Re: SATA AHCI RAID Hot Swapping

[Gordon Messmer]

On 08/06/2016 09:40 AM, Philip Rhoades wrote:
It appears I should enable the AHCI option for RAID functionality 
(even if I only have a single boot drive installed) and then that will 
allow hot swapping.



What mode is it set to now?  AHCI is typically the default.
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SATA AHCI RAID Hot Swapping

[Philip Rhoades]

People,

I have this motherboard:

  http://www.asus.com/au/Motherboards/Z97AUSB_31

I boot Fedora 24 x86_64 from a single SATA Linux drive in one of four 
hot-swap bays but I occasionally want to look at old backup drives 
without shutting down the computer, inserting or extracting the drive 
and starting up the computer again.  It appears I should enable the AHCI 
option for RAID functionality (even if I only have a single boot drive 
installed) and then that will allow hot swapping.  My concern is the 
warning message I get about turning on AHCI when I start to make the 
change in BIOS - about the possibility of destroying my boot disk! - 
does anyone know about this stuff?


  dmesg | grep ahci

gives this:

[0.343128] ahci :00:1f.2: version 3.0
[0.343211] ahci :00:1f.2: AHCI 0001.0300 32 slots 6 ports 6 Gbps 
0x1 impl SATA mode
[0.343228] ahci :00:1f.2: flags: 64bit ncq led clo pio slum part 
ems apst

[0.343606] scsi host0: ahci
[0.343703] scsi host1: ahci
[0.344391] scsi host2: ahci
[0.345073] scsi host3: ahci
[0.345752] scsi host4: ahci
[0.346433] scsi host5: ahci

so the drivers are already being loaded without the BIOS being 
configured for AHCI?  From a lot of Googling, it appears that most 
people are turning on AHCI for a RAID setup - but that doesn't apply to 
me . .


Thanks,

Phil.

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Philip Rhoades

PO Box 896
Cowra  NSW  2794
Australia
E-mail:  p...@pricom.com.au
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

OK,

Thank.
flash-plugin-11.2.202.442-release.i386 was installed.
I remove to install flash-plugin-11.2.202.442-release.x86_64

Wait and see.

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 at 2:01 PM
> From: "Daniel J Walsh" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> 
> On 02/17/2015 02:16 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:
> > It is very long.
> > Just the end.
> >
> >
> > time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> > type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.864:452969): 
> > proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> > type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.864:452969): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> > success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25724 
> > auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> > sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> > subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> > type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.864:452969): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> > pid=25724 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> > dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> > scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> > tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> > 
> > time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> > type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.864:452970): 
> > proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> > type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.864:452970): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> > success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25724 
> > auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> > sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> > subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> > type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.864:452970): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> > pid=25724 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> > dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> > scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> > tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> > 
> > time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> > type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.915:452971): 
> > proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> > type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.915:452971): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> > success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25730 
> > auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> > sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> > subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> > type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.915:452971): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> > pid=25730 comm="plugin-containe" 
> > path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> > dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> > scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> > tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> > 
> > time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> > type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.915:452972): 
> >

Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

zilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> 
> time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.977:452973): 
> proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.977:452973): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25734 
> auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.977:452973): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> pid=25734 comm="plugin-containe" 
> path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> 
> time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
> type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): 
> proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25734 
> auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> pid=25734 comm="plugin-containe" 
> path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
> 
> time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:09 2015
> type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): 
> proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
> type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): arch=c03e syscall=9 
> success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25739 
> auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 
> sgid=1000 fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
> exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
> subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
> type=AVC msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
> pid=25739 comm="plugin-containe" 
> path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
> dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
> scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
> tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0
>
> ===
>  Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
>  Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
>  Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
>  Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
>  189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
> ===
>
>
>> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 at 7:21 PM
>> From: "Chris Murphy" 
>> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
>> Subject: Re: swapping
>>
>> ausearch -m AVC
>> -- 
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>> Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
>>
Is that the standard location for these files?

Here is where flash is installed on my box.

/usr/lib64/flash-plugin/libflashplayer.so
/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins/libflashplayer.so

The problem is we are not allowing plugins to write and execute in the
same directory.

You can either see about moving this file or just adding a custom policy
module.

# grep flash /var/log/audit/audit.log | audit2allow -m myflash
# semodule -i myflash.pp

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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

nconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
type=AVC msg=audit(1424177091.104:502416): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
pid=32631 comm="plugin-containe" 
path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0

time->Tue Feb 17 13:44:49 2015
type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424177089.438:502399): 
proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424177089.438:502399): arch=c03e syscall=9 
success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=32592 
auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 sgid=1000 
fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
type=AVC msg=audit(1424177089.438:502399): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
pid=32592 comm="plugin-containe" 
path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0


===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 at 2:28 PM
> From: "Daniel J Walsh" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> 
> On 02/12/2015 06:42 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > I did both. Unfortunately, sometimes, like today I have to kill 
> > the setroubleshootd process all the times without much success at the end!
> >
> > Any suggestion?
> >
> > ===
> >  Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
> >  Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
> >  Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
> >  Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
> >  189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
> > ===
> >
> >
> >> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 at 4:24 AM
> >> From: "Michael Cronenworth" 
> >> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> >> Subject: Re: swapping
> >>
> >> On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> >>> Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.
> >>>
> >>> touch /.autorelabel; reboot
> >>>
> >>> Will fix the labels, or you could just do
> >>>
> >>> restorecon -R /
> >> Except that is not the case in this instance.
> >> -- 
> >> users mailing list
> >> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> >> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
> >> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
> >> Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
> >> Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> >> Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
> >>
> Could you attach the current list of AVC's you are receiving?
> -- 
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

6C696236342F666972
type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.977:452973): arch=c03e syscall=9 
success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25734 
auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 sgid=1000 
fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.977:452973): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
pid=25734 comm="plugin-containe" 
path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0

time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:08 2015
type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): 
proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): arch=c03e syscall=9 
success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25734 
auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 sgid=1000 
fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
type=AVC msg=audit(1424168108.977:452974): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
pid=25734 comm="plugin-containe" 
path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0

time->Tue Feb 17 11:15:09 2015
type=PROCTITLE msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): 
proctitle=2F7573722F6C696236342F66697265666F782F706C7567696E2D636F6E7461696E6572002F7573722F6C696236342F6D6F7A696C6C612F706C7567696E732D777261707065642F6E73777261707065725F33325F36342E6C6962666C617368706C617965722E736F002D6772656F6D6E69002F7573722F6C696236342F666972
type=SYSCALL msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): arch=c03e syscall=9 
success=no exit=-13 a0=0 a1=223800 a2=5 a3=802 items=0 ppid=16828 pid=25739 
auid=1000 uid=1000 gid=1000 euid=1000 suid=1000 fsuid=1000 egid=1000 sgid=1000 
fsgid=1000 tty=(none) ses=916 comm="plugin-containe" 
exe="/usr/lib64/firefox/plugin-container" 
subj=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 key=(null)
type=AVC msg=audit(1424168109.059:452975): avc:  denied  { execute } for  
pid=25739 comm="plugin-containe" 
path="/usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins-wrapped/nswrapper_32_64.libflashplayer.so" 
dev="dm-0" ino=241943 
scontext=unconfined_u:unconfined_r:mozilla_plugin_t:s0-s0:c0.c1023 
tcontext=system_u:object_r:mozilla_plugin_rw_t:s0 tclass=file permissive=0

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 at 7:21 PM
> From: "Chris Murphy" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> ausearch -m AVC
> -- 
> users mailing list
> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Re: swapping

[Chris Murphy]

ausearch -m AVC
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

Hello,

As I said in another message,
The issue may not be due to seltroubleshhoting but to firefox!
I can get 20 firefox processes running requiring 5% of Mem each
and filling the 8Go of mem.

How can I get the list of AVC's?

Thank.

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 at 2:28 PM
> From: "Daniel J Walsh" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> 
> On 02/12/2015 06:42 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > I did both. Unfortunately, sometimes, like today I have to kill 
> > the setroubleshootd process all the times without much success at the end!
> >
> > Any suggestion?
> >
> > ===
> >  Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
> >  Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
> >  Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
> >  Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
> >  189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
> > ===
> >
> >
> >> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 at 4:24 AM
> >> From: "Michael Cronenworth" 
> >> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> >> Subject: Re: swapping
> >>
> >> On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> >>> Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.
> >>>
> >>> touch /.autorelabel; reboot
> >>>
> >>> Will fix the labels, or you could just do
> >>>
> >>> restorecon -R /
> >> Except that is not the case in this instance.
> >> -- 
> >> users mailing list
> >> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> >> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
> >> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
> >> Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
> >> Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> >> Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
> >>
> Could you attach the current list of AVC's you are receiving?
> -- 
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> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

On 02/12/2015 06:42 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I did both. Unfortunately, sometimes, like today I have to kill 
> the setroubleshootd process all the times without much success at the end!
>
> Any suggestion?
>
> ===
>  Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
>  Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
>  Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
>  Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
>  189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
> ===
>
>
>> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 at 4:24 AM
>> From: "Michael Cronenworth" 
>> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
>> Subject: Re: swapping
>>
>> On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
>>> Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.
>>>
>>> touch /.autorelabel; reboot
>>>
>>> Will fix the labels, or you could just do
>>>
>>> restorecon -R /
>> Except that is not the case in this instance.
>> -- 
>> users mailing list
>> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
>> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
>> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>> Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
>> Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
>> Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
>>
Could you attach the current list of AVC's you are receiving?
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swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

Hello,

I guess that the permanent swapping is not due to setroubleshooter
but ma Go of RAM and teh swapping is just increasing permanently
reaching 5Go
(20 firefox processes are running requiring 5% of Mem each)

How can I trouble shoot this permanent issue on this computer?

Thank.

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

Hello,

I did both. Unfortunately, sometimes, like today I have to kill 
the setroubleshootd process all the times without much success at the end!

Any suggestion?

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 at 4:24 AM
> From: "Michael Cronenworth" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> > Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.
> >
> > touch /.autorelabel; reboot
> >
> > Will fix the labels, or you could just do
> >
> > restorecon -R /
> 
> Except that is not the case in this instance.
> -- 
> users mailing list
> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

Hello,

I did both. Unfortunately, sometimes, like today I have to kill 
the setroubleshootd process all the time!


===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 at 4:24 AM
> From: "Michael Cronenworth" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> > Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.
> >
> > touch /.autorelabel; reboot
> >
> > Will fix the labels, or you could just do
> >
> > restorecon -R /
> 
> Except that is not the case in this instance.
> -- 
> users mailing list
> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
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>
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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Angelo Moreschini]

Hi,

[?]
I opened the computer with the new disk
and -this time- miraculously it started perfectly.

It remains me, now, only the problem of the restore grub.

Amazing ... it need to have to have courage


Thanks for your interest

Angelo

On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 11:55 AM, Chris Murphy 
wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 1:14 AM, Angelo Moreschini
>  wrote:
> > However trying to restore on a different (new and virgin) Hard Disk, the
> > operation fails.
>
> That's not specific enough. There are probably hundreds or even
> thousands of reasons for failure. Exactly how does it fail?
> >
> >
> > When I I restore on a virgin HD the computer (after the grub message to
> > choose the OS), loads fedora only in recovery mode 
>
> OK when you say the restore operation fails, that suggests the restore
> operation did not complete. Now you're suggesting the restore
> completed, but the computer boots in recovery mode.
>
> Please take a photo of the screen when the computer is in this
> recovery mode. It sounds like it's not arriving at basic.target, and
> there are a bunch of reasons for that, but usually with software
> restore this is because /etc/fstab UUID doesn't match the actual
> volume UUID. But that's really basic, I'd think Clonezilla would know
> that if it's doing file copy cloning. And it wouldn't be necessary
> with block level cloning.
>
> So in any case we need more info.
>
> >
> > It is possible to restore the clone on any (different) HD or it is
> possible
> > restore it only on the one HD from where the image was toke?
>
> The answer from Rick is that yes you can restore a clone to a
> different drive. But I can't tell exactly what you're doing step by
> step. So it might be useful to describe exactly how you created the
> clone, and then how you're doing the restore, literally a recipe so
> that someone who has never used clonezilla before could reproduce your
> results.
>
>
> >
> > if the restore can be done to any HD, ...how I can manage the change of
> > symbol attributed to HD?
>
> Since I don't know exactly why it's failing, I can't tell you what or
> how to fix it yet. It could be many things.
>
>
> --
> Chris Murphy
> --
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> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Chris Murphy]

On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 1:14 AM, Angelo Moreschini
 wrote:
> However trying to restore on a different (new and virgin) Hard Disk, the
> operation fails.

That's not specific enough. There are probably hundreds or even
thousands of reasons for failure. Exactly how does it fail?
>
>
> When I I restore on a virgin HD the computer (after the grub message to
> choose the OS), loads fedora only in recovery mode 

OK when you say the restore operation fails, that suggests the restore
operation did not complete. Now you're suggesting the restore
completed, but the computer boots in recovery mode.

Please take a photo of the screen when the computer is in this
recovery mode. It sounds like it's not arriving at basic.target, and
there are a bunch of reasons for that, but usually with software
restore this is because /etc/fstab UUID doesn't match the actual
volume UUID. But that's really basic, I'd think Clonezilla would know
that if it's doing file copy cloning. And it wouldn't be necessary
with block level cloning.

So in any case we need more info.

>
> It is possible to restore the clone on any (different) HD or it is possible
> restore it only on the one HD from where the image was toke?

The answer from Rick is that yes you can restore a clone to a
different drive. But I can't tell exactly what you're doing step by
step. So it might be useful to describe exactly how you created the
clone, and then how you're doing the restore, literally a recipe so
that someone who has never used clonezilla before could reproduce your
results.


>
> if the restore can be done to any HD, ...how I can manage the change of
> symbol attributed to HD?

Since I don't know exactly why it's failing, I can't tell you what or
how to fix it yet. It could be many things.


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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Angelo Moreschini]

thanks for your answers


 I explain better .

recently I started with Linux and, as a beginner, I made many mistakes that
forced me to reinstall many times, both fedora that all the SW already
installed.

That is the way I decided to “invest some time” with clonezilla in order to
prevent the possibility that these problems occurs again.


 Actually I made a clone with the image of the HD where is installed fedora
and now I am doing some tests in order to know very well how much this
clone is reliable and which are the possibilities that I can use it for
recovering my system ...

I took the image of the all HD (I used a new HD witjh 1 TB capacity).


 I know (for trying it) that with the clone I can perform good recovery
when I use it on the same disk from which the image was taken.
However trying to restore on a different (new and virgin) Hard Disk, the
operation fails.


 When I I restore on a virgin HD the computer (after the grub message to
choose the OS), loads fedora only in recovery mode 


 Having no experience, I can not be sure that the recovery from a clone can
be made on a new virgin HD .. and this is the reason why I posted this
question .

 I can say that when I connected (on the computer) the virgin HD with the
same cables that was connected the old HD it was detected with
different values:


/dev/sda if the original

/dev/sdc if the HD is the new (the virgin one)


 Could this be, perhaps, be the cause of the problem ... 



 Now I have two questions:

   -

   It is possible to restore the clone on any (different) HD or it is
   possible restore it only on the one HD from where the image was toke?

-

   if the restore can be done to any HD, ...how I can manage the change of
   symbol attributed to HD?



On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 11:35 PM, Chris Murphy 
wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 2:15 PM, Rick Stevens 
> wrote:
> > We do need more info other than "the clone operation failed". I have
> > cloned a large number of machines using Clonezilla using virgin drives
> > (CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu, Winblows). Many had the target drives larger
> > than the original. I will say that they all used fdisk-style partition
> > tables, though (no GPT tables).
>
> Yeah and it's a minor problem for the backup GPT to be in the wrong
> location, that alone wouldn't cause boot to fail unless the primary
> GPT were hosed somehow. The primary header points to the LBA of the
> backup header, which would still be valid if you had used something
> like dd or ddrescue. The problem is that if the primary header is
> hosed (missing, totally corrupt or checksum fails), a tool will assume
> the backup is at the end of the drive but won't find it there.
>
> Unless that tool is the kernel. Funny enough, the kernel itself right
> now doesn't fallback to the backup GPT if the primary one is corrupt.
> Instead boot fails. Not cool! [1]
>
>
> [1]
> mishandled corruption of primary GPT table, failure to boot
> https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=63591
>
> --
> Chris Murphy
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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Chris Murphy]

On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 2:15 PM, Rick Stevens  wrote:
> We do need more info other than "the clone operation failed". I have
> cloned a large number of machines using Clonezilla using virgin drives
> (CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu, Winblows). Many had the target drives larger
> than the original. I will say that they all used fdisk-style partition
> tables, though (no GPT tables).

Yeah and it's a minor problem for the backup GPT to be in the wrong
location, that alone wouldn't cause boot to fail unless the primary
GPT were hosed somehow. The primary header points to the LBA of the
backup header, which would still be valid if you had used something
like dd or ddrescue. The problem is that if the primary header is
hosed (missing, totally corrupt or checksum fails), a tool will assume
the backup is at the end of the drive but won't find it there.

Unless that tool is the kernel. Funny enough, the kernel itself right
now doesn't fallback to the backup GPT if the primary one is corrupt.
Instead boot fails. Not cool! [1]


[1]
mishandled corruption of primary GPT table, failure to boot
https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=63591

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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Rick Stevens]

On 01/21/2015 12:22 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

On Tue, Jan 20, 2015 at 11:40 PM, Angelo Moreschini
 wrote:

Hi,


I already used successfully clonezilla to backup my OS (fedora).

I did this (only for exercise til now) restoring the OS on the original disk
from which I had take the clone.

Now I wanted to use my clone to restore fedora on a virgin HD. (for security
reasons, I did not want restore the clone on the disk with the OS which I
use currently).

In this case, however, the operation failed.


The clone operation failed? With what error message?



That is why, I ask if restoring of a clone (made with clonezilla) can be
carried out, in general, on any (virgin) HD.


http://clonezilla.org/

Limitations:
The destination partition must be equal or larger than the source one.
Online imaging/cloning is not implemented yet. The partition to be
imaged or cloned has to be unmounted.


Maybe one of those is related. I can't tell whether you cloned the
entire drive, or just a partition. I also don't know how clonezilla
works, if it does file copies or if it's a sector copy to something
like a sparsefile. If a whole drive clone is basically a dd or
ddrescue sort of thing, then it ought to just work even if you go to a
larger sized drive. The one small problem is if the drive has a GPT
partition scheme, the backup GPT needs relocation if the new drive has
a different number of sectors (even by 1 sector).

Another possible issue is if the original (source) is not 4096 byte
aligned but the new drive has 4096 physical sectors, then special
handling is necessary or you'll get bad performance. I don't know if
clonezilla knows this. It might know special handling is needed, but
can't do it, so it fails.


We do need more info other than "the clone operation failed". I have
cloned a large number of machines using Clonezilla using virgin drives
(CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu, Winblows). Many had the target drives larger
than the original. I will say that they all used fdisk-style partition
tables, though (no GPT tables).
--
- Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, AllDigitalri...@alldigital.com -
- AIM/Skype: therps2ICQ: 22643734Yahoo: origrps2 -
--
- Microsoft Windows:  Proof that P.T. Barnum was right   -
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Re: swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Chris Murphy]

On Tue, Jan 20, 2015 at 11:40 PM, Angelo Moreschini
 wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
> I already used successfully clonezilla to backup my OS (fedora).
>
> I did this (only for exercise til now) restoring the OS on the original disk
> from which I had take the clone.
>
> Now I wanted to use my clone to restore fedora on a virgin HD. (for security
> reasons, I did not want restore the clone on the disk with the OS which I
> use currently).
>
> In this case, however, the operation failed.

The clone operation failed? With what error message?


> That is why, I ask if restoring of a clone (made with clonezilla) can be
> carried out, in general, on any (virgin) HD.

http://clonezilla.org/

Limitations:
The destination partition must be equal or larger than the source one.
Online imaging/cloning is not implemented yet. The partition to be
imaged or cloned has to be unmounted.


Maybe one of those is related. I can't tell whether you cloned the
entire drive, or just a partition. I also don't know how clonezilla
works, if it does file copies or if it's a sector copy to something
like a sparsefile. If a whole drive clone is basically a dd or
ddrescue sort of thing, then it ought to just work even if you go to a
larger sized drive. The one small problem is if the drive has a GPT
partition scheme, the backup GPT needs relocation if the new drive has
a different number of sectors (even by 1 sector).

Another possible issue is if the original (source) is not 4096 byte
aligned but the new drive has 4096 physical sectors, then special
handling is necessary or you'll get bad performance. I don't know if
clonezilla knows this. It might know special handling is needed, but
can't do it, so it fails.


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Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

On 01/16/2015 03:45 PM, poma wrote:
> On 16.01.2015 20:35, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
>> On 01/16/2015 01:57 PM, poma wrote:
>>> On 16.01.2015 19:47, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
 On 01/16/2015 07:47 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
>> On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 
>>
>>> Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
>>> against *things* on your system.
>> Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
>> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
>> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
>> it's good for.
> You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
> Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
> means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
> clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
> provide benefit.
>
> poc
>
 Here is a case of SELinux protecting your house.

 http://danwalsh.livejournal.com/71122.html

>>> Not to fall to false sense of security, does SElinux need SElinux?
>>>
>>>
>> SELinux is the kernel, so does the Kernel need the kernel.
>>
> You've probably wanted to write, SELinux is a Linux(kernel) feature.
> But in some another context, the kernel needs the kernel, and not only.
>
>> But theoretically SELinux/Kernel can protect itself.  We can prevent
>> privileged processes (root) from manipulating the SELinux settings.
>>
> Can SELinux, AppArmor and Grsecurity perform together, to achieve an even 
> greater level of security?
>
>
SELinux and AppArmor can not, although there was some effort to allow
multiple LSM's.  Check out discussion on the selinux upstream list.

I have no idea whether Grsecurity and SELinux can run on the same
kernel.  Grsecurity has never been upstreamed.


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swapping the disk, with the operating system, using a clone made with CLONEZILLA

[Angelo Moreschini]

Hi,


I already used successfully clonezilla to backup my OS (fedora).

I did this (only for exercise til now) *restoring the OS on the original
disk from which I had **take** the clone*.

Now I wanted to use my clone to restore fedora on a virgin HD. (for
security reasons, I did not want restore the clone on the disk with the OS
which I use currently).

In this case, however, the operation failed.


That is why, I ask if *restor**ing** of a clone (made with clonezilla) can
be carried out, in general, on a**ny* *(**v**i**rg**i**n**) HD**.*

I would like to get an answer to this question.

Thank You

Regards

Angelo
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Re: swapping

[poma]

On 17.01.2015 19:52, Ntlworld wrote:
> Right - I think I might start looking at Ubuntu!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 

This old man and me, were at the bar and we
Were having us some beers and swaping I dont cares
Talking politics, blonde and red-head chicks
Old dogs and new tricks and habits we aint kicked

We talked about Gods grace and all the hell we raised
Then I heard the ol' man say;
God is great, beer is good and people are crazy

B.C.

:)

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Re: swapping

[Chris Murphy]

On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 4:54 AM, Andrew R Paterson <
andy.pater...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

> Having watched this debate I find I must add my own 10c
> I have spent over 30 years working on unix systems starting with xenix,
bsd
> and ending up with linux .
> We survived quite happily using the well known DAC methods of standard
UNIX.
> (UGO - RWX - setuid etc).
> Then I worked on some military systems (high security stuff) and started
to use
> SOLARIS CMW (Compartentalised Mode Workstation) and DEC MLS (Multi-Level-
> Security).
> These both use the same (probably not as up to date) MAC security via
> labelling as (I guess) selinux.
> I can truthfully say I loved UNIX in all its forms until coming across
CMW &
> MLS and now SELINUX - then basically - I wanted OUT!.
> They are horrendous; if you start to use labelling in earnest - absolutely
> suicidal!!! - unless you have a real motive - ie you work for the security
> services or a bank or something  and have a massive amount of time to
devote.
> Why do the selinux guys have to force MAC onto all linux users - even
> hobbyists?

Here, maybe this is more your style for this subject:
https://people.redhat.com/duffy/selinux/selinux-coloring-book_A4-Stapled.pdf

Quite honestly I feel the same way about packaging on linux. I sorta
understand that it's necessary, like concrete needs cement, but I don't
want to interact with it at all. Every distribution reinvents this
particular wheel and makes me understand it's peculiarities when it comes
to packaging. It causes users, packagers, and upstream no end of grief. It
enhances my notion that distros are really different operating systems that
just so happen to share a kernel (and maybe some other stuff).

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[Chris Murphy]

On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 8:05 PM, jd1008  wrote:
> Yes, I knew about what gparted can do. I had tried it
> on a 1tb drive, and it still took at least 2  hours.
> Maybe there was an issue with the sata internal bus???

We'd need dmesg to have any idea about that. Anytime I've done only an
fs shrink or grow with ext4, it's taken less than a minute. Two hours
sounds like the partition was being moved, not just shrunk. Since ext3
doesn't use extents or preallocation it's prone to more fragmentation
but 2 hours is a long time.

The thing is, swap is as fundamental to the system as the root volume,
so I'd be inclined to make the necessary space on the internal drive
and offload other things as needed.

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Re: swapping

[Gordon Messmer]

On 01/17/2015 03:54 AM, Andrew R Paterson wrote:

then basically - I wanted OUT!.


I feel your pain.  I used to really like computers, until we networked 
them all together, and security became something we had to care about.


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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/17/2015 07:14 PM, John Mellor wrote:
You do not need to mess it up, unless you are actually using all 2TB 
of the disk.  Use gparted to shrink the existing partitions as required.


On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 8:11 PM, jd1008 > wrote:



On 01/17/2015 06:02 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Uswsusp

It looks like it support swapfiles. I still don't think a
sparse file
backing a loop device as a swap device will work for suspend
to disk,
but it may just be a matter of creativity. If this is a laptop
I think
you're better off with swap on the internal drive and just
make up the
space you've lost some other way. If you ever have to grab it
and go
you don't want an object attached that can get caught on
something and
snapped off. If the laptop has an optical drive, remove it and
put in
a hard drive to supplement the SSD.

The nand flash sinks completely into the multi-flash
reader/writer, nothing to protrude. So I think this
is a good solution for my situation. I really do not
want to back up 2TB drive, repartition it to create
a 16GB swap partition and restore the rest.
Too gosh darned time consuming.


Yes, I knew about what gparted can do. I had tried it
on a 1tb drive, and it still took at least 2  hours.
Maybe there was an issue with the sata internal bus???


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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[John Mellor]

You do not need to mess it up, unless you are actually using all 2TB of the
disk.  Use gparted to shrink the existing partitions as required.

On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 8:11 PM, jd1008  wrote:

>
> On 01/17/2015 06:02 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:
>
>> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Uswsusp
>>
>> It looks like it support swapfiles. I still don't think a sparse file
>> backing a loop device as a swap device will work for suspend to disk,
>> but it may just be a matter of creativity. If this is a laptop I think
>> you're better off with swap on the internal drive and just make up the
>> space you've lost some other way. If you ever have to grab it and go
>> you don't want an object attached that can get caught on something and
>> snapped off. If the laptop has an optical drive, remove it and put in
>> a hard drive to supplement the SSD.
>>
> The nand flash sinks completely into the multi-flash
> reader/writer, nothing to protrude. So I think this
> is a good solution for my situation. I really do not
> want to back up 2TB drive, repartition it to create
> a 16GB swap partition and restore the rest.
> Too gosh darned time consuming.
>
>
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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/17/2015 06:28 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 6:11 PM, jd1008  wrote:


The nand flash sinks completely into the multi-flash
reader/writer, nothing to protrude. So I think this
is a good solution for my situation.

Seems reasonable I guess.


I really do not
want to back up 2TB drive, repartition it to create
a 16GB swap partition and restore the rest.
Too gosh darned time consuming.

Surely something can just be resized by 16GB?


No room left in current partitioning layout.
All that's left are a few megabytes that do not fit
within the 2000 sector scheme that drive currently
is using. Those last tidbits are not available because
the very last partition I created was the swap and
and it was supposed to consume whatever disk space
was left. It did not. It left some unused space, but useless
anyway, because it does not amount to much.

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[Chris Murphy]

On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 6:11 PM, jd1008  wrote:

> The nand flash sinks completely into the multi-flash
> reader/writer, nothing to protrude. So I think this
> is a good solution for my situation.

Seems reasonable I guess.

> I really do not
> want to back up 2TB drive, repartition it to create
> a 16GB swap partition and restore the rest.
> Too gosh darned time consuming.

Surely something can just be resized by 16GB?

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/17/2015 06:02 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Uswsusp

It looks like it support swapfiles. I still don't think a sparse file
backing a loop device as a swap device will work for suspend to disk,
but it may just be a matter of creativity. If this is a laptop I think
you're better off with swap on the internal drive and just make up the
space you've lost some other way. If you ever have to grab it and go
you don't want an object attached that can get caught on something and
snapped off. If the laptop has an optical drive, remove it and put in
a hard drive to supplement the SSD.

The nand flash sinks completely into the multi-flash
reader/writer, nothing to protrude. So I think this
is a good solution for my situation. I really do not
want to back up 2TB drive, repartition it to create
a 16GB swap partition and restore the rest.
Too gosh darned time consuming.

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[Chris Murphy]

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Uswsusp

It looks like it support swapfiles. I still don't think a sparse file
backing a loop device as a swap device will work for suspend to disk,
but it may just be a matter of creativity. If this is a laptop I think
you're better off with swap on the internal drive and just make up the
space you've lost some other way. If you ever have to grab it and go
you don't want an object attached that can get caught on something and
snapped off. If the laptop has an optical drive, remove it and put in
a hard drive to supplement the SSD.
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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/17/2015 03:52 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 7:22 PM, jd1008  wrote:

On 01/16/2015 07:11 PM, John Morris wrote:

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 14:26 -0700, jd1008 wrote:


In older "traditional" practices, swap space was normally
about twice the ram size. Today, with some systems having
64 and even 128GB and even larger RAM, it becomes interesting
how big swap space should be. Where is the cutoff for performance?
Paging in and out 128GB memory space could prove to be itself a
performance bottleneck on very busy or memory bound servers.

My advice is don't bother unless you know you need it.  I find 512MB or
1GB to be plenty of swap.  You need some swap just so the system can
ditch memory that was used once to initialize code but isn't accessed
again and other similar things that can be safely tossed to swap and
forgot about.  But if the system is actually swapping hundreds of
megabytes in and out you will quickly be in a world of pain.  Plus most
of the time when that sort of memory pressure hits it is a runaway
process that the OOM killer will eventually take out and having a lot of
swap only increases how long you suffer with an almost totally
unresponsive machine until that happens.  If you are swapping and it
isn't a runaway process or an exception to process a one off huge
dataset it is a sign you need to bite the bullet and get more ram.  If
you know you are going to need a lot of swap to get through some script
you banged out that allocates memory like mad, just add an extra
swapfile on a temporary basis and drop it when you are done.  You are
allowed to have multiple swap files, partitions or any combination of
them within sensible limits.



Well, I need at least 8GB of swap if I want to hibernate, and often
I need to hibernate so I can let an important app continue where
it left off (apps that do not depend on an internet continuous connection)


Does hibernation (suspend to disk) even work with a swapfile? It seems
to depend on the root file system becoming available, so that
/etc/fstab can state what/where the hibernation file is located. But
for a loop mounted swap file, in addition the loop needs to be setup
first. Before that time the swap device doesn't exist. So this seems
difficult.

If you want to hibernate you need 1x RAM at least. The installer
(specifically python-blivet) has laptop hibernation specific code to
create a swap partition that's 2x RAM. This code doesn't get used by
default in Fedora.

So if you need to hibernate I think you're best off with a swap
partition that's 2x RAM. It's suggested it might work with less than
that, but the recommendation is to account for the possibility some
swap is in use at the time the computer hibernates, so it needs enough
space to hold what was use for swap and all of RAM.



Agreed!
The lightweight solution for me is to
get a nand flash stick of 12 or 16GB to remain in the
multi flash reader/writer slot at all times.

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[Chris Murphy]

On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 7:22 PM, jd1008  wrote:
>
> On 01/16/2015 07:11 PM, John Morris wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 14:26 -0700, jd1008 wrote:
>>
>>> In older "traditional" practices, swap space was normally
>>> about twice the ram size. Today, with some systems having
>>> 64 and even 128GB and even larger RAM, it becomes interesting
>>> how big swap space should be. Where is the cutoff for performance?
>>> Paging in and out 128GB memory space could prove to be itself a
>>> performance bottleneck on very busy or memory bound servers.
>>
>> My advice is don't bother unless you know you need it.  I find 512MB or
>> 1GB to be plenty of swap.  You need some swap just so the system can
>> ditch memory that was used once to initialize code but isn't accessed
>> again and other similar things that can be safely tossed to swap and
>> forgot about.  But if the system is actually swapping hundreds of
>> megabytes in and out you will quickly be in a world of pain.  Plus most
>> of the time when that sort of memory pressure hits it is a runaway
>> process that the OOM killer will eventually take out and having a lot of
>> swap only increases how long you suffer with an almost totally
>> unresponsive machine until that happens.  If you are swapping and it
>> isn't a runaway process or an exception to process a one off huge
>> dataset it is a sign you need to bite the bullet and get more ram.  If
>> you know you are going to need a lot of swap to get through some script
>> you banged out that allocates memory like mad, just add an extra
>> swapfile on a temporary basis and drop it when you are done.  You are
>> allowed to have multiple swap files, partitions or any combination of
>> them within sensible limits.
>>
>>
> Well, I need at least 8GB of swap if I want to hibernate, and often
> I need to hibernate so I can let an important app continue where
> it left off (apps that do not depend on an internet continuous connection)
>

Does hibernation (suspend to disk) even work with a swapfile? It seems
to depend on the root file system becoming available, so that
/etc/fstab can state what/where the hibernation file is located. But
for a loop mounted swap file, in addition the loop needs to be setup
first. Before that time the swap device doesn't exist. So this seems
difficult.

If you want to hibernate you need 1x RAM at least. The installer
(specifically python-blivet) has laptop hibernation specific code to
create a swap partition that's 2x RAM. This code doesn't get used by
default in Fedora.

So if you need to hibernate I think you're best off with a swap
partition that's 2x RAM. It's suggested it might work with less than
that, but the recommendation is to account for the possibility some
swap is in use at the time the computer hibernates, so it needs enough
space to hold what was use for swap and all of RAM.


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Re: swapping

[Ntlworld]

Right - I think I might start looking at Ubuntu!

Sent from my iPhone

> On 17 Jan 2015, at 14:10, poma  wrote:
> 
>> On 17.01.2015 12:54, Andrew R Paterson wrote:
>>> On Friday 16 January 2015 16:31:03 Gordon Messmer wrote:
 On 01/15/2015 11:28 PM, Heinz Diehl wrote:
 Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
 the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
 it's good for.
>>> 
>>> If you do not use file system permissions for something useful,
>>> chmod -R a+w /
>>> 
>>> File system permissions require at least basic knowledge and
>>> administration.  Most of the people I installed Linux for don't even
>>> know what they're good for.
>>> 
>>> If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security
>>> subsystem?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *eyeroll*
>> Having watched this debate I find I must add my own 10c
>> I have spent over 30 years working on unix systems starting with xenix, bsd 
>> and ending up with linux .
>> We survived quite happily using the well known DAC methods of standard UNIX.
>> (UGO - RWX - setuid etc).
>> Then I worked on some military systems (high security stuff) and started to 
>> use 
>> SOLARIS CMW (Compartentalised Mode Workstation) and DEC MLS (Multi-Level-
>> Security).
>> These both use the same (probably not as up to date) MAC security via 
>> labelling as (I guess) selinux.
>> I can truthfully say I loved UNIX in all its forms until coming across CMW & 
>> MLS and now SELINUX - then basically - I wanted OUT!.
>> They are horrendous; if you start to use labelling in earnest - absolutely 
>> suicidal!!! - unless you have a real motive - ie you work for the security 
>> services or a bank or something  and have a massive amount of time to devote.
>> Why do the selinux guys have to force MAC onto all linux users - even 
>> hobbyists?
>> Its getting like some kind of religion!
>> 
>> Andy
>> 
>> Andy
> 
> 
> Perhaps it's more pragmatic, something like
> Free feEDback frOm useRs Arangement
> F  ED   O R  A
> by Red Hat for the purposes of RHEL,
> and there lies a profit, right.
> 
> Without it, maybe you could say Grsecurity is optimal model for Fedora.
> 
> 
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Re: swapping

[poma]

On 17.01.2015 12:54, Andrew R Paterson wrote:
> On Friday 16 January 2015 16:31:03 Gordon Messmer wrote:
>> On 01/15/2015 11:28 PM, Heinz Diehl wrote:
>>> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
>>> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
>>> it's good for.
>>
>> If you do not use file system permissions for something useful,
>> chmod -R a+w /
>>
>> File system permissions require at least basic knowledge and
>> administration.  Most of the people I installed Linux for don't even
>> know what they're good for.
>>
>> If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security
>> subsystem?
>>
>>
>> *eyeroll*
> Having watched this debate I find I must add my own 10c
> I have spent over 30 years working on unix systems starting with xenix, bsd 
> and ending up with linux .
> We survived quite happily using the well known DAC methods of standard UNIX.
> (UGO - RWX - setuid etc).
> Then I worked on some military systems (high security stuff) and started to 
> use 
> SOLARIS CMW (Compartentalised Mode Workstation) and DEC MLS (Multi-Level-
> Security).
> These both use the same (probably not as up to date) MAC security via 
> labelling as (I guess) selinux.
> I can truthfully say I loved UNIX in all its forms until coming across CMW & 
> MLS and now SELINUX - then basically - I wanted OUT!.
> They are horrendous; if you start to use labelling in earnest - absolutely 
> suicidal!!! - unless you have a real motive - ie you work for the security 
> services or a bank or something  and have a massive amount of time to devote.
> Why do the selinux guys have to force MAC onto all linux users - even 
> hobbyists?
> Its getting like some kind of religion!
> 
> Andy
> 
> Andy
> 


Perhaps it's more pragmatic, something like
Free feEDback frOm useRs Arangement
F  ED   O R  A
by Red Hat for the purposes of RHEL,
and there lies a profit, right.

Without it, maybe you could say Grsecurity is optimal model for Fedora.


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Re: swapping

[Andrew R Paterson]

On Friday 16 January 2015 16:31:03 Gordon Messmer wrote:
> On 01/15/2015 11:28 PM, Heinz Diehl wrote:
> > Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
> > the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
> > it's good for.
> 
> If you do not use file system permissions for something useful,
> chmod -R a+w /
> 
> File system permissions require at least basic knowledge and
> administration.  Most of the people I installed Linux for don't even
> know what they're good for.
> 
> If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security
> subsystem?
> 
> 
> *eyeroll*
Having watched this debate I find I must add my own 10c
I have spent over 30 years working on unix systems starting with xenix, bsd 
and ending up with linux .
We survived quite happily using the well known DAC methods of standard UNIX.
(UGO - RWX - setuid etc).
Then I worked on some military systems (high security stuff) and started to use 
SOLARIS CMW (Compartentalised Mode Workstation) and DEC MLS (Multi-Level-
Security).
These both use the same (probably not as up to date) MAC security via 
labelling as (I guess) selinux.
I can truthfully say I loved UNIX in all its forms until coming across CMW & 
MLS and now SELINUX - then basically - I wanted OUT!.
They are horrendous; if you start to use labelling in earnest - absolutely 
suicidal!!! - unless you have a real motive - ie you work for the security 
services or a bank or something  and have a massive amount of time to devote.
Why do the selinux guys have to force MAC onto all linux users - even 
hobbyists?
Its getting like some kind of religion!

Andy

Andy
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Re: swapping

[Joe Zeff]

On 01/16/2015 04:31 PM, Gordon Messmer wrote:

If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security
subsystem?


Sometimes it protects you from badly-written software.  My desktop uses 
BOINC to run various projects for the World Community Grid.  One project 
started throwing up constant SELinux alerts because it kept trying to 
walk all of /proc, something it had no business doing.  After several of 
us reported it, the project was withdrawn until it could be debugged. 
Not malware, just a careless programmer, but if it had tried to write to 
random locations in /proc, it could have caused considerable damage to 
people's systems.

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Re: swapping

[Tim]

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration.

I can't agree with that.  In general, it requires none.  The average
user doesn't have to do anything, it just does what it's supposed to do.
They're not likely to even know it's there until a warning pops up about
something, which shouldn't happen unless there's a fault, or the user is
doing something they shouldn't do.  In which case, the right answer is
sort out what's going wrong, not shoot the messenger.


-- 
tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp

Linux 3.17.8-200.fc20.i686 #1 SMP Fri Jan 9 00:01:03 UTC 2015 i686

All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point trying
to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the public lists.

George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny, not
a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments.

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Re: swapping

[John Morris]

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 16:31 -0800, Gordon Messmer wrote:

> If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security 
> subsystem?
> *eyeroll*

That actually isn't as crazy as you seem to think.  Security should
always be seen as tradeoff between the cost of the security vs the
potential loss and the odds of a breech.  Seen in that light simply
disabling permissions could indeed be justified under some conditions.
But there are some important differences between SELinux and the UNIX
model,

1.  You can teach a total newb (assuming IQ over room temp) the basics
of the UNIX permissions system in under an hour and every admin is
expected to know pretty much all details of it.  Nobody understands
SELinux beyond a few developers at RedHat and the NSA.  Even after
reading the O'Reilly book since it is already obsolete.  Contrast to the
UNIX model that hasn't changed in longer than the median age of the
typical Linux user and has extensive documentation that is accurate.

2.  The UNIX security model is integral to UNIX and Linux.  SELinux
exists almost entirely outside the normal filesystems and toolset.
Normal tools rarely preserve SELInux attributes when taking backups or
transferring files between machines.  RPM only partially understands it
after it being a standard feature for a decade.

3.  Any machine configured even slightly differently than the RH devels
expected -WILL- break SELinux.  Or I have just been very very unlucky on
multiple occasions.  Unless one is, or has access to, one of the
extremely limited number of SELinux experts the best solution is to
simply disable it when it breaks.  Doubly so if the machine in question
isn't a server.

4.  Consider the points above and realize SELinux has been a mandatory
at install time feature on Fedora even longer than PulseAudio, and
neither are even close to being reliable... yet were pushed into
production and removal apparently isn't a topic for civilized
discussion.  At what point is it legitimate to question the wisdom of
this?



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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/16/2015 07:11 PM, John Morris wrote:

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 14:26 -0700, jd1008 wrote:


In older "traditional" practices, swap space was normally
about twice the ram size. Today, with some systems having
64 and even 128GB and even larger RAM, it becomes interesting
how big swap space should be. Where is the cutoff for performance?
Paging in and out 128GB memory space could prove to be itself a
performance bottleneck on very busy or memory bound servers.

My advice is don't bother unless you know you need it.  I find 512MB or
1GB to be plenty of swap.  You need some swap just so the system can
ditch memory that was used once to initialize code but isn't accessed
again and other similar things that can be safely tossed to swap and
forgot about.  But if the system is actually swapping hundreds of
megabytes in and out you will quickly be in a world of pain.  Plus most
of the time when that sort of memory pressure hits it is a runaway
process that the OOM killer will eventually take out and having a lot of
swap only increases how long you suffer with an almost totally
unresponsive machine until that happens.  If you are swapping and it
isn't a runaway process or an exception to process a one off huge
dataset it is a sign you need to bite the bullet and get more ram.  If
you know you are going to need a lot of swap to get through some script
you banged out that allocates memory like mad, just add an extra
swapfile on a temporary basis and drop it when you are done.  You are
allowed to have multiple swap files, partitions or any combination of
them within sensible limits.



Well, I need at least 8GB of swap if I want to hibernate, and often
I need to hibernate so I can let an important app continue where
it left off (apps that do not depend on an internet continuous connection)
.

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[John Morris]

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 14:26 -0700, jd1008 wrote:

> In older "traditional" practices, swap space was normally
> about twice the ram size. Today, with some systems having
> 64 and even 128GB and even larger RAM, it becomes interesting
> how big swap space should be. Where is the cutoff for performance?
> Paging in and out 128GB memory space could prove to be itself a
> performance bottleneck on very busy or memory bound servers.

My advice is don't bother unless you know you need it.  I find 512MB or
1GB to be plenty of swap.  You need some swap just so the system can
ditch memory that was used once to initialize code but isn't accessed
again and other similar things that can be safely tossed to swap and
forgot about.  But if the system is actually swapping hundreds of
megabytes in and out you will quickly be in a world of pain.  Plus most
of the time when that sort of memory pressure hits it is a runaway
process that the OOM killer will eventually take out and having a lot of
swap only increases how long you suffer with an almost totally
unresponsive machine until that happens.  If you are swapping and it
isn't a runaway process or an exception to process a one off huge
dataset it is a sign you need to bite the bullet and get more ram.  If
you know you are going to need a lot of swap to get through some script
you banged out that allocates memory like mad, just add an extra
swapfile on a temporary basis and drop it when you are done.  You are
allowed to have multiple swap files, partitions or any combination of
them within sensible limits.


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Re: swapping

[Gordon Messmer]

On 01/15/2015 11:28 PM, Heinz Diehl wrote:

Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
it's good for.


If you do not use file system permissions for something useful,
chmod -R a+w /

File system permissions require at least basic knowledge and 
administration.  Most of the people I installed Linux for don't even 
know what they're good for.


If your computer is single-user anyway, why does it need a security 
subsystem?



*eyeroll*
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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[John Morris]

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 13:08 -0700, jd1008 wrote:
> Can it be done?
> 
> So far, swapon says:
> swapon: /var/swapfile: skipping - it appears to have holes.
> ...
> Maybe the devs can have a look and see if they can modify the swapper to
> allow sparse swap files??
> 

There is a reason why it acts like it does.  The system would panic if
it tried and failed to allocate blocks when it needed them and the drive
was full.  The whole point is that swap is treated 'like ram, only
slower' and thus it is not prepared for it to be in a 'quantum' state
until the moment of actual use.


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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

On 01/16/2015 01:57 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:

On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 1:08 PM, jd1008  wrote:

Can it be done?

So far, swapon says:
swapon: /var/swapfile: skipping - it appears to have holes.

I was hoping that the kernel's swapper would allow the filesystem to
allocate
real blocks to the sparse file when they are needed rather than check
up front to see if they already exist.

Maybe the devs can have a look and see if they can modify the swapper to
allow sparse swap files??

No the issue is that the swap code doesn't actually write through the
file system. Essentially it gets the LBA range of the file from the
file system, and then asserts direct control to write to those blocks.
And in this case the sparse file has no real blocks so swapon fails.

It's similar problem to swapfiles on NFS and Btrfs. There are patches
floating around to get this working on NFS that Btrfs was also going
to leverage. I don't know the status of that work,  it seems a bit
stalled to me.

You could probably create a sparsefile to back a loop device, and then
specify the loop device as swap. But reports are this will be slower
than a swapfile.




Thank you Chris.
Yes, it works if I losetup /dev/loop? as the device.

Reason I asked, is that I just upgraded my laptop to 8GB ram
and I really do not want to have to repartition the drive to have a
larger swap space and restore everything from backup.

In older "traditional" practices, swap space was normally
about twice the ram size. Today, with some systems having
64 and even 128GB and even larger RAM, it becomes interesting
how big swap space should be. Where is the cutoff for performance?
Paging in and out 128GB memory space could prove to be itself a
performance bottleneck on very busy or memory bound servers.

Cheers,

JD

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Re: Swapping to a large sparse file

[Chris Murphy]

On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 1:08 PM, jd1008  wrote:
> Can it be done?
>
> So far, swapon says:
> swapon: /var/swapfile: skipping - it appears to have holes.
>
> I was hoping that the kernel's swapper would allow the filesystem to
> allocate
> real blocks to the sparse file when they are needed rather than check
> up front to see if they already exist.
>
> Maybe the devs can have a look and see if they can modify the swapper to
> allow sparse swap files??

No the issue is that the swap code doesn't actually write through the
file system. Essentially it gets the LBA range of the file from the
file system, and then asserts direct control to write to those blocks.
And in this case the sparse file has no real blocks so swapon fails.

It's similar problem to swapfiles on NFS and Btrfs. There are patches
floating around to get this working on NFS that Btrfs was also going
to leverage. I don't know the status of that work,  it seems a bit
stalled to me.

You could probably create a sparsefile to back a loop device, and then
specify the loop device as swap. But reports are this will be slower
than a swapfile.


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Re: swapping

[poma]

On 16.01.2015 20:35, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> 
> On 01/16/2015 01:57 PM, poma wrote:
>> On 16.01.2015 19:47, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
>>> On 01/16/2015 07:47 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
 On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
> On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 
>
>> Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
>> against *things* on your system.
> Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
> it's good for.
 You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
 Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
 means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
 clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
 provide benefit.

 poc

>>> Here is a case of SELinux protecting your house.
>>>
>>> http://danwalsh.livejournal.com/71122.html
>>>
>> Not to fall to false sense of security, does SElinux need SElinux?
>>
>>
> SELinux is the kernel, so does the Kernel need the kernel.
> 

You've probably wanted to write, SELinux is a Linux(kernel) feature.
But in some another context, the kernel needs the kernel, and not only.

> But theoretically SELinux/Kernel can protect itself.  We can prevent
> privileged processes (root) from manipulating the SELinux settings.
> 

Can SELinux, AppArmor and Grsecurity perform together, to achieve an even 
greater level of security?


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Swapping to a large sparse file

[jd1008]

Can it be done?

So far, swapon says:
swapon: /var/swapfile: skipping - it appears to have holes.

I was hoping that the kernel's swapper would allow the filesystem to 
allocate

real blocks to the sparse file when they are needed rather than check
up front to see if they already exist.

Maybe the devs can have a look and see if they can modify the swapper to
allow sparse swap files??

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Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

On 01/16/2015 01:57 PM, poma wrote:
> On 16.01.2015 19:47, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
>> On 01/16/2015 07:47 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
>>> On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
 On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 

> Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
> against *things* on your system.
 Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
 Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
 the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
 it's good for.
>>> You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
>>> Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
>>> means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
>>> clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
>>> provide benefit.
>>>
>>> poc
>>>
>> Here is a case of SELinux protecting your house.
>>
>> http://danwalsh.livejournal.com/71122.html
>>
> Not to fall to false sense of security, does SElinux need SElinux?
>
>
SELinux is the kernel, so does the Kernel need the kernel.

But theoretically SELinux/Kernel can protect itself.  We can prevent
privileged processes (root) from manipulating the SELinux settings.
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Re: swapping

[poma]

On 16.01.2015 19:47, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
> 
> On 01/16/2015 07:47 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
>> On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
>>> On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 
>>>
 Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
 against *things* on your system.
>>> Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
>>> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
>>> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
>>> it's good for.
>> You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
>> Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
>> means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
>> clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
>> provide benefit.
>>
>> poc
>>
> Here is a case of SELinux protecting your house.
> 
> http://danwalsh.livejournal.com/71122.html
> 

Not to fall to false sense of security, does SElinux need SElinux?


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Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

On 01/16/2015 07:47 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
>> On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 
>>
>>> Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
>>> against *things* on your system.
>> Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
>> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
>> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
>> it's good for.
> You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
> Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
> means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
> clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
> provide benefit.
>
> poc
>
Here is a case of SELinux protecting your house.

http://danwalsh.livejournal.com/71122.html
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Re: swapping

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Fri, 2015-01-16 at 08:28 +0100, Heinz Diehl wrote:
> On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 
> 
> > Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
> > against *things* on your system.
> 
> Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
> Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
> the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
> it's good for.

You mean like the fuses in your house or the airbag in your car? When
Selinux is working you don't know it's there. When it alerts you it
means there's something wrong. I agree that the alerts are not always as
clear as they might be, but it's a fallacy to suggest that it doesn't
provide benefit.

poc

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Re: swapping

[Heinz Diehl]

On 16.01.2015, Tim wrote: 

> Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
> against *things* on your system.

Any recent Linux distribution can be secured without using selinux.
Selinux requires at least basic knowledge and administration. Most of
the people I installed Linux for didn't even know it was there or what
it's good for.

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Re: swapping

[Tim]

Allegedly, on or about 15 January 2015, Heinz Diehl sent:
> If you do not use selinux for something useful, add a "selinux=0" to
> your kernel boot parameters. 

Bad advice!  It's like saying that if you do not use the earth wiring in
your house, rip it out.

Of course *you* do not *use* it, it's there as a protective device
against *things* on your system.

-- 
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp
Linux 3.9.10-100.fc17.x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Jul 14 01:31:27 UTC 2013 x86_64

All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted, there is no point
trying to privately email me, I will only read messages posted to the
public lists.

George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny, not
a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments.

ZNQR LBH YBBX



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Re: swapping

[Michael Cronenworth]

On 01/15/2015 04:15 PM, Daniel J Walsh wrote:

Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.

touch /.autorelabel; reboot

Will fix the labels, or you could just do

restorecon -R /


Except that is not the case in this instance.
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Re: swapping

[Sam Varshavchik]

Patrick Dupre writes:


How I can do so?
Before I rebooted the machine after I clicked on troubleshooting alerts and  
a report had been sent.

but it did not change the situation..
Depending, sometimes, I can recover the memory by closing firefox, but
other times I have to reboot.


The selinux alert will indicate which process or application tripped the  
alert. This is what you will have to investigate.


I have never had Firefox itself trigger selinux alerts. The most likely  
explanation is a broken Firefox extension.


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Re: swapping

[Daniel J Walsh]

Usually if you are in this situation, you have a bad labeling problem.

touch /.autorelabel; reboot

Will fix the labels, or you could just do

restorecon -R /

On 01/15/2015 08:15 AM, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> On 01/15/2015 06:06 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:
>> Very often I reach a situation where I cannot work because fedora
>> is swapping permanently.
>> I attach the top file.
>>
>> I need to restart the machine to have it fix!
>
> I've seen this on my box, too, but only once. Kill the setroubleshoot
> process and it will return to "normal." I've filed a bug.
>
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1175827

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Re: swapping

[Chris Murphy]

On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 2:08 PM, Heinz Diehl  wrote:
> On 15.01.2015, Patrick Dupre wrote:
>
>> I need to restart the machine to have it fix!
>
> If you do not use selinux for something useful, add a "selinux=0" to
> your kernel boot parameters.

That's bad advice. First use enforcing=0 and then also file a bug.
selinux=0 is the last resort.



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Re: swapping

[Heinz Diehl]

On 15.01.2015, Patrick Dupre wrote: 

> I need to restart the machine to have it fix!

If you do not use selinux for something useful, add a "selinux=0" to
your kernel boot parameters.

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Re: swapping

[Michael Cronenworth]

On 01/15/2015 06:06 AM, Patrick Dupre wrote:

Very often I reach a situation where I cannot work because fedora
is swapping permanently.
I attach the top file.

I need to restart the machine to have it fix!


I've seen this on my box, too, but only once. Kill the setroubleshoot process 
and it will return to "normal." I've filed a bug.


https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1175827
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Re: swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


> Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2015 at 1:42 PM
> From: "Sam Varshavchik" 
> To: "Community support for Fedora users" 
> Subject: Re: swapping
>
> Patrick Dupre writes:
> 
> > Hello,
> >
> > Very often I reach a situation where I cannot work because fedora
> > is swapping permanently.
> > I attach the top file.
> >
> > I need to restart the machine to have it fix!
> 
> Wow, setroubleshoot ate ten gigs of virtual memory on a machine with 8gb of  
> physical ram.
> 
> Something is spewing SELinux denial errors, making setroubleshoot blow up.  
> That's what this looks to me.
> 
> You should have a honking button somewhere, imploring you to review all the  
> accumulated selinux alerts. You need to chase down what's tripping up  
> SELinux, and address that.
> 
How I can do so?
Before I rebooted the machine after I clicked on troubleshooting alerts and a 
report had been sent.
but it did not change the situation..
Depending, sometimes, I can recover the memory by closing firefox, but
other times I have to reboot.
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Re: swapping

[Sam Varshavchik]

Patrick Dupre writes:


Hello,

Very often I reach a situation where I cannot work because fedora
is swapping permanently.
I attach the top file.

I need to restart the machine to have it fix!


Wow, setroubleshoot ate ten gigs of virtual memory on a machine with 8gb of  
physical ram.


Something is spewing SELinux denial errors, making setroubleshoot blow up.  
That's what this looks to me.


You should have a honking button somewhere, imploring you to review all the  
accumulated selinux alerts. You need to chase down what's tripping up  
SELinux, and address that.




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swapping

[Patrick Dupre]

Hello,

Very often I reach a situation where I cannot work because fedora
is swapping permanently.
I attach the top file.

I need to restart the machine to have it fix!

Thank for your help.

===
 Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com
 Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | |
 Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale   | |
 Tel.  (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12   | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44
 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France
===


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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[jd1008]

On 10/16/2014 11:12 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 16Oct2014 22:44, jd1008  wrote:

Could you explain _why_ you want to renumber the partitions? Does
something have a hardwired desire to use "partition 1" or something?


I think I need to do it because the windows partition for some reason
will not boot as partition 2 even though the boot.ini was edited to look
in partition 2  instead of partition 2.

So, I restored boot.init to look into partition 1, and then I will 
try to boot windows
from the grub2 menu (which I have also edited to look into msdos1 
instead of msdos2.


Not sure it will work, but worth a try.
I might save me a reinstall.


Don't forget to keep a copy of the partition table dump file when you 
dump it with sfdisk. That way if there is some disaster in your edit 
you can put the original back.


And don't forget that sfdisk is terribly easy to misuse. I always 
quake with fear of overwriting the partition table instead of dumping 
it. Read the manual entry carefully (it has examples, and this same 
warning) and ensure you have the command line options right.


Nonetheless, it is still terrible useful.

Thanx. Good advice.



Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

I think... Therefore I ride.  I ride... Therefore I am.
- Mark Pope 


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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[Cameron Simpson]

On 16Oct2014 22:44, jd1008  wrote:

Could you explain _why_ you want to renumber the partitions? Does
something have a hardwired desire to use "partition 1" or something?


I think I need to do it because the windows partition for some reason
will not boot as partition 2 even though the boot.ini was edited to look
in partition 2  instead of partition 2.

So, I restored boot.init to look into partition 1, and then I will try 
to boot windows
from the grub2 menu (which I have also edited to look into msdos1 
instead of msdos2.


Not sure it will work, but worth a try.
I might save me a reinstall.


Don't forget to keep a copy of the partition table dump file when you dump it 
with sfdisk. That way if there is some disaster in your edit you can put the 
original back.


And don't forget that sfdisk is terribly easy to misuse. I always quake with 
fear of overwriting the partition table instead of dumping it. Read the manual 
entry carefully (it has examples, and this same warning) and ensure you have 
the command line options right.


Nonetheless, it is still terrible useful.

Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

I think... Therefore I ride.  I ride... Therefore I am.
- Mark Pope 
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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[jd1008]

On 10/16/2014 10:25 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 16Oct2014 18:45, jd1008  wrote:

On 10/16/2014 03:32 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 16Oct2014 12:55, jd1008  wrote:

I am trying to avert having to dd out 2 partitions to external drive
and repartition and dd them back in.

What I am trying to do is renumber partition 1 as partition 2
and partition 2 as partition 1.

Is this possible? parted and fdisk and sfdisk do not seem to provide
such operations.


sfdisk has a dump option. I would think you could dump the partition 
table and reorder the partition records and reload it. I can't see 
any reason that would not work.


OK, it's just that I did not want to wreck the drive, as I was not sure
it would accomplish what I wanted.
So, P2 will be renamed P1
and P1 will be renamed (renumbered) P2.


I would expect so. Note that I haven't done this myself.


Will this affect the other partitions P3 and P4 in any way?


Shouldn't.


Such as, will it affect their starting offsets? Will the system
no longer be able to identify them by their existing UUID?


AFAIK, the partition table is just a data structure laying out the 
on-disk location of partition. The partition number is the record 
number in the data structure. The physical location should be 
independent. So you should be able to rearrange the records.


I gather the UUID is embedded in the partition itself. But I have 
never found out. But on that basis, the system should be just fine. In 
fact, that's really the point of putting UUIDs on partitions - so the 
OS config files don't have to track partitions locations and hard 
drive locations.


Note that this suggestions doesn't move any of the on-disk data around 
(except the partition table itself I guess).


Could you explain _why_ you want to renumber the partitions? Does 
something have a hardwired desire to use "partition 1" or something?


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

Sometimes when you fill a vacuum, it still sucks.
- attributed to Dennis Ritchie, about X

I think I need to do it because the windows partition for some reason
will not boot as partition 2 even though the boot.ini was edited to look
in partition 2  instead of partition 2.

So, I restored boot.init to look into partition 1, and then I will try 
to boot windows
from the grub2 menu (which I have also edited to look into msdos1 
instead of msdos2.


Not sure it will work, but worth a try.
I might save me a reinstall.
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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[Cameron Simpson]

On 16Oct2014 18:45, jd1008  wrote:

On 10/16/2014 03:32 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 16Oct2014 12:55, jd1008  wrote:

I am trying to avert having to dd out 2 partitions to external drive
and repartition and dd them back in.

What I am trying to do is renumber partition 1 as partition 2
and partition 2 as partition 1.

Is this possible? parted and fdisk and sfdisk do not seem to provide
such operations.


sfdisk has a dump option. I would think you could dump the partition 
table and reorder the partition records and reload it. I can't see 
any reason that would not work.


OK, it's just that I did not want to wreck the drive, as I was not sure
it would accomplish what I wanted.
So, P2 will be renamed P1
and P1 will be renamed (renumbered) P2.


I would expect so. Note that I haven't done this myself.


Will this affect the other partitions P3 and P4 in any way?


Shouldn't.


Such as, will it affect their starting offsets? Will the system
no longer be able to identify them by their existing UUID?


AFAIK, the partition table is just a data structure laying out the on-disk 
location of partition. The partition number is the record number in the data 
structure. The physical location should be independent. So you should be able 
to rearrange the records.


I gather the UUID is embedded in the partition itself. But I have never found 
out. But on that basis, the system should be just fine. In fact, that's really 
the point of putting UUIDs on partitions - so the OS config files don't have to 
track partitions locations and hard drive locations.


Note that this suggestions doesn't move any of the on-disk data around (except 
the partition table itself I guess).


Could you explain _why_ you want to renumber the partitions? Does something 
have a hardwired desire to use "partition 1" or something?


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

Sometimes when you fill a vacuum, it still sucks.
- attributed to Dennis Ritchie, about X
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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[jd1008]

On 10/16/2014 03:32 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 16Oct2014 12:55, jd1008  wrote:

I am trying to avert having to dd out 2 partitions to external drive
and repartition and dd them back in.

What I am trying to do is renumber partition 1 as partition 2
and partition 2 as partition 1.

Is this possible? parted and fdisk and sfdisk do not seem to provide
such operations.


sfdisk has a dump option. I would think you could dump the partition 
table and reorder the partition records and reload it. I can't see any 
reason that would not work.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

What's fair got to do with it? It's going to happen.- Lawrence of 
Arabia

OK, it's just that I did not want to wreck the drive, as I was not sure
it would accomplish what I wanted.
So, P2 will be renamed P1
and P1 will be renamed (renumbered) P2.
Will this affect the other partitions P3 and P4 in any way?
Such as, will it affect their starting offsets? Will the system
no longer be able to identify them by their existing UUID?


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Re: Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[Cameron Simpson]

On 16Oct2014 12:55, jd1008  wrote:

I am trying to avert having to dd out 2 partitions to external drive
and repartition and dd them back in.

What I am trying to do is renumber partition 1 as partition 2
and partition 2 as partition 1.

Is this possible? parted and fdisk and sfdisk do not seem to provide
such operations.


sfdisk has a dump option. I would think you could dump the partition table and 
reorder the partition records and reload it. I can't see any reason that would 
not work.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 

What's fair got to do with it? It's going to happen.- Lawrence of Arabia
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Swapping the number of 2 partitions

[jd1008]

I am trying to avert having to dd out 2 partitions to external drive
and repartition and dd them back in.

What I am trying to do is renumber partition 1 as partition 2
and partition 2 as partition 1.

Is this possible? parted and fdisk and sfdisk do not seem to provide
such operations.


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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Maciek Borzęcki]

On Fri, 2012-12-28 at 00:37 +0100, Reindl Harald wrote:
> dd if=/dev/sd of=/dev/sd bs=16M
> and wait. there is no progress visible!

Well, not exactly. One can use kill -USR1  to see the current
progress report.

> 
> dd if=/dev/sda | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sda bs=16M" &
> dd if=/dev/sdb | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdb bs=16M" &
> dd if=/dev/sdc | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdc bs=16M" &
> dd if=/dev/sdd | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdd bs=16M" &
and if shell pipe is used, pv can be really useful, use it like this:
dd  | pv | ssh 

and you'll get a nifty speed report, that corresponds to the rate at
which ssh reads from pv's output (~network throughput).
IMO pv can be used for local dd use as well, just do:
dd if=/dev/sd bs=16M | pv | dd of=/dev/sd bs=16M



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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Reindl Harald]

Am 28.12.2012 00:22, schrieb Eddie G. O'Connor Jr.:
>> Besides, I agree with your conclusion, that Clonezilla may be the best
>> way for you. I used it and I like it.
>>
> I am thankful for all the comments, I have just finished my backup of my 
> entire system, I'm still "skiffy" when it
> comes to command line stuff...(too bad there's no Text for Fedora 17 Command 
> Line training?...like there is with
> Red Hat!) so I will be going the path of least resistance and going with the 
> option that will make an exact "clone"
> of my drive. Here's to hoping this works!

dd is really no rocket science

you only need to make sure what is source and what is destination
after plug a external hard disk "dmesg" make clear in it's last
entries what is the enw device

dd if=/dev/sd of=/dev/sd bs=16M
and wait. there is no progress visible!

___

given you boot both machines from a live-cd and configure sshd for
key-authentication which takes a little google and 5 minutes i was
able to clone a complete PC with 4 x 2 TB disks having 3 linux
software-raids (RAID1 for /boot, RAID10 for / and RAID10 for /data
eith a 4-liner

it took only few hours and all i had to do was reconfigure the
network on the new machine - giving you have a quad-core cpu
and configure ssh for compression this is dmaned effective
because the empty parts are compressed well and you have one
cpu-core for compress/encrpt a disk

dd if=/dev/sda | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sda bs=16M" &
dd if=/dev/sdb | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdb bs=16M" &
dd if=/dev/sdc | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdc bs=16M" &
dd if=/dev/sdd | ssh root@192.168.196.129 "dd of=/dev/sdd bs=16M" &

these days i would use 'ssh -c "arcfour128"'which results in
around 100 MB/second by "cheaper" encryption which i also
use these days for rsync-backups in 100% secure networks



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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Eddie G. O'Connor Jr.]

On 12/27/2012 11:15 AM, Paweł Brodacki wrote:

2012/12/27 Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. :


WOW!so much information to digest! Thanks to one and all, but after
reading the responses, I think the Clonezilla way might be for me, I'm not
too familiar with the Terminal and the command lines and suchalthough I
think it would be AWESOME to be able to do such tings strictly from a
terminalI'm also afraid since this is the only "working" laptop I have
that connects me to the outside world...and I would hate to lose all the
info and files on here.maybe I'll find some old drives and do a "test"
run firstjust to be sure I've gotten the hang of it! Thanks again
everyone!


EGO II


Backup. You *need* backup. Now.

 From what I understand, you are going to perform an operation on a
disk containing the sole copy of data which you'd "hate to loose".
Backup this data now.

Any rearrangement of a disk bears an inherent risk of thrashing the
disk. A backup is easy to make with Fedora (e.g. using deja-dup), will
reduce your stress level during the operation and making your first
backup may get you into a good habit ;).

Besides, I agree with your conclusion, that Clonezilla may be the best
way for you. I used it and I like it.

Paweł
I am thankful for all the comments, I have just finished my backup of my 
entire system, I'm still "skiffy" when it comes to command line 
stuff...(too bad there's no Text for Fedora 17 Command Line 
training?...like there is with Red Hat!) so I will be going the path of 
least resistance and going with the option that will make an exact 
"clone" of my drive. Here's to hoping this works! I'm going from the 
320GB hard drive this laptop came with (SATA) to a 500GB one so that I 
have more space. I'm also looking into external storage...in a "server" 
veinso that I don't have to hunt around for the external hard drives 
anymore...thinking maybe a standalone tower with a 1TB HDD...and a 
"real" server OS like CEntOS ormaybe Ubuntu?don't know yet...but 
here goes



EGO II
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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Paweł Brodacki]

2012/12/27 Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. :

> WOW!so much information to digest! Thanks to one and all, but after
> reading the responses, I think the Clonezilla way might be for me, I'm not
> too familiar with the Terminal and the command lines and suchalthough I
> think it would be AWESOME to be able to do such tings strictly from a
> terminalI'm also afraid since this is the only "working" laptop I have
> that connects me to the outside world...and I would hate to lose all the
> info and files on here.maybe I'll find some old drives and do a "test"
> run firstjust to be sure I've gotten the hang of it! Thanks again
> everyone!
>
>
> EGO II
>

Backup. You *need* backup. Now.

From what I understand, you are going to perform an operation on a
disk containing the sole copy of data which you'd "hate to loose".
Backup this data now.

Any rearrangement of a disk bears an inherent risk of thrashing the
disk. A backup is easy to make with Fedora (e.g. using deja-dup), will
reduce your stress level during the operation and making your first
backup may get you into a good habit ;).

Besides, I agree with your conclusion, that Clonezilla may be the best
way for you. I used it and I like it.

Paweł
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Re: [Bulk] Swapping HDD....

[Bill Davidsen]

Phil Savoie wrote:

On 12/26/2012 09:50 PM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:

I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB SATA HD. I'm
finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I
have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I
do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as
the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from
my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I
be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my
applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would
be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!


EGO II

Hi,

I just replaced a smaller drive to a larger one much like you want to do.  My
procedure was the following:

- get a copy of clonezilla and clone the drive to an external usb drive

- replace the small drive with the larger drive

- use clonezilla to populate the larger drive

Some form of physical copy seems to be the lowest risk path for the O.P. who 
said command line is not his thing. So clonezilla is a way to go. Making an 
exact copy should result in a drive which will just boot, no "populate" step 
needed, is there?



- you will note that the larger drive is a clone of the smaller one, so you will
need to grow it

- get a copy of the "System Rescue CD", boot off it and use gparted to grow the
cloned filesystem to fill out the drive

Bearing in mind that "CD" device may not be on this system is it's a laptop. In 
which case there will be a question on converting a CD to a USB thumb drive. 
Hang in, Eddie, there are answers to all the questions, but a *little* 
competence with command line will save you a vast amount of tool finding and 
learning in the long run.



Hope this helps,

Phil



--
Bill Davidsen 
  "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from
the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot
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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Michael D. Setzer II]

On 26 Dec 2012 at 21:50, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:

Date sent:  Wed, 26 Dec 2012 21:50:07 -0500
From:   "Eddie G. O'Connor Jr." 

To: Community support for Fedora users 

Subject:Swapping HDD

> I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB  SATA HD.
> I'm finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other
> files I have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD.
> How can I do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact
> specs as the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer
> everything from my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB
> enclosure? will I be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy
> settings and ALL my applications transfer over intact? Any help
> someone could provide would be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Thanks!

As others have stated - Clonezilla can do the job, as other similar 
programs like g4u and g4l. I've been the maintainer of g4l, and 
use Fedora as the build system for the most part, but the kernels 
are built from kernel.org source. It can do direct clones, but can 
also do disk or partition images to external disk or others via the 
network. 

I can run g4l directly from the grub menu to make and restore 
images.

Good Luck. 

Note: It will take some time to clone since the hard disk speed 
with be the uncached speed since once the cache is filled you will 
only get the physical drive speed.



> 
> 
> EGO II
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+--+
  Michael D. Setzer II -  Computer Science Instructor  
  Guam Community College  Computer Center  
  mailto:mi...@kuentos.guam.net
  mailto:msetze...@gmail.com
  http://www.guam.net/home/mikes
  Guam - Where America's Day Begins
  G4L Disk Imaging Project maintainer 
  http://sourceforge.net/projects/g4l/
+--+

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu (Original)
Number of Seti Units Returned:  19,471
Processing time:  32 years, 290 days, 12 hours, 58 minutes
(Total Hours: 287,489)

BOINC@HOME CREDITS
SETI13538639.902672   |   EINSTEIN 9460580.039852
ROSETTA  5677104.958529   |   ABC 15632753.780253

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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Heinz Diehl]

On 27.12.2012, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote: 

> I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I do this
> when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as the Gateway?

- Connect your new HDD to your laptop (e.g. as an external drive).
- Get the new HDD partitioned and formatted
- "rsync -avxHSAX /old/partition/ /new/partition" will do a proper copy
  of your existing data
- Look into /etc/fstab and change the new partitions UUIDs to the same
  (old) UUIDs used in fstab ("man tune2fs") 
- Change the HDDs
- Install GRUB ("man grub-install")

I have done this quite often, it works.


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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Eddie G. O'Connor Jr.]

On 12/27/2012 12:04 AM, staticsafe wrote:

On 12/26/12 21:50, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:

I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB  SATA HD. I'm
finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I
have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I
do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as
the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from
my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I
be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my
applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would
be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!


EGO II

It is certainly possible. I find Clonezilla[0] to be very useful in
matters such as these.

[0] - http://clonezilla.org/

WOW!so much information to digest! Thanks to one and all, but after 
reading the responses, I think the Clonezilla way might be for me, I'm 
not too familiar with the Terminal and the command lines and 
suchalthough I think it would be AWESOME to be able to do such tings 
strictly from a terminalI'm also afraid since this is the only 
"working" laptop I have that connects me to the outside world...and I 
would hate to lose all the info and files on here.maybe I'll find 
some old drives and do a "test" run firstjust to be sure I've gotten 
the hang of it! Thanks again everyone!



EGO II
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Re: Swapping HDD....

[staticsafe]

On 12/26/12 21:50, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
> I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB  SATA HD. I'm
> finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I
> have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I
> do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as
> the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from
> my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I
> be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my
> applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would
> be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> EGO II

It is certainly possible. I find Clonezilla[0] to be very useful in
matters such as these.

[0] - http://clonezilla.org/

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Re: [Bulk] Swapping HDD....

[Phil Savoie]

On 12/26/2012 09:50 PM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:

I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB SATA HD. I'm
finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I
have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I
do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as
the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from
my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I
be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my
applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would
be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!


EGO II

Hi,

I just replaced a smaller drive to a larger one much like you want to 
do.  My procedure was the following:


- get a copy of clonezilla and clone the drive to an external usb drive

- replace the small drive with the larger drive

- use clonezilla to populate the larger drive

- you will note that the larger drive is a clone of the smaller one, so 
you will need to grow it


- get a copy of the "System Rescue CD", boot off it and use gparted to 
grow the cloned filesystem to fill out the drive


Hope this helps,

Phil
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Re: Swapping HDD....

[Sam Varshavchik]

fred smith writes:


if that doesn't get you where you need to go, you might try:
--with the new drive connected via USB
--boot from the aforementioned live CD
--create the partitions as you want them
--pray a while...
--copy all the files from each partition on the OLD drive into the
  matching partition on the NEW drive (using something akin to
  "cp -a /dev/sd ").


I do not believe that cp -a will do the right thing with hard links.

I think you want to use "rsync -a -H -A -X -S".


--install GRUB on the new drive
--oh yeah, pray some more :)
--swap new into the computer and see what you get.


It's going to be easier to swap the drive first, then boot off a live CD or  
an installation CD, let it mount the partitions on the hard drive, then drop  
to a rescue shell, then chroot /mnt/sysimage and then /sbin/grub2-install.




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Re: Swapping HDD....

[fred smith]

On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 09:50:07PM -0500, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
> I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB  SATA HD. I'm 
> finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I 
> have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I 
> do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as 
> the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from 
> my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I 
> be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my 
> applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would 
> be greatly appreciated!

I would THINK you could put the new drive in the USB enclosure then
--boot from a live cd
--use dd from the live cd to copy the entire old drive to the new drive
  MAKING SURE you you understand which /dev/whatever is the old drive, and
  which is the new drive before you start this step. You wouldn't want
  to copy a nice empty drive over your existing data...
--use gparted live CD or partitionmagic or some such to "slide" the
  partitions around on the new drive and adjust their sizes to fit
  the new drive
--then cross your fingers, pray a bit, then swap the OLD drive out
  and the new drive IN, pray a bit more, then see if the machine boots.

if that doesn't get you where you need to go, you might try:
--with the new drive connected via USB
--boot from the aforementioned live CD
--create the partitions as you want them
--pray a while...
--copy all the files from each partition on the OLD drive into the
  matching partition on the NEW drive (using something akin to
  "cp -a /dev/sd ").
--install GRUB on the new drive
--oh yeah, pray some more :)
--swap new into the computer and see what you get.

In either case, as long as you've been careful to NOT copy the new drive
on top of your old one, even if it doesn't work, all it's cost you is
some time. But I would expect either one of those to be doable.


-- 
 Fred Smith -- fre...@fcshome.stoneham.ma.us -
  The eyes of the Lord are everywhere, 
keeping watch on the wicked and the good.
- Proverbs 15:3 (niv) -
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Swapping HDD....

[Eddie G. O'Connor Jr.]

I am currently using a Gateway T-6321 laptop with a 320 GB  SATA HD. I'm 
finding it's running out of room, with all the pdf's and other files I 
have accumulated. I want to swap it out to a 750GB SATA HDD. How can I 
do this when I don't have another laptop with the same exact specs as 
the Gateway? In other words is it possible to transfer everything from 
my current HDD to the 750GB one using an external USB enclosure? will I 
be able to then install the 750GB HDD and have ALLmy settings and ALL my 
applications transfer over intact? Any help someone could provide would 
be greatly appreciated!


Thanks!


EGO II
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