Re: post-mortem: f24 boot fails; need help.
Bill, Power supplies can fail at any time, and they are less reliable than any other parts in my PC's. PC's are more reliable if you leave them on, configured to go into sleep mode when left unused (this statement will spark a discussion). Most spinning disk drives these days support smartd, smartctl. http://www.linuxjournal.com/magazine/monitoring-hard-disks-smart An exception would be hardware RAID (shown below), its manufacturer would supply management tools. With smartctl, expect the failure counts to be non-zero, all disks have errors which get remapped. The error counts can be alarming even though the disk is fine for normal use. Any sudden increase in errors and you will want to save some good backups Right Soon Now. Spinning disks often fail gradually over days or weeks. SSDs can suddenly drop completely, with no remedy. cheers -- Rick --RAID-- # smartctl --all /dev/sdb smartctl 6.5 2016-05-07 r4318 [x86_64-linux-4.11.3-300.fc26.x86_64] (local build) Copyright (C) 2002-16, Bruce Allen, Christian Franke, www.smartmontools.org === START OF INFORMATION SECTION === Vendor: HP Product: LOGICAL VOLUME Revision: 3.66 User Capacity:1,200,186,941,440 bytes [1.20 TB] Logical block size: 512 bytes Rotation Rate:15000 rpm Logical Unit id: 0x600508b1001c4a3abee7e559b116e419 Serial number:50014380145ECE10 Device type: disk Local Time is:Wed May 31 01:58:57 2017 CDT SMART support is: Unavailable - device lacks SMART capability. --SSD-- root@lite:~# smartctl --all /dev/sda smartctl 6.6 2016-05-31 r4324 [x86_64-linux-4.10.0-20-generic] (local build) Copyright (C) 2002-16, Bruce Allen, Christian Franke, www.smartmontools.org === START OF INFORMATION SECTION === Model Family: Samsung based SSDs Device Model: Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250GB Serial Number:S21NNS99 .. SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability. SMART support is: Enabled .. --SATA-- # smartctl --all /dev/sdb smartctl 6.6 2016-05-31 r4324 [x86_64-linux-4.10.0-20-generic] (local build) Copyright (C) 2002-16, Bruce Allen, Christian Franke, www.smartmontools.org === START OF INFORMATION SECTION === Model Family: SAMSUNG SpinPoint F3 Device Model: SAMSUNG HD103SJ Serial Number:S2QPJ9KB9 .. SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability. SMART support is: Enabled .. On 2017-05-31 12:09 AM, William Mattison wrote: I wasn't fully convinced these problems are due to the battery. That's why I listed the four things I found "odd". On the other hand, I recall hearing and reading that the output of lithium batteries is almost flat (better than any other type of battery), but then very quickly drops (faster than any other type of battery) as it reaches end-of-life. Back to diagnosing the real cause of the problems... Is there a Fedora command that I can use to check the hard drive (not the file systems) for bad blocks, sectors, tracks, etc? Is there a Fedora command that I can use to check the controller? Both problems occurred immediately after doing a "dnf upgrade". What is that telling us? Does "dnf upgrade" access the hard drive or the controller in a way that normal daily use does not? Is there something different about the first boot after a "dnf upgrade" vs other boots? I shut down every night, and boot up every morning. When I bought the system 4+ years ago, I bought separate parts. This is a DIY desktop. I was advised to buy more power supply than needed. I did so. So unless the power supply is failing, I would think it's not a good candidate for the cause of the two problems. There have been no problems until this month, and I've been doing weekly patches since I got the system in 2013. I was/am not in the mood to change the battery! Since I've already bought the new one and have no other use for it, and since the old one is 4+ years old, I plan to change the battery either Friday or Saturday. But you know what they say: "If you want to make God laugh, tell Him your plans!". I did watch the youtube that Tim provided. I don't recall seeing screws on the underside of the motherboard. I'll look again Friday or Saturday (God willing!). Thanks, Bill. ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Migrating an existing system with a different OS
Hello, I'm using Windows with several virtual machines (VMware); is there a way to use these virtual machines with Fedora as host OS? Thanks, Walter ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Migrating an existing system with a different OS
Walter, Yes (I am almost certain, but you need to try it and see). For free or with a budget? I assume free. You are familiar with VMware so you will want to stick with that. An alternative would be KVM. You will want to install the VMware host software ESXi, I think it is free. The online info for RedHat will often also apply to Fedora. In Google, search for rhel or RedHat or Centos or Fedora (not all at once!). Your challenge is that Fedora is leading edge, and can be different than RedHat. VMware migt depend on specific versions of Redhat (I have that problem with VirtualBox). The links below do not tell you exactly what you need, they are just what I found quickly. Other folks will have more specific answers. cheers -- Rick https://www.vmware.com/pdf/vsphere4/r41/vsp_41_esxi_i_get_start.pdf http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vsphere4/r40/vsp_compatibility_matrix.pdf https://my.vmware.com/en/web/vmware/info/slug/datacenter_cloud_infrastructure/vmware_vsphere/6_5#open_source http://rhelblog.redhat.com/2016/02/25/getting-started-with-the-red-hat-container-development-kit-cdk/#more-1533 On 2017-05-31 04:01 AM, Walter H. wrote: Hello, I'm using Windows with several virtual machines (VMware); is there a way to use these virtual machines with Fedora as host OS? Thanks, Walter ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: Migrating an existing system with a different OS
On Wed, 2017-05-31 at 10:01 +0200, Walter H. wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I'm using Windows with several virtual machines (VMware);
>
> is there a way to use these virtual machines with Fedora as host OS?
Yes. There is a free-to-use version of VMware Workstation for Fedora.
Check the VMware web page. You can also convert your VMware VMs to run
under KVM/QEMU ('man qemu-img'). Another alternative is VirtualBox.
poc
___
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Re: post-mortem: f24 boot fails; need help.
On 05/30/2017 09:09 PM, William Mattison wrote: > I wasn't fully convinced these problems are due to the battery. That's why I > listed the four things I found "odd". On the other hand, I recall hearing > and reading that the output of lithium batteries is almost flat (better than > any other type of battery), but then very quickly drops (faster than any > other type of battery) as it reaches end-of-life. > > Back to diagnosing the real cause of the problems... > > Is there a Fedora command that I can use to check the hard drive (not the > file systems) for bad blocks, sectors, tracks, etc? Is there a Fedora > command that I can use to check the controller? > > Both problems occurred immediately after doing a "dnf upgrade". What is that > telling us? Does "dnf upgrade" access the hard drive or the controller in a > way that normal daily use does not? Is there something different about the > first boot after a "dnf upgrade" vs other boots? I shut down every night, > and boot up every morning. > > When I bought the system 4+ years ago, I bought separate parts. This is a > DIY desktop. I was advised to buy more power supply than needed. I did so. > So unless the power supply is failing, I would think it's not a good > candidate for the cause of the two problems. There have been no problems > until this month, and I've been doing weekly patches since I got the system > in 2013. > > I was/am not in the mood to change the battery! Since I've already bought > the new one and have no other use for it, and since the old one is 4+ years > old, I plan to change the battery either Friday or Saturday. But you know > what they say: "If you want to make God laugh, tell Him your plans!". I did > watch the youtube that Tim provided. I don't recall seeing screws on the > underside of the motherboard. I'll look again Friday or Saturday (God > willing!). > > Thanks, > Bill. > ___ > users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org > Have you tried badblocks? If you are not careful it will wipe your disk completely. This will do a sector by sector scan. -- Joseph Loo j...@acm.org ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: post-mortem: f24 boot fails; need help.
Allegedly, on or about 31 May 2017, William Mattison sent: > I recall hearing and reading that the output of lithium batteries is > almost flat (better than any other type of battery), but then very > quickly drops (faster than any other type of battery) as it reaches > end-of-life. I can't say that I'm familiar with their discharge pattern, but I have read that an in-use lifespan of three years is considered normal. So, you're at the time it might be worth replacing, even if it's not the cause of current problems. At the very least, you stop this being a potential problem in another year or so. > Is there a Fedora command that I can use to check the hard drive (not > the file systems) for bad blocks, sectors, tracks, etc? Is there a > Fedora command that I can use to check the controller? Look up S.M.A.R.T., though be aware that some controllers may not co-operate, but that tends to be things like outboard USB interfaces, or RAID. Ordinary hard drives plugged straight into the motherboard are likely to be checkable. It's the hard drive, itself, that checks its health and produces the stats, smartctl just gives you an interface. > Both problems occurred immediately after doing a "dnf upgrade". What > is that telling us? That you ought to try rebooting using a previous kernel, and see if problems persist. There are two red flags about problems after doing an update: 1. That a new kernel has changed hardware drivers, or created other incompatibilities. 2. That your hard drive had some bad spots that hadn't been used before, but as you filled it up with more files (the recent downloads and installs), you hit the problem area. Those are the two things that immediately jump to mind. Yes, an update can be more stressful than other PC activities, for *some* users. But for other users, they're always subjecting their PC to a heavy workload, so a prolonged update session is nothing different from normal use. > Does "dnf upgrade" access the hard drive or the controller in a way > that normal daily use does not? I would say not. It's just files in and out, under the control of some program, onto storage system in the usual way. > When I bought the system 4+ years ago, I bought separate parts. This > is a DIY desktop. I was advised to buy more power supply than needed. > I did so. So unless the power supply is failing, I would think it's > not a good candidate for the cause of the two problems. There have > been no problems until this month, and I've been doing weekly patches > since I got the system in 2013. Power supplies do fail, sometimes gradually, sometimes spontaneously combusting, sometimes just randomly glitching. It can be complete coincidence that some technical failure happens at the same time as you did something you considered more special than it merely sitting there. I agree with the concept of getting bigger than you think you need, but it's hard to work out the criteria. Few devices specify their power requirements, at all, or specify them adequately. i.e. A graphics card may say it needs a 100 watt power supply. That claim may be bogus, they may be overestimating so you buy an adequate one, it may be accurate. It doesn't specify how many watts it requires from the different supplies in your PC (12 volt, 5 volt, 3.3 volt, etc). So it could require a lot from a 12 volt supply, less from the 5 volt, and your power supply could be inadequate in one of those areas. Then there's the power supply specs. Do they list the power it can continuously supply, the momentary higher peaks that it can supply? And there's a similar thing with the devices, does a graphic card's power supply requirements specify continuous and momentary peaks. The momentary peaks, as something suddenly needs more power, as it turns on, or changes modes, etc., can be the kind of thing that cause enough trouble to make a system unstable. If you have a simple system, e.g. motherboard, graphics card, hard drive, optical drive, it's not too hard to ensure you put in a sufficiently beefy supply. If you have a PC loaded with gadgets, it's harder to estimate the requirements. But what type of power supply did you put in? Did you match the wattage your supplier said you needed, did you overcompensate by an extra 100 watts? Did you get some generic Chinese thing, or something that had a reputation? As an opposing example: I stripped apart a friend's Mac, it has a ridiculously beefy power supply, with large fat bus bars that bolt to the motherboard, rather than those multi-pin molex connectors you see on the average PC. And that system is designed as a whole, so the manufacturer ought to know the full system specs, as opposed to a PC assembled from multiple different vendors who never collaborated. > I did watch the youtube that Tim provided. I don't recall seeing > screws on the underside of the motherboard. I'll look again Friday or > Saturday (God willing!). I could see them on one of the videos,
Re: post-mortem: f24 boot fails; need help.
I did "smartctl --all /dev/sda > smartctl_out.txt". I got over 200 lines of output. The most recent error reported in the output file is this one: === Error 66 occurred at disk power-on lifetime: 13741 hours (572 days + 13 hours) When the command that caused the error occurred, the device was active or idle. After command completion occurred, registers were: ER ST SC SN CL CH DH -- -- -- -- -- -- -- 40 51 00 ff ff ff 0f Error: UNC at LBA = 0x0fff = 268435455 Commands leading to the command that caused the error were: CR FR SC SN CL CH DH DC Powered_Up_Time Command/Feature_Name -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- 60 00 08 ff ff ff 4f 00 00:05:43.747 READ FPDMA QUEUED 61 00 08 ff ff ff 4f 00 00:05:43.746 WRITE FPDMA QUEUED ea 00 00 00 00 00 a0 00 00:05:43.746 FLUSH CACHE EXT ef 10 02 00 00 00 a0 00 00:05:43.746 SET FEATURES [Enable SATA feature] 27 00 00 00 00 00 e0 00 00:05:43.745 READ NATIVE MAX ADDRESS EXT [OBS-ACS-3] === I can't really make heads or tails of this. I also notice in my system e-mail these 2 messages, bot on Thursday, May 25: (1st message) Device: /dev/sda [SAT], 8 Currently unreadable (pending) sectors (2nd message, 1 minute later) Device: /dev/sda [SAT], 8 Offline uncorrectable sectors I also tried "smartctl -t short /dev/sda", followed later by "smartctl -l selftest /dev/sda". The result: === SMART Self-test log structure revision number 1 Num Test_DescriptionStatus Remaining LifeTime(hours) LBA_of_first_error # 1 Short offline Completed without error 00% 13813 - === If I understand the "-all" output correctly, the "-long" test would take about 4 hours, so I'm not trying that until later this week. What else from the "smartctl" output should I post here? What other "smartctl" functionality should I try or use? Thank-you. Bill. ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: post-mortem: f24 boot fails; need help.
> Look up S.M.A.R.T., though be aware that some controllers may not > co-operate, but that tends to be things like outboard USB interfaces, or > RAID. Ordinary hard drives plugged straight into the motherboard are > likely to be checkable. It's the hard drive, itself, that checks its > health and produces the stats, smartctl just gives you an interface. Please see my reply to Rick. > That you ought to try rebooting using a previous kernel, and see if > problems persist. I did, and the problem showed up with all three of the latest f24 versions available in the grub menu. > Yes, an update can be more stressful than other PC activities, for > *some* users. But for other users, they're always subjecting their PC > to a heavy workload, so a prolonged update session is nothing different > from normal use. I don't understand what you're saying here. Both weekly patches went very quickly (I wish windows-7 were like that!) and with no errors reported in the output. > But what type of power supply did you put in? Did you match the wattage > your supplier said you needed, did you overcompensate by an extra 100 > watts? Did you get some generic Chinese thing, or something that had a > reputation? I did not figure out that part for myself. I got advice from a friend with decades of experience working for IBM's high performance division, and then for Cray research. The power supply is a Thermaltake TR2 600W. The system also has a Core i7-3770K @ 3.5GHz x 8, 16 GB memory, GeForce GTX 660 graphics card, an ASUS Xonar Essence STX audio card, a 2 TB hard drive, 2 blu-ray drives, keyboard, trackball, web cam (rarely plugged in), two 27-inch Dell monitors, and 2 small speakers. It's no gaming system, but a rather high-powered programming workstation by 2013 standards. Thank-you, Bill. ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
