Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/27/2011 06:17 PM, Craig White wrote: > If you want to dance on the head of the pin suggesting that you never > actually said what you clearly inferred, then so be it. What you > specifically said... > No, you inferred. If anything, I implied. Even Cerebus the Aardvark knew the difference between the two. > "Have you considered poorfraeding your posts before sending them? It > will catch most of the things the spelling checker can't. HTH, HAND." > > No matter how much you endeavor to soften it up now that it is out > there, it was hostile, uncalled for and arrogant. > Really? What did I write that was hostile or arrogant? I offered a polite, friendly suggestion and even told him to Have A Nice Day[1]. Would it make you happier if I left this list? Are you so offended by what I said, even though it wasn't directed at you that you'd rather I didn't offer my assistance any longer? If so, just say the word and I'm gone. At this point, it's almost not worth the bother any longer. [1]HTH, HAND = Hope This Helps, Have A Nice Day. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sun, 2011-06-26 at 08:18 -0700, Joe Zeff wrote: > Don't fall prey to Ed's Big Lie: I never corrected his grammar, spelling > or syntax. I never acted as a Grammar Nazi. All I did was point out > that proofreading his email would help avoid him from making errors in > the future after *he corrected his own mistake.* Calling me a Grammar > Nazi IS A LIE! when did you stop beating your wife? If you want to dance on the head of the pin suggesting that you never actually said what you clearly inferred, then so be it. What you specifically said... "Have you considered poorfraeding your posts before sending them? It will catch most of the things the spelling checker can't. HTH, HAND." No matter how much you endeavor to soften it up now that it is out there, it was hostile, uncalled for and arrogant. I know how things like that happen because it sometimes happens to me. I write an e-mail, go back and change some of the wording without fully proofreading it yet again and the grammar which was probably acceptable when I typed the stream of conscious thought, got gnarled. Hardly worth the many e-mails, defensiveness and divisiveness that your posting engendered. Clearly Ed proofreads his messages - that is why he corrected himself in the first place. Even if he didn't proofread his messages, is it worth humiliating him by suggesting that he do so? Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On Sun, 2011-06-26 at 21:22 +0100, Marko Vojinovic wrote: > Well, I am one of the people who deliberately turn off the > spell-checker in my mail client (KMail). Why? Because I often compose > mails in non-English languages, sometimes mixing several languages in > the same e-mail, etc. And it gets on my nerves when the whole text of > my e-mail is underlined in red just because I am writing it in a > language that is not English. And if you write technical documents, just about every technical term, and other jargon, is marked out as being incorrect. I used to load up a old document in new word processors, and add every word *it* marked as incorrect as being correct, to try and get all the spell checker alerts out of the way, ahead of time. -- [tim@localhost ~]$ uname -r 2.6.27.25-78.2.56.fc9.i686 Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored. I read messages from the public lists. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On Sun, 2011-06-26 at 19:14 -0700, James McKenzie wrote: > I'm wondering if it will become, sometime in the future, possible to > write an article in OpenOffice like I do in Microsoft Word where I can > select the dictionary for only one word, if needed, and change > languages. No need to wait for the future. You can do that in the present. In fact IIRC that feature has existed for quite a while. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On 6/26/11 7:01 PM, Marko Vojinovic wrote: > Sure, but it's not possible to use them simultaneously, or have the machine > decide which dictionary should be used for a given paragraph and switch to > that one. Manually switching them is a pain, and just not worth the effort if > I > am mixing several languages in the same post. > > It is also impossible for the machine to know whether it is correct to say > color or colour in the given context. And there are people who will bicker > about it if I don't get it right (where the definition of "right" differs in > US > and UK, for example). ;-) Spell-checker is next to useless in these cases, > again unless I manually select the proper dictionary. If someone gets upset about this, they have way too much time on their hands. The 'or' versus 'our' is a long drawn out battle that most people decide to leave alone. I'm wondering if it will become, sometime in the future, possible to write an article in OpenOffice like I do in Microsoft Word where I can select the dictionary for only one word, if needed, and change languages. Not that I would try to embed Cyrillic into a Latin document just to see what would happen. BTW, someone decided that French was the language to use, and we are an English only shop. Led to interesting spelling 'errors' which were not. James McKenzie -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On Monday 27 June 2011 00:51:56 Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/26/2011 01:22 PM, Marko Vojinovic wrote: > > Well, I am one of the people who deliberately turn off the spell-checker > > in my mail client (KMail). > > Is it possible to install several dictionaries? Sure, but it's not possible to use them simultaneously, or have the machine decide which dictionary should be used for a given paragraph and switch to that one. Manually switching them is a pain, and just not worth the effort if I am mixing several languages in the same post. It is also impossible for the machine to know whether it is correct to say color or colour in the given context. And there are people who will bicker about it if I don't get it right (where the definition of "right" differs in US and UK, for example). ;-) Spell-checker is next to useless in these cases, again unless I manually select the proper dictionary. Best, :-) Marko -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 05:26 PM, James McKenzie wrote: > I did not see where you were a Grammar Nazi, and I have not considered > you one. And you do bring alot of knowledge to this list. I would > appreciate it if you chalk this one up to the eventual stupidity that > some folks demonstrate, including myself, every once in a while. In > other words: Please stay. Thank you. As I wrote, I've not decided yet. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 6/26/11 4:47 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/26/2011 10:16 AM, James McKenzie wrote: >> (and both of you are very valuable to the project and you both >> have brought in a great deal of good information, now folks may question >> it.) > And, because of the way I've been flamed for something I didn't do, I'm > seriously considering leaving this list. Joe: I did not see where you were a Grammar Nazi, and I have not considered you one. And you do bring alot of knowledge to this list. I would appreciate it if you chalk this one up to the eventual stupidity that some folks demonstrate, including myself, every once in a while. In other words: Please stay. Thank you. James McKenzie -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On 06/26/2011 03:45 PM, charles zeitler wrote: > some are. Esperanto is,& is also 100% phonetic. So is Hebrew, except that there are some sounds that can be represented by more than one letter. In fact, most people who are really familiar with the language don't even bother with the "vowels," because the pattern of letters tells them what the sounds must be. (i.e., all two letter verbs use one pattern, all three letter verbs a different on and so on.) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On 06/26/2011 01:22 PM, Marko Vojinovic wrote: > Well, I am one of the people who deliberately turn off the spell-checker in my > mail client (KMail). Is it possible to install several dictionaries? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 10:16 AM, James McKenzie wrote: > (and both of you are very valuable to the project and you both > have brought in a great deal of good information, now folks may question > it.) And, because of the way I've been flamed for something I didn't do, I'm seriously considering leaving this list. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: [OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
-- Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. On Sun, Jun 26, 2011 at 3:22 PM, Marko Vojinovic wrote: > > > As a side note, given that my native language is 100% phonetic and spelling > rules are trivialized to the point where spelling errors are indistinguishable > from typographical errors, I can only feel sorrow for all the native-English- > speaking people who have to put up with the very concept of spell-checking, > memorizing correct spelling for uncommon words, children devoting time to > learn correct spelling in school, etc... If human languages were "made by > design" some are. Esperanto is, & is also 100% phonetic. > HTH, :-) > Marko > charles zeitler Love is the law, love under will. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
[OT] Spelling... [was: Re: where is gnomebreakpad]
On Sunday 26 June 2011 17:31:27 Joe Zeff wrote: > I also understand spelling issues; not just from dyslexic posters but > from those who (like me) weren't properly taught as children. In my > case, it took word processors with spelling checkers to teach me > (mostly) how to spell, and I still depend on them. What I don't > understand, I'll admit, is people who either turn them off or ignore the > warnings. Not knowing how to spell is something I can understand, but I > can't wrap my head around the idea of poor spellers who Just Don't Care. Well, I am one of the people who deliberately turn off the spell-checker in my mail client (KMail). Why? Because I often compose mails in non-English languages, sometimes mixing several languages in the same e-mail, etc. And it gets on my nerves when the whole text of my e-mail is underlined in red just because I am writing it in a language that is not English. So far I do not know of any way for KMail to do a context analysis of the text I am typing, guess the language I use and reconfigure the spell-checker on the fly to do its job right. I would love to have such a thing being done for me in e-mail automatically, if possible even when I mix several languages within a single post. But alas, such intelligent spell-checking facilities don't exist AFAIK, at least for e-mail clients. Bottomline --- I turn off the spell-checker because it is not multilingual, and does a very bad job for any person composing e-mails in more than one language. It's not that I "Just Don't Care", but rather that "Spell-Checkers Do A Lousy Job", in the modern multilingual world. The most blunt example is that I need to switch the spell-checker rules based on whether the e-mail recipient lives in US or UK... And I am supposedly composing an e-mail in "English" in both cases. It's a mess. As a side note, given that my native language is 100% phonetic and spelling rules are trivialized to the point where spelling errors are indistinguishable from typographical errors, I can only feel sorrow for all the native-English- speaking people who have to put up with the very concept of spell-checking, memorizing correct spelling for uncommon words, children devoting time to learn correct spelling in school, etc... If human languages were "made by design" (like programming languages are), I'd say English has by far the worst lexicographical syntax design of all human languages I ever came in touch with. ;-) The very existence of spell-checkers as helper tools just confirms that. HTH, :-) Marko -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sun, Jun 26, 2011 at 6:16 PM, James McKenzie wrote: > > It's called 'taking it off list' and that is where MOST of this thread > should have been. Hey folks, if someone's posting bothers you, take it > 'off list'. If someone publicly accuses you of something you did not > do, then rebuff and leave it at that. > > As to the two children that kept this going, corners please and next > time, take it out of the public view. It only makes you look foolish to > have a 'did to, did not' kind of fight and it diminishes your value to > others (and both of you are very valuable to the project and you both > have brought in a great deal of good information, now folks may question > it.) > > Very respectfully, How about we all post on matters of real relevance to Fedora? -- mike c -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 6/26/11 10:07 AM, Michael Hennebry wrote: > On Sun, 26 Jun 2011, Ed Greshko wrote to Joe Zeff and us: > >> I don't think I ever accused you of anything. I simply took issue with >> your unsolicited suggestion that I should proofread my messages. If I >> recall correctly you indicated that reading posts with poor English gave >> you pain. > There might be a polite way to say proofread next time, > but I don't know it. > It's called 'taking it off list' and that is where MOST of this thread should have been. Hey folks, if someone's posting bothers you, take it 'off list'. If someone publicly accuses you of something you did not do, then rebuff and leave it at that. As to the two children that kept this going, corners please and next time, take it out of the public view. It only makes you look foolish to have a 'did to, did not' kind of fight and it diminishes your value to others (and both of you are very valuable to the project and you both have brought in a great deal of good information, now folks may question it.) Very respectfully, James McKenzie -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sun, 26 Jun 2011, Ed Greshko wrote to Joe Zeff and us: > I don't think I ever accused you of anything. I simply took issue with > your unsolicited suggestion that I should proofread my messages. If I > recall correctly you indicated that reading posts with poor English gave > you pain. There might be a polite way to say proofread next time, but I don't know it. > But, to ask another question, prompted by the "big lie" in another > email, please cite where I said you corrected my grammar? The only > thing I ever asked was if you were aware that correcting a person's > grammar or spelling is frowned upon. That is not indicating that you > have done so. It is simply asking if you are aware of the netiquette. > I understand that is a subtle distinction. I didn't say that he was gay, I simply asked him, in public, if he had a sick boyfriend. I understand that is a subtle distinction. -- Michael henne...@web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu "Pessimist: The glass is half empty. Optimist: The glass is half full. Engineer: The glass is twice as big as it needs to be." -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 12:31 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > Even though the suggestion was made to Ed, not the gentleman from France? If you don't see my point, you never will. Go back and read your own replies and think about it. I hereby invoke closure on my participation... -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 09:15 AM, Gary Waters wrote: > What got under my skin was the fact that your post was subsequent to Ed > responding to a question posed by a gentleman from France. Even though the suggestion was made to Ed, not the gentleman from France? > > I'd hate to see the international members clam up and hesitate to post > out of fear that their posts will be dissected by more Orwellian > members. You made matters worse with your "cut them extra slack" stance. > Why not be tactful and consider it a compliment that they are trying > their best to communicate in YOUR language? Ed did that... "Orwellian?" Where did that come from? And, by "cut them extra slack," I mean that I try to remember that their English skills may not be as good as mine and make no comment that might embarrass them[1]. In fact, the only times I've ever mentioned it is on the rare occasion that a poster starts off by asking our forbearance for their poor English. I've replied, privately, once or twice to tell them that their skills are actually better than they think and I found them quite understandable. I also understand spelling issues; not just from dyslexic posters but from those who (like me) weren't properly taught as children. In my case, it took word processors with spelling checkers to teach me (mostly) how to spell, and I still depend on them. What I don't understand, I'll admit, is people who either turn them off or ignore the warnings. Not knowing how to spell is something I can understand, but I can't wrap my head around the idea of poor spellers who Just Don't Care. [1]This was first written as "...make not comment that..." and I always have trouble with "embarrass." This is why I use the spelling checker and proof read. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 6/26/2011 11:22 AM, Carroll Grigsby wrote: > Enough. Grow up. > -- cmg Agreed, Paul -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 12:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/26/2011 08:41 AM, Gary Waters wrote: >> I read the thread from the beginning. Ed's reaction was the same as my >> own. > > You found a polite suggestion offensive? Why? Seriously, I want to know. What got under my skin was the fact that your post was subsequent to Ed responding to a question posed by a gentleman from France. You can rest assured that his French is perfect ( judging from his signature, he may even be published), whereas his English may not be up to your esteemed standards. I'd hate to see the international members clam up and hesitate to post out of fear that their posts will be dissected by more Orwellian members. You made matters worse with your "cut them extra slack" stance. Why not be tactful and consider it a compliment that they are trying their best to communicate in YOUR language? Ed did that... -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 08:58 AM, Ed Greshko wrote: > I simply reached what I feel is the logical conclusion. Don't correct > ones mistakes or you may find yourself the recipient of unsolicited > "help" Go for it, if that's what floats your boat. I won't object, as long as you're right, and if I disagree, I'll try to be more polite about it than you were. However, I'll take this post as an agreement that I'm not a Grammar Nazi, and didn't act as one. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 08:41 AM, Gary Waters wrote: > I read the thread from the beginning. Ed's reaction was the same as my > own. You found a polite suggestion offensive? Why? Seriously, I want to know. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
Joe Zeff wrote: >On 06/26/2011 12:33 AM, Craig White wrote: >> Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether >> self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity >> bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. > >Which is why I didn't do it, even though Ed Greshko keeps falsely >accusing me of it. LOL. I don't think I ever accused you of anything. I simply took issue with your unsolicited suggestion that I should proofread my messages. If I recall correctly you indicated that reading posts with poor English gave you pain. You further indicated that you don't, or wouldn't say anything about a person's grammar or spelling unless they brought it up. I didn't dispute that or suggest otherwise. I simply reached what I feel is the logical conclusion. Don't correct ones mistakes or you may find yourself the recipient of unsolicited "help". I base this conclusion on what I understand you to have said. That, in and of itself, should clue you in to the fact that I didn't accuse you of correcting anything I wrote but simply mildly annoyed that you felt the need to come to my "aid" and somehow, potentially, turn me into a "better writer?" without even having the courtesy to ask me if I would like your help in this matter. I thought we were done, sigh But, to ask another question, prompted by the "big lie" in another email, please cite where I said you corrected my grammar? The only thing I ever asked was if you were aware that correcting a person's grammar or spelling is frowned upon. That is not indicating that you have done so. It is simply asking if you are aware of the netiquette. I understand that is a subtle distinction. Feel free to carry on. I don't think, nor did I state you are a grammar Nazi, OK? But I, for one, don't need or want your help to reduce the number of errors in my mailings. If I feel I need help in that area I am sure I can find someone much more qualified than anyone on this list. As I said, feel free to carry on. I'm going to sleep and will probably filter this subject as it seems to be serving no useful purpose to anyone. Feel free to characterize what I've said as lies. I have confidence that a proper reading of the thread shows otherwise. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 11:18 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > Don't fall prey to Ed's Big Lie: I never corrected his grammar, spelling > or syntax. I never acted as a Grammar Nazi. All I did was point out > that proofreading his email I read the thread from the beginning. Ed's reaction was the same as my own. I simply did not get involved until I saw the rather pretentious post about cutting people "extra slack." It's a friggin mailing list, not a run at the pulitzer prize for literature. You might consider "proofreading" your "brainfarts" before typing them out and hitting send. You might also invoke a little role-taking. Say to yourself, "will this line of thought incur the wrath of the lesser troglodytes" before you type it out and hit send. That way the rest of use will not rise upright off our knuckles and start beating our chests in a display of anger. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 08:22 AM, Carroll Grigsby wrote: > On Sun, 26 Jun 2011 08:10:15 -0700 > Joe Zeff wrote: > >> On 06/26/2011 12:33 AM, Craig White wrote: >>> Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether >>> self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity >>> bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. >> >> Which is why I didn't do it, even though Ed Greshko keeps falsely >> accusing me of it. > > > Enough. Grow up. I tried to drop the subject last night, but I'm not going to let these false accusations stand without defending myself. As long as people are calling me a Grammar Nazi, I'll continue calling them liars. As soon as they admit they were wrong (even tacitly, by dropping the subject) I'll have nothing to respond to. The one acting like a child is the mud-slinger, not the one continually wiping it off his face. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sun, 26 Jun 2011 08:10:15 -0700 Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/26/2011 12:33 AM, Craig White wrote: > > Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether > > self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity > > bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. > > Which is why I didn't do it, even though Ed Greshko keeps falsely > accusing me of it. Enough. Grow up. -- cmg -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 06:22 AM, Gary Waters wrote: > On 06/25/2011 09:46 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: >> Which is why I don't normally comment on such things. Instead, if I see >> that the message came from someplace where English is at best a second >> language, I cut them extra slack. > > Extra slack? LOL! Yes, extra slack. I expect that most people on this list who grew up speaking English will be fairly proficient. I've spent years working with people who only know a little English (I live near LA; most of them are Hispanic.) and I'm used to their phonetic spelling. > > Your attitude will not only alienate non-anglophone speakers/writers who > are struggling on this list, but people with learning disabilities such > as Dyslexia. My wife has dyslexia. I used to be in a DND game with a dyslexic GM. I was his "co-GM," reading the manuals for him so that he'd know what the monsters powers were and how the spells worked. And, I'm quite familiar with his non-standard spelling, such as "sord" for "sword," because he doesn't *hear* the W. No problem; he's doing the best he can. Don't fall prey to Ed's Big Lie: I never corrected his grammar, spelling or syntax. I never acted as a Grammar Nazi. All I did was point out that proofreading his email would help avoid him from making errors in the future after *he corrected his own mistake.* Calling me a Grammar Nazi IS A LIE! -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 12:33 AM, Craig White wrote: > Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether > self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity > bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. Which is why I didn't do it, even though Ed Greshko keeps falsely accusing me of it. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 09:46 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > Which is why I don't normally comment on such things. Instead, if I see > that the message came from someplace where English is at best a second > language, I cut them extra slack. Extra slack? LOL! How many bloody languages do you speak/write? Personally, I spend every single day of my life juggling English and French. I hate SpellNazis for either side, primarily because they tend to be ethnocentric at best and bigots at worst... if not outright xenophobic. If people can make ends meet and actually achieve "comprehension," who the hell cares how well they spell?? Your attitude will not only alienate non-anglophone speakers/writers who are struggling on this list, but people with learning disabilities such as Dyslexia. My wife has dyslexia. She sits there at her keyboard with a bloody dictionary when she makes facebook posts because the SpellNazis have almost driven her underground. GW -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 03:33 PM, Craig White wrote: > On Sun, 2011-06-26 at 13:40 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: >> Yet, I guess it is good to know that as long as people make >> grammatical >> errors and spellings mistakes as long as they don't correct themselves >> you'll keep quiet about it. > > sort of a cowardly way to make a point - single out those who have > already admitted their error and pounce on it, sort of like kicking > someone when they are already down. I must have missed the part where he admitted an error in judgment. > Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether > self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity > bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. > For the most part, I would second that opinion. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sun, 2011-06-26 at 13:40 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: > Yet, I guess it is good to know that as long as people make > grammatical > errors and spellings mistakes as long as they don't correct themselves > you'll keep quiet about it. sort of a cowardly way to make a point - single out those who have already admitted their error and pounce on it, sort of like kicking someone when they are already down. Personally I fail to see any distinctive difference whether self-admitted or not, grammatical policing is a hostile activity bordering on, if not completely bombastic behavior. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 02:41 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > I'm not looking to have the last word, but you do keep asking questions. > If you'll stop asking, I'll have nothing to answer, will I? Good point... Although I feel the second question, and maybe even the first one, in my last message was rhetorical. So, last one Are we done now? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 11:28 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > Now, would you like to get back our regularly scheduled programming or > do you really need to have the last word. I'm not looking to have the last word, but you do keep asking questions. If you'll stop asking, I'll have nothing to answer, will I? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 02:00 PM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/25/2011 10:40 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: >> Yet, I guess it is good to know that as long as people make grammatical >> errors and spellings mistakes as long as they don't correct themselves >> you'll keep quiet about it. > Please note that *I'm* not the one with the chip on my shoulder. Why do you find it necessary to attempt to characterize what you feel someone else feels or thinks? As far as I can tell, I am simply repeating what you've already said/claimed...and added a bit of an editorial comment. You did say the only reason you decided to "help" me was because I had corrected my mistake. Yes? So, I'm simply saying that as long as nobody corrects themselves you'll not feel the need to come to their aid. Which I personally find to be a good thing. I don't think anyone on this list is looking for help in grammar or writing style. FWIW, the only reason I found it necessary to correct myself is due to the possibility of my mistake being taken as a proper linux command by the OP. Since I have no knowledge of his experience level I wanted to make sure that he understood I meant "yum" and not "you". I wanted to avoid the possibility of him coming back and telling me that he ran the command I suggested and got back "bash: you: command not found...". Now, would you like to get back our regularly scheduled programming or do you really need to have the last word. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 10:40 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > Yet, I guess it is good to know that as long as people make grammatical > errors and spellings mistakes as long as they don't correct themselves > you'll keep quiet about it. Please note that *I'm* not the one with the chip on my shoulder. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 07:14 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/25/2011 03:23 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: >> Well, now that you've established yourself as the "writer" on this list >> and maybe the expert and arbiter of all things related to American >> English (British English too?) > For someone who didn't take offense, you're getting surprisingly > belligerent, you know. IMO, what I've said doesn't rise to the level of belligerence. If I wanted to be hostile I would have told you directly what I though of you and what you could do with your supposedly "helpful" suggestion. Now, that would have been hostile. >> some folks may pay attention to every >> detail of what you write in order to make helpful suggestions about how >> you may improve. That is, of course, assuming you are not above reproach. > Go for it. Unlike some people I know (in person, that is) I don't > consider myself perfect and I certainly make my share of mistakes. And, > of course, you can't correct your mistakes if everybody's afraid to > point them out. I said "some folks". I hope you didn't take that to mean me. I have better things to do with my time. You can't being to imagine how underwhelmed I I found myself when you rated my writing "good" in an earlier post. Yet, I guess it is good to know that as long as people make grammatical errors and spellings mistakes as long as they don't correct themselves you'll keep quiet about it. Now back the technical portion of our program. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 05:06 PM, Craig White wrote: > This of course doesn't even begin to cover the many who frequent this > list for whom English is not their native language and might be put off > by self-appointed jackasses defenders of grammatical correctness. Which is why I don't normally comment on such things. Instead, if I see that the message came from someplace where English is at best a second language, I cut them extra slack. And, please note, this tempest in a tea pot didn't start because I corrected somebody, it started when I replied to a poster's self-correction with a friendly suggestion about how to avoid similar mistakes in the future. If the OP hadn't corrected himself I would have just let the error go by without comment, the same way I do with other errors. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On Sat, 2011-06-25 at 16:14 -0700, Joe Zeff wrote: > Go for it. Unlike some people I know (in person, that is) I don't > consider myself perfect and I certainly make my share of mistakes. And, > of course, you can't correct your mistakes if everybody's afraid to > point them out. this list does not need to waste the bandwidth for every would be grammarian. This is about Fedora, not grammar 101. E-mail itself is informal despite anyone's attempts to make it otherwise and thus spelling, sentence structure and other grammatical faux pas are completely irrelevant to the topic. The only point is to make yourself understood. This of course doesn't even begin to cover the many who frequent this list for whom English is not their native language and might be put off by self-appointed jackasses defenders of grammatical correctness. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 03:23 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > Well, now that you've established yourself as the "writer" on this list > and maybe the expert and arbiter of all things related to American > English (British English too?) For someone who didn't take offense, you're getting surprisingly belligerent, you know. > some folks may pay attention to every > detail of what you write in order to make helpful suggestions about how > you may improve. That is, of course, assuming you are not above reproach. Go for it. Unlike some people I know (in person, that is) I don't consider myself perfect and I certainly make my share of mistakes. And, of course, you can't correct your mistakes if everybody's afraid to point them out. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 06:16 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/25/2011 02:55 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: >> So, you are suggesting I am a "poor" writer due to my writing which you >> have judged? > No. I'm saying that I have no way of knowing, other than what I see in > your posts. And, for the record, much of your writing is excellent, as > the vicar said to the bishop. Yes, you have no way of knowing anything about me. Just what you judge based on what you read. Well, now that you've established yourself as the "writer" on this list and maybe the expert and arbiter of all things related to American English (British English too?) some folks may pay attention to every detail of what you write in order to make helpful suggestions about how you may improve. That is, of course, assuming you are not above reproach. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 02:55 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > So, you are suggesting I am a "poor" writer due to my writing which you > have judged? No. I'm saying that I have no way of knowing, other than what I see in your posts. And, for the record, much of your writing is excellent, as the vicar said to the bishop. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 05:43 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > On 06/25/2011 02:23 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: >> Are you suggesting that I am unaware of that? >> > Judging only by your writing, I've no idea. So, you are suggesting I am a "poor" writer due to my writing which you have judged? >> Are you also aware that pointing out spelling errors and grammar errors >> of people on mailing lists has long been considered bad form? > Usually by people who either can't or won't use them properly. However, > I'd also like to point out that if you hadn't corrected yourself, I'd > not have mentioned it either. As you did, I made what was intended to > be a helpful suggestion as to how to avoid it. Instead of accepting it > in the spirit in which it was offered, you decided to take offense where > none was offered. Not offended. Just mildly irritated. (FWIW, IMO, folks should ask what others are feeling and not make assumed statements.) You have no idea who I am. You don't know, for example, that I may have a vision impairment which may make proof reading harder than normal. You don't know, for example, that I may suffer from dyslexia. Thank you for letting me, and others, know that we should avoid correcting ourselves (even if the correction is necessary to avoid a technical misunderstanding) to help you with your desire to make "helpful suggestions". -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 02:23 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > Are you suggesting that I am unaware of that? > Judging only by your writing, I've no idea. > Are you also aware that pointing out spelling errors and grammar errors > of people on mailing lists has long been considered bad form? Usually by people who either can't or won't use them properly. However, I'd also like to point out that if you hadn't corrected yourself, I'd not have mentioned it either. As you did, I made what was intended to be a helpful suggestion as to how to avoid it. Instead of accepting it in the spirit in which it was offered, you decided to take offense where none was offered. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 03:55 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > I was pointing out that a spelling checker can't catch everything > because it doesn't know when you've used the wrong word but spelled it > correctly. I am, among other things, a writer (not published yet, alas) > and I find some of the poor spelling and misused words on this mailing > list (and others) almost painful to read. I do my best not to mention > it because it almost never does any good. In this case, as you were > correcting your own error, it seemed appropriate to suggest a simple way > to avoid doing it again. Are you suggesting that I am unaware of that? Are you also aware that pointing out spelling errors and grammar errors of people on mailing lists has long been considered bad form? Except for, maybe, mailing lists dedicated to a given language and its usage. I am happy to hear that you do your best not to mention these transgressions which cause you immeasurable pain. I suggest you work a bit harder. For my part, I'll try to monitor my new Android Tablet's features in an attempt to save you additional grief. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 12:44 PM, Ed Greshko wrote: > On 06/26/2011 01:53 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: >> Have you considered poorfraeding your posts before sending them? It >> will catch most of the things the spelling checker can't. HTH, HAND. > > What is your point? I was pointing out that a spelling checker can't catch everything because it doesn't know when you've used the wrong word but spelled it correctly. I am, among other things, a writer (not published yet, alas) and I find some of the poor spelling and misused words on this mailing list (and others) almost painful to read. I do my best not to mention it because it almost never does any good. In this case, as you were correcting your own error, it seemed appropriate to suggest a simple way to avoid doing it again. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/26/2011 01:53 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: > Have you considered poorfraeding your posts before sending them? It > will catch most of the things the spelling checker can't. HTH, HAND. What is your point? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 03:02 AM, Ed Greshko wrote: > Of course i meant yum Spell check strikes again. Have you considered poorfraeding your posts before sending them? It will catch most of the things the spelling checker can't. HTH, HAND. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/25/2011 06:55 PM, François Patte wrote: > Le 25/06/2011 11:48, Ed Greshko a écrit : > > "François Patte" wrote: > > >> evince-2.32.0-4.fc14.i686 > > > OK, F14. I don't have that running, but what does > > > you whatprovides */libgnomebreakpad.so > > Not match! > I sort of that that would be the case Having done a google search of your problem only turned up results from the Fedora 8 days...or there about. I assume that when you do "which evince" you get /usr/bin/evince. And if you do "ldd /usr/bin/evince" libgnomebreakpad.so is in the result? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Le 25/06/2011 11:48, Ed Greshko a écrit : > "François Patte" wrote: > >> evince-2.32.0-4.fc14.i686 > > OK, F14. I don't have that running, but what does > > you whatprovides */libgnomebreakpad.so Not match! - -- François Patte UFR de mathématiques et informatique Université Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints Pères F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 Tél. +33 (0)1 8394 5849 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk4FvqcACgkQdE6C2dhV2JXkVgCeOrgjwOfXlIQmV9Yp+KtgFAZ1 ELkAoMM0JTJAfECwE5wVQ1B2n/JDGceB =TDCZ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
Of course i meant yum Spell check strikes again. -- Sent from my Android tablet with K-9 Mail. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
"François Patte" wrote: > >evince-2.32.0-4.fc14.i686 OK, F14. I don't have that running, but what does you whatprovides */libgnomebreakpad.so return? -- Sent from my Android tablet with K-9 Mail. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Le 24/06/2011 10:36, Ed Greshko a écrit : > On 06/24/2011 02:57 PM, François Patte wrote: >> When launching evince, I get this warning: >> >> Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "gnomebreakpad": libgnomebreakpad.so >> >> >> Where to find this module? >> >> > > What version of Fedora and evince are you using? evince-2.32.0-4.fc14.i686 - -- François Patte UFR de mathématiques et informatique Université Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints Pères F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 Tél. +33 (0)1 8394 5849 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk4FqTgACgkQdE6C2dhV2JUUDACghGwRobEbEO4aZx+UYIk0vWKp eusAoL4Bh8VWiaaWXVBm+RNIDChTDLaK =CxeK -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
Re: where is gnomebreakpad
On 06/24/2011 02:57 PM, François Patte wrote: > > When launching evince, I get this warning: > > Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "gnomebreakpad": libgnomebreakpad.so > > > Where to find this module? > > What version of Fedora and evince are you using? F15 doesn't seem to have that module as "yum whatprovides" returns No Matches found. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
where is gnomebreakpad
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Bonjour, When launching evince, I get this warning: Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "gnomebreakpad": libgnomebreakpad.so Where to find this module? Thanks - -- François Patte UFR de mathématiques et informatique Université Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints Pères F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 Tél. +33 (0)1 8394 5849 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk4ENXAACgkQdE6C2dhV2JV+awCfa9uy85C1JnTET0NFsMTb2ie4 aTMAnjZSnQowG7smUflBJQDehD1eOyPw =koT9 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
