Re: [Vo]:Was Ignition; now Mars

2012-04-23 Thread mixent
In reply to  Robert Lynn's message of Mon, 23 Apr 2012 20:59:06 +0100:
Hi,
[snip]
>Silane also requires hydrogen to make (apart from
>silicon) that is only available in trace quantities in the Martian
>atmosphere (.03% Water)
[snip]
There is probably plenty of water ice in the ground though.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html



RE: [Vo]:Was Ignition; now Mars

2012-04-23 Thread Robert Lynn
One of best rocket fuel combinations for Mars is actually carbon monoxide
and oxygen made directly from the Martian atmosphere using a solar or
nuclear heat source.  It gives an exhaust velocity of about 2700m/s (about
the same as an old Saturn F1 at sea level) which is good enough for a
rocket to reach orbit given the much lower Martian gravity and orbital
velocity.  It also makes it possible for an exploration team to hop
repeatedly around Mars looking at different spots refuelling between hops.
 The overall mass saving could be a huge win for any effort to put people
on Mars.

I can't see much point to Silane unless you are trying to make an aircraft
- which is very challenging given lack of runways and low atmospheric
pressure.  30km/10ft equivalent altitude is higher than any existing
aircraft can fly.  Silane also requires hydrogen to make (apart from
silicon) that is only available in trace quantities in the Martian
atmosphere (.03% Water)

On 23 April 2012 20:30, Hoyt A. Stearns Jr.  wrote:

> **
>  The Martians may not take kindly to that.
>
> Frank Lloyd Wright inspired house:
>
> http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/04images/Mars4/Structures/Diamond_001b.png
>
> Other bizarrities:
>
> http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Images_26.html
> http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Images.html
>
> http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Other_02.html
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> *From:* Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
> *Sent:* Monday, April 23, 2012 7:10 AM
>
>
>
>  ... The main one is silane – which is a molecule like methane but with
> silicon at the core instead of carbon. Robert Zurbin suggest this in “The
> Case for Mars: The Plan to Settle the Red Planet and Why We Must” and NASA
> has picked up on it, so I guess it is accurate.
>
> ** **
>
> http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-Mars-Settle-Planet/dp/0684835509
>
> ** **
>
> The atmosphere of Mars is mostly of carbon dioxide 95+%.
>
> ** **
>


RE: [Vo]:Was Ignition; now Mars

2012-04-23 Thread Hoyt A. Stearns Jr.
The Martians may not take kindly to that.

Frank Lloyd Wright inspired house:
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/04images/Mars4/Structures/Diamond_00
1b.png

Other bizarrities:

http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Images_26.html
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Images.html

http://www.thelivingmoon.com/43ancients/02files/Mars_Other_02.html



-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 7:10 AM


 ... The main one is silane - which is a molecule like methane but with
silicon at the core instead of carbon. Robert Zurbin suggest this in "The
Case for Mars: The Plan to Settle the Red Planet and Why We Must" and NASA
has picked up on it, so I guess it is accurate.



http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-Mars-Settle-Planet/dp/0684835509



The atmosphere of Mars is mostly of carbon dioxide 95+%.