Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Sun, Jun 29, 2003 at 01:07:24PM -0700, Michael Wenk wrote: On Sunday 29 June 2003 02:32 am, Bill Kendrick wrote: Okay, just out of curiosity. Say one wanted to create a 'Java application' (e.g., something that runs in a web browser, cell phone or PDA JVM), but they wanted to write the application using the C /language/. This is possible, is it not? If so, are there some tools for this under Linux? (I see gjc, the Java compiler from GNU, as well as gij, the Java bytecode interpreter from GNU; but nothing for taking code in other programming languages and turning them into Java bytecode) Thx! -bill! The biggest problem would be language features. C allows you to many things java does not. You'd probably spend more time trying to debug your javabytecodes on whatever system you're developing than you would learning java syntax. Also, even if you wanted to use C, you would still have to learn the Java API(or write your own, which would be difficult to do), and how to call API classes from within the language. This would be a problem if you were compiling C source into Java source; but AIUI the JVM is a pretty complete virtual representation of an actual machine; you should be able to use all features you normally have in C. But it'd either have to be a freestanding (think embedded) implementation, or you'd need a decent implementation of the standard C library in javacode. -Micah ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Sun, Jun 29, 2003 at 06:27:08PM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: On Sunday 29 June 2003 02:06 pm, Ken Bloom wrote: Second, their standard libraries have very different names for most things (even something so simple as the sine function has two different incompatible lines to call it in the two different languages - in c it's sin() , and in java it's Math.sine() ). So I can't even copy/paste strictly mathematical functions between the two languages. Technically, libraries are not part of the language. Not from the standpoint of your typical language spec (at least for C). The C standard specifies the standard library as part of the language; though I seem to recall that C++ seperates them more distinctly in the language. ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Mon, Jun 30, 2003 at 10:05:24AM -0700, Micah J. Cowan wrote: On Sun, Jun 29, 2003 at 01:07:24PM -0700, Michael Wenk wrote: On Sunday 29 June 2003 02:32 am, Bill Kendrick wrote: Okay, just out of curiosity. Say one wanted to create a 'Java application' (e.g., something that runs in a web browser, cell phone or PDA JVM), but they wanted to write the application using the C /language/. This is possible, is it not? If so, are there some tools for this under Linux? (I see gjc, the Java compiler from GNU, as well as gij, the Java bytecode interpreter from GNU; but nothing for taking code in other programming languages and turning them into Java bytecode) Thx! -bill! The biggest problem would be language features. C allows you to many things java does not. You'd probably spend more time trying to debug your javabytecodes on whatever system you're developing than you would learning java syntax. Also, even if you wanted to use C, you would still have to learn the Java API(or write your own, which would be difficult to do), and how to call API classes from within the language. This would be a problem if you were compiling C source into Java source; but AIUI the JVM is a pretty complete virtual representation of an actual machine; you should be able to use all features you normally have in C. ... I don't think this is true. The JVM is a virtual representation of a _stack-based_ machine (i.e. it doesn't have any notion of memory addresses) so I don't think it can do a lot of the pointer arithmetic that you often find in C code. Matt -- * * Matt Roper [EMAIL PROTECTED]* * http://www.mattrope.com * * PGP Key: http://www.mattrope.com/mattrope.asc * * ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
[vox-tech] VNC at 1024x768 resolution??
Hello I am accessing a Linux system via the VNC server. The VNC client is running on Win2K. After the connection is established, the VNC client window opens up as a 800x600 window. The XF86Config is using the resolution at 1024x768. Some of the items from the Linux system are going beyond the VNC client boundry. When I try to maximize the window, the display is still at 800x600 with broad dark strips around the window. The display resolution on Win2K is greater than the 1024x768 resolution. How can I increase my VNC Client to show the Linux system at 1024x768 resolution? Thank you in advance. -- Subba Rao [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Old American Wild West saying: God created men but Colt made them equal. Today: Linus created Linux and Linux made IT companies equal. ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Mon, Jun 30, 2003 at 10:37:15AM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: On Monday 30 June 2003 10:07 am, Micah J. Cowan wrote: On Sun, Jun 29, 2003 at 06:27:08PM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: On Sunday 29 June 2003 02:06 pm, Ken Bloom wrote: Second, their standard libraries have very different names for most things (even something so simple as the sine function has two different incompatible lines to call it in the two different languages - in c it's sin() , and in java it's Math.sine() ). So I can't even copy/paste strictly mathematical functions between the two languages. Technically, libraries are not part of the language. Not from the standpoint of your typical language spec (at least for C). The C standard specifies the standard library as part of the language; though I seem to recall that C++ seperates them more distinctly in the language. Do you have a reference for that? I always thought that language by definition does not include libraries. Perhaps the standard you are referring to covers more than just the language. The usual reference the first sentence of the first paragraph of the first section (Scope) of the standard, which states: This International Standard specifies the form and establishes the interpretation of programs written in the C programming language. Yet, this standard provides a clause detailing all standard C library facilities. It is generally accepted among comp.lang.c regulars that the standard C library is part of the language itself, according to the language of the standard. For corroborations from respected regulars of comp.lang.c, including Dan Pop, who while sometimes rather rude has the reputation of near-inscrutability in issues regarding the C language and standard (pick arguments with him at your own risk: he tends to fight dirty, and he's nearly always right); and Chris Torek, responsible for writing huge portions of the FreeBSD C and system libraries: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=9606231913.AA17433%40ues5.cern.chrnum=1 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=97i9i0%242f3%241%40elf.bsdi.comrnum=1 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=885344571snz%40genesis.demon.co.ukrnum=58 -Micah ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
Well then let's consider my comment to refer to C as it was defined by Kernighan and Ritchie. If they don't count any more, I give up. -- Rod On Monday 30 June 2003 11:29 am, Micah J. Cowan wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2003 at 10:37:15AM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: On Monday 30 June 2003 10:07 am, Micah J. Cowan wrote: On Sun, Jun 29, 2003 at 06:27:08PM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: On Sunday 29 June 2003 02:06 pm, Ken Bloom wrote: Second, their standard libraries have very different names for most things (even something so simple as the sine function has two different incompatible lines to call it in the two different languages - in c it's sin() , and in java it's Math.sine() ). So I can't even copy/paste strictly mathematical functions between the two languages. Technically, libraries are not part of the language. Not from the standpoint of your typical language spec (at least for C). The C standard specifies the standard library as part of the language; though I seem to recall that C++ seperates them more distinctly in the language. Do you have a reference for that? I always thought that language by definition does not include libraries. Perhaps the standard you are referring to covers more than just the language. The usual reference the first sentence of the first paragraph of the first section (Scope) of the standard, which states: This International Standard specifies the form and establishes the interpretation of programs written in the C programming language. Yet, this standard provides a clause detailing all standard C library facilities. It is generally accepted among comp.lang.c regulars that the standard C library is part of the language itself, according to the language of the standard. For corroborations from respected regulars of comp.lang.c, including Dan Pop, who while sometimes rather rude has the reputation of near-inscrutability in issues regarding the C language and standard (pick arguments with him at your own risk: he tends to fight dirty, and he's nearly always right); and Chris Torek, responsible for writing huge portions of the FreeBSD C and system libraries: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=9606231913.AA17433%40ues5.cern.chrnum =1 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=97i9i0%242f3%241%40elf.bsdi.comrnum=1 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=885344571snz%40genesis.demon.co.ukrnu m=58 -Micah ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Mon 30 Jun 03, 11:29 AM, Micah J. Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: On Mon, Jun 30, 2003 at 10:37:15AM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: Do you have a reference for that? I always thought that language by definition does not include libraries. Perhaps the standard you are referring to covers more than just the language. The usual reference the first sentence of the first paragraph of the first section (Scope) of the standard, which states: This International Standard specifies the form and establishes the interpretation of programs written in the C programming language. Yet, this standard provides a clause detailing all standard C library facilities. It is generally accepted among comp.lang.c regulars that the standard C library is part of the language itself, according to the language of the standard. the two of you are talking about two different standards. K+R very explicitly say: - there are no input/output functions in C. - there are no functions that perform file operations in C. - the std C library is NOT a part of the language proper. of course, when they wrote the book, there was no C99. as for the quote above, i have two comments: 1. you cannot logically infer that the std library is a part of the library. 2. however, i would agree that it's probably the intent of whoever wrote that sentence. pete -- GPG Instructions: http://www.dirac.org/linux/gpg GPG Fingerprint: B9F1 6CF3 47C4 7CD8 D33E 70A9 A3B9 1945 67EA 951D ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
Bill Kendrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Okay, just out of curiosity. Say one wanted to create a 'Java application' (e.g., something that runs in a web browser, cell phone or PDA JVM), but they wanted to write the application using the C /language/. Makes me think of SWIG. Make multilanguage apps. http://www.swig.org/ It's usually for scripting languages interfacing to C or vice-versa, but it also does C to Java. It's about all I know about that. This is possible, is it not? If so, are there some tools for this under Linux? (I see gjc, the Java compiler from GNU, as well as gij, the Java bytecode interpreter from GNU; but nothing for taking code in other programming languages and turning them into Java bytecode) In a nutshell, language translation tools are hard to get right or to even do most of the work. Here's a paper that describes work translating from C++ to Java: http://seclab.cs.ucdavis.edu/~devanbu/dp.tex.pdf Now do it in reverse, and un-object-ify it. That would be a nice paper, or thesis even. :) Cheers, -- Ricardo Anguiano http://www.codesourcery.com ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
as for the quote above, i have two comments: 1. you cannot logically infer that the std library is a part of the library. I'm assuming the second library was meant to be language; and I have to politely disagree with you there. The scope section of ISO international standards are intended to completely and entirely convey the scope and content of the document. If it says that this standard specifies A, and does not elaborate, then that is all the standard does. I understand the reasoning you probably mean, though: under many circumstances, a sentence such as the above could break down to: A contains B which, obviously, does not preclude the possibility that A contains C for any C. However, things don't really work that way with standards for the most part; certainly, every regular I know in comp.lang.c reads it as A *is* B. Which would imply that the standard library is part of the language definition. This is also far from unusual (BTW, I was wrong about C++ - it too includes the library facility definitions as part of the language definition as a whole). It has been pretty common in language specifications to consider the entire specification to define a language, and for that specification to include a standard library which is considered part of the language. Incidentally, KR has not been the authoritative definition of the C language since 1989, when it was first standardized by ANSI (and, in the following year, by ISO). -Micah ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
RE: [vox-tech] VNC at 1024x768 resolution??
IIRC, the option to pass to the VNC server is something like this: vncserver other options -geometry 1024x768 HTH, --Seth Hello I am accessing a Linux system via the VNC server. The VNC client is running on Win2K. After the connection is established, the VNC client window opens up as a 800x600 window. The XF86Config is using the resolution at 1024x768. Some of the items from the Linux system are going beyond the VNC client boundry. When I try to maximize the window, the display is still at 800x600 with broad dark strips around the window. The display resolution on Win2K is greater than the 1024x768 resolution. How can I increase my VNC Client to show the Linux system at 1024x768 resolution? Thank you in advance. -- Subba Rao [EMAIL PROTECTED] - - Old American Wild West saying: God created men but Colt made them equal. Today: Linus created Linux and Linux made IT companies equal. ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Compiling C into Java bytecode?
On Mon, Jun 30, 2003 at 11:43:49AM -0700, Rod Roark wrote: Well then let's consider my comment to refer to C as it was defined by Kernighan and Ritchie. If they don't count any more, I give up. Meh... What did KR ever give _us_?! ;^) -bill! -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Got kids? Get Tux Paint! http://newbreedsoftware.com/bill/ http://newbreedsoftware.com/tuxpaint/ ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
Re: [vox-tech] Measure network usage?
I like ntop ( www.ntop.org ). It has a nice SSL server w/interface and graphs to view what is going on, and it uses nmap, lsof, and several other network utilities to find out about the machines on the network ( and the remote connections ) Mark Shawn P. Neugebauer wrote: On Saturday 28 June 2003 01:50 am, Samuel Merritt wrote: Shawn P. Neugebauer said: I have a few Linux boxes that have uptimes of days to months. I need to try to estimate bandwidth usage for a long-ish period of time (e.g., days or weeks) in order to characterize how much bandwidth I use (to decide on level-of-service issues for a new ISP---I have to move :( ) . Is there a way to tell the amount (in bytes) of traffic sent and received by a running box? Is there a simple *non-intrusive* tool that might add a little value to whatever is built-in? I'm aware of MRTG, and Orca, but these are overkill for this type of problem. Take a look at the output of /sbin/ifconfig. It should have a line like RX bytes:2328595615 (2.1 GiB) TX bytes:3104087047 (2.8 GiB) or so. Have a script dump the byte counts to a text file once an hour, and then you can do a little simple analysis with a hand-rolled tool. That was the first place I checked, but slapping hand on forehead I saw RX/TX packets and missed the byte count. I just man'd ifconfig, noticed it used /proc/net/dev, saw byte counts in *there* and started wondering why they didn't show up with ifconfig... Now, if I can extract some info from my router, I might have some idea how much data exits and arrives at my network... Thanks. ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech ___ vox-tech mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox-tech
