[Vo]:subcribe
[Vo]:Erdos CTL - a Communist success story? with implications for Rossi?
Erdos CTL (aka Shenhua CTL) is a coal liquefaction plant in Mongolia producing 20,000 barrels per day of gasoline from local coal. It has been fully operational for 3 years. It is State owned and operated and poised to expand rapidly. With a yearly output of 7 million barrels, at the OPEC price of $100 barrel, and with coal at $40 ton, this single plant saves the Chinese economy half a billion US dollars equivalent per year in imports, while making a large net return on investment (40% gross margin). Many Oil experts in the USA said this would never work, since it was State owned for one thing and since the ancient Bergius process (not Fischer-Tropsch) was being used. However, those same Big Oil experts had a hand in closing the one successful CTL plant which was operated in the USA. During WWII we conducted secret research on converting coal to gasoline. An operational plant was producing high octane gasoline by 1948. The Louisiana process was also the Bergius method, and it produced premium gasoline at a cost only slightly higher than pre-OPEC gasoline, which was 26 cents per gallon at the pump. The facility was shut down in 1953 by the Eisenhower administration after intense lobbying by the Texas oil industry. Since that time, the cost of gasoline has gone up by a factor of 15:1 but the price of coal has gone up by only 4:1. Now, in China at least 4 more CTL plants but larger are under construction or nearing operational status, since China has lots of coal. All are Bergius process. China looks at this technology as a great success of State sponsorship, where an efficient enterprise is doing something that no capitalist in the USA has accomplished and is making both a huge profit and saving the economy billions by reduced reliance on OPEC oil. OTHO - It is fair to suspect that the Erdos CTL plant is a big air polluter, and that the economics would not be as favorable in say - Montana as they are in Mongolia. But anyway, the only reason this story came up in the first place - was in the context of LENR and the Bergius catalysts. Primarily these catalyst are hexavalent. That would only matter in LENR if Rydberg levels of ionization are seen in the deeper levels. Andrea Rossi was said to be an expert on Bergius catalysts back in the Petrodragon days. Nickel is a Bergius catalyst, yet it is not normally hexavalent. To achieve hexavalency Ni chemistry usually demands an alkali, such as potassium. Notably the Rydberg levels in nickel are at IP5 and IP6. The bottom line seems to be that if deep Rydberg ionization levels are related to LENR in a causative way, and many who have followed the field believe that they are ... then with nickel, possibly the easiest way to achieve hexavalency is the NiO4 anion (2-) ... which seems to like potassium as the cation. That's a long way from Mongolia ... but it makes one wonder if LERN is somehow involved in a thermal boost in a successful CTL operation. That is probably the kind of information that will not be shared, but it could be a contributory reason that IH/Cherokee had no trouble convincing their Chinese partner- Technology Capital Co. of the nickel power claim. attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:Erdos CTL - a Communist success story? with implications for Rossi?
On Sat, Apr 5, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: China looks at this technology as a great success of State sponsorship, where an efficient enterprise is doing something that no capitalist in the USA has accomplished and is making both a huge profit and saving the economy billions by reduced reliance on OPEC oil. Over the next 40 years, China will save the capitalists from themselves, by offering genuine competition to their regulatory capturing, crony version of capitalism. China will do as was done in Singapore and develop a well-oiled, heavily socially engineered machine that is both efficient and slightly repugnant to Western sensibilities. Where US defense contractors will require 1 billion dollars to produce a new military system, the Chinese defense establishment will do something a little pared down and less ostentatious, but still quite effective, with 20 million dollars. As this happens, we will all collectively come to disdain prevailing superstition about efficient markets and start to look for more practical ways of allocating capital for large endeavors. (It's the big efforts that seem to pose a challenge for the US version of capitalism; I get the sense that commodity markets are already fairly efficient.) Eric
Re: [Vo]:BlackLight Power, Inc. Announces Sustained Production of Electricity
I do not think Rossi and Mills do a disservice to LENR because they raise money. They dishonor LENR because of the cockeyed theories that purports to describe their systems. Science is put off by this theoretical farce and it has been for 25 years. I hope that DGT will serve the cause of LENR as a science, when they release their product, I hope they release solid LENR research material that completely describes the correct LENR theory for the Ni/H reactor in detail. On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 7:30 PM, Lennart Thornros lenn...@thornros.comwrote: hello all, I am posting my comment here but it is several treads, which I am commenting on. i think as we all are trying to promote LENR. We are doing a lot of disservice to or case by being negative to the guys who has raised the funds, i have read half the ebook about an Andrea Rossi and i think he is a true entrepreneur. Are there thins you might question ? Yes of course. However, there are no real entreprenur that has not gone through a lot of problems . The matter of fact is that he has rissen from a situation most people cannot even grasp. My hat off for him. I hope his concept is right and that he succeed. I have very little background about BLP. I hope , contrary to most comments that he is on the right track. He is as far as i know putting himself on the line and it will either float or sink. I wish him luck. I would like his background more in detail but still he is hanging in there. Why fight 'inhouse'. Let me say that I do agree with the doubt about the sciebtifical dispute but I see no reason for the dogmatic attack of people. Those guys and few others has SOLD their concept to investors and already that is more than most of us can brag about. The discussion about how AR handles his patents is totally guess work. You only have a fraction of the background. Wait and see. Even if it could be handled better it cannot be done by someone with only fractional information. The long story about BLP might be indicative of something. However, I am sure very few outsiders know the full story. Wait and see. Most of all be happy the LENR idea has a few devoted people who has stuck out their head for it and convinced others to back them. Lennart Thornros / On Apr 3, 2014 11:13 PM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote: BlackLight Power is about to be swept into the dustbin of history. In a year or less, a workable LENR product will be demonstrated as a preproduction prototype. This should cut the legs out from under their investor base who have been so cruelly abused over these many years and that has propped up the BLP fantasy for far too long. The clock is ticking, their time is short, their fate is set, and their end is near. As an anathema to the quantum world, the fantasy that is the hydrino will be a fiction of the past and forgotten as the wondrous quantum causes of LENR are patently explained by serious and innovative scientific methods and top-notch research.
