Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 2/13/2014 2:28 AM, g wrote: On 02/13/2014 07:28 AM, Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update or windows itself to continue working properly;-) if xp is going eol, why would 'what ever' of xp games not go eol? so a game hits eol, is it going to break or quit just because the os is never update again? i think not. For a STEAM user, as myself, who decides to continue running windows xp, after it goes eol, without internet access to continue playing games purchased from STEAM may have this problem because the game wont get validated,etc from STEAM, without internet access. Again, just pure speculation on my behalf how would "windows itself", presuming you mean xp, not continue to work? I was thinking if the user decides to install a new hardware that requires a newer driver it was a pleasure of conversion with you and others on this thread, however, i don't want to rude but I think it is starting to get off topic for a fedora list, so this will be my last reply for this thread:-) Best Regards -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 06:40 PM, Doug wrote: On 02/13/2014 11:24 AM, g wrote: On 02/13/2014 01:11 PM, Tim wrote: Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, g sent: oos I don't know what that means, but "Occupational Overuse Syndrome" of acronyms seems appropriate. ;-) "other operating system", but your definition to acronym surely does work, also, for "ms bs os". I think I sound "_obsolete_ operating system" somewhere. lshif. yes, that works also. -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 06:02 PM, Doug wrote: On 02/13/2014 05:37 AM, g wrote: On 02/13/2014 07:45 AM, Frank Murphy wrote: On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 23:28:29 -0800 Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update That's the point, most XP stuff will not be updated, incl games. or windows itself to continue working properly;-) It will continue to work, if you look after it. and make a full backup for when it throws up it's famous blue screen. I have no complaint about backups, and I admit that the only game I play in Windows is Microsoft Pinball, but I have _never_ seen a BSOD in XP. All the time in 95 and 98, but for me, XP cured that problem. It really is too bad they'r e phasing out support for XP. My laptop just can't hack Win 7. It's so slow it's pitiful! the only oos game i ever played was the 'flight sim'. the 2 planes i flew where the 'sopwith camel' and the 'lear jet'. flying the lear was not 'true flight'. an actual lear jet flight is a "peak point" coarse. from take of, your flight is an ascent to a peak half way between points and then a steady decent to landing. flying the lear jet thru the obstacle coarse would not be possible for a real lear jet. was not all that easy in the 'flight sim' either. the later 'purchase' version of 'flight sim' was a lot better and more planes. other 2 games i bought and played where 'falcon 3.0', an f16 fighting falcon simulator, and a helicopter simulator. [do not recall name, and it is packed away somewhere.] i played 'falcon 3.0' mostly because i finished 'flight school', but never got thru 'flight school' with the helicopter. :-( -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 11:24 AM, g wrote: On 02/13/2014 01:11 PM, Tim wrote: Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, g sent: oos I don't know what that means, but "Occupational Overuse Syndrome" of acronyms seems appropriate. ;-) "other operating system", but your definition to acronym surely does work, also, for "ms bs os". I think I sound "_obsolete_ operating system" somewhere. --doug -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 05:37 AM, g wrote: On 02/13/2014 07:45 AM, Frank Murphy wrote: On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 23:28:29 -0800 Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update That's the point, most XP stuff will not be updated, incl games. or windows itself to continue working properly;-) It will continue to work, if you look after it. and make a full backup for when it throws up it's famous blue screen. ( I have no complaint about backups, and I admit that the only game I play in Windows is Microsoft Pinball, but I have _never_ seen a BSOD in XP. All the time in 95 and 98, but for me, XP cured that problem. It really is too bad they'r e phasing out support for XP. My laptop just can't hack Win 7. It's so slow it's pitiful! --doug -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 01:11 PM, Tim wrote: Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, g sent: oos I don't know what that means, but "Occupational Overuse Syndrome" of acronyms seems appropriate. ;-) "other operating system", but your definition to acronym surely does work, also, for "ms bs os". -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Pete Travis sent: > Hi, do you realize this is a Fedora list? I'm pretty sure we all do. And you may have noticed that we've been sinking the boot into Windows... -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64 All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
How do I change the list? Il Giovedì 13 Febbraio 2014 14:19, Tim ha scritto: Allegedly, on or about 13 February 2014, Roger sent: > My main concern is how to save her emails, photos and poetry to a usb > drive. If you don't want to go to all the trouble of trying to selectively back up just what's needed, then plug in external disc (hard drive, flash drive), copy entire home directory to it. Simple backup... It gets harder if they've saved data all over the place, rather than just in their own space. XP was still dealing with people running as admin, to cope with programs which stored things in the programs directory. -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64 All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists. George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny, not a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
Allegedly, on or about 13 February 2014, Roger sent: > My main concern is how to save her emails, photos and poetry to a usb > drive. If you don't want to go to all the trouble of trying to selectively back up just what's needed, then plug in external disc (hard drive, flash drive), copy entire home directory to it. Simple backup... It gets harder if they've saved data all over the place, rather than just in their own space. XP was still dealing with people running as admin, to cope with programs which stored things in the programs directory. -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64 All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists. George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny, not a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
Allegedly, on or about 13 February 2014, Roger sent: > With Grub, I have ubuntu13.04 on first partition and Fedora 19 on the > second partition, Ubuntu Grub allows me to select between those as > well as another fedora on a separate hard drive so I guess it will > find the windows partition. An already-installed GRUB will just have what it currently does. It's during the installation phase of an OS, when it's creating the GRUB configuration, that the set-up programming goes looking for operating systems to put on the list. -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64 All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists. George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny, not a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, g sent: > oos I don't know what that means, but "Occupational Overuse Syndrome" of acronyms seems appropriate. ;-) -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64 All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 10:39 AM, Frank Murphy wrote: On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 10:37:58 + g wrote: this is last of taking up my time making comments about a _software_company_ that needs to go 'eol'. Fedora also goes EOL :) only by virgin. ;-) -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Thu, 13 Feb 2014 10:37:58 + g wrote: > this is last of taking up my time making comments about a > _software_company_ that needs to go 'eol'. Fedora also goes EOL :) ___ Regards Frank frankly3d.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 07:45 AM, Frank Murphy wrote: On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 23:28:29 -0800 Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update That's the point, most XP stuff will not be updated, incl games. or windows itself to continue working properly;-) It will continue to work, if you look after it. and make a full backup for when it throws up it's famous blue screen. ((GBWG)) one thing i learned about oos years ago; a- 1- make initial install. 2- tweak. 3- make a full backup. then when it crashes, you do not have to repeat 1 & 2. b- when packages or 3rd party are install, make an incremental backup. c- when an sp is released, and installed, make incremental backup. i learned "my abc's" from running unix, before there ever was oos. :-) this is last of taking up my time making comments about a _software_company_ that needs to go 'eol'. -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 07:28 AM, Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update or windows itself to continue working properly;-) if xp is going eol, why would 'what ever' of xp games not go eol? so a game hits eol, is it going to break or quit just because the os is never update again? i think not. how would "windows itself", presuming you mean xp, not continue to work? if it is working, it is not going to stop working. if you mean something crashing and trashing the install, so the cookie crumbles. reinstall and not worry about updates. how many games crash from lack of updates? :-) -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 2/12/2014 11:45 PM, Frank Murphy wrote: On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 23:28:29 -0800 Edward Mart wrote: On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update That's the point, most XP stuff will not be updated, incl games. or windows itself to continue working properly;-) It will continue to work, if you look after it. ___ Regards Frank frankly3d.com now i understand why a store was using win98 as a jukebox playing mp3s. offline Regards -- "Education is our passport to the future, for tomorrow belongs to the people who prepare for it today." Malcolm X -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 23:28:29 -0800 Edward Mart wrote: > On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: > > it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for > > games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better > > choice over upgrading > > until one those games or apps require an update That's the point, most XP stuff will not be updated, incl games. or windows > itself to continue working properly;-) It will continue to work, if you look after it. ___ Regards Frank frankly3d.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 2/12/2014 4:55 PM, g wrote: it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading until one those games or apps require an update or windows itself to continue working properly;-) -- "Education is our passport to the future, for tomorrow belongs to the people who prepare for it today." Malcolm X -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/13/2014 02:05 AM, Roger wrote: I know your pain. But a clean Linux install shouldn't take that long. Only an update-install, which is based on what was previously installed (and has to churn through assessing it and all the updates that will be needed), should take that long to run. agreed. centos with a default install is very easy to talk someone thru. once installed, remote console can be setup and "good to go" thereafter. Many thanks to all who responded to this dilemma. I really don't > want to touch it but it's someone I have known for 30 years, we > worked together though remotely, producing a quarterly newsletter > for 10 years. Trust me, she is so slow and requires confirmation > at each small step, having to explain each step takes time. (bwg) sounds like some of my mom's friends, so i can very well understand what you are saying. some folks just like to be cautious. Fortunately I am adept at ubuntu and Fedora installs so apart from the above it should be painless. > My main concern is how to save her emails, photos and poetry to a usb drive. Linux to linux is easy. if you can wait on wiping oos, simply by mounting the oos partition, you should well be able to copy over all that you are wanting to save for her. thunderbird can import most any emails that would be on an oos box. as for photos, .gif, .jpg, .png, are same in any os. an easy way to find them that i have used many time is to; ]$ su -c updatedb with oos mounted. after update; ]$ locate .gif|grep /path/to/oos> gif.001 ]$ locate .jpg|grep /path/to/oos> jpg.001 ]$ locate .png|grep /path/to/oos> png.001 and you have 3 listings of graphic files. granted, you will have files from various progs, but that can be minimized by noting file locations and run a 'grep' on pic files to get only what you want. same would apply for poetry. running grep against her user path will give you what you want. I'll look at centOS it is only an older version of fedora that became redhat. ;-) With Grub, I have ubuntu13.04 on first partition and Fedora 19 on the second partition, Ubuntu Grub allows me to select between those as well as another fedora on a separate hard drive so I guess it > will find the windows partition. The windows mbr is what has me > troubled so a fresh linux install will be the best option. if you have ubuntu and fedora already installed, you have no need to worry about mbr. Thanks again welcome again. Roger -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
I know your pain. But a clean Linux install shouldn't take that long. Only an update-install, which is based on what was previously > installed (and has to churn through assessing it and all the updates > that will be needed), should take that long to run. agreed. centos with a default install is very easy to talk someone thru. once installed, remote console can be setup and "good to go" thereafter. Many thanks to all who responded to this dilemma. I really don't want to touch it but it's someone I have known for 30 years, we worked together though remotely, producing a quarterly newsletter for 10 years. Trust me, she is so slow and requires confirmation at each small step, having to explain each step takes time. Fortunately I am adept at ubuntu and Fedora installs so apart from the above it should be painless. My main concern is how to save her emails, photos and poetry to a usb drive. Linux to linux is easy. I'll look at centOS With Grub, I have ubuntu13.04 on first partition and Fedora 19 on the second partition, Ubuntu Grub allows me to select between those as well as another fedora on a separate hard drive so I guess it will find the windows partition. The windows mbr is what has me troubled so a fresh linux install will be the best option. Thanks again Roger -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 02/12/2014 10:28 PM, Edward M wrote: On 2/12/2014 2:34 AM, Roger wrote: Dell 1520 laptop which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. As many have said windows xp eol is taking place in two months, and the laptop probably may require more ram to be added so it can be upgraded to either windows 7 or windows 8.1(if compatible). > I think removing xp completely and installing a linux distro is a safer choice it is a good suggestion, but installing linux and keeping xp for games, etc and never putting it back on internet is also a better choice over upgrading. and no, i would not expect an oos advocate suggest installing linux. ;-) Here is a nice read: Microsoft's Tim Rains explaining in his blog the risks of running windows xp with no support. http://blogs.technet.com/b/security/archive/2013/08/15/<> some very strong points are made in blog as to how weak oos really is and will continue to be. but, he talks only about xp software, nothing is mentioned about what would happen if a user only uses 3rd party, such as mozilla, and if user blocks all incoming traffic that is not originated. granted, 'mim' is always a possibility, then again, linux is just about only system that is safe from such, tho not completely. for sure, xp is on its way out, as should have been done long before now. but there are some who may be locked in to it because of 3rd party software -- peace out. in a world with out fences, who needs gates. tc.hago. g . -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
greetings roger and tim. On 02/12/2014 02:40 PM, Tim wrote: Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe > to use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe > when XP was being supported, anyway... basically, i would agree and main variation has to do with what oos has for anti virus/malware and internet security. i get a lot of flack when i talk about symantec/norton, but i have found that norton internet security software can be set up as tight as a linux firewall. *all* oos progs can be blocked from accessing internet, including the notorious 'messenger'. only time to enable anything is when there is a new service pack, forget name of prog, and when it does "it's thing", block it again. most hackers that get into an oos, do so because of the progs that are set to monitor incoming traffic. if _all_ oos progs are blocked, there is relative nothing that can happen, because... norton internet security can also be set up to only respond to traffic that has been originated from oos. so, therefore, i recommend and install symantec/norton. of all the oos systems that i have installed symantec/norton, all are still running and connecting to internet. none have been broken into. along with symantec/norton, i install mozilla firefox and thunderbird. my most recent oos setup with symantec/norton and mozilla, is with an hp that had xp installed. it is running as a dual boot with _centos_ as 'default' and _oos_ as second choice. and, yes, i changed label from 'other' to 'oos'. ;-) <> It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software > that can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some > anti-virus vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for > an out-of-date XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. > That's been the trend with even older versions of Windows. Some > do recognise that users are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever > reason (e.g. workplace computers might be un-upgradable). i agree 100% on that from experience with symantec/norton and some w98 boxes. one of which is still running w95 because there is a special program on it that is needed and authors have gone out of business. they still connect to internet, are on a local network that has boxes with w2k and w7 and everything is fine. If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. > Use other, safer, browsers for the www. +1. mozilla firefox and thunderbird. But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having > XP isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going > to have to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the latest version that can be installed on the hardware, > then install it. Though you may have something so old that it can't > support newer releases. about 15 or so years ago, i installed w98b on a laptop that was no longer supported by oem. problem with install of w98 was that w98b did not have drivers for some of the 'custom' hardware. solution was to pull drivers from w98-1 cd and manually install them. worked great. <<>> > If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, > you can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, +1 There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, > at least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other > things its out-of-date with. "about this computer" _should_ show info. if updating is needed, be sure that system has a good internet security program running and is updated. in fact, updating of security program should be done before any attempt to run sp updates. cyoa. But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. i also, except for those willing to dual boot with linux until they can ween themselves from oos. and then it is with agreement that oos is used for games only and it does not connect to internet. :-) I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems >> on the second partition but am worried that on installing it may overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc useless, <<>> such will not happen. that is unless system is already hacked and there is something on it that check new progs and boot sector. <> Yes, it takes over the MBR, but the grub bootloader takes care of booting up Linux or Windows, so that doesn't really matter. this is most true. It might be
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On 2/12/2014 2:34 AM, Roger wrote: Dell 1520 laptop which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. As many have said windows xp eol is taking place in two months, and the laptop probably may require more ram to be added so it can be upgraded to either windows 7 or windows 8.1(if compatible). I think removing xp completely and installing a linux distro is a safer choice Here is a nice read: Microsoft's Tim Rains explaining in his blog the risks of running windows xp with no support. http://blogs.technet.com/b/security/archive/2013/08/15/the-risk-of-running-windows-xp-after-support-ends.aspx -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
By chance does she live somewhere with a local linux users group or computer club? Where I live there is a local community center where people can bring their computer once a month and have their problems sorted. Maybe have a hunt around and see if there is something similar? Goodluck, William On 13/02/2014 10:07 AM, "eoconno...@gmail.com" wrote: > YesI'm sorry but the original poster mentioned > UbuntupersonallyI would install Fedorabut I'm just giving > feedback.sorry! > > - Reply message - > From: "Pete Travis" > To: "Community support for Fedora users" > Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd > Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 12:41 pm > > > > On Feb 12, 2014 9:37 AM, "eoconno...@gmail.com" > wrote: > > > > I would just tell her to backup all her data that she wants saved to an > external device.then do a clean install of Ubuntu...and then she can > transfer her data back. ditch WinXP altogether.makes for an easier > time when its time to support it remotely. > > > > > > Hi, do you realize this is a Fedora list? > > > - Reply message - > > From: "Tim" > > To: > > Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd > > Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 9:40 am > > > > > > Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: > > > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > > > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. > > > > As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe to > > use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe when XP > > was being supported, anyway... > > > > Seen it fubared within seconds of going on-line, even saw it pop up a > > warning about being fubarred, but did nothing to prevent it, nor would > > anything succeed in unfubarring it. Needed a reinstall. How I laughed > > when I watched my friend go through that three times in a row, on one > > night. > > > > It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software that > > can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows > > XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some anti-virus > > vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for an out-of-date > > XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. That's been the > > trend with even older versions of Windows. Some do recognise that users > > are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever reason (e.g. workplace > > computers might be un-upgradable). > > > > If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows > > updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and > > that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop > > using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. Use > > other, safer, browsers for the www. > > > > But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having XP > > isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going to have > > to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the > > latest version that can be installed on the hardware, then install it. > > Though you may have something so old that it can't support newer > > releases. > > > > > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out > > > as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding > > > out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. > > > > If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, you > > can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, rather > > than play the telephone support game. Alternatively, have the thing > > posted to you, sort it out, then send it back. > > > > There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the > > "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, at > > least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other things > > its out-of-date with. > > > > But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. I tell them > > that I don't use it anymore, I'm not up to date with its foibles, and > > it'll take me much longer to sort it out than taking it to a computer > > shop. It's saved me no end of grief. > > > > > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on > > > the second partition but am worried that on installing it may > > > over
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
YesI'm sorry but the original poster mentioned UbuntupersonallyI would install Fedorabut I'm just giving feedback.sorry! - Reply message - From: "Pete Travis" To: "Community support for Fedora users" Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 12:41 pm On Feb 12, 2014 9:37 AM, "eoconno...@gmail.com" wrote: > > I would just tell her to backup all her data that she wants saved to an > external device.then do a clean install of Ubuntu...and then she can > transfer her data back. ditch WinXP altogether.makes for an easier > time when its time to support it remotely. > > Hi, do you realize this is a Fedora list? > - Reply message - > From: "Tim" > To: > Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd > Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 9:40 am > > > Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: > > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. > > As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe to > use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe when XP > was being supported, anyway... > > Seen it fubared within seconds of going on-line, even saw it pop up a > warning about being fubarred, but did nothing to prevent it, nor would > anything succeed in unfubarring it. Needed a reinstall. How I laughed > when I watched my friend go through that three times in a row, on one > night. > > It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software that > can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows > XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some anti-virus > vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for an out-of-date > XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. That's been the > trend with even older versions of Windows. Some do recognise that users > are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever reason (e.g. workplace > computers might be un-upgradable). > > If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows > updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and > that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop > using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. Use > other, safer, browsers for the www. > > But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having XP > isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going to have > to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the > latest version that can be installed on the hardware, then install it. > Though you may have something so old that it can't support newer > releases. > > > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out > > as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding > > out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. > > If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, you > can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, rather > than play the telephone support game. Alternatively, have the thing > posted to you, sort it out, then send it back. > > There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the > "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, at > least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other things > its out-of-date with. > > But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. I tell them > that I don't use it anymore, I'm not up to date with its foibles, and > it'll take me much longer to sort it out than taking it to a computer > shop. It's saved me no end of grief. > > > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on > > the second partition but am worried that on installing it may > > overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc > > useless, particularly Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able > > to reinstall windows without me spending a day on the phone. I no > > longer have the stamina for epic phone calls. > > I know that feeling. I had one friend who would have something go wrong > with his computer, then get stupidly drunk before phoning me for help. > It was hard enough, normally, but that made it extremely painful. > > The last few times that I've installed Linux (including recent/current > Fedora) on a machine with Windows already on it, it has sorted itself > out, and the boot menu lets you
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Feb 12, 2014, at 11:14 AM, "Powell, Michael" wrote: > Why did you insist that a computer illiterate person dual boot? One OS is > enough to deal with, why would you trouble her with two? I agree. > Continue updating Windows XP via Windows Update until everything has been > installed, and once done, try updating McAfee again. I also agree that the first, and least path of resistance, is to get XP safer by ensuring it's updated. And this buys some time for actual budgeting and migration planning, until April anyway. No plan should include XP after even Microsoft has washed their hands of it. The dual boot plan is risky. But I might be convinced it's workable if the existing XP setup is properly backed up, then fully updated; and the Linux install is to test the waters, familiarization and training. If it's the right direction, by April the plan needs to be the obliteration of XP. And that means obliterating and reinstalling whatever Linux is present and restoring user data. So… that's a lot to chew off. She's almost certainly better off with a Windows 7 upgrade and leaving well enough alone unless she initiates a preference to move away from that experience. Chris Murphy -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Feb 12, 2014, at 3:34 AM, Roger wrote: > I understand how to get linux to clean install on the second partition and I > think I remember about how to use it's own boot record not the MBR but have > no idea how she would access linux with windows on the first partition. If she installs Fedora, and likely also Ubuntu, at boot time there's a grub menu presented and it will have one or more Linux options and one Windows option. > I would prefer to make Linux the default boot option without overwriting her > MBR. Not possible. > I think this can be done as a bios option as I do on my desktop pc. Your BIOS lets you choose partitions to boot from? That's not a given. Most BIOS don't recognize partitions, they only let you choose between drives. > I think the best linux option would be ubuntu 12.04LTS so she doesn't have to > update the OS. Well I'd refuse that premise from the outset. For one, we don't know her workflow or budget or her interest in becoming significantly more computer literate than she is now. I'd say complete migration away from Windows XP is mandatory. Migrating to Windows 7 alone is a superior option to dual booting Linux and XP. Enabling her to keep XP is simply bad advice so don't do that. The only way it's going to be semi-safe to use XP in several months is when disconnected from the internet. Other options include migrating to a tablet if her needs are fairly sparse and infrequent, to maybe a Chromebook if there a bit more sophisticated like needing to write basic documents or is a moderate to prolific emailer. If the workflow requires more capable applications then I'd say she needs a user group or someone to be her IT staff - that comes first, and whoever does that determines what the OS is not the other way around. Chris Murphy -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
RE: Installing Linux on a windows hd
> A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop which when > new, Dell required it have xp installed. I insisted at the time that the hd > have > 2 partitions as I intended to install either Fedora or Ubuntu but that was > years ago and I had forgotten all about it till today. Why did you insist that a computer illiterate person dual boot? One OS is enough to deal with, why would you trouble her with two? > Macafee insists on updating but will not do so until she updates explorer > which she never uses and knows nothing about. I have no idea about > updating explorer either, never used it. I've googled but my google produces > different results to her google search so I can't tell her to click on this > or that > option. > > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out as all > contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding out, me neither, > and she lives some 120 km away. McAfee likely needs a certain service pack or system update to continue. I would recommend that you instruct her to press the following keyboard shortcut at the Windows desktop: windows + Pause. If she has trouble finding the windows key / pause key, ask her to right-click 'My Computer' and select 'Properties'. This will open the System Properties dialog and it should say what version of Windows XP she has along with any service packs. Windows XP SP3 (large download): http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=24 Once Service Pack 3 has been verified or has been installed, instruct her to further update Windows XP to the latest via Windows Update (Start menu->Windows update). If Windows Update has trouble starting, it may indicate that Internet Explorer needs to be updated first. Internet Explorer 8 (large download): http://www.microsoft.com/en-in/download/internet-explorer-8-details.aspx Continue updating Windows XP via Windows Update until everything has been installed, and once done, try updating McAfee again. > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on the > second partition but am worried that on installing it may overwrite the > windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc useless, particularly > Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able to reinstall windows without > me spending a day on the phone. I no longer have the stamina for epic > phone calls. To dual boot Windows and Linux, the recommended method is to always install Windows then Linux. The good news is that Windows XP is already installed. The bad news is that Windows XP is likely using the entire partition, and you'll have to step her through reducing the primary partition in order to create a secondary partition before installing Linux. Are you sure this is what's best for her? > This person has no confidence with computers. Over the years I have talked > her through windows problems but now I am lost as to how to tackle this > one. > > I understand how to get linux to clean install on the second partition and I > think I remember about how to use it's own boot record not the MBR but > have no idea how she would access linux with windows on the first partition. > I would prefer to make Linux the default boot option without overwriting her > MBR. I think this can be done as a bios option as I do on my desktop pc. > I think the best linux option would be ubuntu 12.04LTS so she doesn't have to > update the OS. > Can someone direct me on the best approach for this as I would have to set > aside 3-4 hours on the phone to walk her through a basic install before the > file system updates, which can also take hours. > > Help is most gratefully appreciated. > Thanks in advance > Roger Whether provoked or not, the computer literate tend to push their methods onto the computer illiterate. The issue with doing so is that the computer illiterate are then forced into dependency. There's potentially nothing wrong with this if there's a business involved, but for the occasional friendly PC repair over the phone, it's best to do what is right for the computer illiterate. For that reason alone, I recommend that you stop pushing Linux and do either of the following: 1. Spend some time investigating PC repair places in her area over the phone. Try to develop a rapport with a computer technician that you can then direct your friend to so that she will receive friendly, in-person, service instead of just being another customer. You can pay her bill or even tip the computer technician so that he goes above and beyond. 2. Buy her Windows 7 and spend your time helping to back-up her data and installing (format) Windows 7. 3. Buy her a new machine with a newer version of Windows and help transfer her data. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: h
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Feb 12, 2014 9:37 AM, "eoconno...@gmail.com" wrote: > > I would just tell her to backup all her data that she wants saved to an external device.then do a clean install of Ubuntu...and then she can transfer her data back. ditch WinXP altogether.makes for an easier time when its time to support it remotely. > > Hi, do you realize this is a Fedora list? > - Reply message - > From: "Tim" > To: > Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd > Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 9:40 am > > > Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: > > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. > > As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe to > use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe when XP > was being supported, anyway... > > Seen it fubared within seconds of going on-line, even saw it pop up a > warning about being fubarred, but did nothing to prevent it, nor would > anything succeed in unfubarring it. Needed a reinstall. How I laughed > when I watched my friend go through that three times in a row, on one > night. > > It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software that > can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows > XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some anti-virus > vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for an out-of-date > XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. That's been the > trend with even older versions of Windows. Some do recognise that users > are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever reason (e.g. workplace > computers might be un-upgradable). > > If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows > updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and > that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop > using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. Use > other, safer, browsers for the www. > > But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having XP > isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going to have > to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the > latest version that can be installed on the hardware, then install it. > Though you may have something so old that it can't support newer > releases. > > > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out > > as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding > > out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. > > If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, you > can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, rather > than play the telephone support game. Alternatively, have the thing > posted to you, sort it out, then send it back. > > There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the > "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, at > least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other things > its out-of-date with. > > But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. I tell them > that I don't use it anymore, I'm not up to date with its foibles, and > it'll take me much longer to sort it out than taking it to a computer > shop. It's saved me no end of grief. > > > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on > > the second partition but am worried that on installing it may > > overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc > > useless, particularly Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able > > to reinstall windows without me spending a day on the phone. I no > > longer have the stamina for epic phone calls. > > I know that feeling. I had one friend who would have something go wrong > with his computer, then get stupidly drunk before phoning me for help. > It was hard enough, normally, but that made it extremely painful. > > The last few times that I've installed Linux (including recent/current > Fedora) on a machine with Windows already on it, it has sorted itself > out, and the boot menu lets you pick whether to boot Linux or Windows. > Depending on which distro was installed, Windows may actually appear as > Windows in the menu, or simply be referred to as "Other." And Linux is > usually the default boot option. > > Yes, it takes over the MBR, but the grub bootloader takes care of > booting up Linux or Windows, so that doesn't really matter. > > It might be worth you trying out d
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
I would just tell her to backup all her data that she wants saved to an external device.then do a clean install of Ubuntu...and then she can transfer her data back. ditch WinXP altogether.makes for an easier time when its time to support it remotely. - Reply message - From: "Tim" To: Subject: Installing Linux on a windows hd Date: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 9:40 am Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe to use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe when XP was being supported, anyway... Seen it fubared within seconds of going on-line, even saw it pop up a warning about being fubarred, but did nothing to prevent it, nor would anything succeed in unfubarring it. Needed a reinstall. How I laughed when I watched my friend go through that three times in a row, on one night. It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software that can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some anti-virus vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for an out-of-date XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. That's been the trend with even older versions of Windows. Some do recognise that users are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever reason (e.g. workplace computers might be un-upgradable). If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. Use other, safer, browsers for the www. But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having XP isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going to have to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the latest version that can be installed on the hardware, then install it. Though you may have something so old that it can't support newer releases. > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out > as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding > out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, you can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, rather than play the telephone support game. Alternatively, have the thing posted to you, sort it out, then send it back. There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, at least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other things its out-of-date with. But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. I tell them that I don't use it anymore, I'm not up to date with its foibles, and it'll take me much longer to sort it out than taking it to a computer shop. It's saved me no end of grief. > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on > the second partition but am worried that on installing it may > overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc > useless, particularly Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able > to reinstall windows without me spending a day on the phone. I no > longer have the stamina for epic phone calls. I know that feeling. I had one friend who would have something go wrong with his computer, then get stupidly drunk before phoning me for help. It was hard enough, normally, but that made it extremely painful. The last few times that I've installed Linux (including recent/current Fedora) on a machine with Windows already on it, it has sorted itself out, and the boot menu lets you pick whether to boot Linux or Windows. Depending on which distro was installed, Windows may actually appear as Windows in the menu, or simply be referred to as "Other." And Linux is usually the default boot option. Yes, it takes over the MBR, but the grub bootloader takes care of booting up Linux or Windows, so that doesn't really matter. It might be worth you trying out doing a multi-boot install at your own end, to familiarise yourself with it. It doesn't have to be a Linux/Windows dual-boot, if you don't have a Windows install to play with. Make it two different Linux installations. > This person has no confidence with computers. Over the years I have > talked her through windows problems but now I am lost as to how to > tackle this one. Explain carefully and strongly that XP will not be supported within about a month, that they really need to abandon it. > I
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
Allegedly, on or about 12 February 2014, Roger sent: > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. As has already been said, XP support dies very soon. It's not safe to use XP on the net after then. It was never particularly safe when XP was being supported, anyway... Seen it fubared within seconds of going on-line, even saw it pop up a warning about being fubarred, but did nothing to prevent it, nor would anything succeed in unfubarring it. Needed a reinstall. How I laughed when I watched my friend go through that three times in a row, on one night. It's not just XP, itself, that becomes unsupported. It software that can be run on XP, as *those* other coders abandon the abandoned Windows XP over time. Though it's probably quite likely that some anti-virus vendors will continue to produce anti-virus software for an out-of-date XP for some time, long after Microsoft abandons XP. That's been the trend with even older versions of Windows. Some do recognise that users are stuck with using old OSs, for whatever reason (e.g. workplace computers might be un-upgradable). If they are going to continue using XP, go through all the Windows updates, now, let it update all the bug fixes that can be done, and that'll take care of internet explorer, at the same time. Then stop using internet explorer, except for browsing the Microsoft site. Use other, safer, browsers for the www. But it's not new, now, is it? So the Dell *requirement* of having XP isn't really so concrete, and that requirement is surely going to have to change when XP is killed. If they must use Windows, find out the latest version that can be installed on the hardware, then install it. Though you may have something so old that it can't support newer releases. > I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out > as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding > out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. If you feel so inclined, and both of your internet is fast enough, you can take remote control of her PC, and fix it for her yourself, rather than play the telephone support game. Alternatively, have the thing posted to you, sort it out, then send it back. There are tools that give you summaries of the installation, and the "about this computer" option can reveal the service pack installed, at least. You'd need to try Windows update to see how many other things its out-of-date with. But I abandoned helping friends with Windows, long ago. I tell them that I don't use it anymore, I'm not up to date with its foibles, and it'll take me much longer to sort it out than taking it to a computer shop. It's saved me no end of grief. > I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on > the second partition but am worried that on installing it may > overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc > useless, particularly Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able > to reinstall windows without me spending a day on the phone. I no > longer have the stamina for epic phone calls. I know that feeling. I had one friend who would have something go wrong with his computer, then get stupidly drunk before phoning me for help. It was hard enough, normally, but that made it extremely painful. The last few times that I've installed Linux (including recent/current Fedora) on a machine with Windows already on it, it has sorted itself out, and the boot menu lets you pick whether to boot Linux or Windows. Depending on which distro was installed, Windows may actually appear as Windows in the menu, or simply be referred to as "Other." And Linux is usually the default boot option. Yes, it takes over the MBR, but the grub bootloader takes care of booting up Linux or Windows, so that doesn't really matter. It might be worth you trying out doing a multi-boot install at your own end, to familiarise yourself with it. It doesn't have to be a Linux/Windows dual-boot, if you don't have a Windows install to play with. Make it two different Linux installations. > This person has no confidence with computers. Over the years I have > talked her through windows problems but now I am lost as to how to > tackle this one. Explain carefully and strongly that XP will not be supported within about a month, that they really need to abandon it. > I think the best linux option would be ubuntu 12.04LTS so she doesn't > have to update the OS. Could be... Or CentOS, if you're more familiar with solving problems similar to Fedora, than dealing with Ubuntu issues. > I would have to set aside 3-4 hours on the phone to walk her through a > basic install before the file system updates, which can also take > hours. I know your pain. But a clean Linux install shouldn't take that long. Only an update-install, which is based on what was previously installed (and has to churn through assessing it and all the
Re: Installing Linux on a windows hd
On Wed, 12 Feb 2014 21:34:55 +1100 Roger wrote: > A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop > which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. XP will be EOL on April 8th 2014 http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/enterprise/endofsupport.aspx Tell her not to use it when connected to internet. She will get fubared as her McAffee will also not be updated. Just be honest tell her she (may) need to possibly get new kit to works with Win7 http://windows.microsoft.com/en-IE/windows/downloads/upgrade-advisor After that immaterial what Linux you use. ___ Regards Frank frankly3d.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Installing Linux on a windows hd
A friend who is not computer literate at all has a Dell 1520 laptop which when new, Dell required it have xp installed. I insisted at the time that the hd have 2 partitions as I intended to install either Fedora or Ubuntu but that was years ago and I had forgotten all about it till today. Macafee insists on updating but will not do so until she updates explorer which she never uses and knows nothing about. I have no idea about updating explorer either, never used it. I've googled but my google produces different results to her google search so I can't tell her to click on this or that option. I do not know if her xp is sp1, 2 or 3 and have no way of finding out as all contact is by phone, she doesn't have a clue about finding out, me neither, and she lives some 120 km away. I would like to run her through installing one of the Linux systems on the second partition but am worried that on installing it may overwrite the windows MBR making her windows files, folders, etc useless, particularly Thunderbird and Firefox. She would not be able to reinstall windows without me spending a day on the phone. I no longer have the stamina for epic phone calls. This person has no confidence with computers. Over the years I have talked her through windows problems but now I am lost as to how to tackle this one. I understand how to get linux to clean install on the second partition and I think I remember about how to use it's own boot record not the MBR but have no idea how she would access linux with windows on the first partition. I would prefer to make Linux the default boot option without overwriting her MBR. I think this can be done as a bios option as I do on my desktop pc. I think the best linux option would be ubuntu 12.04LTS so she doesn't have to update the OS. Can someone direct me on the best approach for this as I would have to set aside 3-4 hours on the phone to walk her through a basic install before the file system updates, which can also take hours. Help is most gratefully appreciated. Thanks in advance Roger -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
