Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Barry, Propes, Barry L wrote: is the bottom line that he (Semen's) wanting certain areas protected by a role, and other areas protected/accessible only by another role? Sounds like he wants user-level authorization, which Tomcat just doesn't do. Oh, and anonymous connections, too. - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHDOAW9CaO5/Lv0PARAr6pAKCzez5Vb+7nQ2Hf2JcIiEjKCdc8owCgqRWV avO2i4692YvvlKq68UnYnqo= =gr6U -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Semen, Semen Vadishev wrote: But behavior I need is: 1. If Tomcat gets request with no user information data (username/password) it should pass it to servlet and then servlet after handling request's URI according to pba config file may send SC_UNAUTHORIZED (if it needs authenticated user) or SC_FORBIDDEN (if any access denied). 2. If Tomcat gets request with username and password it should check them according to conf/tomcat-users.xml and if user authenticated pass it to servlet. You cannot do this with Tomcat's authentication mechanism. You will have to provide an alternative implementation. I recommend looking st securityfilter (http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net). It's implemented as a filter, so it works with any servlet container. It can work with Tomcat's built-in realms or you can write your own. It supports unsolicited logins (i.e. you can use your own login page that submits to j_security_check without having to first request a protected resource). It has configuration similar to that in web.xml, so you don't have to learn a new configuration format. You are free to use securityfilter's authentication mechanisms and completely skip authorization, which is what it looks like you want to do (by implementing it yourself). Hope that helps, - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHC4mU9CaO5/Lv0PARAm/tAJ4/SAUdOsMlZSugPtOsJaXpFGbRQACfRGov R26GvoQR29oZmVyMcH0EPmc= =N9aS -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
Christopher, thanks for reply. 2007/10/9, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: You cannot do this with Tomcat's authentication mechanism. You will have to provide an alternative implementation. I recommend looking st securityfilter ( http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net ). Well, securityfilter doesn't satisfy some servlet's requirements, so as you said I will have to provide my own low level authentication mechanism. It will be my first implementation, so any help will be appreciated. Thanks, S. Vadishev.
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Semen, Semen Vadishev wrote: Christopher, thanks for reply. 2007/10/9, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: You cannot do this with Tomcat's authentication mechanism. You will have to provide an alternative implementation. I recommend looking st securityfilter ( http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net ). Well, securityfilter doesn't satisfy some servlet's requirements Like what? so as you said I will have to provide my own low level authentication mechanism. You can use Tomcat's built-in Realm as a basis for the authentication -- so, for instance, you don't have to write your own SELECT query, etc. Can I ask why you want your own servlets to do the authorization instead of the container (or securityfilter)? It will be my first implementation, so any help will be appreciated. First servlet implementation, or first authentication and authorization implementation? - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHC6to9CaO5/Lv0PARAuLwAJwOxMCxIpHka7S1KPRz56EZcOX6twCfaS1x jWqHtOk9bvkGEtaKH5UiGfE= =QR6J -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
Christopher, 2007/10/9, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: You cannot do this with Tomcat's authentication mechanism. You will have to provide an alternative implementation. I recommend looking st securityfilter ( http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net ). Well, securityfilter doesn't satisfy some servlet's requirements Like what? Sorry if I was wrong, but does security filter supports such auth-methods as BASIC, DIGEST, etc.? It was pointed that BASIC authentication will be supported in an upcoming 1.1 release at http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net . But at http://sourceforge.net/projects/securityfilter/ I found some newer release notes, but I found nothing about added support of other auth methods. so as you said I will have to provide my own low level authentication mechanism. You can use Tomcat's built-in Realm as a basis for the authentication -- so, for instance, you don't have to write your own SELECT query, etc. Thanks, I've got it. ...why you want your own servlets to do the authorization instead of the container (or securityfilter)? This is the main question. Today we decided to do nothing new with authentication and use special guest user in the first version of servlet. And only if users will ask for anonymous access I decribed earlier, we'll develop custom mechanism or maybe use security filter. As I understood you represents interests of security filter's developers (sorry if it's mistake) and it will be greate if you' ll look at servlet's code at http://svn.svnkit.com/repos/svnkit/trunk/ (svnkit-dav subdirectory) and give me a response of how to use security filter with our servlet. It will be my first implementation, so any help will be appreciated. First servlet implementation, or first authentication and authorization implementation? First authentication and authorization implementation. Thanks, S. Vadishev.
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Semen, Semen Vadishev wrote: Christopher, 2007/10/9, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: You cannot do this with Tomcat's authentication mechanism. You will have to provide an alternative implementation. I recommend looking st securityfilter ( http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net ). Well, securityfilter doesn't satisfy some servlet's requirements Like what? Sorry if I was wrong, but does security filter supports such auth-methods as BASIC, DIGEST, etc.? It was pointed that BASIC authentication will be supported in an upcoming 1.1 release at http://securityfilter.sourceforge.net . But at http://sourceforge.net/projects/securityfilter/ I found some newer release notes, but I found nothing about added support of other auth methods. Right. The documentation for securityfilter is horrible. Fortunately, there's not much code there, so it's possible to go into it and see if something is implemented and how. I do not believe that securityfilter supports BASIC, DIGEST, or CLIENT-CERT authentication schemes. It might support BASIC, but I don't use that so I don't know. ...why you want your own servlets to do the authorization instead of the container (or securityfilter)? This is the main question. Today we decided to do nothing new with authentication and use special guest user in the first version of servlet. I'm not sure what that means. And only if users will ask for anonymous access I described earlier, we'll develop custom mechanism or maybe use security filter. I'm not convinced you need either. You can use the built-in Tomcat authentication to do logins. You can also use the built-in authorization, but it looks like you don't want authorization at all: you want a site that basically lets anyone use it, but also allows logins for other things (but you haven't mentioned any of them). Tomcat can do this: just don't make anything protected except for a single protected page that can be used to trigger a login request. As I understood you represents interests of security filter's developers (sorry if it's mistake) Not really. I use securityfilter because Tomcat's implementation does not meet my needs (I need to be able to accept unexpected logins instead of first requesting a protected resource), but I am not a contributor. it will be great if you' ll look at servlet's code I'm not going to read through your code to figure out your requirements. It will be my first implementation, so any help will be appreciated. First servlet implementation, or first authentication and authorization implementation? First authentication and authorization implementation. Again, I don't think you need to implement anything yourself, whether you use Tomcat's built-in AA or if you use securityfilter. - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHC9599CaO5/Lv0PARAufGAKCrMiD2hgTWGtDcoNaO8uWTZwOmaACginZ9 e2Wo5D5k6CgMMXBfnOH5udE= =MB4n -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
Christopher, thank you for your great help, 2007/10/10, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: ...why you want your own servlets to do the authorization instead of the container (or securityfilter)? This is the main question. Today we decided to do nothing new with authentication and use special guest user in the first version of servlet. I'm not sure what that means. Well, have you ever configured path based authentication for Subversion Server? Pba config file contains a set of rules and they look like [/path/in/repos] *= user1=r So anonymous user has any read permisions but a user logged on as user1 may read from /path/in/repos. In our case, configuration above means that user logged on as a guest has no permissions and user1 has read permissions. And only if users will ask for anonymous access I described earlier, we'll develop custom mechanism or maybe use security filter. I'm not convinced you need either. You can use the built-in Tomcat authentication to do logins. It sounds interesting. So if there is no security-constraint element in web.xml, Tomcat doesn't provide authorization, right? And if web.xmlcontains login-config element and doesn't contain security-constraint element then servlet gets Principal object anyway (if client sent user/pass then request.getRemoteUser() returns user and if not request.getRemoteUser() returns null)? Well at least I will try to configure Tomcat this way. You can also use the built-in authorization, but it looks like you don't want authorization at all: you want a site that basically lets anyone use it, but also allows logins for other things (but you haven't mentioned any of them). There is no site and pages, we have servlet that handles requests via webDAV protocol (an extension of HTTP1.1). There are two types of requests we should handle in servlet: 1. Requests with no authentication data. If such request tries to access /some/path and pba config file contains rule : [/some/path] *=r then we do not send any error, handle request and normally send result , otherwise we send SC_UNAUTHORIZED error. 2. Requests with authentication data, for instance client sends to us usename/password and tries to access /some/path. So we want Tomcat to check if this pair username/password is valid (at this moment Tomcat looks at Realm class as I think), so if it's not valid, Tomcat should send SC_UNAUTHORIZED otherwise servlet checks request using pba and if pba config file has rule: [/some/path] username=r then we do not send any error and handle request normally, otherwise we send SC_FORBIDDEN error. So my question now is: If Tomcat configured to provide built-in authentication and do not provide built-in authorization can we get described behavior? Hope this explanation is more clear. Thanks, S. Vadishev.
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Semen, Semen Vadishev wrote: Well, have you ever configured path based authentication for Subversion Server? Oh, you're using WebDAV. :( So if there is no security-constraint element in web.xml, Tomcat doesn't provide authorization, right? Correct. It will not perform authentication either. I think it's important to understand what's going on here: Tomcat's built-in AA requires that an unauthenticated user request a protected resource (protected by a security-constraint). When this happens, Tomcat intercepts the request internally and issues the appropriate login request (HTTP AUTH, FORM, etc.). Upon successful authentication, Tomcat re-processes the original request. Tomcat authorization is done separately, though probably by the same component (Valve). You can require authentication but not enforce any specific role by using role-name*/role-name in your security-constraint. Unfortunately for you, J2EE does not do user-based authorization; it will only do role-based authorization. I don't think you can use Tomcat's authorization at all. I don't know enough about the WebDAV/svn protocol to know whether it will work for authentication. And if web.xmlcontains login-config element and doesn't contain security-constraint element then servlet gets Principal object anyway (if client sent user/pass then request.getRemoteUser() returns user and if not request.getRemoteUser() returns null)? Well at least I will try to configure Tomcat this way. If you want Tomcat to do authentication and not authorization (which it sounds like is the case), then use role-name*/role-name on whatever resource you are protecting and Tomcat will demand that the user authenticate in order to access the resource (but it won't care who the user is). Then, you should be able to get a Principal from the request object during a request. 1. Requests with no authentication data. I'm pretty sure you're always going to want authentication data. To get Tomcat to work this way, you will need authentication data for pretty much every request. 2. Requests with authentication data [...] so we want Tomcat to check if this pair username/password is valid You can't have Tomcat do this kind of thing on demand. You can either use their authentication mechanism (with all the requirements above) or not. So my question now is: If Tomcat configured to provide built-in authentication and do not provide built-in authorization can we get described behavior? You can try using role-name*/role-name as described above, but it may not work the way you want it to work. For instance, if you want to allow completely anonymous access (i.e. not even requiring the use of a guest username and password), then you'll need to do everything yourself. Don't worry: authentication is really easy. Authorization isn't that bad, either, especially since you will probably only have a single servlet that needs protecting. The problem with these things is usually making sure you didn't miss anything (like leaving a swath of URIs unprotected). Feel free to look at Tomcat's Realm implementations for coding inspiration. Hope this explanation is more clear. It is, thanks. - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHC/uy9CaO5/Lv0PARAghHAKCVnSxdBUrmVruDS9rbq6qhKgZ2PgCfQMAU mQuDZdXT7R+mZsiEP8l/GmI= =4bmb -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
is the bottom line that he (Semen's) wanting certain areas protected by a role, and other areas protected/accessible only by another role? Or is he looking for authentication at every protected juncture? -Original Message- From: Christopher Schultz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 5:08 PM To: Tomcat Users List Subject: Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured. -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Semen, Semen Vadishev wrote: Well, have you ever configured path based authentication for Subversion Server? Oh, you're using WebDAV. :( So if there is no security-constraint element in web.xml, Tomcat doesn't provide authorization, right? Correct. It will not perform authentication either. I think it's important to understand what's going on here: Tomcat's built-in AA requires that an unauthenticated user request a protected resource (protected by a security-constraint). When this happens, Tomcat intercepts the request internally and issues the appropriate login request (HTTP AUTH, FORM, etc.). Upon successful authentication, Tomcat re-processes the original request. Tomcat authorization is done separately, though probably by the same component (Valve). You can require authentication but not enforce any specific role by using role-name*/role-name in your security-constraint. Unfortunately for you, J2EE does not do user-based authorization; it will only do role-based authorization. I don't think you can use Tomcat's authorization at all. I don't know enough about the WebDAV/svn protocol to know whether it will work for authentication. And if web.xmlcontains login-config element and doesn't contain security-constraint element then servlet gets Principal object anyway (if client sent user/pass then request.getRemoteUser() returns user and if not request.getRemoteUser() returns null)? Well at least I will try to configure Tomcat this way. If you want Tomcat to do authentication and not authorization (which it sounds like is the case), then use role-name*/role-name on whatever resource you are protecting and Tomcat will demand that the user authenticate in order to access the resource (but it won't care who the user is). Then, you should be able to get a Principal from the request object during a request. 1. Requests with no authentication data. I'm pretty sure you're always going to want authentication data. To get Tomcat to work this way, you will need authentication data for pretty much every request. 2. Requests with authentication data [...] so we want Tomcat to check if this pair username/password is valid You can't have Tomcat do this kind of thing on demand. You can either use their authentication mechanism (with all the requirements above) or not. So my question now is: If Tomcat configured to provide built-in authentication and do not provide built-in authorization can we get described behavior? You can try using role-name*/role-name as described above, but it may not work the way you want it to work. For instance, if you want to allow completely anonymous access (i.e. not even requiring the use of a guest username and password), then you'll need to do everything yourself. Don't worry: authentication is really easy. Authorization isn't that bad, either, especially since you will probably only have a single servlet that needs protecting. The problem with these things is usually making sure you didn't miss anything (like leaving a swath of URIs unprotected). Feel free to look at Tomcat's Realm implementations for coding inspiration. Hope this explanation is more clear. It is, thanks. - -chris -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHC/uy9CaO5/Lv0PARAghHAKCVnSxdBUrmVruDS9rbq6qhKgZ2PgCfQMAU mQuDZdXT7R+mZsiEP8l/GmI= =4bmb -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Anonymous access with Tomcat Authentication configured.
Christopher, 2007/10/10, Christopher Schultz [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Tomcat's built-in AA requires that an unauthenticated user request a protected resource (protected by a security-constraint). When this happens, Tomcat intercepts the request internally and issues the appropriate login request (HTTP AUTH, FORM, etc.). Upon successful authentication, Tomcat re-processes the original request. Tomcat authorization is done separately, though probably by the same component (Valve). [...] Don't worry: authentication is really easy. Authorization isn't that bad, either, especially since you will probably only have a single servlet that needs protecting. The problem with these things is usually making sure you didn't miss anything (like leaving a swath of URIs unprotected). Feel free to look at Tomcat's Realm implementations for coding inspiration. So implementing internal server component (probably valve) is the only solution, right? And is this container independent solution? Thanks, S. Vadishev.
