Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-30 Thread Tom Horsley
On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 09:16:05 -0400
George N. White III wrote:

> SPICE has been deprecated inRHEL 8

And here I was hoping it would some day have 3D graphics
support :-).
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-30 Thread George N. White III
On Thu, 24 Dec 2020 at 13:29, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users <
users@lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 2020-12-23 at 18:15 +1000, Michael D. Setzer II via users wrote:
>
>
> I think if you try and run a local session and vnc session with both using
> gnome desktop there are issues with it. But I always run the vnc session
> with the xfce desktop and never had a problem. I've also had no problem
> running xfce locally with a vnc xfce session. Seems gnome is doing
> something with dbus, and causes a conflict with both sessions trying to
> use the same dbus settings??
>
>
> My situation is similar, except that I use MATE exclusively. I am trying
> to understand why the upstream maintainer's solution allows only a single
> TigerVNC logon using a particular UserID. In other words, if I have a local
> USER-A and a TigerVNC USER-A, if one is logged on the other cannot. Does
> this mean that a TigerVNC USER-A will not have access to local USER-A's
> home directory, and vice versa. If so, this is ludicrous.
>
> If TigerVNC has been so badly mangled in the name of systemd support, what
> alternative VNC can folks recommend in its place? I seriously need one to
> support development of virtual machines hosted on a server with huge
> storage, and the local console of that storage machine is not in a suitable
> place for development.
>

My use case needs VM's with a number of default installs of popular linux
distros in order to support specialized applications for users scattered
around the globe, so I can't avoid GNOME.   With Fedora 29-32 I was using
SPICE on the console of the system (located in a different building, so not
always convenient) that hosted the VM's.   Fedora 33 came along at the same
time as new versions of the applications and some new hardware, so I
haven't had time to look after the VM's.   Getting remote access to the
VM's is on my todo list.

Some of my colleagues use macOS so I may need to add that to the mix.

SPICE ("The SPICE project aims to provide a complete open source solution
for remote access to virtual machines in a seamless way so you can play
videos, record audio, share usb devices and share folders without
complications." --https://www.spice-space.org/index.html), is not a
long-term option:

SPICE has been deprecated inRHEL 8


In RHEL 8.3, the SPICE remote display protocol has been deprecated. Note
that SPICE will remain supported in RHEL 8, but Red Hat recommends using
alternate solutions for remote display streaming:


   - For remote console access, use the VNC protocol.
  - For advanced remote display functions, use third party tools such
  as RDP, HP RGS, or Mechdyne TGX.

I have used VirtualBox RDP support in an "enterprise" environment where
Windows was the "desktop standard", but I'm not familiar with  HP RGS

or Mechdyne TGX
.
 Both are commercial.  HP RGS is now called* HP ZCentral Remote Boost.*



-- 
George N. White III
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-29 Thread Ed Greshko

On 30/12/2020 02:01, Matthew Miller wrote:

On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 01:21:08AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

On Tue, Dec 29, 2020 at 08:34:49AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory

sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass

That isn't necessary if one has copied their public key to the
~/.ssh/authorized_keys file on the remote host running which is running
libvirtd.

Is that what it's complaining about? I assumed it wasn't properly getting
the key from the GNOME keyring and therefore needed to run that to unlock
it.

Yes.  That is why it says "ssh".

Well, it specifically says that ssh-askpass is not found, not "ssh
authentication denied". So there might be a key that exists but isn't
unlocked.


You're right.

I just realized that all of my ssh keys were generated with empty pass phrases. 
 To add to my confused
state, I did a test from a VM which was installed via the Xfce spin.  Unlike 
Workstation and the KDE spin,
the Xfce spin installs openssh-askpass by default which I did not realize.

Now, with that in mind, it would have been good to know *how* the OP was 
starting virt-manager since
these are 3 observations.  With the ssh key and a pass phrase.

1.  Starting virt-manager from the command line and openssh-askpass installed 
one gets a GUI pop-up
requesting pass phrase.

2.  Starting virt-manager from the command line without openssh-askpass 
installed one gets a prompt
in the terminal for the pass-phrase.

3.  Starting virt-manager from the menu without openssh-askpass installed 
results in a pop-up as noted
by the OP.  "Configure SSH key access for the remote host, or install an SSH askpass 
package locally."

So, knowing #3 wold have given me a better chance of actually recreating the 
error.  :-) :-)

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-29 Thread Matthew Miller
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 01:21:08AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:
> >On Tue, Dec 29, 2020 at 08:34:49AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:
> exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory
> >>>sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass
> >>That isn't necessary if one has copied their public key to the
> >>~/.ssh/authorized_keys file on the remote host running which is running
> >>libvirtd.
> >Is that what it's complaining about? I assumed it wasn't properly getting
> >the key from the GNOME keyring and therefore needed to run that to unlock
> >it.
> Yes.  That is why it says "ssh".

Well, it specifically says that ssh-askpass is not found, not "ssh
authentication denied". So there might be a key that exists but isn't
unlocked.


-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-29 Thread Ed Greshko

On 30/12/2020 00:51, Matthew Miller wrote:

On Tue, Dec 29, 2020 at 08:34:49AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory

sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass

That isn't necessary if one has copied their public key to the
~/.ssh/authorized_keys file on the remote host running which is running
libvirtd.

Is that what it's complaining about? I assumed it wasn't properly getting
the key from the GNOME keyring and therefore needed to run that to unlock
it.




Yes.  That is why it says "ssh".

Did you define the connection in virt-manager?  If you did, didn't you find it 
"odd" that there was no
"password" field to enter?

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-29 Thread Matthew Miller
On Tue, Dec 29, 2020 at 08:34:49AM +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:
> >>exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory
> >sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass
> 
> That isn't necessary if one has copied their public key to the
> ~/.ssh/authorized_keys file on the remote host running which is running
> libvirtd.

Is that what it's complaining about? I assumed it wasn't properly getting
the key from the GNOME keyring and therefore needed to run that to unlock
it.


-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-28 Thread Ed Greshko

On 29/12/2020 05:56, Matthew Miller wrote:

exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory

sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass


That isn't necessary if one has copied their public key to the 
~/.ssh/authorized_keys file on the
remote host running which is running libvirtd.

FWIW, one of the first things I do when configuring a new system is to disable 
passwords for ssh connections
and only allow public key authentication.

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-28 Thread Matthew Miller
On Mon, Dec 28, 2020 at 11:58:35AM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users 
wrote:
> Now disperse this scenario. Run virt-manager on the laptop and create a
> VM on the storage server. To test the correct configuration of the VM,
> I will need to have a VNC installed in that VM and connect to it from
> the Windows PC. If I need to make any changes, I'll go back to the VNC
> client on the laptop and make any mods required.

You do not need to have VNC installed _in_ the VM. Just configure the VM
_with_ VNC.


> The trouble with this dispersal concept is that the various components
> don't cooperate permissions-wise. This is partly due to classic rwx
> permissions, partly systemd misconfiguration, and partly other stuff I
> haven't quite figured out.

[...]

> exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory

sudo dnf install /usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass





-- 
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Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-28 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Mon, 2020-12-28 at 07:17 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:
> On 28/12/2020 06:04, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:
> > Here's the environment:
> > 
> > Bulk storage server for whole home
> > - 45drives.com Storinator
> > - 1 of 3 payload bays populated with 15 x 4TB drives in a 39 TB ZFS
> > raidz3 array
> > - OS is CentOS 8.3 with array
> > - NFS shared as /tank
> > - /etc/exports  contains   /tank
> >  192.168.1.0/24(rw/sync,root_squash)
> > - samba not yet configured
> > 
> > Linux laptop
> > - ThinkKPad P72 with 2 TB NVME boot drive
> > - OS is Fedora 33
> > - /etc/fstab contains   store:/tank /tank nfs defaults 0 0
> > - tank array mounted on /tank
> > 
> > Windows 10 Pro PC
> > 
> > My original concept was to create a 240 GB VM in the /tank/VM/
> > space and prototype C7, C8, or F33 versions of a physical storage
> > server at a client site with a 240 GB SSD boot drive and 4 x 500 GB
> > LVM RAID5 array served out with Samba to multiple client PCs and
> > MACs.
> > 
> > I wanted to use a TigerVNC client on the Linux laptop to set up and
> > configure the 240 GB VM on the storage server, but because the
> > upstream author has munged its systemd conversion this is no longer
> > possible. I also wanted to use RDP to connect the Windows PC to
> > test samba connections on the VM running TigerVNC server.
> > 
> > Unfortunately I've run into permissions hell and can get none of
> > these working. I would like to find an alternative to TigerVNC that
> > will work in the target environment.
> 
> To verify.
> 
> 1.  The VM's disk will be located on the file system mounted on that
> laptop at /tank in a subdirectory VM.
> 2.  The VM is running on the laptop.  That is, the laptop is running
> virt-manager.  Meaning the laptop is the host.
> 3.  Your user is a member of the libvirt group.
> 
> (Ignoring for the moment that it isn't clear to me what you mean by,
> and where the 240 GB SSD boot drive
> and 4 x 500 GB LVM RAID5 array resides.  And/or, if that storage is
> to be part of the C7, C8 VM's in some
> manner.)
> 
> If the above is true, then I see no need to connect to the storage
> server via VNC.
> 
> On the laptop I would run something akin to
> 
> qemu-img create -f qcow2 /tank/VM/F33.qcow2 240G
> 
> Then running virt-manager on the laptop follow the steps to create a
> new VM and in the step to create or choose
> the storage location point to /tank/VM/F33.qcow2.

Ed,

Imagine I were trying to do all this on one machine. I would use virt-
manager to create a 240 GB VM on the laptop and install a working copy
of the client's fileserver OS there. (I would also create a small Samba
disk later to test operation from a Windows PC, but let's not get
tripped up on that just yet.)

Now disperse this scenario. Run virt-manager on the laptop and create a
VM on the storage server. To test the correct configuration of the VM,
I will need to have a VNC installed in that VM and connect to it from
the Windows PC. If I need to make any changes, I'll go back to the VNC
client on the laptop and make any mods required.

The trouble with this dispersal concept is that the various components
don't cooperate permissions-wise. This is partly due to classic rwx
permissions, partly systemd misconfiguration, and partly other stuff I
haven't quite figured out.

I should point out that the storage server is not in a convenient
location, which is why I want it to have a VNC server and also one in
each of the VMs I build in its payload bay. Simple ssh connections
without desktops aren't enough.

And I have created the 240 GB image file on the storage server:

# ls -l /tank/VMs/
total 1
-rwxrw-rw-. 1 doc doc 257698037760 Dec 26 10:57 U-Studios.img

The problem is the virt-manager on my laptop can't connect to it.

# dir /tank/VMs/
total 1
-rw---. 1 root root 257698037760 Dec 26 10:57 U-Studios.img

Virtual Machine Manager Connectiono libvirt
qemu+ssh://doc@storinator/system.
Configure SSH key access for the remote host, or install an SSH askpass
package locally.
Would you still like to remember this connection?

Details:

Unable to connect to libvirt qemu+ssh://doc@storinator/system.

Configure SSH key access for the remote host, or install an SSH askpass
package locally.

Libvirt URI is: qemu+ssh://doc@storinator/system

Traceback (most recent call last):
File "/usr/share/virt-manager/virtManager/connection.py", line 922, in
_do_open
self._backend.open(cb, data)
File "/usr/share/virt-manager/virtinst/connection.py", line 153, in
open
conn = libvirt.openAuth(self._open_uri,
File "/usr/lib64/python3.9/site-packages/libvirt.py", line 104, in
openAuth
if ret is None:raise libvirtError('virConnectOpenAuth() failed')
libvirt.libvirtError: Cannot recv data: ssh_askpass:
exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or directory
Permission denied, please try again.
ssh_askpass: exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-askpass): No such file or
directory
Permission denied, please try again.
ssh_askpass: exec(/usr/libexec/openssh/ssh-

Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-27 Thread Ed Greshko

On 28/12/2020 06:04, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:

Here's the environment:

Bulk storage server for whole home
- 45drives.com Storinator
- 1 of 3 payload bays populated with 15 x 4TB drives in a 39 TB ZFS raidz3 array
- OS is CentOS 8.3 with array
- NFS shared as /tank
- /etc/exports  contains   /tank  192.168.1.0/24(rw/sync,root_squash)
- samba not yet configured

Linux laptop
- ThinkKPad P72 with 2 TB NVME boot drive
- OS is Fedora 33
- /etc/fstab contains   store:/tank /tank nfs defaults 0 0
- tank array mounted on /tank

Windows 10 Pro PC

My original concept was to create a 240 GB VM in the /tank/VM/ space and 
prototype C7, C8, or F33 versions of a physical storage server at a client site 
with a 240 GB SSD boot drive and 4 x 500 GB LVM RAID5 array served out with 
Samba to multiple client PCs and MACs.

I wanted to use a TigerVNC client on the Linux laptop to set up and configure 
the 240 GB VM on the storage server, but because the upstream author has munged 
its systemd conversion this is no longer possible. I also wanted to use RDP to 
connect the Windows PC to test samba connections on the VM running TigerVNC 
server.

Unfortunately I've run into permissions hell and can get none of these working. 
I would like to find an alternative to TigerVNC that will work in the target 
environment.


To verify.

1.  The VM's disk will be located on the file system mounted on that laptop at 
/tank in a subdirectory VM.
2.  The VM is running on the laptop.  That is, the laptop is running 
virt-manager.  Meaning the laptop is the host.
3.  Your user is a member of the libvirt group.

(Ignoring for the moment that it isn't clear to me what you mean by, and where 
the 240 GB SSD boot drive
and 4 x 500 GB LVM RAID5 array resides.  And/or, if that storage is to be part 
of the C7, C8 VM's in some
manner.)

If the above is true, then I see no need to connect to the storage server via 
VNC.

On the laptop I would run something akin to

qemu-img create -f qcow2 /tank/VM/F33.qcow2 240G

Then running virt-manager on the laptop follow the steps to create a new VM and 
in the step to create or choose
the storage location point to /tank/VM/F33.qcow2.


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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-27 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Sun, 2020-12-27 at 12:14 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:
> On 27/12/2020 11:39, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:
> > Snapshot:  I want to build and use a 240 GB  C7.9 VM from my F33
> > laptop using NFS storage from a C8.3 server
> > 
> > Reality: You can't get there from here. At every step there's a
> > permissions blockage, and none is a simple rwx problem.
> 
> Do I understand you correctly when I say you want your C(entos) 7
> VM's disk storage to reside on
> your C(entos) NFS server?
> 
> If so, that is pretty much what I do.
> 
> My F33 desktop had several VM's defined.  While I don't use that much
> storage the F33 system has,
> for example.
> 
> [root@meimei images]# pwd
> /var/lib/libvirt/images
> 
> [root@meimei images]# ll f33k.qcow2
> lrwxrwxrwx. 1 root root 27 Aug 29 16:35 f33k.qcow2 -> /aux/qemu-
> images/f33k.qcow2
> 
> [root@meimei images]# df -T | grep aux
> nas:/volume1/aux nfs4 5621463168 1946477440 3674985728  35% /aux
> 
> The system "nas" is a Synology NFS server.

Ed,

Here's the environment:

Bulk storage server for whole home
- 45drives.com Storinator
- 1 of 3 payload bays populated with 15 x 4TB drives in a 39 TB ZFS
raidz3 array
- OS is CentOS 8.3 with array
- NFS shared as /tank
- /etc/exports  contains   /tank  192.168.1.0/24(rw/sync,root_squash)
- samba not yet configured

Linux laptop
- ThinkKPad P72 with 2 TB NVME boot drive
- OS is Fedora 33
- /etc/fstab contains   store:/tank /tank nfs defaults 0 0
- tank array mounted on /tank

Windows 10 Pro PC

My original concept was to create a 240 GB VM in the /tank/VM/ space
and prototype C7, C8, or F33 versions of a physical storage server at a
client site with a 240 GB SSD boot drive and 4 x 500 GB LVM RAID5 array
served out with Samba to multiple client PCs and MACs.

I wanted to use a TigerVNC client on the Linux laptop to set up and
configure the 240 GB VM on the storage server, but because the upstream
author has munged its systemd conversion this is no longer possible. I
also wanted to use RDP to connect the Windows PC to test samba
connections on the VM running TigerVNC server.

Unfortunately I've run into permissions hell and can get none of these
working. I would like to find an alternative to TigerVNC that will work
in the target environment.

--Doc Savage
    Fairview Heights, IL
 
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-27 Thread Matthew Miller
On Sat, Dec 26, 2020 at 09:39:53PM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users 
wrote:
> > For this use case, have you considered using the built-in VNC
> > functionality of virt-manager?
> Snapshot:  I want to build and use a 240 GB  C7.9 VM from my F33 laptop
> using NFS storage from a C8.3 server
> 
> Reality: You can't get there from here. At every step there's a
> permissions blockage, and none is a simple rwx problem.

I have set up and managed CentOS VMs on a remote CentOS server using
virt-manager on Fedora. This was our primary way of working with a
collection of systems at a previous job. One can definitely get there.

Have you looked at the approach I'm suggesting?


-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-27 Thread Ed Greshko

On 27/12/2020 12:14, Ed Greshko wrote:

On 27/12/2020 11:39, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:

Snapshot:  I want to build and use a 240 GB  C7.9 VM from my F33 laptop using 
NFS storage from a C8.3 server

Reality: You can't get there from here. At every step there's a permissions 
blockage, and none is a simple rwx problem.


Do I understand you correctly when I say you want your C(entos) 7 VM's disk 
storage to reside on
your C(entos) NFS server?

If so, that is pretty much what I do.

My F33 desktop had several VM's defined.  While I don't use that much storage 
the F33 system has,
for example.

[root@meimei images]# pwd
/var/lib/libvirt/images

[root@meimei images]# ll f33k.qcow2
lrwxrwxrwx. 1 root root 27 Aug 29 16:35 f33k.qcow2 -> 
/aux/qemu-images/f33k.qcow2

[root@meimei images]# df -T | grep aux
nas:/volume1/aux nfs4 5621463168 1946477440 3674985728  35% /aux

The system "nas" is a Synology NFS server.



Oh, and FWIW, I also use qemu-img to create a qcow2 file directly on 
/aux/qemu-images and
point to that file when creating the VM.

The advantage to that is one can thin-provision the qcow2 file to "save" space.

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-26 Thread Ed Greshko

On 27/12/2020 11:39, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:

Snapshot:  I want to build and use a 240 GB  C7.9 VM from my F33 laptop using 
NFS storage from a C8.3 server

Reality: You can't get there from here. At every step there's a permissions 
blockage, and none is a simple rwx problem.


Do I understand you correctly when I say you want your C(entos) 7 VM's disk 
storage to reside on
your C(entos) NFS server?

If so, that is pretty much what I do.

My F33 desktop had several VM's defined.  While I don't use that much storage 
the F33 system has,
for example.

[root@meimei images]# pwd
/var/lib/libvirt/images

[root@meimei images]# ll f33k.qcow2
lrwxrwxrwx. 1 root root 27 Aug 29 16:35 f33k.qcow2 -> 
/aux/qemu-images/f33k.qcow2

[root@meimei images]# df -T | grep aux
nas:/volume1/aux nfs4 5621463168 1946477440 3674985728  35% /aux

The system "nas" is a Synology NFS server.

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-26 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Thu, 2020-12-24 at 13:47 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 24, 2020 at 12:30:19PM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via
> users wrote:
> > The primary mission of the server is mass storage (19 TB ZFS).
> > Direct
> > console (MATE) and ssh connections meet those needs just fine. It's
> > the
> > new mission objective of using that huge back-end storage space for
> > creating virtual machines to prototype new client servers (not yet
> > purchased). A VNC supporting the MATE desktop would be ideal since
> > the
> > local console is located in an inconvenient space. My plans to use
> > TigerVNC to access virtual machines on this server now seem to be
> > torpedoed.
> 
> For this use case, have you considered using the built-in VNC
> functionality
> of virt-manager?

Matt,

Snapshot:  I want to build and use a 240 GB  C7.9 VM from my F33 laptop
using NFS storage from a C8.3 server

Reality: You can't get there from here. At every step there's a
permissions blockage, and none is a simple rwx problem.

--Doc Savage
    Fairview Heights, IL
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-24 Thread Ed Greshko

On 25/12/2020 02:47, Matthew Miller wrote:

On Thu, Dec 24, 2020 at 12:30:19PM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users 
wrote:

The primary mission of the server is mass storage (19 TB ZFS). Direct
console (MATE) and ssh connections meet those needs just fine. It's the
new mission objective of using that huge back-end storage space for
creating virtual machines to prototype new client servers (not yet
purchased). A VNC supporting the MATE desktop would be ideal since the
local console is located in an inconvenient space. My plans to use
TigerVNC to access virtual machines on this server now seem to be
torpedoed.

For this use case, have you considered using the built-in VNC functionality
of virt-manager?


When it comes to connecting to a VM I use remmina along with the 
remmina-plugins-spice.
Works fine, and there is no need to configure a VNC server on the VM.

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-24 Thread Matthew Miller
On Thu, Dec 24, 2020 at 12:30:19PM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users 
wrote:
> The primary mission of the server is mass storage (19 TB ZFS). Direct
> console (MATE) and ssh connections meet those needs just fine. It's the
> new mission objective of using that huge back-end storage space for
> creating virtual machines to prototype new client servers (not yet
> purchased). A VNC supporting the MATE desktop would be ideal since the
> local console is located in an inconvenient space. My plans to use
> TigerVNC to access virtual machines on this server now seem to be
> torpedoed.

For this use case, have you considered using the built-in VNC functionality
of virt-manager?



-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-24 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Thu, 2020-12-24 at 13:07 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 24, 2020 at 11:29:02AM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via
> users wrote:
> > what alternative VNC can folks recommend in its place? I seriously
> > need
> > one to support development of virtual machines hosted on a server
> > with
> > huge storage, and the local console of that storage machine is not
> > in a
> > suitable place for development.
> 
> Does X2Go work for your use cases?
> 
> https://wiki.x2go.org/doku.php/start
> 
> Or, wait, since you're running VMs, have you considered using VNC as
> the
> graphics console for your VMs and connecting directly?
> 
> 
> -- 
> Matthew Miller
> 
> Fedora Project Leader

Matt,

The primary mission of the server is mass storage (19 TB ZFS). Direct
console (MATE) and ssh connections meet those needs just fine. It's the
new mission objective of using that huge back-end storage space for
creating virtual machines to prototype new client servers (not yet
purchased). A VNC supporting the MATE desktop would be ideal since the
local console is located in an inconvenient space. My plans to use
TigerVNC to access virtual machines on this server now seem to be
torpedoed.

--Doc Savage
    Fairview Heights, IL
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-24 Thread Matthew Miller
On Thu, Dec 24, 2020 at 11:29:02AM -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users 
wrote:
> what alternative VNC can folks recommend in its place? I seriously need
> one to support development of virtual machines hosted on a server with
> huge storage, and the local console of that storage machine is not in a
> suitable place for development.

Does X2Go work for your use cases?

https://wiki.x2go.org/doku.php/start

Or, wait, since you're running VMs, have you considered using VNC as the
graphics console for your VMs and connecting directly?


-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-24 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Wed, 2020-12-23 at 18:15 +1000, Michael D. Setzer II via users
wrote:
> On 22 Dec 2020 at 23:04, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> 
> Subject:    Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??
> To: Community support for Fedora users 
> 
> From:   Samuel Sieb 
> Date sent:  Tue, 22 Dec 2020 23:04:46 -0800
> Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora users 
> 
> 
> > On 12/22/20 10:06 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:
> > > On 22 Dec 2020 at 20:28, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> > > > On 12/22/20 8:13 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:
> > > > > Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into
> > > > > that user id,
> > > > > since it is configured for only the vnc session on that
> > > > > user??
> > > > 
> > > > That doesn't make sense.  Can you explain what you mean?
> > > 
> > > Never said it made sense. Just what it is.
> > > 
> > > If you set up a user account they way they say. It will start a
> > > vnc session
> > > on boot up with that user and that port. You can then vnc into
> > > the
> > > computer on that port and use the computer.
> > > 
> > > If you try to log in locally on that computer with that user id,
> > > the log in
> > > doesn't work, and it goes immediately back to the log in screen..
> > 
> > Oh, that's what you mean.  I thought you meant you couldn't ssh
> > into it 
> > using that user or something like that.  Ok, then that's just the
> > same 
> > thing that you were saying further down.  You can't have multiple 
> > graphical sessions for the same user.  It just doesn't work.  Have
> > you 
> > ever been able to do that with vncserver?  It's never worked for
> > me.  Or 
> > it sort of worked briefly, but sooner or later things go badly
> > wrong.
> 
> I think if you try and run a local session and vnc session with both
> using 
> gnome desktop there are issues with it. But I always run the vnc
> session 
> with the xfce desktop and never had a problem. I've also had no
> problem 
> running xfce locally with a vnc xfce session. Seems gnome is doing 
> something with dbus, and causes a conflict with both sessions trying
> to 
> use the same dbus settings??

My situation is similar, except that I use MATE exclusively. I am
trying to understand why the upstream maintainer's solution allows only
a single TigerVNC logon using a particular UserID. In other words, if I
have a local USER-A and a TigerVNC USER-A, if one is logged on the
other cannot. Does this mean that a TigerVNC USER-A will not have
access to local USER-A's home directory, and vice versa. If so, this is
ludicrous.

If TigerVNC has been so badly mangled in the name of systemd support,
what alternative VNC can folks recommend in its place? I seriously need
one to support development of virtual machines hosted on a server with
huge storage, and the local console of that storage machine is not in a
suitable place for development.

--Doc Savage
    Fairview Heights, IL
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-23 Thread Michael D. Setzer II via users
On 22 Dec 2020 at 23:04, Samuel Sieb wrote:

Subject:Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??
To: Community support for Fedora users 

From:   Samuel Sieb 
Date sent:  Tue, 22 Dec 2020 23:04:46 -0800
Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora users 


> On 12/22/20 10:06 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:
> > On 22 Dec 2020 at 20:28, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> >> On 12/22/20 8:13 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:
> >>> Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into that user id,
> >>> since it is configured for only the vnc session on that user??
> >>
> >> That doesn't make sense.  Can you explain what you mean?
> > 
> > Never said it made sense. Just what it is.
> > 
> > If you set up a user account they way they say. It will start a vnc session
> > on boot up with that user and that port. You can then vnc into the
> > computer on that port and use the computer.
> > 
> > If you try to log in locally on that computer with that user id, the log in
> > doesn't work, and it goes immediately back to the log in screen..
> 
> Oh, that's what you mean.  I thought you meant you couldn't ssh into it 
> using that user or something like that.  Ok, then that's just the same 
> thing that you were saying further down.  You can't have multiple 
> graphical sessions for the same user.  It just doesn't work.  Have you 
> ever been able to do that with vncserver?  It's never worked for me.  Or 
> it sort of worked briefly, but sooner or later things go badly wrong.

I think if you try and run a local session and vnc session with both using 
gnome desktop there are issues with it. But I always run the vnc session 
with the xfce desktop and never had a problem. I've also had no problem 
running xfce locally with a vnc xfce session. Seems gnome is doing 
something with dbus, and causes a conflict with both sessions trying to 
use the same dbus settings??





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 Guam - Where America's Day Begins
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Samuel Sieb

On 12/22/20 10:06 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:

On 22 Dec 2020 at 20:28, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 12/22/20 8:13 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:

Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into that user id,
since it is configured for only the vnc session on that user??


That doesn't make sense.  Can you explain what you mean?


Never said it made sense. Just what it is.

If you set up a user account they way they say. It will start a vnc session
on boot up with that user and that port. You can then vnc into the
computer on that port and use the computer.

If you try to log in locally on that computer with that user id, the log in
doesn't work, and it goes immediately back to the log in screen..


Oh, that's what you mean.  I thought you meant you couldn't ssh into it 
using that user or something like that.  Ok, then that's just the same 
thing that you were saying further down.  You can't have multiple 
graphical sessions for the same user.  It just doesn't work.  Have you 
ever been able to do that with vncserver?  It's never worked for me.  Or 
it sort of worked briefly, but sooner or later things go badly wrong.

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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Michael D. Setzer II via users
On 22 Dec 2020 at 20:28, Samuel Sieb wrote:

Subject:Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??
To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org
From:   Samuel Sieb 
Date sent:  Tue, 22 Dec 2020 20:28:21 -0800
Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora users 


> On 12/22/20 8:13 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:
> > Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into that user id,
> > since it is configured for only the vnc session on that user??
> 
> That doesn't make sense.  Can you explain what you mean?

Never said it made sense. Just what it is.

If you set up a user account they way they say. It will start a vnc session 
on boot up with that user and that port. You can then vnc into the 
computer on that port and use the computer.

If you try to log in locally on that computer with that user id, the log in 
doesn't work, and it goes immediately back to the log in screen..

You can log in locally on the machine with a different user that doesn't 
have the vnc setup, and you can then use the vncviewer to connect to the 
same machine with that user? 

Seems to solve the problem of running a local and vnc gnome session at 
the same time, the solution is that you can only do one or the other.

Even if you want to run the vnc with a different desktop..

That is what I found... If someone finds different.


> 
> > Never got a clear answer on why they seem to think this is necessary,
> > and who  is pushing it. Have heard there were some issues with running
> > a local gnome and an vnc gnome at same time. I always ran the vnc with
> > xfce so never had an issue. Had lines in rc.local that would start the
> > vncserver for users at boot up using runuser option.
> 
> Of course you can't run them both at the same time.  Both Gnome sessions 
> are going to be trying to run the same processes and they'll conflict. 
> If you run a simpler desktop system that doesn't use dbus or multiple 
> processes, then it might be ok to run both.  But you still might end up 
> with conflicting file writes for configs or caches.
> 
> > Their is now a new config file in the ~/.vnc directory that is suppose to
> > start up things, but last time I tested it. I was giving errors if you 
> > tried to
> > setup a session option.
> 
> Works fine for me.  I have it setup for openbox.
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 mailto:msetze...@gmail.com
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++


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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Samuel Sieb

On 12/22/20 8:13 PM, Michael D. Setzer II wrote:

Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into that user id,
since it is configured for only the vnc session on that user??


That doesn't make sense.  Can you explain what you mean?


Never got a clear answer on why they seem to think this is necessary,
and who  is pushing it. Have heard there were some issues with running
a local gnome and an vnc gnome at same time. I always ran the vnc with
xfce so never had an issue. Had lines in rc.local that would start the
vncserver for users at boot up using runuser option.


Of course you can't run them both at the same time.  Both Gnome sessions 
are going to be trying to run the same processes and they'll conflict. 
If you run a simpler desktop system that doesn't use dbus or multiple 
processes, then it might be ok to run both.  But you still might end up 
with conflicting file writes for configs or caches.



Their is now a new config file in the ~/.vnc directory that is suppose to
start up things, but last time I tested it. I was giving errors if you tried to
setup a session option.


Works fine for me.  I have it setup for openbox.
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Michael D. Setzer II
On 22 Dec 2020 at 19:14, Tom Horsley wrote:

Date sent:  Tue, 22 Dec 2020 19:14:37 -0500
From:   Tom Horsley 
To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Subject:Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??
Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora users 


> On Tue, 22 Dec 2020 18:05:05 -0600
> Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:
> 
> > When I followed the TigerVNC installation and configuration
> > instructions in the F33 SysAdmin Guide
> 
> I took a different tack: I copied the vncserver script off my
> f32 partition, and it worked fine :-).

It is totally screwed up. More talk on the vnc list.
The vncserver disappeared with an update on Fedora 32, but then they 
put it back with info on the change. Rather than keeping it simple with 
the vncserver, they want to move it to systemd and require all kinds of 
hoops to jump thru and make it a lot less useful. Have to have an 
administrator add user and port to the /etc/tigervnc/vncserver.user
:port=user

# TigerVNC User assignment
#
# This file assigns users to specific VNC display numbers.
# The syntax is =. E.g.:
#
# :2=andrew
# :3=lisa

Then you have to systemctl enable for that port.

Then on startup. I will start the vnc.

Problem is: If it works, you can no longer locally log into that user id, 
since it is configured for only the vnc session on that user??

Never got a clear answer on why they seem to think this is necessary, 
and who  is pushing it. Have heard there were some issues with running 
a local gnome and an vnc gnome at same time. I always ran the vnc with 
xfce so never had an issue. Had lines in rc.local that would start the 
vncserver for users at boot up using runuser option. 

New setup is letter root (systemd) start the vncsession option. 

Their is now a new config file in the ~/.vnc directory that is suppose to 
start up things, but last time I tested it. I was giving errors if you tried to 
setup a session option. 

So, on my fedora 32 machines I downgraded the tigervncserver to before 
the upgrade, and exclude the update. Haven't figured what I will do later.

Worked fine with setup using xfce option, so not sure if this is coming 
from gnome or tigervnc or someone that thinks they know best for 
everyone...




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 mailto:msetze...@gmail.com
 Guam - Where America's Day Begins
 G4L Disk Imaging Project maintainer 
 http://sourceforge.net/projects/g4l/
++


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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Samuel Sieb

On 12/22/20 4:05 PM, Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:
When I followed the TigerVNC installation and configuration instructions 
in the F33 SysAdmin Guide, I suspected something had been overtaken by 
systemctl. But when I followed the instructions in link [2], I'm still 
getting pretty much the same unhelpful error:


If you followed the instructions in the sysadmin guide, you will most 
likely have to undo everything you did or it won't work.
The instructions in that second link which is also at 
/usr/share/doc/tigervnc/HOWTO.md are the correct ones.


Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[153994]: 
vncserver@:1.service: Failed to execute command: Permission denied
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[153994]: 
vncserver@:1.service: Failed at step EXEC spawning /sbin/runuser: 
Permission denied


Check the journal to see if there is any more information.
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Tom Horsley
On Tue, 22 Dec 2020 18:05:05 -0600
Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users wrote:

> When I followed the TigerVNC installation and configuration
> instructions in the F33 SysAdmin Guide

I took a different tack: I copied the vncserver script off my
f32 partition, and it worked fine :-).
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-12-22 Thread Robert G. (Doc) Savage via users
On Wed, 2020-09-16 at 16:54 -0400, Ben Cotton wrote:
> It looks like what happened is that the upstream project removed that
> wrapper script. This kind of update probably shouldn't have been
> submitted for Fedora 32, but now that it's in the wild, I've opened a
> bug[1] to request the package maintainer add a script that points
> users to new instructions. You can see the new instructions in the
> HOWTO.md file in the package repo[2].
> 
> [1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1879739
> [2]
> https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/tigervnc/blob/518baca222c94fb7f4499f5426dd0d10e4b419e7/f/HOWTO.md
> 
> -- 
> Ben Cotton
> He / Him / His
> Senior Program Manager, Fedora & CentOS Stream
> Red Hat
> TZ=America/Indiana/Indianapolise

Ben,

When I followed the TigerVNC installation and configuration
instructions in the F33 SysAdmin Guide, I suspected something had been
overtaken by systemctl. But when I followed the instructions in link
[2], I'm still getting pretty much the same unhelpful error:

# systemctl start vncserver@:1
Job for vncserver@:1.service failed because the control process exited
with error code.
See "systemctl status vncserver@:1.service" and "journalctl -xe" for
details.

# systemctl status vncserver@:1.service
* vncserver@:1.service - Remote desktop service (VNC)
Loaded: loaded (/etc/systemd/system/vncserver@.service; disabled;
vendor preset: disabled)
Active: failed (Result: exit-code) since Tue 2020-12-22 18:02:39 CST;
23s ago
Process: 153994 ExecStart=/sbin/runuser -l doc -c /usr/bin/vncserver :1
-geometry 1280x1024 (code=exited, status=203/EXEC)
CPU: 1ms

Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[1]: Starting Remote desktop
service (VNC)...
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[153994]:
vncserver@:1.service: Failed to execute command: Permission denied
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[153994]:
vncserver@:1.service: Failed at step EXEC spawning /sbin/runuser:
Permission denied
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[1]: vncserver@:1.service:
Control process exited, code=exited, status=203/EXEC
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[1]: vncserver@:1.service:
Failed with result 'exit-code'.
Dec 22 18:02:39 tiger.protogeek.org systemd[1]: Failed to start Remote
desktop service (VNC).


What does 203/EXEC mean to you??

--Doc Savage
    Fairview Heights, IL
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-09-16 Thread Tom Horsley
On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 16:54:55 -0400
Ben Cotton wrote:

> You can see the new instructions in the
> HOWTO.md file in the package repo

More frigging systemd fungus engulfing the world, huh?

Soon there will be no commands left in linux other than systemctl.

Sheesh!
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-09-16 Thread Tom Horsley
On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 16:53:01 -0400
Tom Horsley wrote:

> No idea what that is about.

Found a man page saying x0vncserver is only for sharing the
physical X display, since the only times I ever use vncserver
is to create a separate instance of an X display not associated
with a physical display this sounds like a major chunk of
functionality just disappeared. Seems like a bug to me.
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-09-16 Thread Ben Cotton
It looks like what happened is that the upstream project removed that
wrapper script. This kind of update probably shouldn't have been
submitted for Fedora 32, but now that it's in the wild, I've opened a
bug[1] to request the package maintainer add a script that points
users to new instructions. You can see the new instructions in the
HOWTO.md file in the package repo[2].

[1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1879739
[2] 
https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/tigervnc/blob/518baca222c94fb7f4499f5426dd0d10e4b419e7/f/HOWTO.md

-- 
Ben Cotton
He / Him / His
Senior Program Manager, Fedora & CentOS Stream
Red Hat
TZ=America/Indiana/Indianapolis
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Re: vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-09-16 Thread Tom Horsley
On Thu, 17 Sep 2020 06:36:29 +1000
Michael D. Setzer II via users wrote:

> Have two machines running Fedora 32, and just noticed with the latest 
> update of tigervnc-server the vncserver is GONE?

I don't use vncserver very often, but I just did an update and
I see no /usr/bin/vncserver, but there is a /usr/bin/x0vncserver:

zooty> rpm -q -f /usr/bin/x0vncserver
tigervnc-server-1.11.0-1.fc32.x86_64

No idea what that is about.
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vncserver program disappered on FC32??

2020-09-16 Thread Michael D. Setzer II via users
Have two machines running Fedora 32, and just noticed with the latest 
update of tigervnc-server the vncserver is GONE?

Did a downgrade on both machines, and it is back and running just fine.

The one machine had rebooted, and therefor wasn't able to load the 
server. The other machine still had the server running from before the 
upgrade, so was able to vnc into it. 

The file from the /usr/bin director was just no longer there. Tried a 
reinstall, and still no file. Only the downgrade option restored it??

Not sure on how to report this. Didn't notice it until trying to vnc into 
machine that had rebooted? The dnf whatprovides shows that the 
program is included, so not sure what kind of error is in the latest 
update??

Thanks and be Safe...

++
 Michael D. Setzer II - Computer Science Instructor (Retired) 
 mailto:mi...@guam.net
 mailto:msetze...@gmail.com
 Guam - Where America's Day Begins
 G4L Disk Imaging Project maintainer 
 http://sourceforge.net/projects/g4l/
++


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