Re: Wrestling with UEFI

2023-08-21 Thread Samuel Sieb

On 8/21/23 21:06, Robert McBroom via users wrote:
Added a Fedora 37 and Fedora 38 installations on separate drives to a 
Windows system. Default boot is the Windows 10 system. Using the boot 
menu gets me to grub which can boot the system of my choice.


When the Fedora 38 install goes to sleep it doesn't come back to Fedora 
but boots to the Windows install. Keeps going to sleep in a 
frustratingly short time. The screensaver time setting don't seem to 
interact with the powermanagement settings. Never doesn't seem to be never.


It's not the screensaver time, it's the sleep time setting.  But also, 
if it's booting again, then the sleep isn't even working.



What will make fedora stay in its own neighborhood?


If the default boot is windows, then any time it reboots, it will go 
there.  You either need to disable the sleeping or figure out why it's 
not working properly.

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Wrestling with UEFI

2023-08-21 Thread Robert McBroom via users
Added a Fedora 37 and Fedora 38 installations on separate drives to a 
Windows system. Default boot is the Windows 10 system. Using the boot 
menu gets me to grub which can boot the system of my choice.


When the Fedora 38 install goes to sleep it doesn't come back to Fedora 
but boots to the Windows install. Keeps going to sleep in a 
frustratingly short time. The screensaver time setting don't seem to 
interact with the powermanagement settings. Never doesn't seem to be never.


What will make fedora stay in its own neighborhood?
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Re: Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Geoffrey Leach
On Mon, 21 Aug 2023 20:30:44 -0700
Samuel Sieb  wrote:

> On 8/21/23 08:56, Paul Smith wrote:
> > Are other also experience that with the new kernel:
> > 
> > 6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64
> > 
> > I have already file a bug but no answer:
> > 
> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838  
> 
> You didn't really provide any info that would help.  Can you get any 
> journal output or the sos file?  Is there any indication of what is 
> going wrong?

FWIW 
I had a similar problem recently with a F37 system. After being unable
to figure out a reason for the emergency mode -- in particular
journalctl was clean, as was fstab -- I re-installed, which resolved
the problem. 
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Re: Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Samuel Sieb

On 8/21/23 08:56, Paul Smith wrote:

Are other also experience that with the new kernel:

6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64

I have already file a bug but no answer:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838


You didn't really provide any info that would help.  Can you get any 
journal output or the sos file?  Is there any indication of what is 
going wrong?

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Re: GNU Emacs 29.1 in the repos?

2023-08-21 Thread Jonathan Billings
On Aug 21, 2023, at 11:44, Gábor Papp  wrote:
> Good morning/afternoon/evening/night!
> 
> I was just wondering when will Emacs 29.1 be available in the Fedora 38 repos?

Looks like it has only been built for Fedora 39 at this point.

https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2023-07e6003761

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Re: Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Mon, 2023-08-21 at 17:13 +0100, Paul Smith wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 5:10 PM Patrick O'Callaghan
>  wrote:
> > 
> > > Are other also experience that with the new kernel:
> > > 
> > > 6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64
> > > 
> > > I have already file a bug but no answer:
> > > 
> > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838
> > 
> > I didn't have any problems, but I updated to 6.4.11 this morning so
> > maybe try that.
> 
> Thanks, Patrick: My bad: the problematic kernel is:
> 
> kernel-6.4.11-200.fc38.x86_64

That's the one I'm using now. Haven't seen any issues with it, touch
wood.

poc
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Re: f38 & snapd

2023-08-21 Thread Barry


> On 15 Aug 2023, at 10:18, François Patte 
>  wrote:
> 
> error: system does not fully support snapd: cannot mount squashfs image using

A web search showed a possible answer install squashfuse?

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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Joe Zeff

On 08/21/2023 12:16 PM, John Mellor wrote:


I think that you're missing the point.  In order to accommodate the vast 
majority that are not on laptops, it should at least be programmable 
behaviour instead of forcing laptop behaviour on everyone.


I've no objection of it being an option, just to have it be the default, 
especially without warning.

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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread John Mellor

On 2023-08-21 12:55, Joe Zeff wrote:

On 08/21/2023 07:03 AM, Chris Adams wrote:

This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
(Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.


So everybody has to have it like that because one commercial user 
wants it? 


I think that you're missing the point.  In order to accommodate the vast 
majority that are not on laptops, it should at least be programmable 
behaviour instead of forcing laptop behaviour on everyone.

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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Tim via users
Michael D. Setzer II:
>> Question? If that is so, why couldn't they modify their Linux
>> pre-installed setup to have it set, rather than forcing everyone
>> else to have to have it as default?

Because we're the poor buggas who debug their ideas...  But I agree.  

If you're creating commercial installations that have to adhere to some
illusory green-washing principle you really shouldn't be using stock
installations but a custom one.

The average home user switches their PC off when it's not in use, and
expects it to stay switched on when they want it.  The non-average PC
user that leaves their PC on for extended hours, or 24/7 has done so on
purpose because that's what they want it to do.

And quite frankly, I can imagine chaos in the IT department of a
business that has to deal with multiple employee PCs going dormant at
inopportune moments.  Computers going tits-up because the worker was on
a phone call that took longer than the impatience period, had to do
something away from the desk, lunch breaks, whatever...


>> Wonder how many people are going to be reporting machines as
>> broken since they keep shutting down because of thie FEATURE...

Me too.


Richard Shaw:
> In my case my computer becomes completely unresponsive. Neither
> pressing reset, or holding down the power button have any effect
> forcing me to use the power supply switch. Not a very good end user
> experience.

Those of us who've been around here long enough remember that a great
number of computers fail spectacularly at suspending, hibernating, and
resuming.  Sometimes its the hardware, it's never going to manage it. 
Sometimes it's the software, they've gone about it in an ill-conceived
manner, or expected all hardware to work in some particular way.

As a general rule, manufacturers only test against Windows
compatibility.  And if they find a problem, and if they decide to
bother with a solution, it'll be a Windows patch, rather than fixing up
their hardware.



-- 
 
NB:  All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the list.
 
The following system info data is generated fresh for each post:
 
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UTC 2023 x86_64
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Joe Zeff

On 08/21/2023 07:03 AM, Chris Adams wrote:

This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
(Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.


So everybody has to have it like that because one commercial user wants it?
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Re: Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Paul Smith
On Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 5:10 PM Patrick O'Callaghan
 wrote:
>
> > Are other also experience that with the new kernel:
> >
> > 6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64
> >
> > I have already file a bug but no answer:
> >
> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838
>
> I didn't have any problems, but I updated to 6.4.11 this morning so
> maybe try that.

Thanks, Patrick: My bad: the problematic kernel is:

kernel-6.4.11-200.fc38.x86_64

Paul
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Re: Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Mon, 2023-08-21 at 16:56 +0100, Paul Smith wrote:
> Dear All,
> 
> Are other also experience that with the new kernel:
> 
> 6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64
> 
> I have already file a bug but no answer:
> 
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838
> 

I didn't have any problems, but I updated to 6.4.11 this morning so
maybe try that.

poc
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Last kernel update leads to emergency mode

2023-08-21 Thread Paul Smith
Dear All,

Are other also experience that with the new kernel:

6.4.10-200.fc38.x86_64

I have already file a bug but no answer:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2232838

Have a nice day,

Paul
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GNU Emacs 29.1 in the repos?

2023-08-21 Thread Gábor Papp
Good morning/afternoon/evening/night!

I was just wondering when will Emacs 29.1 be available in the Fedora 38
repos?

Thank you.

PS: Apologies for the HTML email.
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread George N. White III
On Sun, Aug 20, 2023 at 5:50 PM Joe Zeff  wrote:

> On 08/20/2023 01:56 PM, Tim via users wrote:
> > Quite an assumption, that's completely wrong for a large number of
> > people.  And considering the number of PCs that don't get hibernation
> > and suspending working right, that's yet another problem to deal with.
>

There is a big difference between individual home, small and medium buisness
users, and enterprise environments.

At my "enterprise" workplace, each building had an energy budget based on
watts
per workstation.  Electrical panels and HVAC were sized to that level.
Users were
issued a laptop with docking station and monitor.  Just before COVID send
users
home, there was a plan to increase density using call center cubicles.

>
> "But it works for us!"  That, and the assumption that everybody wants
> their desktop to look the way the devs do are two of the main reasons I
> don't use Gnome.
>

In my field, there is a "mission critical" command-line app that was
developed
on SGI IRIX64 and ported to macOS and linux.  The vast majority of users
have
little or no interest or experience with linux, so if they aren't macOS
users, they
just install some linux distro (I tell them to seek out other linux users
at their site
for advice on choice of distro so they can get help with site-specific
configuration)
using the default configuration.  This user community benefits when the
number
of different linux configurations is kept small.  Since the majority of
users are
stuck with Windows in their workplace. it is helpful if the linux desktop
is not too
different from Windows.

-- 
George N. White III
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Re: f38 & snapd

2023-08-21 Thread stan via users
On Mon, 21 Aug 2023 11:30:55 +0200
François Patte  wrote:

> No lights from anyone?
 
I don't use snaps and know almost nothing about snaps, but maybe this
link will help?

https://computingforgeeks.com/install-snapd-and-snap-applications-on-fedora/
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Mon, 2023-08-21 at 08:03 -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Joe Zeff  said:
> > On 08/20/2023 01:56 PM, Tim via users wrote:
> > > Quite an assumption, that's completely wrong for a large number
> > > of
> > > people.  And considering the number of PCs that don't get
> > > hibernation
> > > and suspending working right, that's yet another problem to deal
> > > with.
> > 
> > "But it works for us!"  That, and the assumption that everybody
> > wants their desktop to look the way the devs do are two of the main
> > reasons I don't use Gnome.
> 
> This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
> change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
> (Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
> certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.

Some people need it, some don't, but everyone gets it and quite a few
don't know they have it until it trips them up. It ignores the old rule
known as the Principle of Least Astonishment.

poc
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Richard Shaw
On Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 9:01 AM Michael D. Setzer II via users <
users@lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:

> > This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
> > change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
> > (Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
> > certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.
> >
>
> Question? If that is so, why couldn't they modify their Linux
> pre-installed setup to have it set, rather than forcing everyone else
> to have to have it as default?
>
> Since I did a dnf upgrade it didn't present any option saying it was
> going to do this, or prompting for the option. Don't know if a clean
> install would have presented any option..
>
> Wonder how many people are going to be reporting machines as
> broken since they keep shutting down because of thie FEATURE...
>

In my case my computer becomes completely unresponsive. Neither pressing
reset, or holding down the power button have any effect forcing me to use
the power supply switch. Not a very good end user experience.

Thanks,
Richard
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Tim via users
On Mon, 2023-08-21 at 08:03 -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
> change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
> (Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
> certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.

It should have been an option that the owner could *easily* control.

People are having to ask about unsetting it, because the only obvious
control for changing it will only affect the computer while you're
logged into it (power management settings for *you*).  As soon as you
log out, the login screen's settings take over.

Come to that, GDM really needs re-thinking.  It's so damn hard to
change how the login screen works that it's not funny.
 
-- 
 
uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1160.95.1.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Mon Jul 24 13:59:37 UTC 2023 x86_64
 
Boilerplate:  All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.
 
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Michael D. Setzer II via users
On 21 Aug 2023 at 8:03, Chris Adams wrote:

Date sent:  Mon, 21 Aug 2023 08:03:34 -0500
From:   Chris Adams 
To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Subject:Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now 
suspending after 15
minues??
Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora users 


> Once upon a time, Joe Zeff  said:
> > On 08/20/2023 01:56 PM, Tim via users wrote:
> > >Quite an assumption, that's completely wrong for a large number of
> > >people.  And considering the number of PCs that don't get hibernation
> > >and suspending working right, that's yet another problem to deal with.
> > 
> > "But it works for us!"  That, and the assumption that everybody
> > wants their desktop to look the way the devs do are two of the main
> > reasons I don't use Gnome.
> 
> This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
> change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
> (Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
> certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.
> 

Question? If that is so, why couldn't they modify their Linux 
pre-installed setup to have it set, rather than forcing everyone else 
to have to have it as default? 

Since I did a dnf upgrade it didn't present any option saying it was 
going to do this, or prompting for the option. Don't know if a clean 
install would have presented any option..

Wonder how many people are going to be reporting machines as 
broken since they keep shutting down because of thie FEATURE...



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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Chris Adams
Once upon a time, Joe Zeff  said:
> On 08/20/2023 01:56 PM, Tim via users wrote:
> >Quite an assumption, that's completely wrong for a large number of
> >people.  And considering the number of PCs that don't get hibernation
> >and suspending working right, that's yet another problem to deal with.
> 
> "But it works for us!"  That, and the assumption that everybody
> wants their desktop to look the way the devs do are two of the main
> reasons I don't use Gnome.

This wasn't just some developer's idea... IIRC the request for this
change came from someone who sells systems with Linux pre-installed
(Lenovo?), because this is a requirement for meeting power
certifications needed for desktop/notebook systems.

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Re: f38 & snapd

2023-08-21 Thread François Patte

Le 2023-08-15 11:17, François Patte a écrit :

Bonjour,

on f38 it is possible to install snapd but it seems impossible to use
it: while I wanted to install nextcloud via snap, I get this error
message:

error: system does not fully support snapd: cannot mount squashfs
image using "squashfs":
   - mount: /tmp/syscheck-mountpoint-2175242409: type de
système de fichiers « squashfs »
   inconnu.

I installed squashfs-tools but no change...

Thank you for lights.


No lights from anyone?

--
François Patte
UFR de mathématiques et informatique
Laboratoire CNRS MAP5, UMR 8145
Université Paris Descartes
45, rue des Saints Pères
F-75270 Paris Cedex 06
Tél. +33 (0)6 7892 5822
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FSF
https://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/presenting-shoetool-happy-holidays-from-the-fsf
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Re: Upgraded machine to Fedora 38 and now suspending after 15 minues??

2023-08-21 Thread Jon Ingason via users

Den 2023-08-21 kl. 03:09, skrev Michael D. Setzer II via users:



Question. Just looked at the sleep.conf file on my machine and all
the commented lines (all) seem to show the default as =yes, so I
assuming that you mean to uncomment the lines and change =yes
to =no??

Check the file on my Fedora 37 and it also shows most of same
options?

[Sleep]
#AllowSuspend=yes
#AllowHibernation=yes
#AllowSuspendThenHibernate=yes
#AllowHybridSleep=yes
#SuspendMode=
#SuspendState=mem standby freeze
#HibernateMode=platform shutdown
#HibernateState=disk
#HybridSleepMode=suspend platform shutdown
#HybridSleepState=disk
#HibernateDelaySec=120min



What I understand this shows the standard value of this parameters.
There for you need to uncomment "Allow*" and change "yes" to "no".
This works for me. I also do:

sudo -u gdm dbus-run-session gsettings set 
org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.power sleep-inactive-ac-timeout 0


since I am running Gnome.


--
Regards

Jon Ingason

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