Re: Regarding Final Note
- What I would love to see is a "simple" download and install package for WO developers. For example, the recommended Eclipse 3.3.1 and stable WOLips for WO5.4 development. -- This doesn't sound too hardisn't just about everything shy of the WO libraries and EOGenerator stuff in the Eclipse folder (by default) ? Thanks, jeremy ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Regarding Final Note
What I would love to see is a "simple" download and install package for WO developers. The biggest issue with this is that someone has to host the extra 100+ meg installer for a bunch of leeches to download :) But anyone could technically make a preinstalled bundle. For example, the recommended Eclipse 3.3.1 and stable WOLips for WO5.4 development. Not sure if it's possible but that would be nice. And maybe bundle a README file with links pointing users to places pages where they can find more info. Since most real projects consist of reusable frameworks and applications that use them, I think a tutorial should cover how to build a framework and add that dependency to one of your apps. Have you seen the wolips wiki? It has all of this. ms ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Regarding Final Note
On Oct 30, 2007, at 4:31 PM, Mike Schrag wrote: And by the way, the move from Xcode + WOB + EOM to Eclipse + WOLips + EM is really no different than Apple's move from the old iMovie to iMovie 08. The big point of contention is that it's neither a clear upward or downward move. In some ways it's substantially better, in some ways it's worse, but, like Apple with iMovie, we (being WOLips and Apple) collectively believe that even though we took a step down in some areas, the overall trajectory of this direction is much stronger. I fully believe this for WOLips. Yes, graphical editing of tables isn't there yet, and you can't drag and drop bindings yet, but there's a HUGE amount of new stuff that IS there that makes a much stronger development platform to work off of. Think different ;) What I would love to see is a "simple" download and install package for WO developers. For example, the recommended Eclipse 3.3.1 and stable WOLips for WO5.4 development. Not sure if it's possible but that would be nice. And maybe bundle a README file with links pointing users to places pages where they can find more info. Since most real projects consist of reusable frameworks and applications that use them, I think a tutorial should cover how to build a framework and add that dependency to one of your apps. That should be helpful for beginners. Ricardo Parada ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Regarding Final Note
And by the way, the move from Xcode + WOB + EOM to Eclipse + WOLips + EM is really no different than Apple's move from the old iMovie to iMovie 08. The big point of contention is that it's neither a clear upward or downward move. In some ways it's substantially better, in some ways it's worse, but, like Apple with iMovie, we (being WOLips and Apple) collectively believe that even though we took a step down in some areas, the overall trajectory of this direction is much stronger. I fully believe this for WOLips. Yes, graphical editing of tables isn't there yet, and you can't drag and drop bindings yet, but there's a HUGE amount of new stuff that IS there that makes a much stronger development platform to work off of. Think different ;) ms On Oct 30, 2007, at 4:27 PM, Thierry Kramis wrote: There have been many mails on WO passing. First of all it didn't until now, and it won't for some time (at least that is what I think). But anyway. With the introduction of Webobject 5.4 and Leopard we've seen two things: 1. Java isn't top priority anymore (look at Java 6 not being there...). 2. Therefore also Webobjects can't be. They didn't even manage to launch a new webobjects homepage synchronized with the release of Leopard and in Server Features it isn't leasted under the key technologie section. And to be honest, the progress they made since 5.3 in my view is a little dissapointing altough going in the right direction. They now mainly rely on help from the superbe wonder community for tools and anything. But in the end their pushing other technologies in place... Regards Thierry ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/mschrag%40mdimension.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Regarding Final Note
There have been many mails on WO passing. First of all it didn't until now, and it won't for some time (at least that is what I think). But anyway. With the introduction of Webobject 5.4 and Leopard we've seen two things: 1. Java isn't top priority anymore (look at Java 6 not being there...). 2. Therefore also Webobjects can't be. They didn't even manage to launch a new webobjects homepage synchronized with the release of Leopard and in Server Features it isn't leasted under the key technologie section. And to be honest, the progress they made since 5.3 in my view is a little dissapointing altough going in the right direction. They now mainly rely on help from the superbe wonder community for tools and anything. But in the end their pushing other technologies in place... I don't believe this is the case. First of all, their release plan with Java 6 basically matches their behavior with all previous releases of Java and demonstrates to me that it's as important as it's always been (whether that is high importance or not, who knows, but it seems at least consistent). There's a huge amount of speculation about what's going on, but I suspect the answer is "it's coming out really soon, chill people." All these folks on the blogs who are so worked up about Java 6, I'm curious what exactly the features are of 6 that they're really that upset about not having right now? It seems to me Sun's pretty well lamed up the Java 6 release -- give me some REAL features, Sun -- don't just bundle a damn database in your VM. This is not by any means an excuse for Apple to delay releasing, I'd love the latest and greatest also, but looking at the differences, I'm not really all that upset. Secondly while 5.3 in many ways is just catching up with what Wonder and others have had for a while, I think it's forward momentum, and that's a good thing for the platform. Wonder has had 7 (or so) years of active development while WO has mostly stood still, so yeah, it's going to take a while to figure out what makes sense to go into the platform and for them to bring those features in. And while I've disagreed with some of the specific 5.4 decisions, I think Pierre, Daryl, and crew have good intentions for the platform and I know they're actively working on making it better. Apple could have decided to not put a single more man hour into WO development, but instead they've made a fairly substantial turn in the past year or so and are actually trying to offer new developments. I do agree that the WO 5.3 webpage on Apple's site is pretty lame, but it's also a technology in a weird place at the moment. Do they show WOLips pictures there? Maybe, but I'm not sure there's much of a precedent for that. Give it time to work itself out. And honestly, if it doesn't, so be it. You're still using one of the best technologies around, and Apple not doing a damn thing for almost a decade hasn't really held you up thus far. ms ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
