Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
I am there too. I have used ExpressPCB because it is actually very fast and easy for small projects. I also use the schematic capture for illustrations (when I just need a schematic, no PWB) because it also makes decent looking schematics without fuss. Creating component models bot both schematic and layout is quick and easy. It is decidedly not for professional uses, but for small projects, it is hard to beat. I have installed KiCad (a month ago) and got extremely frustrated trying to create models for schematic components. Whatever I did I could not find a way to get the component in a library and I eventually lost the work. Instructions/tutorials are sorely missing. Then I found out it had problems dealing with mixed metric and imperial units, so I abandoned it. Aside from prototypes which I do with ExpressPCB, For the last 10 years, I have been having my (good) boards done by a professional PWB designer who is using a $15,000 package. It costs more, but it is done quickly, 100% error free and there are 0 issues in manufacturing :) Didier On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 11:11 AM, BIll Ezell w...@quackers.net wrote: On 1/6/2015 12:00 PM, volt-nuts-requ...@febo.com wrote: Re: Design Spark PCB Design Package It depends on what you need PCBs for. I've used ExpressPCB for years. They have proprietary layout software, all very manual, no routing, and free. It will also do multilayer, vias, fills, etc. The reason I use them is that you can get 3 3x5 boards from them for $60 if you use their app. They also have a schematic capture app that works with the layout app and does some basic netlist checking. I find them very convenient for one-off projects that will fit. -- Bill Ezell -- The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck will be the day they make vacuum cleaners. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
I think DesignSpark works pretty well for the pricetag. The only way to know if you will know for sure is to try it for yourself. IMHO, there isn't one ideal free/low cost program, they all have their issues. BTW, DesignSpark easily handles multiple gates per component. Cheers, Neil From: volt-nuts volt-nuts-boun...@febo.com on behalf of David C. Partridge david.partri...@perdrix.co.uk Sent: January 5, 2015 8:23 AM To: 'Discussion of precise voltage measurement' Subject: Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package When I tried Design Spark PCB I wasn't impressed, though I'm told it has got better in the intervening year or so. An example: most PCB design packages put down multi opamps/logic chips as individual pieces with 1 gate/opamp per piece (e.g. U16A, U16B, U16C, U16D), but DS PCB placed a single glom of all four opamps in a rectangular lump with all the pins and I had to sort out the mess. When I complained I was told - well it's easy to design your own component/footprint/package to do it your way - but I don't wan't to do that sort of basic stuff. That said I use Multisim/Ultiboard, and despair over Ultiboard's autorouting - it doesn't seem to understand that a straight line is the shortest route between two pins that have the same X or Y coordinates, and regularly fails to route when there is a blindingly obvious route (same layer, no obstructions etc.) that won't break any design rules. Regards, David Partridge ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
On 1/6/2015 12:00 PM, volt-nuts-requ...@febo.com wrote: Re: Design Spark PCB Design Package It depends on what you need PCBs for. I've used ExpressPCB for years. They have proprietary layout software, all very manual, no routing, and free. It will also do multilayer, vias, fills, etc. The reason I use them is that you can get 3 3x5 boards from them for $60 if you use their app. They also have a schematic capture app that works with the layout app and does some basic netlist checking. I find them very convenient for one-off projects that will fit. -- Bill Ezell -- The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck will be the day they make vacuum cleaners. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
This is indirectly pertinent to the group since I am designing a PCB for the HP-419A and Fluke 845A modifications. Does anyone have any experience/comments on the Design Spark PCB design package? Is is a viable package for hobbyist use? thanks, Randy Evans ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
When I tried Design Spark PCB I wasn't impressed, though I'm told it has got better in the intervening year or so. An example: most PCB design packages put down multi opamps/logic chips as individual pieces with 1 gate/opamp per piece (e.g. U16A, U16B, U16C, U16D), but DS PCB placed a single glom of all four opamps in a rectangular lump with all the pins and I had to sort out the mess. When I complained I was told - well it's easy to design your own component/footprint/package to do it your way - but I don't wan't to do that sort of basic stuff. That said I use Multisim/Ultiboard, and despair over Ultiboard's autorouting - it doesn't seem to understand that a straight line is the shortest route between two pins that have the same X or Y coordinates, and regularly fails to route when there is a blindingly obvious route (same layer, no obstructions etc.) that won't break any design rules. Regards, David Partridge ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
Lack of forward/back annotation would kill it for me too! Dave ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
Has anyone had any Gerber file compatibility issues with batch pcb manufacturers? For example, pad sizes or trace widths not matching what is on the screen. Todd On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 4:41 PM, David C. Partridge david.partri...@perdrix.co.uk wrote: Lack of forward/back annotation would kill it for me too! Dave ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
Have you looked at Kicad? It is used by both professionals and hobbyists, and being open source, is not reliant on RS to update it. Now there is a decent open source PCB layout program, I would not suggest anyone learn a new proprietary package unless there were very good reasons, such as an employer says you must use a particular program. OK, I keep hearing how great KiCAD is, and should abandon everything else. I'm being persuaded to try KiCAD, and am not very impressed. If you do one board a year, it may be OK. But if you do a board or two a week, forget it. When you create a board, you have to export the netlist from the schematic and import it into the board manually. No foreword/back annotation is maintained automatically. Second, there is no way to highlight a net in the schematic, to show what pins/components are attached to it. Makes it very hard to follow what is actually connected. However for me the killer is you have to map each schematic entity to the physical package for every board layout. When you make a library item, such as an opamp, the schematic symbol is not tied to the package. You have to map them in a separate step. Huge time consumer! Libraries are also not solid yet. You are better off creating your own. Also, the package is bloated with a whole bunch of .pdf's for various chips. (Why???) Printing is a schematic is problematic, and seems to cut off the left edge of the page on my printer. That said, I am following the project with interest, and would really like to see it turn into a full blown package. In some number of years, that should happen. However at this point I do not feel it is ready for daily use. It feels like beta software. If you've actually used KiCAD and know something different, please speak up! Dan ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
I had same experiance with DS, even it is free, it not quite professional to use. I checked several free available PCB programs. I would recommend KiCAD, but the free version of EAGLE and the free German program Target 3001 (actual v1.7) I can also recommend. BR Ludger Lenzen Gesendet: Montag, 05. Januar 2015 um 17:23 Uhr Von: David C. Partridge david.partri...@perdrix.co.uk An: 'Discussion of precise voltage measurement' volt-nuts@febo.com Betreff: Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package When I tried Design Spark PCB I wasn't impressed, though I'm told it has got better in the intervening year or so. An example: most PCB design packages put down multi opamps/logic chips as individual pieces with 1 gate/opamp per piece (e.g. U16A, U16B, U16C, U16D), but DS PCB placed a single glom of all four opamps in a rectangular lump with all the pins and I had to sort out the mess. When I complained I was told - well it's easy to design your own component/footprint/package to do it your way - but I don't wan't to do that sort of basic stuff. That said I use Multisim/Ultiboard, and despair over Ultiboard's autorouting - it doesn't seem to understand that a straight line is the shortest route between two pins that have the same X or Y coordinates, and regularly fails to route when there is a blindingly obvious route (same layer, no obstructions etc.) that won't break any design rules. Regards, David Partridge ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
Another program that is supposed to be very nice is DIPTRACE. Their free version is limited by pin count... Eagle's free version is limited by board size. Eagle has more community support than the other packages. ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [volt-nuts] Design Spark PCB Design Package
On 5 Jan 2015 15:36, Randy Evans randyevans2...@gmail.com wrote: This is indirectly pertinent to the group since I am designing a PCB for the HP-419A and Fluke 845A modifications. Does anyone have any experience/comments on the Design Spark PCB design package? Is is a viable package for hobbyist use? thanks, Randy Evans I have not used it. Have you looked at Kicad? It is used by both professionals and hobbyists, and being open source, is not reliant on RS to update it. Now there is a decent open source PCB layout program, I would not suggest anyone learn a new proprietary package unless there were very good reasons, such as an employer says you must use a particular program. Dave ___ volt-nuts mailing list -- volt-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/volt-nuts and follow the instructions there.
