Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Thu, 2010-09-02 at 12:15 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote: > kalinix wrote: > > >> What exactly is ksplice meant to do? > >> I yum-installed it today, > >> and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. > >> I expected this to start running, but it didn't. > >> Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. > > > ksplice and yum update are two entirely different things. Let's say you > > are running kernel 2.6.33.6-147: yum update downloads and install the > > latest kernel release of your vendor of choice (e.g. Fedora's kernel > > 2.6.33.8-149) from your vendor's repository; ksplice update downloads > > only deltas between 2.6.33.6-147 and 2.6.33.8-149, compiled as modules, > > and apply them on the current running kernel. The deltas are downloaded > > from ksplice site, therefore are compiled by them. > > So if you ran yum update you just downloaded and installed the latest > > Fedora kernel, which needs reboot. > > I yum-installed ksplice under Fedora-13. > I don't seem to have any application called "ksplice", > so how do I run "ksplice update" as you suggest? > > > -- > Timothy Murphy > e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net > tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366 > s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland > Actually I wasn't very clear: the update command is 'uptrack-upgrade'. If you want to see the updates you can see them with uptrack-show. If you're using X, you can see the patches with uptrack-manager HTH, -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = Don't be irreplaceable, if you can't be replaced, you can't be promoted. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
kalinix wrote: >> What exactly is ksplice meant to do? >> I yum-installed it today, >> and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. >> I expected this to start running, but it didn't. >> Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. > ksplice and yum update are two entirely different things. Let's say you > are running kernel 2.6.33.6-147: yum update downloads and install the > latest kernel release of your vendor of choice (e.g. Fedora's kernel > 2.6.33.8-149) from your vendor's repository; ksplice update downloads > only deltas between 2.6.33.6-147 and 2.6.33.8-149, compiled as modules, > and apply them on the current running kernel. The deltas are downloaded > from ksplice site, therefore are compiled by them. > So if you ran yum update you just downloaded and installed the latest > Fedora kernel, which needs reboot. I yum-installed ksplice under Fedora-13. I don't seem to have any application called "ksplice", so how do I run "ksplice update" as you suggest? -- Timothy Murphy e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366 s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: PackageKit (was: Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?)
On Thu, 2 Sep 2010 08:02:40 +0100, Richard wrote: > >> Also, you forgot to point to bugzillas in your email. > > > > There is no bugzilla ticket about it, because I simply don't have the time > > to open tickets for _every_ issue I run into and have > > Then please don't send sarky emails to users@lists.fedoraproject.org No idea where you've found sarcasm in my mails in this thread. Rather I could call one of your mails "sarky" (the one quoted at the very top). [And just for completeness, I've not been s_n_arky either.] I will continue to participate on this list whenever I like to. There has been a comment about "turn[ing] off the annoying packagekit app", and that has prompted me to reply to it. Often, it makes a lot of sense to talk about something before submitting a problem report. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: PackageKit (was: Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?)
On 1 September 2010 12:08, Michael Schwendt wrote: > Then I could return to running "yum -y update --skip-broken" instead of > letting an autostarted desktop app be "more convenient". Right? Up to you. >> Also, you forgot to point to bugzillas in your email. > > There is no bugzilla ticket about it, because I simply don't have the time > to open tickets for _every_ issue I run into and have Then please don't send sarky emails to users@lists.fedoraproject.org Thanks, Richard. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Wed, 2010-09-01 at 21:31 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote: > kalinix wrote: > > > ksplice works only for kernels. And make several modules out of the > > deltas between the kernel release, which will be loaded in the older > > kernel. So you'll end up with, let's say 2.6.33.6-147 and a bunch of > > modules covering the patches up to the 2.6.33.8-149. Technically you are > > at 2.6.33.8-149. Practically you still run 2.6.33.6-147 (with > > improvements :) ). > > What exactly is ksplice meant to do? > I yum-installed it today, > and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. > I expected this to start running, but it didn't. > Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. > > > -- > Timothy Murphy > e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net > tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366 > s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland > ksplice and yum update are two entirely different things. Let's say you are running kernel 2.6.33.6-147: yum update downloads and install the latest kernel release of your vendor of choice (e.g. Fedora's kernel 2.6.33.8-149) from your vendor's repository; ksplice update downloads only deltas between 2.6.33.6-147 and 2.6.33.8-149, compiled as modules, and apply them on the current running kernel. The deltas are downloaded from ksplice site, therefore are compiled by them. So if you ran yum update you just downloaded and installed the latest Fedora kernel, which needs reboot. -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = An atom-blaster is a good weapon, but it can point both ways. -- Isaac Asimov -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 09/01/2010 06:14 PM, Timothy Murphy wrote: > Ranjan Maitra wrote: > >>> What exactly is ksplice meant to do? >>> I yum-installed it today, >>> and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. >>> I expected this to start running, but it didn't. >>> Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. >>> >> >> Sounds very cool, and I had not heard of it before today also, but here >> is the results of yum info ksplice: >> >> Summary : Patching a Linux kernel without reboot >> URL : http://ksplice.com >> License : GPLv2 >> Description : Ksplice allows system administrators to apply security >> patches to >> : the Linux kernel without having to reboot. Ksplice takes as >> : input a source code change in unified diff format and the >> : kernel source code to be patched, and it applies the patch >> : to the corresponding running kernel. The running kernel does >> : not need to have been prepared in advance in any way. >> >> Is it too good to be true? > Sorry, but it sounds to me as though it is much easier to re-boot. For most users, yes, much easier to reboot. But there are hundreds if not thousand of situations where a reboot is out of the question. If you have not worked in very large database center with thousands of clients all over the world, you will understand why sometimes a reboot would be out of the question. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Ranjan Maitra wrote: >> What exactly is ksplice meant to do? >> I yum-installed it today, >> and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. >> I expected this to start running, but it didn't. >> Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. >> > > > Sounds very cool, and I had not heard of it before today also, but here > is the results of yum info ksplice: > > Summary : Patching a Linux kernel without reboot > URL : http://ksplice.com > License : GPLv2 > Description : Ksplice allows system administrators to apply security > patches to > : the Linux kernel without having to reboot. Ksplice takes as > : input a source code change in unified diff format and the > : kernel source code to be patched, and it applies the patch > : to the corresponding running kernel. The running kernel does > : not need to have been prepared in advance in any way. > > Is it too good to be true? Sorry, but it sounds to me as though it is much easier to re-boot. -- Timothy Murphy e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366 s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 09/01/2010 04:19 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > > "Kevin J. Cummings" writes: >> On 08/31/2010 09:08 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: >>> Why not just do reboots at 3 in the morning and it just won't matter all >>> that much. I just have a cron script in /etc/cron.daily that checks to >> No! I'm often doing something at 3AM (granted I *should* be going to >> bed before that time), and I hate it when I'm working on something the >> the system goes down for a reboot without asking first > > I've been there too. It used to just do a "shutdown -r +3 'a quick > reboot for yum'", but even with the 3 minute warning a pending reboot > was a real pain in the neck. I'd often be funbling with "ps" trying > frantically to locate the shutdown so I could kill it before it killed > me. ;-) FWIW, a simple "shutdown -c" should cancel a running shutdown process. -- Bob Nichols "NOSPAM" is really part of my email address. Do NOT delete it. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
"Kevin J. Cummings" writes: > On 08/31/2010 09:08 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: >> Why not just do reboots at 3 in the morning and it just won't matter all >> that much. I just have a cron script in /etc/cron.daily that checks to > No! I'm often doing something at 3AM (granted I *should* be going to > bed before that time), and I hate it when I'm working on something the > the system goes down for a reboot without asking first I've been there too. It used to just do a "shutdown -r +3 'a quick reboot for yum'", but even with the 3 minute warning a pending reboot was a real pain in the neck. I'd often be funbling with "ps" trying frantically to locate the shutdown so I could kill it before it killed me. ;-) For the curious, here is my script. It has served me well for a few years. -wolfgang #!/bin/sh ### ## ## ## File: reboot-if-needed ## ## Author: Wolfgang S. Rupprecht ## ## Created: Wed Dec 3 16:20:29 PST 2008 ## ## Contents: reboot a host if needed## ## ## ## Copyright (c) 2008 Wolfgang S. Rupprecht.## ## All rights reserved. ## ## ## ## $Id$ ### # install reboot-if-needed /etc/cron.daily/-reboot-if-needed # boot.log is a file we can expect to exist and is at most as old as # the last boot-time. If yum.log is newer, we have installed or # deleted something. It is best to reboot to make sure all the new # files get used and the disk space for the old files gets freed up. # was: /var/run/crond.pid for < fedora-12, where boot.log never was touched. # # The cron rpm sometimes gets updated by yum and this will cause cron # to be restarted and the pid file to be touched. Use boot.log if # possible. if [ /var/log/yum.log -nt /var/log/boot.log ] then # Don't reboot if someone is logged in. if [ -n "$(w -h)" ] then logger -i -s -t 'reboot-if-needed' 'Please reboot for newly installed files' exit fi logger -i -s -t 'reboot-if-needed' 'a quick reboot for newly installed files (via yum)' shutdown -r +3 'a quick reboot for newly installed files (via yum)' fi # # end # -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Wed, Sep 01, 2010 at 15:45:51 -0500, Ranjan Maitra wrote: > > Is it too good to be true? You can read more about it at Linux Weekly New. One article is: http://lwn.net/Articles/340477/ -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010 15:31:43 -0500 Timothy Murphy wrote: > kalinix wrote: > > > ksplice works only for kernels. And make several modules out of the > > deltas between the kernel release, which will be loaded in the older > > kernel. So you'll end up with, let's say 2.6.33.6-147 and a bunch of > > modules covering the patches up to the 2.6.33.8-149. Technically you are > > at 2.6.33.8-149. Practically you still run 2.6.33.6-147 (with > > improvements :) ). > > What exactly is ksplice meant to do? > I yum-installed it today, > and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. > I expected this to start running, but it didn't. > Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. > Sounds very cool, and I had not heard of it before today also, but here is the results of yum info ksplice: Summary : Patching a Linux kernel without reboot URL : http://ksplice.com License : GPLv2 Description : Ksplice allows system administrators to apply security patches to : the Linux kernel without having to reboot. Ksplice takes as input : a source code change in unified diff format and the kernel source : code to be patched, and it applies the patch to the corresponding : running kernel. The running kernel does not need to have been : prepared in advance in any way. Is it too good to be true? Ranjan -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
kalinix wrote: > ksplice works only for kernels. And make several modules out of the > deltas between the kernel release, which will be loaded in the older > kernel. So you'll end up with, let's say 2.6.33.6-147 and a bunch of > modules covering the patches up to the 2.6.33.8-149. Technically you are > at 2.6.33.8-149. Practically you still run 2.6.33.6-147 (with > improvements :) ). What exactly is ksplice meant to do? I yum-installed it today, and then ran "yum update" which installed a new kernel. I expected this to start running, but it didn't. Admittedly I didn't read any instructions. -- Timothy Murphy e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366 s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 08/31/2010 09:08 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > > Why not just do reboots at 3 in the morning and it just won't matter all > that much. I just have a cron script in /etc/cron.daily that checks to No! I'm often doing something at 3AM (granted I *should* be going to bed before that time), and I hate it when I'm working on something the the system goes down for a reboot without asking first > see if /var/log/yum has changed since the last reboot and then it does a > reboot if nobody is logged in. If I had certain long-running programs > that needed to finish, I'd have to check for those too, but I don't. Well, that's slightly better than the MS way of doing it. (Yes, I have been on my wife's computer when it decided that it was time to reboot with 2 users logged in.) > -wolfgang -- Kevin J. Cummings kjch...@rcn.com cummi...@kjchome.homeip.net cummi...@kjc386.framingham.ma.us Registered Linux User #1232 (http://counter.li.org) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 09/01/2010 04:24 AM, Tim wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 18:50 -0700, JD wrote: >> A simple logout will not kill the many daemons and processes that are >> still running AND linked to the older, just replaced libraries. > But, in this case, when you logout, your use of the evolution data > server /should/ completely exit (there's no need for it to still be > doing something for when you're not there). And it should be free to > restart. Though, if you had multiple users logged in, rebooting does > become the simple way around it. > > I do notice that there's often a variety of lingering things, sometimes, > when you log out, that ought to quit, but don't. > > That is true iff evolution daemon only starts when you login, and dies when you logout; AND iff evolution is your only concern. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 22:37, kalinix wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 20:20 -0400, Tom Horsley wrote: > > Why not just only apply updates when you feel like rebooting? > That's what I do. I've lived without them my whole life, > a few more days won't hurt anything. > > Of course, I also turn off the annoying packagekit app that > is like an animated paperclip tapping on my screen saying: > > "Hey! There's updates! Don't you want to apply updates! > Com'on, it will be fun! Let's go update the system! You > don't have anything better to do". > > > http://www.imagepoop.com/image/660/I-Reboot-As-Much-As-I-Get-Laid.html > > :)) > Hahaha... awesome! :-) ... oh, wait a minute... damn it! :-/ -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 00:11, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 22:15 -0300, Andre Costa wrote: >> These userspace apps should be restated automatically after >> the upgrade, without bothering the user with a "reboot your computer >> to make sure any changes will be applied" warning. > > Suddenly restarting apps without consulting the user is the last thing > we need. Even the "please reboot" message is simply a suggestion, and if > you use yum directly rather than via PK you won't even see it. That's a good point (also made by Calin a couple of messages ago), it's obviously not practical, I would hate it as well. Please forget I even suggested that ;-) Still, AFAICS a reboot shouldn't be necessary on such cases. Andre -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 18:50 -0700, JD wrote: > A simple logout will not kill the many daemons and processes that are > still running AND linked to the older, just replaced libraries. But, in this case, when you logout, your use of the evolution data server /should/ completely exit (there's no need for it to still be doing something for when you're not there). And it should be free to restart. Though, if you had multiple users logged in, rebooting does become the simple way around it. I do notice that there's often a variety of lingering things, sometimes, when you log out, that ought to quit, but don't. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: PackageKit (was: Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?)
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010 11:41:50 +0100, Richard wrote: > > I've tried hard not to turn it off in F13 and F14 Branched, so I could > > test it, … but it is just plain annoying to see it fail due to a broken > > dependency and then refuse to remove itself from the notification area. > > That's too much of a distraction for me. > > Can't you just change the preferences to check for updates "Never"? ?? Also with F13? Then I could return to running "yum -y update --skip-broken" instead of letting an autostarted desktop app be "more convenient". Right? > Also, you forgot to point to bugzillas in your email. There is no bugzilla ticket about it, because I simply don't have the time to open tickets for _every_ issue I run into and have - package maintainers possibly ignore the tickets for months, and - dist EOL bug autoclosing scripts force me to re-examine dozens of issues. So, typically I open only a limited number of tickets, and only if there is progress, I will consider reporting further issues. For some things it's simply much more easier to just disable it and move on. Eventually, there will be another user to notice and report the same issue, and that will spread the load. Or it's on some todo-list already. Time will tell. Problems, such as the package list view paging up and down automatically (and wildly) during download even if the user wants to scroll manually, is a UI issue that won't go unnoticed forever. > Removing itself > from the icon after a failed dep update is probably a sane thing to > do. > > Richard. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: PackageKit (was: Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?)
On 1 September 2010 11:26, Michael Schwendt wrote: > I've tried hard not to turn it off in F13 and F14 Branched, so I could > test it, … but it is just plain annoying to see it fail due to a broken > dependency and then refuse to remove itself from the notification area. > That's too much of a distraction for me. Can't you just change the preferences to check for updates "Never"? Also, you forgot to point to bugzillas in your email. Removing itself from the icon after a failed dep update is probably a sane thing to do. Richard. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
PackageKit (was: Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?)
On Tue, 31 Aug 2010 20:20:23 -0400, Tom wrote: > Of course, I also turn off the annoying packagekit app that > is like an animated paperclip tapping on my screen saying: > > "Hey! There's updates! Don't you want to apply updates! > Com'on, it will be fun! Let's go update the system! You > don't have anything better to do". I've tried hard not to turn it off in F13 and F14 Branched, so I could test it, … but it is just plain annoying to see it fail due to a broken dependency and then refuse to remove itself from the notification area. That's too much of a distraction for me. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Wed, 2010-09-01 at 00:17 -0400, Jonathan Beatty wrote: > Why use the application anyway? It's faster from xterm. What are you talking about? What application? poc PS Kindly refrain from top-quoting. See the list Guidelines. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Why use the application anyway? It's faster from xterm. On 8/31/10, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 22:15 -0300, Andre Costa wrote: >> These userspace apps should be restated automatically after >> the upgrade, without bothering the user with a "reboot your computer >> to make sure any changes will be applied" warning. > > Suddenly restarting apps without consulting the user is the last thing > we need. Even the "please reboot" message is simply a suggestion, and if > you use yum directly rather than via PK you won't even see it. > > poc > > -- > users mailing list > users@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe or change subscription options: > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users > Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > -- Sent from my mobile device -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 22:15 -0300, Andre Costa wrote: > These userspace apps should be restated automatically after > the upgrade, without bothering the user with a "reboot your computer > to make sure any changes will be applied" warning. Suddenly restarting apps without consulting the user is the last thing we need. Even the "please reboot" message is simply a suggestion, and if you use yum directly rather than via PK you won't even see it. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 08/31/2010 05:56 PM, Andre Costa wrote: > Hi JD, > > On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 19:47, JD wrote: >> On 08/31/2010 03:17 PM, Andre Costa wrote: >>> Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: >>> evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. >>> >>> ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop >>> components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? >>> This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the >>> computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services >>> besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! >>> >>> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really >>> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I >>> don't know... it really seems unneeded. >>> >>> I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or >>> some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those >>> good old times" :-( >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Andre >> It was bound to happen. >> Way too many daemons are running linked with libraries that just got >> updated. >> That said, I think that unless you want to boot with the updated kernel, you >> can get away with just doing; >> >> sudo init 1 >> Once you are in the single user shell, issue >> >> init 5 >> >> This will at least get you running the the latest apps and libs while >> staying with the currently booted kernel. > Yes, it's slightly better than a reboot, but still more "drastic" than > it should be IMHO. In this particular case (and many others I've seen > recently), a simple logout should be enough AFAICS. > > Regards, > > Andre A simple logout will not kill the many daemons and processes that are still running AND linked to the older, just replaced libraries. Furthermore, the very daemons themelves may have been replaced. Such is life when you use a bleeding edge distro like Fedora. There are other distros that do not issue so many updates so frequently. Try Centos. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 20:20 -0400, Tom Horsley wrote: > Why not just only apply updates when you feel like rebooting? > That's what I do. I've lived without them my whole life, > a few more days won't hurt anything. > > Of course, I also turn off the annoying packagekit app that > is like an animated paperclip tapping on my screen saying: > > "Hey! There's updates! Don't you want to apply updates! > Com'on, it will be fun! Let's go update the system! You > don't have anything better to do". http://www.imagepoop.com/image/660/I-Reboot-As-Much-As-I-Get-Laid.html :)) -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = Linux ext2fs has been stable for a long time, now it's time to break it -- Linuxkongreß '95 in Berlin -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 22:15 -0300, Andre Costa wrote: > > > > Andre, I think needs-restarting means those applications need to be > > restarted, not you need to restart the whole system to update those > > applications. > > Yes, that's what I understood as well. This is what I tried to > evidence with my example. > > > As well as 'reboot me' should means exactly that: reboot that particular > > application. > > Exactly. These userspace apps should be restated automatically after > the upgrade, without bothering the user with a "reboot your computer > to make sure any changes will be applied" warning. > Well you must admit that is not a very nice feeling to see that your text editor, or your mail client just restarted, in the middle of something extremely important, or even better, your pidgin restarted right in the middle of a conference with your boss :) . That's why it gives you the option to restart those particular applications at your own will. And I emphasize: those specific applications, not the entire system. I don't know about the other message (and my personal opinion is you can completely forget about it), as I only use yum, but I can tell you this: before restarting my system (F13) this evening in order to load the latest kernel, I had at least 40 days uptime, with an fully up to date system (except of course for kernel which was 4 releases old). So my advice is: restart only those applications that show up in needs-restarting and forget about reboots, until a new kernel is released. And switch to yum :) > > I never ever saw a linux system which has to be rebooted in order to > > update pidgin. > > Amen. If it ever happens, it will be time to move on to something else... ;-) > > Andre -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = True happiness will be found only in true love. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 22:08, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > > Why not just do reboots at 3 in the morning and it just won't matter all > that much. I just have a cron script in /etc/cron.daily that checks to > see if /var/log/yum has changed since the last reboot and then it does a > reboot if nobody is logged in. If I had certain long-running programs > that needed to finish, I'd have to check for those too, but I don't. It would work. But that's still not fixing the cause, only dealing with the consequences. (BTW: I don't leave my computer on continuously, so I know upgrades will be effective tomorrow. It just feels plain wrong ;-)) Andre -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 21:59, kalinix wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 21:43 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 20:17, Patrick O'Callaghan
>> wrote:
>> > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 19:17 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
>> >> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really
>> >> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I
>> >> don't know... it really seems unneeded.
>> >
>> > needs-restarting ("yum install yum-utils" if you don't have it). This
>> > will catch everything except the kernel, but that one is obvious.
>>
>> That's nice, I didn't know needs-restarting, it will definitely be
>> useful (it is installed). Thks =)
>>
>> Still, my point is: this kind of check should be handled automatically
>> by the upgrade process, and the user should only be asked to reboot if
>> there's *really* need to do so. Eg. right now, after those two
>> upgrades I mentioned, that read "reboot me!" icon is sitting on my
>> notification panel, but if I run 'needs-restarting' this is what I
>> get:
>>
>> 3478 :
>> /usr/libexec/clock-applet--oaf-activate-iid=OAFIID:GNOME_ClockApplet_Factory--oaf-ior-fd=42
>> 3484 : /usr/sbin/restorecond-u
>> 3501 : pidgin
>>
>> Aside from restorecond, it's obvious I don't need to restart because
>> clock-applet and pidgin were upgraded... :-/ (and even restorecond
>> might not require a reboot).
>>
>> Andre
>
> Andre, I think needs-restarting means those applications need to be
> restarted, not you need to restart the whole system to update those
> applications.
Yes, that's what I understood as well. This is what I tried to
evidence with my example.
> As well as 'reboot me' should means exactly that: reboot that particular
> application.
Exactly. These userspace apps should be restated automatically after
the upgrade, without bothering the user with a "reboot your computer
to make sure any changes will be applied" warning.
> I never ever saw a linux system which has to be rebooted in order to
> update pidgin.
Amen. If it ever happens, it will be time to move on to something else... ;-)
Andre
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Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Why not just do reboots at 3 in the morning and it just won't matter all that much. I just have a cron script in /etc/cron.daily that checks to see if /var/log/yum has changed since the last reboot and then it does a reboot if nobody is logged in. If I had certain long-running programs that needed to finish, I'd have to check for those too, but I don't. -wolfgang -- Wolfgang S. Rupprecht http://www.wsrcc.com/wolfgang/ (IPv6-only) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 21:02 -0400, Paul Cartwright wrote: > On Tue August 31 2010, Andre Costa wrote: > > Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: > > evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. > > what about ksplice?? I've heard about it, but don't know if it is ready yet.. > > -- > Paul Cartwright > Registered Linux user # 367800 P.S. Yes is ready and free for fedora users :) -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = NOTICE: -- THE ELEVATORS WILL BE OUT OF ORDER TODAY -- (The nearest working elevator is in the building across the street.) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 21:02 -0400, Paul Cartwright wrote: > On Tue August 31 2010, Andre Costa wrote: > > Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: > > evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. > > what about ksplice?? I've heard about it, but don't know if it is ready yet.. > > -- > Paul Cartwright > Registered Linux user # 367800 ksplice works only for kernels. And make several modules out of the deltas between the kernel release, which will be loaded in the older kernel. So you'll end up with, let's say 2.6.33.6-147 and a bunch of modules covering the patches up to the 2.6.33.8-149. Technically you are at 2.6.33.8-149. Practically you still run 2.6.33.6-147 (with improvements :) ). -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better and greater than a "Yes" merely uttered to please, or what is worse, to avoid trouble. -- Mahatma Gandhi -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue August 31 2010, Andre Costa wrote: > Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: > evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. what about ksplice?? I've heard about it, but don't know if it is ready yet.. -- Paul Cartwright Registered Linux user # 367800 -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 21:43 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 20:17, Patrick O'Callaghan
> wrote:
> > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 19:17 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
> >> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really
> >> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I
> >> don't know... it really seems unneeded.
> >
> > needs-restarting ("yum install yum-utils" if you don't have it). This
> > will catch everything except the kernel, but that one is obvious.
>
> That's nice, I didn't know needs-restarting, it will definitely be
> useful (it is installed). Thks =)
>
> Still, my point is: this kind of check should be handled automatically
> by the upgrade process, and the user should only be asked to reboot if
> there's *really* need to do so. Eg. right now, after those two
> upgrades I mentioned, that read "reboot me!" icon is sitting on my
> notification panel, but if I run 'needs-restarting' this is what I
> get:
>
> 3478 :
> /usr/libexec/clock-applet--oaf-activate-iid=OAFIID:GNOME_ClockApplet_Factory--oaf-ior-fd=42
> 3484 : /usr/sbin/restorecond-u
> 3501 : pidgin
>
> Aside from restorecond, it's obvious I don't need to restart because
> clock-applet and pidgin were upgraded... :-/ (and even restorecond
> might not require a reboot).
>
> Andre
Andre, I think needs-restarting means those applications need to be
restarted, not you need to restart the whole system to update those
applications.
As well as 'reboot me' should means exactly that: reboot that particular
application.
I never ever saw a linux system which has to be rebooted in order to
update pidgin.
--
Calin
Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857
=
"Every morning, I get up and look through the 'Forbes' list of the
richest people in America. If I'm not there, I go to work" -- Robert
Orben
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Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Hi JD, On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 19:47, JD wrote: > On 08/31/2010 03:17 PM, Andre Costa wrote: >> Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: >> evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. >> >> ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop >> components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? >> This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the >> computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services >> besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! >> >> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really >> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I >> don't know... it really seems unneeded. >> >> I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or >> some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those >> good old times" :-( >> >> Regards, >> >> Andre > It was bound to happen. > Way too many daemons are running linked with libraries that just got > updated. > That said, I think that unless you want to boot with the updated kernel, you > can get away with just doing; > > sudo init 1 > Once you are in the single user shell, issue > > init 5 > > This will at least get you running the the latest apps and libs while > staying with the currently booted kernel. Yes, it's slightly better than a reboot, but still more "drastic" than it should be IMHO. In this particular case (and many others I've seen recently), a simple logout should be enough AFAICS. Regards, Andre -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Hi Calin, On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 20:48, kalinix wrote: > In this particulary case, why not just an evolution --force-shutdown? > This will shutdown evolution-data-server. As simple as that. Yes, it's simple. So simple it should have been handled automatically by the upgrade *without a reboot* ;-) I appreciate all the tips (really), but my point is not specifically about Evolution, it's just that I believe reboots are being required unnecessarily. Upgrades could and should be smarter. It seems we're stepping backwards. Regards, Andre -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 08/31/2010 05:31 PM, kalinix wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 17:04 -0700, JD wrote: > >>> In this particulary case, why not just an evolution --force-shutdown? >>> This will shutdown evolution-data-server. As simple as that. >> Is this thread only about evolution updates? >> > the OP complained about two components, which happened to be evolution > related. And moreover, the second component, libgtkhtml only deals with > evolution itself, not even the data-server. So I gave him a simpler > solution to avoid from entering runlevel 1 and then re-entering runlevel > 5 (geez, you always do this when you update your system?). That's why I > wrote in my post "in this particular case". > > But of course, if you think that finding which daemon should be updated, > killing it and then restarting (as linux always worked, even before the > fancy, candy-eyed, gui apps that make it looks like crappy windows) is a > little bit overkill, a simple reboot would save you from this pain. As a > matter of fact, those gui apps were meant exactly for this. > > BTW, this reminded me to reboot to load the latest kernel... I was 4 > releases behind ;) Ala tha OP that compared linux to windows as far as the frequent reboots required after updates: perhaps Linux should be renamed Winux :) :) Just kidding :) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 20:17, Patrick O'Callaghan
wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 19:17 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
>> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really
>> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I
>> don't know... it really seems unneeded.
>
> needs-restarting ("yum install yum-utils" if you don't have it). This
> will catch everything except the kernel, but that one is obvious.
That's nice, I didn't know needs-restarting, it will definitely be
useful (it is installed). Thks =)
Still, my point is: this kind of check should be handled automatically
by the upgrade process, and the user should only be asked to reboot if
there's *really* need to do so. Eg. right now, after those two
upgrades I mentioned, that read "reboot me!" icon is sitting on my
notification panel, but if I run 'needs-restarting' this is what I
get:
3478 :
/usr/libexec/clock-applet--oaf-activate-iid=OAFIID:GNOME_ClockApplet_Factory--oaf-ior-fd=42
3484 : /usr/sbin/restorecond-u
3501 : pidgin
Aside from restorecond, it's obvious I don't need to restart because
clock-applet and pidgin were upgraded... :-/ (and even restorecond
might not require a reboot).
Andre
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Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 17:04 -0700, JD wrote: > > In this particulary case, why not just an evolution --force-shutdown? > > This will shutdown evolution-data-server. As simple as that. > > Is this thread only about evolution updates? > the OP complained about two components, which happened to be evolution related. And moreover, the second component, libgtkhtml only deals with evolution itself, not even the data-server. So I gave him a simpler solution to avoid from entering runlevel 1 and then re-entering runlevel 5 (geez, you always do this when you update your system?). That's why I wrote in my post "in this particular case". But of course, if you think that finding which daemon should be updated, killing it and then restarting (as linux always worked, even before the fancy, candy-eyed, gui apps that make it looks like crappy windows) is a little bit overkill, a simple reboot would save you from this pain. As a matter of fact, those gui apps were meant exactly for this. BTW, this reminded me to reboot to load the latest kernel... I was 4 releases behind ;) -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = Virus transmitted from computer to sysadmins. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Why not just only apply updates when you feel like rebooting? That's what I do. I've lived without them my whole life, a few more days won't hurt anything. Of course, I also turn off the annoying packagekit app that is like an animated paperclip tapping on my screen saying: "Hey! There's updates! Don't you want to apply updates! Com'on, it will be fun! Let's go update the system! You don't have anything better to do". -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 08/31/2010 04:48 PM, kalinix wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 15:47 -0700, JD wrote: >> On 08/31/2010 03:17 PM, Andre Costa wrote: >>> Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: >>> evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. >>> >>> ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop >>> components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? >>> This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the >>> computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services >>> besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! >>> >>> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really >>> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I >>> don't know... it really seems unneeded. >>> >>> I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or >>> some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those >>> good old times" :-( >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Andre >> It was bound to happen. >> Way too many daemons are running linked with libraries that just got >> updated. >> That said, I think that unless you want to boot with the updated kernel, you >> can get away with just doing; >> >> sudo init 1 >> Once you are in the single user shell, issue >> >> init 5 >> >> This will at least get you running the the latest apps and libs while >> staying with the currently booted kernel. >> >> >> > In this particulary case, why not just an evolution --force-shutdown? > This will shutdown evolution-data-server. As simple as that. Is this thread only about evolution updates? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 15:47 -0700, JD wrote: > On 08/31/2010 03:17 PM, Andre Costa wrote: > > Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: > > evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. > > > > ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop > > components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? > > This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the > > computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services > > besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! > > > > Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really > > necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I > > don't know... it really seems unneeded. > > > > I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or > > some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those > > good old times" :-( > > > > Regards, > > > > Andre > It was bound to happen. > Way too many daemons are running linked with libraries that just got > updated. > That said, I think that unless you want to boot with the updated kernel, you > can get away with just doing; > > sudo init 1 > Once you are in the single user shell, issue > > init 5 > > This will at least get you running the the latest apps and libs while > staying with the currently booted kernel. > > > In this particulary case, why not just an evolution --force-shutdown? This will shutdown evolution-data-server. As simple as that. -- Calin Key fingerprint = 37B8 0DA5 9B2A 8554 FB2B 4145 5DC1 15DD A3EF E857 = The static electricity routing is acting up... -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On Tue, 2010-08-31 at 19:17 -0300, Andre Costa wrote:
> Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really
> necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I
> don't know... it really seems unneeded.
needs-restarting ("yum install yum-utils" if you don't have it). This
will catch everything except the kernel, but that one is obvious.
poc
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Re: Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
On 08/31/2010 03:17 PM, Andre Costa wrote: > Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: > evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. > > ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop > components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? > This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the > computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services > besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! > > Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really > necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I > don't know... it really seems unneeded. > > I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or > some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those > good old times" :-( > > Regards, > > Andre It was bound to happen. Way too many daemons are running linked with libraries that just got updated. That said, I think that unless you want to boot with the updated kernel, you can get away with just doing; sudo init 1 Once you are in the single user shell, issue init 5 This will at least get you running the the latest apps and libs while staying with the currently booted kernel. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Aren't upgrades demanding too much restarts?
Latest F13 upgrades include two packages that "require" a restart: evolution-data-server and GtkHTML. ... ?! Is it really necessary to *reboot* because two desktop components have been upgraded? Shouldn't a logout/login be enough? This sounds like overkill, specially if you're the only one using the computer (i.e. there are no other users using those libraries/services besides you -- *if* you're using them). I don't even use Evolution! Isn't there any more clever way of determining if a reboot is really necessary? Or maybe at least the message should be less "demanding", I don't know... it really seems unneeded. I used to be proud of Linux only needing a reboot when the kernel (or some key component) was upgraded. This is sadly feeling like "those good old times" :-( Regards, Andre -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
