the bottom or back of the monitor saves those extra 5 watts. > > The big difference I see between software blanking and explicitly > pushing the button is that my mouse is sometimes between two position > reports and is essentially on hair trigger. Bumping the desk, or in > some cases just walking into the room causes it to vibrate enough to > unblank the monitor. I therefore try to turn off the monitor anytime > I'm leaving for a while. > > -wolfgang thanks, is the blanking also power down the graphic card? regards, YB. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 12:00 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Sunday 18 April 2010, Antonio Olivares wrote: > >> --- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: >> >>> From: Daniel B. Thurman >>> Subject: Re: Clamav >>> To: "Community support for Fedora users" >>> Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM >>> On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick >>> >>> O'Callaghan wrote: >>> On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles >>> wrote: >>> > I have removed all and I will wait for proper > >>> instruction as I really >>> >>> > do not know enough about this OS > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question >>> is "why do you need >>> >>> Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running >>> mail servers for >>> >>> users who access them from Windows. >>> Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans >>> w-dozs, >>> regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is >>> not just for >>> email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The >>> effectiveness >>> of virus detection is only as good as the design and the >>> latest virus >>> database, and even then, there is no guarantee against >>> newly created >>> viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if >>> you do, damned >>> if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the >>> chances of >>> infection, >>> than none at all'? >>> >>> If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's >>> extremely unlikely >>> >>> that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix >>> and then Linux, >>> >>> I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a >>> proof-of-concept demo. >>> >>> Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the >>> data, please. >>> >>> po >>> I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including >>> clamav, >>> spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus >>> infected >>> incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be >>> happy to >>> post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. >>> Most of my >>> viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via >>> incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking >>> about AV, >>> not malware or other modes of attacks. >>> >>> As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected >>> local >>> files but of course that does not mean there are NO >>> viruses, >>> just undetected ones, if any. >>> >>> And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this >>> Linux email >>> system and it has a separate public IP address apart from >>> another >>> email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public >>> IP address. >>> Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or >>> another, nor >>> overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is >>> interesting to watch >>> which of the two are infected and which is not. >>> >>> FWIW, >>> Dan >>> >> Dan, >> >> The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV >> did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you >> have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan >> incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well. >> >> It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured >> properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not >> entirely 100% safe :( >> >> Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned it >> up DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T >> >> Regards, >> >> Antonio >> >> > I have hoped that this thread would self-destruct. IMO it has no business on > a linux oriented mailing list considering that this company has no visible, > runs on linux products. To me, all it amounts to is tons of free advertising > because some less than attentive person hosed his wine install with a windows > virus. Excrement happens. Shrug. > > One other weird thing i forgot to mention. I install xp via wine 2 months ago. Have not touched it since. Started scanning just to see a week ago. The files that were renamed by the virus were done two days ago, according to time stamps. So this thing sat dormant until I started looking for them and that is when it attacked. Now that's wild -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 11:48 AM, Antonio Olivares wrote: > > --- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: > > >> From: Daniel B. Thurman >> Subject: Re: Clamav >> To: "Community support for Fedora users" >> Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM >> On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick >> O'Callaghan wrote: >> >>> On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles >>> >> wrote: >> >>> >>> I have removed all and I will wait for proper >> instruction as I really >> do not know enough about this OS >>> Given that you say so yourself, the logical question >>> >> is "why do you need >> >>> Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running >>> >> mail servers for >> >>> users who access them from Windows. >>> >> Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans >> w-dozs, >> regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is >> not just for >> email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The >> effectiveness >> of virus detection is only as good as the design and the >> latest virus >> database, and even then, there is no guarantee against >> newly created >> viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if >> you do, damned >> if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the >> chances of >> infection, >> than none at all'? >> >>> If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's >>> >> extremely unlikely >> >>> that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix >>> >> and then Linux, >> >>> I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a >>> >> proof-of-concept demo. >> >>> >>> >> Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the >> data, please. >> >>> po >>> >> I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including >> clamav, >> spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus >> infected >> incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be >> happy to >> post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. >> Most of my >> viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via >> incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking >> about AV, >> not malware or other modes of attacks. >> >> As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected >> local >> files but of course that does not mean there are NO >> viruses, >> just undetected ones, if any. >> >> And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this >> Linux email >> system and it has a separate public IP address apart from >> another >> email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public >> IP address. >> Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or >> another, nor >> overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is >> interesting to watch >> which of the two are infected and which is not. >> >> FWIW, >> Dan >> >> -- >> > Dan, > > The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV did > not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you have an > email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan incoming > mail/messages and also send clean messages as well. > > It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured > properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not entirely > 100% safe :( > > Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned it up > DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T > > Regards, > > Antonio > > > > That's what concerns me about Clamav. It clearly did not trap any of these viruses and if it is the mainstream av scanner for Fedora then people could be in for a surprise if they run a different scanner on the system. I have removed wine altogether and all virtualbox win installs. If the virus definitions from Clamav is written for linux based viruses and not windows based then what real good is it. All virus definitions should be included with the scan Especially if Wine and virtualbox are running on a linux system I just thank god the virus in question was not too severe and just renamed core windows files and appended .xxx to them making them easy to find but effectivly stopping xp from running Michael -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: gnome-key-manager-> seahorse
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 19:24 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > On 04/18/2010 07:06 PM, Aaron Konstam wrote: > > > > As I sometimes am, I am confused by what you say Rahul. The question is > > not whether Red Hat has a right to replace programs by new ones created > > by another different team of volunteers. They do. > > > > I wasn't answering you. It was a reply to Tom Horsley. > > > My question is why call the new project seahorse a name which would be > > hard to associate with what the program does. Is there some reason that > > the new program could not keep the same name or at least a more > > meaningful name? > > > > Two projects obviously can't have the same name. The name is a word > play. Developers can pick whatever name they want. If you don't like > it, feel free to talk to them. Downstream distributions have no say on > that. On the other hand, we do have control over the descriptions in the RPM packages. When this issue came up last fall, I filed a bug to make sure that the word "keyring" appeared in the description field for seahorse, so that it would at least show up in the results of 'yum search keyring'. That bug has not been acted on since I filed it. I just updated the version to 12. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=536945 > > Rahul > -- Matthew Saltzman Clemson University Math Sciences mjs AT clemson DOT edu http://www.math.clemson.edu/~mjs -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: power saving, monitor poweroff
Dj YB writes: > I am considering the best ways to save power while I am off the pc and > in general. my question, is thee a difference in terms of powersaving > between manually shutting down the monitor (pushing the button) and > the screensaver monitor powering off. moreover, is the graphic card > keep on working the same when the screensaver poweroff the monitor? The power on monitors I've tested is the same when using the front-pannel soft-off button or when the computer does a soft-off over the DVI or VGA connector. Note, soft off on many monitors leaves some circuits powered, so the power draw is still a few watts (mine all seem to be around 5 watts). Using the hardwired power supply off switch on the bottom or back of the monitor saves those extra 5 watts. The big difference I see between software blanking and explicitly pushing the button is that my mouse is sometimes between two position reports and is essentially on hair trigger. Bumping the desk, or in some cases just walking into the room causes it to vibrate enough to unblank the monitor. I therefore try to turn off the monitor anytime I'm leaving for a while. -wolfgang -- Wolfgang S. Rupprecht If the airwaves belong to the public why does the public only get 3 non-overlapping WIFI channels? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Nvidia 3D
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 17:11 +, hewjr1...@gmail.com wrote: Where do I go to get 3D drivers for Nvidia 6550 card Running f12 on an HP DV6T 1 Gig Ram 250 Gig HD Also how to install Thanks rpmfusion.org. Instructions are there for installing their RPMs. -- Matthew Saltzman Clemson University Math Sciences mjs AT clemson DOT edu http://www.math.clemson.edu/~mjs -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sunday 18 April 2010, Antonio Olivares wrote: >--- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: >> From: Daniel B. Thurman >> Subject: Re: Clamav >> To: "Community support for Fedora users" >> Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM >> On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick >> >> O'Callaghan wrote: >> > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles >> >> wrote: >> >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper >> >> instruction as I really >> >> >> do not know enough about this OS >> > >> > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question >> >> is "why do you need >> >> > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running >> >> mail servers for >> >> > users who access them from Windows. >> >> Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans >> w-dozs, >> regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is >> not just for >> email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The >> effectiveness >> of virus detection is only as good as the design and the >> latest virus >> database, and even then, there is no guarantee against >> newly created >> viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if >> you do, damned >> if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the >> chances of >> infection, >> than none at all'? >> >> > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's >> >> extremely unlikely >> >> > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix >> >> and then Linux, >> >> > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a >> >> proof-of-concept demo. >> >> Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the >> data, please. >> >> > po >> >> I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including >> clamav, >> spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus >> infected >> incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be >> happy to >> post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. >> Most of my >> viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via >> incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking >> about AV, >> not malware or other modes of attacks. >> >> As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected >> local >> files but of course that does not mean there are NO >> viruses, >> just undetected ones, if any. >> >> And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this >> Linux email >> system and it has a separate public IP address apart from >> another >> email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public >> IP address. >> Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or >> another, nor >> overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is >> interesting to watch >> which of the two are infected and which is not. >> >> FWIW, >> Dan > >Dan, > >The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV > did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you > have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan > incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well. > >It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured > properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not > entirely 100% safe :( > >Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned it > up DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T > >Regards, > >Antonio > I have hoped that this thread would self-destruct. IMO it has no business on a linux oriented mailing list considering that this company has no visible, runs on linux products. To me, all it amounts to is tons of free advertising because some less than attentive person hosed his wine install with a windows virus. Excrement happens. Shrug. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Conversation enriches the understanding, but solitude is the school of genius. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
--- On Sun, 4/18/10, Daniel B. Thurman wrote: > From: Daniel B. Thurman > Subject: Re: Clamav > To: "Community support for Fedora users" > Date: Sunday, April 18, 2010, 11:37 AM > On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick > O'Callaghan wrote: > > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles > wrote: > > > >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper > instruction as I really > >> do not know enough about this OS > >> > > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question > is "why do you need > > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running > mail servers for > > users who access them from Windows. > Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans > w-dozs, > regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is > not just for > email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The > effectiveness > of virus detection is only as good as the design and the > latest virus > database, and even then, there is no guarantee against > newly created > viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if > you do, damned > if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the > chances of > infection, > than none at all'? > > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's > extremely unlikely > > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix > and then Linux, > > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a > proof-of-concept demo. > > > Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the > data, please. > > po > > I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including > clamav, > spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus > infected > incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be > happy to > post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. > Most of my > viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via > incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking > about AV, > not malware or other modes of attacks. > > As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected > local > files but of course that does not mean there are NO > viruses, > just undetected ones, if any. > > And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this > Linux email > system and it has a separate public IP address apart from > another > email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public > IP address. > Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or > another, nor > overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is > interesting to watch > which of the two are infected and which is not. > > FWIW, > Dan > > -- Dan, The virii that hit Michael's machine were via wine. In which case ClamAV did not find them, Avira did. Most of your post is also correct. If you have an email server it makes good sense to have antivirus to scan incoming mail/messages and also send clean messages as well. It you have Selinux, Antivirus, Firewall, all enabled and configured properly, virii should not make it into your machine but one is not entirely 100% safe :( Again, it depends on experiences that one has had/has and you summoned it up DAMMNED IF YOU DO, DAMMED IF YOU DON'T Regards, Antonio -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/15/2010 12:50 PM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 12:22 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > >> I have removed all and I will wait for proper instruction as I really >> do not know enough about this OS >> > Given that you say so yourself, the logical question is "why do you need > Clamav"? Clamav is usually installed by people running mail servers for > users who access them from Windows. Where is the proof that an AV is not needed for Linux sans w-dozs, regardless of the pathways to infection? ClamAV is not just for email-servers but for scanning infected drives. The effectiveness of virus detection is only as good as the design and the latest virus database, and even then, there is no guarantee against newly created viruses and its variants, and one could argue "damned if you do, damned if you don't", but I could argue 'Tis better to reduce the chances of infection, than none at all'? > If all you're doing is reading mail in Linux, it's extremely unlikely > that you even need it. In 35 years of using first Unix and then Linux, > I have yet to see a single virus that wasn't a proof-of-concept demo. > Again, experiences makes proof, not. I prefer the data, please. > po I have a fully installed, F-12 w/ SELinux including clamav, spamassassin and it has found several rejected virus infected incoming email messages. If I get one again, I will be happy to post what the viruses are, as I just don't remember. Most of my viruses are coming from overseas, mostly cn and ru and via incoming email, not visited websites. We are talking about AV, not malware or other modes of attacks. As far as I know, clamav has not detected any infected local files but of course that does not mean there are NO viruses, just undetected ones, if any. And no, I do not run doz via wine nor virtualbox, on this Linux email system and it has a separate public IP address apart from another email system, (W-doz) exchange, again on a separate public IP address. Neither one of these email servers, 'talks' to one or another, nor overlaps, they are mutually exclusive. It is interesting to watch which of the two are infected and which is not. FWIW, Dan -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Nvidia 3D
Where do I go to get 3D drivers for Nvidia 6550 card Running f12 on an HP DV6T 1 Gig Ram 250 Gig HD Also how to install Thanks -Inline Attachment Follows- You may get the the drivers from nvidia site, but the recommended way to get thim is through rpmfusion: http://rpmfusion.org/Howto/nVidia Regards, Antonio -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
DVD Authoring
Anyone know of an authoring suite that takes care of all the transcoding needed if attempting to author from a source file such as an mkv? Thanks! jlc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 10:54 AM, Antonio Olivares wrote: So the myth is just that, a myth >>> IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. >>> >> Where's the myth? Did >> >>> your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files >>> >> corrupted? Was >> >>> any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root >>> >> password compromised? >> >>> Did anything happen that would still have happened if >>> >> you weren't >> >>> running a Windows API? >>> >>> poc >>> >>> >>> >> No, non of linux was actually infected and not harmed >> in any way that I >> can see. >> >> My point is if wine is part of a Fedora install because it >> installs with >> Fedora automatically it is part of the system in general. >> > Nope, Wine is not part of Fedora default install, it is packaged for Fedora > and available through yum > # yum install wine > > >> Considering the way it works I really dont know why it is >> there is there >> if it can be infected as easily as this. >> > Malware exists, it is frequent and if one is not careful, it could come in to > any system. But one has to be asking for it with Linux based and other Unix > based operating systems. Through wine, it can come in, but no harm was done > right? > > >> I have removed wine altogether. >> >> Also I did have Clamav running with this machine and even >> after finding >> the viruses with Avira, Clamav would not see them at all. >> > Maybe the ClamAV is looking for other types of virii not specific to windows. > > >> That to me does spell trouble if >> 1. A person is relying on linux reputation for not getting >> a virus then >> does something dumb like using wine and getting infected. >> > This is like a user shooting (him/her)self on the foot. > > >> 2. Thinks that protection is needed and uses Clamav for >> that protection >> and the software fails them by not finding the culprit >> >> >> I know one thing Avira free is staying on this machine for >> a while >> >> >> Better to be safe than sorry >> -- >> > > running wine on fedora or other linux based systems is something most people > do and do not get infections. What Patrick wrote is right on the money. > > >>> IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. >>> >> Where's the myth? Did >> >>> your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files >>> >> corrupted? Was >> >>> any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root >>> >> password compromised? >> >>> Did anything happen that would still have happened if >>> >> you weren't >> >>> running a Windows API? >>> > It was not and you have stated that. So all in all, it is not Fedora's fault > it is between the user and wine; > > Also as Bruno and others have pointed out, Selinux is there to protect us. > It can also let you know that somethings are going on and that somewhere a > file was mislabeled and , the setroubleshoot star appears and guides you > to find solutions and where the solution offered does not work, you may > report the issue on selinux list, bugzilla, etc. You may also disable it > like some other users have because it gets in the way too much! But it is > there to protect you, not to make your life miserable. I have encountered > difficulties with it too, and Mr. Dan Walsh, Tom London, and others have been > very helpful and thus I can't complain about selinux. > > Regards, > > Antonio > > > > Thank you all for the help -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 10:39 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > On 04/18/2010 10:22 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > > On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 10:13 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > > > >> [...] > >> > > > >> > >> I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines > >> considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet > >> proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If > >> you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance. > >> I am not sure how it happened but it did. > >> > >> > >> The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install > >> > >> > >> So the myth is just that, a myth > >> > > IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. Where's the myth? Did > > your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files corrupted? Was > > any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root password compromised? > > Did anything happen that would still have happened if you weren't > > running a Windows API? > > > > poc > > > > > No, non of linux was actually infected and not harmed in any way that I > can see. > > My point is if wine is part of a Fedora install because it installs with > Fedora automatically it is part of the system in general. > > Considering the way it works I really dont know why it is there is there > if it can be infected as easily as this. > > I have removed wine altogether. > > Also I did have Clamav running with this machine and even after finding > the viruses with Avira, Clamav would not see them at all. > > That to me does spell trouble if > 1. A person is relying on linux reputation for not getting a virus then > does something dumb like using wine and getting infected. > > 2. Thinks that protection is needed and uses Clamav for that protection > and the software fails them by not finding the culprit when all you have is a hammer, everything tends to look like a nail. pattern matching is always going to provide some false positives - that's the nature of the beast. It seems to me that it's folly to run Windows without protection and if all your Windows systems are protected, it's pretty much not needed on Linux but knock yourself out. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
> >> So the myth is just that, a myth > >> > > IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. > Where's the myth? Did > > your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files > corrupted? Was > > any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root > password compromised? > > Did anything happen that would still have happened if > you weren't > > running a Windows API? > > > > poc > > > > > No, non of linux was actually infected and not harmed > in any way that I > can see. > > My point is if wine is part of a Fedora install because it > installs with > Fedora automatically it is part of the system in general. Nope, Wine is not part of Fedora default install, it is packaged for Fedora and available through yum # yum install wine > > Considering the way it works I really dont know why it is > there is there > if it can be infected as easily as this. Malware exists, it is frequent and if one is not careful, it could come in to any system. But one has to be asking for it with Linux based and other Unix based operating systems. Through wine, it can come in, but no harm was done right? > > I have removed wine altogether. > > Also I did have Clamav running with this machine and even > after finding > the viruses with Avira, Clamav would not see them at all. Maybe the ClamAV is looking for other types of virii not specific to windows. > > That to me does spell trouble if > 1. A person is relying on linux reputation for not getting > a virus then > does something dumb like using wine and getting infected. This is like a user shooting (him/her)self on the foot. > > 2. Thinks that protection is needed and uses Clamav for > that protection > and the software fails them by not finding the culprit > > > I know one thing Avira free is staying on this machine for > a while > > > Better to be safe than sorry > -- running wine on fedora or other linux based systems is something most people do and do not get infections. What Patrick wrote is right on the money. > > IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. > Where's the myth? Did > > your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files > corrupted? Was > > any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root > password compromised? > > Did anything happen that would still have happened if > you weren't > > running a Windows API? It was not and you have stated that. So all in all, it is not Fedora's fault it is between the user and wine; Also as Bruno and others have pointed out, Selinux is there to protect us. It can also let you know that somethings are going on and that somewhere a file was mislabeled and , the setroubleshoot star appears and guides you to find solutions and where the solution offered does not work, you may report the issue on selinux list, bugzilla, etc. You may also disable it like some other users have because it gets in the way too much! But it is there to protect you, not to make your life miserable. I have encountered difficulties with it too, and Mr. Dan Walsh, Tom London, and others have been very helpful and thus I can't complain about selinux. Regards, Antonio -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
mobile mail push
hi - do we support pushing mail to mobile devices vs. using tradition fetch? any documentation someone can point me to? some best solutions, practices, experiences with packages would be a great starting point for me... cheers paul -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/18/2010 10:22 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 10:13 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > >> [...] >> > >> >> I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines >> considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet >> proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If >> you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance. >> I am not sure how it happened but it did. >> >> >> The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install >> >> >> So the myth is just that, a myth >> > IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. Where's the myth? Did > your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files corrupted? Was > any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root password compromised? > Did anything happen that would still have happened if you weren't > running a Windows API? > > poc > > No, non of linux was actually infected and not harmed in any way that I can see. My point is if wine is part of a Fedora install because it installs with Fedora automatically it is part of the system in general. Considering the way it works I really dont know why it is there is there if it can be infected as easily as this. I have removed wine altogether. Also I did have Clamav running with this machine and even after finding the viruses with Avira, Clamav would not see them at all. That to me does spell trouble if 1. A person is relying on linux reputation for not getting a virus then does something dumb like using wine and getting infected. 2. Thinks that protection is needed and uses Clamav for that protection and the software fails them by not finding the culprit I know one thing Avira free is staying on this machine for a while Better to be safe than sorry -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Wifi link iwl3945
On Sat, 2010-04-17 at 20:36 -0700, Paolo Galtieri wrote: > On 04/17/2010 07:56 PM, Kurian Thayil wrote: > > > > > > > On Thu, 2010-04-15 at 21:07 -0700, Paolo Galtieri wrote: > > > > > On 04/15/2010 08:42 PM, Kurian Thayil wrote: > > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > > > Since the installation of F12 in my Acer Aspire 580 series > > > > laptop with Intel 3945ABG wireless module, I am having the issue > > > > where my Wifi link gets deactivated and activated (disconnects & > > > > connects) frequently. AP is a Netgear WGR router with WEP > > > > enabled. Was using Debian GNU/Linux (Etch & Lenny) and I was > > > > able to work without any issues. The following is > > > > the /var/log/messages when a typical wifi session is disabled > > > > and enabled. This issue was severe when there was no security > > > > enabled in the router (I gave only MAC address level security). > > > > When I included WEP, it became better. Module iwl3945 is loaded > > > > in the kernel along with iwlcore, mac80211. Any idea on how to > > > > avoid this completely? > > > > > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 8 -> 2 (reason 0) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > deactivating device (reason: 0). > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > canceled DHCP transaction, dhcp client pid 3603 > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost NetworkManager: > > > > check_one_route(): (wlan0) error -34 returned from > > > > rtnl_route_del(): Sucess#012 > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost avahi-daemon[1265]: Withdrawing > > > > address record for 192.168.0.4 on wlan0. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost avahi-daemon[1265]: Leaving mDNS > > > > multicast group on interface wlan0.IPv4 with address > > > > 192.168.0.4. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost avahi-daemon[1265]: Interface > > > > wlan0.IPv4 no longer relevant for mDNS. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > taking down device. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:36 localhost avahi-daemon[1265]: Withdrawing > > > > address record for fe80::21b:77ff:fe51:4fcd on wlan0. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > bringing up device. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost kernel: Registered led device: > > > > iwl-phy0::radio > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost kernel: Registered led device: > > > > iwl-phy0::assoc > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost kernel: Registered led device: > > > > iwl-phy0::RX > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost kernel: Registered led device: > > > > iwl-phy0::TX > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost kernel: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): wlan0: > > > > link is not ready > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > supplicant interface state: starting -> ready > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 2 -> 3 (reason 42) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) starting connection 'Auto virusk' > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 3 -> 4 (reason 0) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) scheduled... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) started... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 2 of 5 (Device Configure) scheduled... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) complete. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 2 of 5 (Device Configure) starting... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 4 -> 5 (reason 0) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0/wireless): access point 'Auto virusk' has security, but > > > > secrets are required. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 5 -> 6 (reason 0) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 2 of 5 (Device Configure) complete. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) scheduled... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) started... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (wlan0): > > > > device state change: 6 -> 4 (reason 0) > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 2 of 5 (Device Configure) scheduled... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 1 of 5 (Device Prepare) complete. > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: Activation > > > > (wlan0) Stage 2 of 5 (Device Configure) starting... > > > > Apr 16 09:03:37 localhost NetworkManager: (w
Re: F12: Cannot drag/drop Firefox URL to desktop as a link
On 04/17/2010 09:26 PM, Hiisi wrote: > 2010/4/17 Daniel B. Thurman : > >> I used to drag and drop FF URL onto the desktop but >> as it is, it creates the index.php file. >> >> Is this a known problem? >> > Which page? Give as the URL. On my F12 it works fine with all the > latest updates installed (it creates a text file with URL in it). > It is strange. What it did previously was to pop up a website file transfer dialog box and then proceed to create on the desktop, an index.php file. But then I did the latest updates, tested the same site, and a desktop link was successfully created. So perhaps, the latest update fixed the problem, whatever it was. Thanks for responding! Dan -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 10:13 -0700, Michael Miles wrote: > [...] > > I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines > considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet > proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If > you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance. > I am not sure how it happened but it did. > > > The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install > > > So the myth is just that, a myth IOW, when you run Windows apps, you get infected. Where's the myth? Did your Linux system crash? Were any of your system files corrupted? Was any of your non-Wine data leaked? Was your root password compromised? Did anything happen that would still have happened if you weren't running a Windows API? poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Clamav
On 04/17/2010 07:54 PM, jdow wrote:
> From: "Sam Sharpe"
> Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 13:20
>
>
>
>> On 17 April 2010 21:05, jdow wrote:
>>
>>> From: "Sam Sharpe"
>>> Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 02:25
>>>
>>>
>>>
On 17 April 2010 10:17, jdow wrote:
> < How many people get frustrated with SELinux and simply disable it?
>
I don't know, but stupidity appears to be an infinite resource. I tend
to believe that if you disable SELinux and you get exploited by
something that SELinux would prevent, then the only thing at fault is
*you*.
However in this case, both a sysctl and SELinux prevent what this
attack claims to do, so if you disable SELinux it still won't work.
>>> Are you sanguine to declare Linux cannot be taken over by malware
>>> given that the most recent rather dramatic hole found is less than a
>>> year old AND new features (hence bugs) are being introduced every
>>> day? How much is the data on the machine worth to you?
>>>
>> You seem to have a general problem with comprehension. That is not
>> what I said - I simply said that the exploit you referred to wouldn't
>> work.
>>
>>
>>> If it means nothing, then why not run Windows wide open and make yourself
>>> a hero to the botnet operators? {^_-}
>>>
>> Don't be an idiot.
>>
> I simply gave the extremes. And this discussion is not all that silly
> considering "J. Random User" yclept Michael Miles has found a way to
> get a virus on his machine that ClamAV might have detected on its way
> in or from a scan.
>
> When giving advice it's best to presume the user is going to do something
> unusual, such as run Wine, and receive an infection. A Wine install needs
> ClamAV. Without Wine I'd suggest chkrootkit and rkhunter, at the least. I
> have seen too many perhaps careless people ask "is this an infection?" And
> in more than a few cases the answer has been yes. Linux is ahead in the
> arms race. Windows is behind. Nonetheless, some protection is worthwhile
> depending on how important your system's function, your relationship with
> your ISP, and your data might be. I happen to be biased towards "very".
> So I bristle when somebody suggests, intentionally or not, that Linux is
> probably safe. So is flying, unless you happened to be on the last flight
> of Pan Am 103, for example. Low probability of a high value loss - what you
> do is your call.
>
> {^_^}
>
>
I think that it is a must to have protection on your machines
considering I am looking at a machine that was supposed to be bullet
proof, and proved to be infectable with windows crap through wine. If
you are running wine without protection then you are taking a chance.
I am not sure how it happened but it did.
The Virus even went to work renaming core files from the xp install
So the myth is just that, a myth
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Nvidia 3D
Where do I go to get 3D drivers for Nvidia 6550 card Running f12 on an HP DV6T 1 Gig Ram 250 Gig HD Also how to install Thanks -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Virus Suspect
On 04/17/2010 07:45 PM, jdow wrote:
> From: "Michael Miles"
> Sent: Saturday, 2010/April/17 10:14
>
>> this is what I find with avira
>> I'm just scanning and not doing anything with this file or files
>>
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/twain.dll
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/dosx.exe.XXX
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/dsound.vxd.XXX
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system32/ddhelp.exe.XXX
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/system/ddeml.dll.XXX
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>> file: /home/amiga5/.wine-x86_64/drive_c/windows/winhelp.exe.XXX
>> last modified on date: 2010-03-09 time: 14:16:14, size: 1032 bytes
>> ALERT: TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2 ; trojan ; Is the Trojan horse
>> TR/Crypt.XPACK.Gen2
>> ALERT-URL: http://www.avira.com/en/threats?q=TR%2FCrypt%2EXPACK%2EGen2
>>
>>
>> Are these false alerts or are they real?
>>
>> Considering they are all the same trojan I would suspect false alert.
>>
>> I could be wrong...Avira and Bitdefender both found these Clamav did
>> not find any.
>>
> If you haven't installed an XP set of files under Wine for your winhelp.exe
> and the like - I do believe you have been infected - somehow. What do you
> run in your Wine? And do you know what the .XXX added to the files is?
> Double check that they don't track back to the wine install. And if they
> don't nukem or reinstall wine.
>
> Those are files with standard Windows names and .XXX suffixes. They
> probably found their way into your wine setup. I don't know if they have
> been unpacked and installed except for twain.dll. They all have the same
> modified date. That is suggestive of having a malware infection. (Twain.dll
> on a fully up to date XP Pro install is dated back in 2004/08/04 and is
> 93k on disk.)
>
> {^_^}
>
>
I set up win xp in wine but did not install any software other than that.
I just did not like the way wine worked and then used Virtualbox for win
7 instead.
I did leave the xp installation there.
I have used both xp and win 7 on this machine as a native os and there
were no infections present on Win machines.
Clearly there is an infection on Fedora 12 in wine now.
It just figures that the powers to be would incorporate windows
vulnerabilities into Fedora through wine.
I had Clamav running the entire life of Fedora 12 on this computer and
the virus made it by there.
Clam av will not even pick up these viruses now and they are still there.
Avira sees them no problem.
Interesting
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Re: Clamav
On Sat, Apr 17, 2010 at 19:54:10 -0700, jdow wrote: > > When giving advice it's best to presume the user is going to do something > unusual, such as run Wine, and receive an infection. A Wine install needs > ClamAV. Without Wine I'd suggest chkrootkit and rkhunter, at the least. I > have seen too many perhaps careless people ask "is this an infection?" And > in more than a few cases the answer has been yes. Linux is ahead in the > arms race. Windows is behind. Nonetheless, some protection is worthwhile > depending on how important your system's function, your relationship with > your ISP, and your data might be. I happen to be biased towards "very". > So I bristle when somebody suggests, intentionally or not, that Linux is > probably safe. So is flying, unless you happened to be on the last flight > of Pan Am 103, for example. Low probability of a high value loss - what you > do is your call. Anti virus is still the wrong way to go for this stuff. It doesn't scale well. It sucks a lot of resources. It doesn't match all bad stuff. There are other ways to keep foreign code from hosing your system (notably selinux). Unless you are protecting other systems that the data is being passed to, anti virus is not a very good solution for Fedora. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
power saving, monitor poweroff
hello, I am considering the best ways to save power while I am off the pc and in general. my question, is thee a difference in terms of powersaving between manually shutting down the monitor (pushing the button) and the screensaver monitor powering off. moreover, is the graphic card keep on working the same when the screensaver poweroff the monitor? thanks, YB. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Dump and filesystem types
On Sat, 2010-04-17 at 19:59 -0600, Chris Kottaridis wrote: > On Sat, 2010-04-17 at 18:47 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > > Just use tar. Dump/restore is designed for fast backup and restoring > > of > > filesystem images. Among other things, this ties you to a specific > > filesystem type and partition size. Tar is more flexible and doesn't > > care what the filesystem is (within reason). > > One of the reasons I have used dump for this process is that if I run > into something unexpected and all I want to do is get back to where I > was, I can put things back as closely as possible. I realize I can get > all the data back with tar also. But, dump has the inode numbers and > file system specific details in it as well and I think a restore -r may > even preserve the inodes, though I don't know for sure. So, generally I > like to use dump to handle the catastrophic situation. That's all very well, but your question wasn't about backup, it was about upgrading Fedora versions. Different scenario, different failure modes. Note that you can also dump the fs and then use tar for the transfer, if you feel nervous about losing anything. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: gnome-key-manager-> seahorse
On 04/18/2010 07:06 PM, Aaron Konstam wrote: > > As I sometimes am, I am confused by what you say Rahul. The question is > not whether Red Hat has a right to replace programs by new ones created > by another different team of volunteers. They do. > I wasn't answering you. It was a reply to Tom Horsley. > My question is why call the new project seahorse a name which would be > hard to associate with what the program does. Is there some reason that > the new program could not keep the same name or at least a more > meaningful name? > Two projects obviously can't have the same name. The name is a word play. Developers can pick whatever name they want. If you don't like it, feel free to talk to them. Downstream distributions have no say on that. Rahul -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: gnome-key-manager-> seahorse
On Sun, 2010-04-18 at 11:40 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > On 04/16/2010 07:05 PM, Tom Horsley wrote: > > On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 08:25:27 -0500 > > Aaron Konstam wrote: > > > > > >> Why would anyone change the name of gnome-key-manager (a name with some > >> meaning) to seahorse (seemingly meaningless)? > >> > > I think this falls under my theory: > > > > http://home.comcast.net/~tomhorsley/wisdom/braindump/darwin.html > > > > I assume this is written in a tongue in cheek manner but this is a a > rather common misconception. Seahorse has replaced gnome-keyring-manager > and it is not a simple rename but a different project and done by a team > of volunteers. Let's look at the business rationale: First of all, not > every company relies on the support and services model. There is a wide > variety of business models built around free and open source software. > The second misunderstanding is what support and services actually > mean. Red Hat, for example does assist customers to setup the > environment to meet particular needs but that hardly covers everything. > Support also involves developing new features or in many cases, > development entirely new projects to meet customer needs and also > elevation of bug fixes. Red Hat has a fairly large content services > team which is responsible for pretty good documentation in > http://redhat.com and some of the documentation in > http://docs.fedoraproject.org not to mention http://kbase.redhat.com > and content for the Red Hat certification courses. > > > Rahul As I sometimes am, I am confused by what you say Rahul. The question is not whether Red Hat has a right to replace programs by new ones created by another different team of volunteers. They do. My question is why call the new project seahorse a name which would be hard to associate with what the program does. Is there some reason that the new program could not keep the same name or at least a more meaningful name? -- === "It doesn't much signify whom one marries for one is sure to find out next morning it was someone else." -- Rogers === Aaron Konstam telephone: (210) 656-0355 e-mail: akons...@sbcglobal.net -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
How to make a Live USB running "from RAM"?
Hi, I successfully created a Live USB bootable pen drive by using my custom kickstart file, livecd-creator, livecd-iso-to-disk, as explained here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_create_and_use_Live_USB Everything works, but I would like to be able to remove the USB pen after boot and run everything from RAM. The machine has 2GiB of RAM and the img is 300MiB, so it is certainly doable. For what I want to do, one free USB port is more valuable than 300MiB of disk cache. Is there a way to obtain this? Thank you. -- Roberto Ragusamail at robertoragusa.it -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: f12 sometimes is slow to start
2010/4/16 Natxo Asenjo : > hi, > > I have been using the f12 (686) on a dell latitude e6500 laptop. This > is my corporate workstation and so far it's working really nice. > Everything works out of the box and configuring it to work with its > docking station was very easy (much easier than expected). Great work! > Thanks. > > There is one little problem. Every now and then when I boot the laptop > it kind of 'freezes' and a few minutes later it works as it should > without any other problems. I can change to a virtual terminal and > login there, but if I try to login graphically it will take me like 2 > to 3 minutes to complete the process. I cannot see anything in the log > files. > > Like I said, it does not happen all the time nor it is really > annoying, but I would like to find out why this is happening. In > /var/log/messages I do not get any errors. How can I debug the gnome > login process? > -- > Groeten, > Natxo Asenjo I had a similar problem until recently with F12 (and previously F11). But in my case it took EVERY TIME additional 40 seconds before I could login. This system boots in runlevel 3 and I do startx when I need GUI. So, actually this delay occurred just after all daemons have been started and during login process. Playing around with services I've found it was preload installed a while ago who caused a lot of disk IO usage. Disabling it resulted in a faster boot process (with no delay at the end of it) and less memory usage on a booted system. But now X takes about two times slower than before... -- Hiisi. Registered Linux User #487982. Be counted at: http://counter.li.org/ -- Spandex is a privilege, not a right. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
