Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Liam Proven]

On Mon, 7 Mar 2005 18:01:15 -0500, Thomas Burns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes, that's a good site, but that's a Mac Plus, with 4mbs of ram and a scsi
> Ethernet connection I believe.

Gosh. I hadn't realized this was an /even lower/ spec machine!

If the software will run from 2 DD floppies, certainly it'll run from
a hard disk, easily I should think. Getting a SLIP or PPP connection
over RS423 serial will be a bit harder, though.

I have to ask, though, what's the point? :¬) Apart from to see if it
can be done?

(I missed hearing a "lowest-end webserver competition among some
friends a few years back. The winning machine was an actual IBM PC -
not even an XT, but a PC with additional hard disk. Running DOS and an
IP stack and a webserver in 640KB of RAM.) Fun, but pointless. I'm
currently considering making my IBM PS/2 Model 80-A21 into a web
server, and it's a 386DX/25 with 16MB RAM and 2 SCSI hard disks. Even
it will be a challenge. So I guess just wanting to *is* a good enough
reason...)
 
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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Thomas Burns]

Yes, that's a good site, but that's a Mac Plus, with 4mbs of ram and a scsi 
Ethernet connection I believe.

Thomas
- Original Message - 
From: "Liam Proven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 9:23 AM
Subject: Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions


On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:12:00 -0500, Thomas Burns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
My first question is, can you put a web server on a Mac 512k/e?
It's been done.
Go visit
http://aurejac.dyndns.org/
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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[simon]

On 7-mrt-05, at 15:23, Liam Proven wrote:
On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:12:00 -0500, Thomas Burns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
My first question is, can you put a web server on a Mac 512k/e?
It's been done.
Go visit
http://aurejac.dyndns.org/

looking at that: i have a 512ke with a memory upgrade to 1Mb. Maybe its 
possible...
I even have a apple hard disk 20 (floppy connector)

but two floppy's is maybe more silent.
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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Liam Proven]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:12:00 -0500, Thomas Burns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> My first question is, can you put a web server on a Mac 512k/e? 

It's been done.

Go visit 

http://aurejac.dyndns.org/

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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Robert Gray]

At 3:30 PM -0500 on 3/4/05, "Thomas Burns" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...what is the pds slot on a LaserWriter IIg motherboard for?
I assume you mean the IIg logic board...the board that makes any 
series two LaserWriter a IIg.  I don't see any plug on the board. 
The only connector internal to the printer is that which connects the 
logic board to the printer circuitry as you shove the board into the 
printer.

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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Gregg Eshelman]

There are dinky little devices with an Ethernet
connector on one end and a .1" spacing pin header
on the other for a serial port.

In between is some amazingly small technology that
connects the two.

What they do is enable just about anything with a
serial port to connect to a TCP/IP network.

They just pass the data through, "wrapping" and
"unwrapping" it with the TCP/IP packet data.

Some folks on the TI-99/4A list are using them to
connect to their broadband internet routers for
text only "websurfing" and send-receiving e-mail.

I don't think anyone's yet tried setting up a web
server on their TI, even with a SCSI hard drive. ;)

It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org

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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Allan Hunter]

Therein lies your problem.  I used System 4 for quite a while, and it 
was tiny and nimble and very nice on a 512.  I remember System 3, 
too, but it was no OS for a computer with a hard drive.

But I really doubt that any Mac System older than System 6 will work 
with MacTCP.  Maybe, just maybe, you could save some RAM by working 
with System 6.0.3 instead of 6.0.8 and still get MacTCP to work.

I would start with that, I think that is a spectacular accomplishment 
by itself, to put a 512Ke on the internet even as a client.  Take a 
screenshot of a 512 that has its own IP address, no one will believe 
it!

At 6:36 PM -0500 3/3/2005, Thomas Burns wrote:
I think the serial port hard drive would be easier to find than the 
3rd party ram upgrade. What if you dropped down to a lower system 
like 3 or 4? I think the recommended system for a 512 is like 3.2? 
MacTCP wouldn't work with that would it nor would WebStar would it?
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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Thomas Burns]

It's all about sheer geekiness, or at least my wife think that. "Why do you 
have all these little Macs in the office, they're not like pets or anything. 
Please don't turn the toaster oven into a web server." lol

I think the serial port hard drive would be easier to find than the 3rd 
party ram upgrade. What if you dropped down to a lower system like 3 or 4? I 
think the recommended system for a 512 is like 3.2? MacTCP wouldn't work 
with that would it nor would WebStar would it?

I saw an Atari 800 as a web server, however I think the IP was on an outside 
device and when hit, the Atari would just squirt out a few lines of html and 
that was about all it could do with 48k.

I'm just wondering if this was a solvable problem.
Thomas
- Original Message - 
From: "Allan Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions


At 5:12 PM -0500 3/3/05, Thomas Burns wrote:
My first question is, can you put a web server on a Mac 512k/e? I was 
wondering if you could use system 6.0.8 and run the connection via 
AppleTalk bridge? Would the limiting factor be the memory?
Wow.  I guess you could shoehorn System 6.0.8 plus MacTCP onto an 800K 
floppy, but what apps or extensions would provide the actual web sharing? 
You wouldn't get WebStar on the same floppy.  A 512k/e with an extra 
(external) floppy drive just conceivably might allow you to run WebStar, 
if there's a version of WebStar that would run in what's left of 512K RAM 
after System 6 including TCP are loaded into RAM... but then, umm, exactly 
what files would you be sharing up over the web, your own System Folder?

Unless you had one of those ancient serial-port hard disks, then you could 
put HTML files on it.

That would be one seriously sluggish web site, though... TCP over 
LocalTalk bridge.

It would be downright fantastic for sheer geekiness to do it, but I'm 
guessing the sticking point is the RAM.  I seem to recall one of those 
"Get your Classic System 6 Mac on the Internet" sites where the challenge 
of getting a 512k/e online was marked "unsolved but I'm still trying".  It 
may be that System 6 and MacTCP together leave you with very little left 
over to run anything in.

My LC is sitting here next to me...
::switches KVM switch::
I'm running MultiFinder and more than a few extensions in addition to 
MacTCP, but System 6.0.8 is eating 2914 K plus 160 K for Finder.  You 
could rename WebStar to "Finder" and set the file type and creator to that 
of Finder's and run a Finderless web server, that'll save you some K.  But 
512 is a very small space to work in.


Now, of course, if you've got your hands on one of those incredibly rare 
3rd-party RAM upgrades for the 512k/e (the ones that you had to clip and 
solder) as well as a serial hard disk, all bets are off ;)


My second question is, what is the pds slot on a LaserWriter IIg 
motherboard for? I tried some research on the web about anything fitting 
in there, but I couldnt come up with anything. Were there plans at one 
time to have an accelerator for it?

Thanks,
Thomas
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Re: Mac 512 and LaserWriter IIg questions

[Allan Hunter]

At 5:12 PM -0500 3/3/05, Thomas Burns wrote:
My first question is, can you put a web server on a Mac 512k/e? I 
was wondering if you could use system 6.0.8 and run the connection 
via AppleTalk bridge? Would the limiting factor be the memory?
Wow.  I guess you could shoehorn System 6.0.8 plus MacTCP onto an 
800K floppy, but what apps or extensions would provide the actual web 
sharing?  You wouldn't get WebStar on the same floppy.  A 512k/e with 
an extra (external) floppy drive just conceivably might allow you to 
run WebStar, if there's a version of WebStar that would run in what's 
left of 512K RAM after System 6 including TCP are loaded into RAM... 
but then, umm, exactly what files would you be sharing up over the 
web, your own System Folder?

Unless you had one of those ancient serial-port hard disks, then you 
could put HTML files on it.

That would be one seriously sluggish web site, though... TCP over 
LocalTalk bridge.

It would be downright fantastic for sheer geekiness to do it, but I'm 
guessing the sticking point is the RAM.  I seem to recall one of 
those "Get your Classic System 6 Mac on the Internet" sites where the 
challenge of getting a 512k/e online was marked "unsolved but I'm 
still trying".  It may be that System 6 and MacTCP together leave you 
with very little left over to run anything in.

My LC is sitting here next to me...
::switches KVM switch::
I'm running MultiFinder and more than a few extensions in addition to 
MacTCP, but System 6.0.8 is eating 2914 K plus 160 K for Finder.  You 
could rename WebStar to "Finder" and set the file type and creator to 
that of Finder's and run a Finderless web server, that'll save you 
some K.  But 512 is a very small space to work in.


Now, of course, if you've got your hands on one of those incredibly 
rare 3rd-party RAM upgrades for the 512k/e (the ones that you had to 
clip and solder) as well as a serial hard disk, all bets are off ;)


My second question is, what is the pds slot on a LaserWriter IIg 
motherboard for? I tried some research on the web about anything 
fitting in there, but I couldnt come up with anything. Were there 
plans at one time to have an accelerator for it?

Thanks,
Thomas
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