Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
I looked at the variable-throttle version. The slide is at about 09:55 in https://connect.arc.nasa.gov/p1zygzm2h3i/?launcher=false&fcsContent=true&pbMode=normal It's worse than I thought! They inject Ni nanoparticles into a jet engine as if it were fuel!!! (Presuming you can 'ignite' it, and that you can get heat-transfer to the air.) When it's done its job it just goes out the exhaust. Never mind that nickel nanoparticles are ... a bit toxic?
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
In reply to David Roberson's message of Mon, 3 Mar 2014 10:23:38 -0500 (EST): Hi, [snip] >This recent news from Rossi leads me to believe that he has made progress in >obtaining a more robust reaction than previously. He does now claim to have a >mouse activation system that excites his cat. It is difficult to translate >this statement into one that we understand properly at this time. > > >My best effort is that he refers to a portion of his new design that controls >the release of hydrogen atoms or ions that then do their magic when entering >the nickel matrix. But on the other hand he may have a method to produce a >strong magnetic field that reaches a threshold level in another cat section. >Has anyone seen a clue about exactly what his cat and mouse are? A long time ago, I advised Rossi to use one reactor to create the heat for a second reactor (thus giving him a maximum COP of 6 x 6). Perhaps he followed up on that advice, resulting in the "cat & mouse" configuration. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
Dave-- At one point I think he indicated potassium was involved--maybe to lend some "heavy electrons from the S shell of potassium. Temperature control has also been identifier as controlling device. This might suggest that an infrared light spectrum may be important. Bob - Original Message - From: David Roberson To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Monday, March 03, 2014 7:23 AM Subject: Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study This recent news from Rossi leads me to believe that he has made progress in obtaining a more robust reaction than previously. He does now claim to have a mouse activation system that excites his cat. It is difficult to translate this statement into one that we understand properly at this time. My best effort is that he refers to a portion of his new design that controls the release of hydrogen atoms or ions that then do their magic when entering the nickel matrix. But on the other hand he may have a method to produce a strong magnetic field that reaches a threshold level in another cat section. Has anyone seen a clue about exactly what his cat and mouse are? IIRC he did not begin to discuss the very high temperature operation and explosion issues until mentioning the cat and mouse structure. This discussion of cat and mouse reminds me of the old TV Tom and Jerry. :-) Dave -Original Message- From: Axil Axil To: vortex-l Sent: Mon, Mar 3, 2014 9:53 am Subject: Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study The control factor of which you speak may well be the production of the sites where the nuclear reactions take place. The common assumption is that there is a fixed number of NAE, but this may not be true in all systems. The melt down of Rossi's reactor speaks against this assumption. Yes, some systems have a fix count of NAE but others must produce NAE as a dynamic process. This may be the reason why a NiH reactor melts down; the increase in number of NAE gets out of control. If a system with a fixed NAE count, the NAE will just self destruct before meltdown occurs. Rossi has said that his reactor will stop when the micro nickel power melts. This looks like that statement cannot be true because the reaction during melt down goes far beyond the temperature that will destroy nickel powder. On Mon, Mar 3, 2014 at 8:56 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Alan Fletcher wrote: One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. Cold fusion produces so much energy per gram of hydrogen I do not think it is possible to modulate it enough to control the reaction. There are no pumps or valves that can admit such tiny quantities at a constant rate. It is roughly 10 million times smaller than the delivery of gasoline by a fuel pump. The other problem is that this method will only work if fraction of hydrogen that reacts remains remains constant. I doubt that is true. I expect that if one moment 0.01% of the available hydrogen is consumed, the next moment it might be 10%. In other words, the presence of hydrogen alone does not control the consumption rate. Other control factors dominate. The reaction fluctuates a great deal when there has been no change in the amount of hydrogen in the cell, and probably not much change in the amount absorbed by the metal. Unless we can figure what these control factors are, and find ways to "control the control factors," I do not think cold fusion can be controlled. The control factors are different for gas loading versus electrolysis. No doubt the net result is the same, in terms of the special conditions in the metal (the NAE). - Jed
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
This recent news from Rossi leads me to believe that he has made progress in obtaining a more robust reaction than previously. He does now claim to have a mouse activation system that excites his cat. It is difficult to translate this statement into one that we understand properly at this time. My best effort is that he refers to a portion of his new design that controls the release of hydrogen atoms or ions that then do their magic when entering the nickel matrix. But on the other hand he may have a method to produce a strong magnetic field that reaches a threshold level in another cat section. Has anyone seen a clue about exactly what his cat and mouse are? IIRC he did not begin to discuss the very high temperature operation and explosion issues until mentioning the cat and mouse structure. This discussion of cat and mouse reminds me of the old TV Tom and Jerry. :-) Dave -Original Message- From: Axil Axil To: vortex-l Sent: Mon, Mar 3, 2014 9:53 am Subject: Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study The control factor of which you speak may well be the production of the sites where the nuclear reactions take place. The common assumption is that there is a fixed number of NAE, but this may not be true in all systems. The melt down of Rossi's reactor speaks against this assumption. Yes, some systems have a fix count of NAE but others must produce NAE as a dynamic process. This may be the reason why a NiH reactor melts down; the increase in number of NAE gets out of control. If a system with a fixed NAE count, the NAE will just self destruct before meltdown occurs. Rossi has said that his reactor will stop when the micro nickel power melts. This looks like that statement cannot be true because the reaction during melt down goes far beyond the temperature that will destroy nickel powder. On Mon, Mar 3, 2014 at 8:56 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Alan Fletcher wrote: One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. Cold fusion produces so much energy per gram of hydrogen I do not think it is possible to modulate it enough to control the reaction. There are no pumps or valves that can admit such tiny quantities at a constant rate. It is roughly 10 million times smaller than the delivery of gasoline by a fuel pump. The other problem is that this method will only work if fraction of hydrogen that reacts remains remains constant. I doubt that is true. I expect that if one moment 0.01% of the available hydrogen is consumed, the next moment it might be 10%. In other words, the presence of hydrogen alone does not control the consumption rate. Other control factors dominate. The reaction fluctuates a great deal when there has been no change in the amount of hydrogen in the cell, and probably not much change in the amount absorbed by the metal. Unless we can figure what these control factors are, and find ways to "control the control factors," I do not think cold fusion can be controlled. The control factors are different for gas loading versus electrolysis. No doubt the net result is the same, in terms of the special conditions in the metal (the NAE). - Jed
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
Axil-- You stated: >If a system with a fixed NAE count, the NAE will just self destruct before >meltdown occurs.> This may not be the case if the initiation of the reaction to produce the energy is controlled by some small energy input and not self sustaining from NAE to NAE. Bob - Original Message - From: Axil Axil To: vortex-l Sent: Monday, March 03, 2014 6:53 AM Subject: Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study The control factor of which you speak may well be the production of the sites where the nuclear reactions take place. The common assumption is that there is a fixed number of NAE, but this may not be true in all systems. The melt down of Rossi's reactor speaks against this assumption. Yes, some systems have a fix count of NAE but others must produce NAE as a dynamic process. This may be the reason why a NiH reactor melts down; the increase in number of NAE gets out of control. If a system with a fixed NAE count, the NAE will just self destruct before meltdown occurs. Rossi has said that his reactor will stop when the micro nickel power melts. This looks like that statement cannot be true because the reaction during melt down goes far beyond the temperature that will destroy nickel powder. On Mon, Mar 3, 2014 at 8:56 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Alan Fletcher wrote: One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. Cold fusion produces so much energy per gram of hydrogen I do not think it is possible to modulate it enough to control the reaction. There are no pumps or valves that can admit such tiny quantities at a constant rate. It is roughly 10 million times smaller than the delivery of gasoline by a fuel pump. The other problem is that this method will only work if fraction of hydrogen that reacts remains remains constant. I doubt that is true. I expect that if one moment 0.01% of the available hydrogen is consumed, the next moment it might be 10%. In other words, the presence of hydrogen alone does not control the consumption rate. Other control factors dominate. The reaction fluctuates a great deal when there has been no change in the amount of hydrogen in the cell, and probably not much change in the amount absorbed by the metal. Unless we can figure what these control factors are, and find ways to "control the control factors," I do not think cold fusion can be controlled. The control factors are different for gas loading versus electrolysis. No doubt the net result is the same, in terms of the special conditions in the metal (the NAE). - Jed
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
The control factor of which you speak may well be the production of the sites where the nuclear reactions take place. The common assumption is that there is a fixed number of NAE, but this may not be true in all systems. The melt down of Rossi's reactor speaks against this assumption. Yes, some systems have a fix count of NAE but others must produce NAE as a dynamic process. This may be the reason why a NiH reactor melts down; the increase in number of NAE gets out of control. If a system with a fixed NAE count, the NAE will just self destruct before meltdown occurs. Rossi has said that his reactor will stop when the micro nickel power melts. This looks like that statement cannot be true because the reaction during melt down goes far beyond the temperature that will destroy nickel powder. On Mon, Mar 3, 2014 at 8:56 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > Alan Fletcher wrote: > > >> One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, >> inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. >> Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. > > > Cold fusion produces so much energy per gram of hydrogen I do not think it > is possible to modulate it enough to control the reaction. There are no > pumps or valves that can admit such tiny quantities at a constant rate. It > is roughly 10 million times smaller than the delivery of gasoline by a fuel > pump. > > The other problem is that this method will only work if fraction of > hydrogen that reacts remains remains constant. I doubt that is true. I > expect that if one moment 0.01% of the available hydrogen is consumed, the > next moment it might be 10%. In other words, the presence of hydrogen alone > does not control the consumption rate. Other control factors dominate. The > reaction fluctuates a great deal when there has been no change in the > amount of hydrogen in the cell, and probably not much change in the amount > absorbed by the metal. Unless we can figure what these control factors are, > and find ways to "control the control factors," I do not think cold fusion > can be controlled. > > The control factors are different for gas loading versus electrolysis. No > doubt the net result is the same, in terms of the special conditions in the > metal (the NAE). > > - Jed > >
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
Alan Fletcher wrote: > One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, > inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. > Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. Cold fusion produces so much energy per gram of hydrogen I do not think it is possible to modulate it enough to control the reaction. There are no pumps or valves that can admit such tiny quantities at a constant rate. It is roughly 10 million times smaller than the delivery of gasoline by a fuel pump. The other problem is that this method will only work if fraction of hydrogen that reacts remains remains constant. I doubt that is true. I expect that if one moment 0.01% of the available hydrogen is consumed, the next moment it might be 10%. In other words, the presence of hydrogen alone does not control the consumption rate. Other control factors dominate. The reaction fluctuates a great deal when there has been no change in the amount of hydrogen in the cell, and probably not much change in the amount absorbed by the metal. Unless we can figure what these control factors are, and find ways to "control the control factors," I do not think cold fusion can be controlled. The control factors are different for gas loading versus electrolysis. No doubt the net result is the same, in terms of the special conditions in the metal (the NAE). - Jed
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
From: "James Bowery" Sent: Saturday, March 1, 2014 4:59:26 PM One interesting concept : since Ni/H LENR might not be throttle-able, inject a stream of gas (H2?) and Ni nanoparticles into the reactor chamber. Throttle by modulating the mass content and/or velocity. But then you'd have to either kill the reaction or get rid of the excess heat as it leaves the chamber. Otherwise, they presume a constant-output LENR. Thye had various fusion-reactor designs as a base for their studies.
Re: [Vo]:NASA Langley Presentation on LENR Aircraft Study
"There is a similar initiative in Lockheed/Martin." Please vote up the submission of this story at slashdot: http://slashdot.org/submission/3377235/nasa-langley-study-on-cold-fusions-potential-in-aviation On Sat, Mar 1, 2014 at 6:59 PM, James Bowery wrote: > > https://connect.arc.nasa.gov/p1zygzm2h3i/?launcher=false&fcsContent=true&pbMode=normal >
