Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Tim]

On Fri, 2016-08-12 at 18:03 -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> Love it!!  First three responses are:
>  
>  1. Yes, designed to work that way
>  2. Not recommended
>  3. Better do a fresh install

What's wrong with that?  It contains all the answers that different
people want to hear.  ;-)

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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Chris Murphy]

On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Jon LaBadie  wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 02:59:49PM -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:
>> Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.
>>
>> Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
>> release ist verboten. :(
>>
> Love it!!  First three responses are:
>
>  1. Yes, designed to work that way
>  2. Not recommended
>  3. Better do a fresh install
>
> :)

Well you could read mine as "upgrade should work, but might have a
rough edge here and there". The upgrade process is tested as part of
release criteria, and if it doesn't work it is release blocking. But
there's always a need for more testing of such things to find the edge
cases. And the difficulty there is most of that testing is done on
cleanly installed n-1 version. Not as much testing happens on aged n-1
systems before running the n version upgrade.

A conservative approach would be to tar up /boot and then snapshot the
'fedora-root' LV before doing the upgrade (or for Btrfs users tar
/boot and then snapshot the 'root' subvolume). I guess the drawback is
conventional LVM snapshots is that they are tedious to use: you have
to have free space in the VG already, which is not a Fedora
installation default, so that the CoW changes to the original volume
during the upgrade have somewhere to go, it's slow, and you have to
commit or reject changes at some point which is also confusing (to me
anyway). LVM thinp snapshots and Btrfs snapshots are way easier to
work with, with LVM thinp LV's totally obviating any future need to
shrink a file system as well - just fstrim it and any unused logical
extents are returned to the VG for reallocation to any other LV.

Or the conservative conventional approach is to back it all up and be
prepared to restore it if it goes badly.

So I'd say I'm closer to opinion 1 than opinion 2.


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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Temlakos]

On 08/12/2016 07:51 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 08/12/2016 03:40 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:

On 08/12/2016 03:03 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 02:59:49PM -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:

Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.

Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
release ist verboten. :(


Love it!!  First three responses are:

 1. Yes, designed to work that way
 2. Not recommended
 3. Better do a fresh install

:)


I think the real concensus is "F22->F24 is probably doable, but not
recommended". The safest way is to back up and do a fresh install.
The next best bet is to:

F22->F23
"dnf --refresh upgrade"
F23->F24

I haven't used the dnf upgrade mechanism to skip a release, but the
old fedup often times had issues doing that. Hence my reticence to
recommend it.


fedup (dnf system-upgrade) is supposed to handle that now.
--


How odd. I did a straight F22->F24 upgrade using dnf's direct commands. 
In fact, I /tried/ to go F22->F23 at first. And the network wouldn't let me.


The only problems I had:

1. The graphical interface not loading by default. One of you told me 
how to fix that.


2. A command called "systraycmd" not found when I tried to load a very 
old executable--goes back to F10--in fact it's the old pwmanager program.


If anyone can help repair /that/, I'd appreciate it.

Temlakos
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Samuel Sieb]

On 08/12/2016 03:40 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:

On 08/12/2016 03:03 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 02:59:49PM -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:

Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.

Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
release ist verboten. :(


Love it!!  First three responses are:

 1. Yes, designed to work that way
 2. Not recommended
 3. Better do a fresh install

:)


I think the real concensus is "F22->F24 is probably doable, but not
recommended". The safest way is to back up and do a fresh install.
The next best bet is to:

F22->F23
"dnf --refresh upgrade"
F23->F24

I haven't used the dnf upgrade mechanism to skip a release, but the
old fedup often times had issues doing that. Hence my reticence to
recommend it.


fedup (dnf system-upgrade) is supposed to handle that now.
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Rick Stevens]

On 08/12/2016 03:03 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 02:59:49PM -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:
>> Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.
>>
>> Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
>> release ist verboten. :(
>>
> Love it!!  First three responses are:
> 
>  1. Yes, designed to work that way
>  2. Not recommended
>  3. Better do a fresh install
> 
> :)

I think the real concensus is "F22->F24 is probably doable, but not
recommended". The safest way is to back up and do a fresh install.
The next best bet is to:

F22->F23
"dnf --refresh upgrade"
F23->F24

I haven't used the dnf upgrade mechanism to skip a release, but the
old fedup often times had issues doing that. Hence my reticence to
recommend it.
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Jon LaBadie]

On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 02:59:49PM -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.
> 
> Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
> release ist verboten. :(
> 
Love it!!  First three responses are:

 1. Yes, designed to work that way
 2. Not recommended
 3. Better do a fresh install

:)
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Chris Murphy]

Upgrades are ultimately non-deterministic, for all sorts of reasons,
so at some point it makes more sense to just clean install and suffer
redoing customizations.


Chris Murphy
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Rick Stevens]

On 08/12/2016 11:59 AM, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.
> 
> Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
> release ist verboten. :(

I don't think it's verboten, but it's not a great idea. Ideally you'd
upgrade to F23, do a full-boat update, then move on to F24.
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Re: F22 -> F23 -> F24 ?

[Samuel Sieb]

On 08/12/2016 11:59 AM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

Planning on taking my F22 desktop to F24 soon.

Just want to confirm that trying to skip a
release ist verboten. :(

I believe that with F24 it was intended that going from F22 to F24 
should work.

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