[wdvltalk] open source story
I'm sure you've all seen this, but not so sure that I'm not giving the link ;-). http://www.news.com/2008-1082_3-5065859.html It is about Sterling Ball and his run in with M$.. Joseph Harris The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] or use the web interface http://e-newsletters.internet.com/discussionlists.html/ Send Your Posts To: wdvltalk@lists.wdvl.com To change subscription settings, add a password or view the web interface: http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/read/?forum=wdvltalk http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Linux Server - Help Getting Started
Hi Everyone - I'm going to put together my first Linux server, for testing purposes now but possibly more later. I currently host and manage 10 Windows 2003 servers, so Windows is my thing. Linux, on the other hand, is not. I've looked at the various distros out there and am not sure which would be the best one for me to start out with. My plan at this point is only to run the server as a web box, so I will want Apache, MySQL, and PHP enabled right away. Later, possibly RoR. And even later, I might possibly incorporate Linux servers into our network. I've done a fair amount of searching on Google, and there is plenty of information - but it is all different (use this, do that, etc). I have downloaded the latest versions of Fedora, Ubuntu, and now openSUSE. Now I just need to figure out which one I'm going with. Based on past experiences, if anyone has any suggestions on how to get started, I would appreciate it! Thanks! Todd The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] or use the web interface http://e-newsletters.internet.com/discussionlists.html/ Send Your Posts To: wdvltalk@lists.wdvl.com To change subscription settings, add a password or view the web interface: http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/read/?forum=wdvltalk http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
Re: [wdvltalk] Linux Server - Help Getting Started
Todd, /me fires up into this is what I do for a living mode and starts typing - this could be a long message... :o) The quick answer: If you want to use Linux and just want a solution that works, use Ubuntu. If you want a server that will be familiar with a large amount of the industry, use either Fedora or CentOS. If you want to _learn_ Linux, use Gentoo. If you want to support Microsoft and use Linux at the same time, use SuSE. [0] The long(er) answer: Ubuntu is a fantastic product. As a desktop operating system, I would use it in place of Windows any day of the week. It is stable, secure, compatible, easy to setup and use (just ask a number of my non-IT-Literate friends and my Dad!) and there is a huge amount of support available either through the forums or mailing lists similar to this one. As a server O/S, I have my reservations (customising PHP to work using nuSOAP instead of the built in libs is a PITA) however the fact that the install program on the server CD has a check box that automatically installs LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySql and PHP) is a definate winner. Administration is also easy and there are many, many tools to help you. As it is based on Debian, any script that is written for Debian to ease Admin (and there are thousands out there!) should work on Ubuntu. Fedora and CentOS appear to be industry standards as they are based on RedHat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) - CentOS is effectively a completely free copy with the branding removed! They are secure, reliable and free just like Ubuntu, although I've never got the hang of the RedHat Base Layout [1]. Gentoo is a nightmare to setup the first time you run it. It can take anywhere up to a week to get a server completely installed and configured. If you do a Stage One installation, you need to compile the compiler(!) however as a learning process, it is invaluable. You will learn more about using and configuring Linux from using Gentoo than just about any other Linux distribution. SuSE is a nightmare to upgrade. Moving from 10.2 to 10.3 requires a complete system re-install. Compare this with Ubuntu where you just type apt-get dist-upgrade from the command line, Fedora/CentOS which have a similar upgrade path and Gentoo which is always the latest version and you can see why I'll say no more about what is otherwise a very good distribution. Out of the above, I would recommend Ubuntu or RedHat (Fedora/CentOS) for a production environment if you need it to be quick and easy. The reason that Ubuntu and RHEL clones are so quick to update is that the software you insatll is pre-comiled, just like Windows installs, so it is very quick although probably not optimised for your system. If you want to know exactly what is on your system and have it optimised for best possible performance, use Gentoo. It does not have the corporate backing in the same way that RedHat/Ubuntu have, however the Gentoo community are excellent for support and a number of Linux Consultancies know Gentoo. Gentoo is source-based. When you install software (which is as easy as typing emerge -av package-name) it downloads the source code and then compiles it against the options that you have set meaning it is truely tailored to your machine. A number of Datacentres that I have worked with use Gentoo for exactly this reason - it may take a few days to get to the perfect server, but it's worth it to know that it is fully tuned to your hardware. If you want any further help, let me know and I'll do what I can, I guess the main advice is don't be put off by not having a mouse. It really is amazing what you can achieve with a command-line and a text editor under Linux! Cheers, Matt. [0] There's been an number of questions raised as to just how impartial SuSE/Novell are when it comes to software patents etc, just google for it! [1] The way in which the directories are laid out on the system Quoting Todd Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi Everyone - I'm going to put together my first Linux server, for testing purposes now but possibly more later. I currently host and manage 10 Windows 2003 servers, so Windows is my thing. Linux, on the other hand, is not. I've looked at the various distros out there and am not sure which would be the best one for me to start out with. My plan at this point is only to run the server as a web box, so I will want Apache, MySQL, and PHP enabled right away. Later, possibly RoR. And even later, I might possibly incorporate Linux servers into our network. I've done a fair amount of searching on Google, and there is plenty of information - but it is all different (use this, do that, etc). I have downloaded the latest versions of Fedora, Ubuntu, and now openSUSE. Now I just need to figure out which one I'm going with. Based on past experiences, if anyone has any suggestions on how to get started, I would
RE: [wdvltalk] Linux Server - Help Getting Started
Hi Matt - Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I actually loaded both Fedora and Ubuntu onto different systems to check them out (apparently I didn't have enough to do!). Fedora is slick, and I would be open to looking at it for using day-to-day. Very easy to get around in, and the system I put it on (nothing spectacular) handled it with ease. I had planned to use that for the LAMP setup, but after installing and such, wasn't sure how good of an idea it was. Next was Ubuntu. I put it on an older P3 800Mhz system (with a SCSI OS drive and 2GB RAM). From what I could see during loading it just flew. However, when it in finished installing and booted up, I looked at the command line for about 5 minutes thinking to myself If I just wait and watch it, maybe it will do something. HA Obviously I understand the use of command lines, but not how to use them. So the learning curve in my eyes just took a 90 straight up. I had heard that SuSE was good for M$ people and I have it downloaded, but not installed yet. However, upgrading is important to me. So if it becomes a PITA and risks data, then that isn't worth it to me either. Again, I appreciate your feedback and will investigate Fedora and Ubuntu a little more. Thanks! Todd -Original Message- From: Matthew Macdonald-Wallace [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 11:25 AM To: wdvltalk@lists.wdvl.com; Todd Richards Subject: Re: [wdvltalk] Linux Server - Help Getting Started Todd, /me fires up into this is what I do for a living mode and starts typing - this could be a long message... :o) The quick answer: If you want to use Linux and just want a solution that works, use Ubuntu. If you want a server that will be familiar with a large amount of the industry, use either Fedora or CentOS. If you want to _learn_ Linux, use Gentoo. If you want to support Microsoft and use Linux at the same time, use SuSE. [0] The long(er) answer: Ubuntu is a fantastic product. As a desktop operating system, I would use it in place of Windows any day of the week. It is stable, secure, compatible, easy to setup and use (just ask a number of my non-IT-Literate friends and my Dad!) and there is a huge amount of support available either through the forums or mailing lists similar to this one. As a server O/S, I have my reservations (customising PHP to work using nuSOAP instead of the built in libs is a PITA) however the fact that the install program on the server CD has a check box that automatically installs LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySql and PHP) is a definate winner. Administration is also easy and there are many, many tools to help you. As it is based on Debian, any script that is written for Debian to ease Admin (and there are thousands out there!) should work on Ubuntu. Fedora and CentOS appear to be industry standards as they are based on RedHat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) - CentOS is effectively a completely free copy with the branding removed! They are secure, reliable and free just like Ubuntu, although I've never got the hang of the RedHat Base Layout [1]. Gentoo is a nightmare to setup the first time you run it. It can take anywhere up to a week to get a server completely installed and configured. If you do a Stage One installation, you need to compile the compiler(!) however as a learning process, it is invaluable. You will learn more about using and configuring Linux from using Gentoo than just about any other Linux distribution. SuSE is a nightmare to upgrade. Moving from 10.2 to 10.3 requires a complete system re-install. Compare this with Ubuntu where you just type apt-get dist-upgrade from the command line, Fedora/CentOS which have a similar upgrade path and Gentoo which is always the latest version and you can see why I'll say no more about what is otherwise a very good distribution. Out of the above, I would recommend Ubuntu or RedHat (Fedora/CentOS) for a production environment if you need it to be quick and easy. The reason that Ubuntu and RHEL clones are so quick to update is that the software you insatll is pre-comiled, just like Windows installs, so it is very quick although probably not optimised for your system. If you want to know exactly what is on your system and have it optimised for best possible performance, use Gentoo. It does not have the corporate backing in the same way that RedHat/Ubuntu have, however the Gentoo community are excellent for support and a number of Linux Consultancies know Gentoo. Gentoo is source-based. When you install software (which is as easy as typing emerge -av package-name) it downloads the source code and then compiles it against the options that you have set meaning it is truely tailored to your machine. A number of Datacentres that I have worked with use Gentoo for exactly this reason - it may take a few days to get to the perfect server, but it's worth it to know that
Re: [wdvltalk] Linux Server - Help Getting Started
On Dec 22, 2007 9:59 AM, Todd Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You got good info from Mathew, but I'll offer a different perspective :-) However, upgrading is important to me. Why? I use various versions of *nix, and other than security patches, really don't care how current they are. The main reason is that they're only a platform for the important stuff, the apps I need to run, and I *never* use a package manager for those. The main reason for that is all package managers I've seen assume you only want to run *one* version of, say, Apache httpd on your system. That's not true for me, either in development/testing mode, or production. So all the apps are installed from source or from a tar file binary, so I run multiple versions in parallel e.g. something like /usr/local/apache-httpd-2.2.4 /usr/local/apache-httpd-2.2.6-PHP /usr/local/apache-httpd-2.2.6-proxy and so on. It also means I have identical file system layouts in dev and production no matter what distros are involved. YMMV, -- Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] or use the web interface http://e-newsletters.internet.com/discussionlists.html/ Send Your Posts To: wdvltalk@lists.wdvl.com To change subscription settings, add a password or view the web interface: http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/read/?forum=wdvltalk http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
