Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads [and a Privacy Policy question]

[Yury Bulka]

Dear all,

In the context of this discussion, I think it might be appropriate to
share the following. A few days ago I had a brief conversation with a
(non-Wikipedian) user on social media regarding a fundraising banner
they were seeing. In their case they had an additional concern with the
banners (apart from "making Wikipedia unusable"). They wrote:

"<...> I find it more than a little creepy that wikipedia is tracking
how often I visit."

Curious, I asked if the popup said anything about their browsing
behavior, and it did (citing a snippet they have shared with me):

"Hi, reader in Canada, it seems you use Wikipedia a lot; that's great!
It's awkward, but this Tuesday we need your help. This is the 10th
appeal we've shown you. We don't have salespeople. Thanks to the
donations of 2% of our readers, Wikipedia remains open to all. If you
donate just $2.75, or whatever you can this Tuesday, Wikipedia could
keep thriving. Thank you."

I have decided to look this up in the Privacy Policy, and indeed:

  We want to make the Wikimedia Sites better for you by learning more
  about how you use them. Examples of this might include how often you
  visit the Wikimedia Sites, what you like, what you find helpful, how you
  get to the Wikimedia Sites, and whether you would use a helpful feature
  more if we explained it differently.

  
https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Privacy_policy#Information_Related_to_Your_Use_of_the_Wikimedia_Sites

This contradicted my intition about the privacy of anonymous Wikipedia
readers. It seems like some behavioral data is collected and then used
to target readers for fundraising in some ways.

Is it specified in more detail anywhere what kind of behavioral data is
collected, for how long it is stored, how it is associated with a
reader's device(s), and what behavioral data is used in the context of
fundraising specifically?

Best,
--
Yury Bulka
https://mamot.fr/@setthemfree
#NotOnFacebook


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

[Wikimedia-l] Free / libre videoconferencing infrastructure hosted by the WMF?

[Yury Bulka]

Dear everyone,

Since some in-person meetups are now moved to online spaces, including
ones based on videoconferencing, I've been thinking if it would be
possible (or maybe it is already being considered) to host a Jitsi Meet
or other comparable solution on the WMF infrastructure, just like we do
with Etherpad, to off-load the other instances currently under heavy
load and gain some independence?

I'm asking about Jitsi Meet in particular because it's the only tool I
know that:

1) Doesn't require any registration process or any personal information
   from attendees, besides their IP address and browser fingerprint;
2) Doesn't require installation of any third-party software except an
   up-to-date web browser;
3) Can be hosted by a trusted organization.

I think it might be appropriate for WMF to host an instance, since
currently the other avaliable Jitsi Meet instances might be under an
exceptionally high load. For instance, I see FramaSoft closing their
instance with a message explaining they can't handle the load imposed by
universities:

https://framatalk.org/accueil/

I'm unsure what is the appropriate channel to submit such proposal,
hence I'm asking here for some direction.

P.S. I know Jitsi Meet is not optimal for large number of participants,
but it may be one of the available solutions for small groups.

Best,
--
Yury Bulka
https://mamot.fr/@setthemfree
#NotOnFacebook

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikipedia was edited from the ISS

[Yury Bulka]

Regarding the current sources and authenticity, certainly there is room
for improvement. I'd only add that in addition to the diff, the user page
and the tweet, we have the user creation log:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Log?type=newusers==User%3AAstro+Christina==

It mentions that the user account was created by an admin+checkuser and that it
was part of an ISS editathon.

Regarding blog post, it is about another instance where an astronaut
created content on the ISS specifically for Wikipedia, but it was added
by someone else:
https://blog.wikimedia.org/2017/11/29/astronaut-spoken-voice/

I think it would make sense to keep the discussion about the sources on
the Wikipedia, since not everyone is subscribed to this list. For now it
has been happening on [[User talk:Darenwelsh]] (although probably it
would have been more appropriate to have it on the article's talk page):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Darenwelsh#Edits_from_space

Best,
--
Yury Bulka
https://mamot.fr/@setthemfree
#NotOnFacebook



Jane Darnell  writes:

> I believe Andy arranged for this to happen and there is a blog out there 
> somewhere
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Dec 28, 2019, at 11:37 PM, Pine W  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Yury,
>>
>> I saw some excitement from people regarding this edit. However, I for one
>> have been hesitant to make wider announcements about this. My personal
>> concern is that, although I have every reason to believe that the
>> contributor is who others claim that she is, the contributor did not self
>> publish information that unambiguously communicated her identity in a
>> public space in the Wikiverse.
>>
>> ENWP can be highly protective of contributors' off wiki identities when
>> contributors have not self published that information. ENWP can be so
>> protective that there is friction within the community about whether paid
>> conflict of interest editors are getting an unreasonable degree of
>> protection. In this case, the contributor's username is highly suggestive
>> of her identity. I regret if the caution seems to be excessive, but there
>> are reasons to be cautious about announcing information about other
>> Wikimedia contributors who have implied and not outright stated information
>> about their identities.
>>
>> I hope that in the near future this contributor will provide a small amount
>> of further self disclosure about her off wiki identity, such as by simply
>> writing her name on her userpage, and at that time I would be much more
>> comfortable celebrating this edit. Again, I regret if this approach feels
>> excessively cautious.
>>
>> Respectfully,
>> Pine
>> ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

[Wikimedia-l] Wikipedia was edited from the ISS

[Yury Bulka]

I'm sorry if this was already posted here, I may have missed it. But in case it 
was not:

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia=926638155=926632230

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_spacewalks_since_2015=prev=926631603

I think this is truly amazing.

P.S. I was trying to find some additional sources besides this edit that
would provide more context for readers, and am currently discussing this
on the user page of the edit author:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Darenwelsh#Edits_from_space

Best,

--
Yury Bulka
https://mamot.fr/@setthemfree
#NotOnFacebook

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

Hm, interesting - the page reports 404 if JS is disabled, but loads
otherwise. Thanks for the hint. Also sharing Mozilla's statement:

https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2019/08/21/mozilla-takes-action-to-protect-users-in-kazakhstan/

Good to know.

RhinosF1  writes:

> link works fine for me Yury
>
> On Fri, 23 Aug 2019 at 10:29, Yury Bulka 
> wrote:
>
>> I'm getting a 404:(
>>
>> John Erling Blad  writes:
>>
>> > Google, Apple, Mozilla move to block Kazakh surveillance system
>> >
>> >
>> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-kazakhstan-internet-surveillance/google-apple-mozilla-move-to-block-kazakh-surveillance-system-idUSKCN1VB17Q
>> > ___
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

I'm getting a 404:(

John Erling Blad  writes:

> Google, Apple, Mozilla move to block Kazakh surveillance system
>
> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-kazakhstan-internet-surveillance/google-apple-mozilla-move-to-block-kazakh-surveillance-system-idUSKCN1VB17Q
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> 


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Movement Strategy: Draft recommendations are here!

[Yury Bulka]

> I think that re-imagining the governance of this movement is going to be the 
> first step towards making any sort of progress towards the goals of either 
> group.

I think this is what the Roles and Responsibilities working group was trying to 
do.



12 серпня 2019 р. 15:41:13 EEST, Adrian Raddatz  написав:
>I'm tempted to sit this one out. The Foundation has organized a bunch
>of
>working groups, staffed primarily through volunteers of various types,
>to
>present some strategic recommendations for moving forward into the
>future.
>We are a movement with flaws and opportunities for improvement, as with
>any
>large organization, and it would be a mistake for us to assume that
>because
>we found the winning formula in the early 2000s we are completely set
>for
>the future. But already, the discussions on Meta are dominated by
>representatives of The Community™ showing up with all of the usual
>toxic
>vested contributor behaviour that I've grown to know and love in my
>time
>with this movement.
>
>That said, it is apparent how broken the community/WMF governance model
>is.
>Large portions of the community feel disenfranchised on the projects
>they
>helped to create, and the WMF is increasingly separate from the
>community
>in terms of its goals and priorities. I think that re-imagining the
>governance of this movement is going to be the first step towards
>making
>any sort of progress towards the goals of either group.
>
>Adrian
>
>
>On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 7:54 AM Yury Bulka
>
>wrote:
>
>> Maybe it is better to discuss specific recommendations on their talk
>> pages?
>>
>>
>>
>https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Working_Groups/Diversity/Recommendations/9
>>
>> We might find ourselves discussing here only one specific
>recommendation
>> while the other working groups' recommendations might fade in shadows
>of
>> this particular discussion.
>>
>>
>>
>> Philip Kopetzky  writes:
>>
>> > Please don't generalise frustration with your conduct on this list.
>> You're
>> > the only one telling people to shut up here.
>> >
>> > And just to keep this on track, what is your view on how we can
>> incorporate
>> > indigenous knowledge without it becoming commercialised by the
>current
>> > licensing scheme?
>> > ___
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe:
>https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe:
>https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>___
>Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
><mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

-- 
Sent from my PDP-11.
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Movement Strategy: Draft recommendations are here!

[Yury Bulka]

Maybe it is better to discuss specific recommendations on their talk
pages?

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Working_Groups/Diversity/Recommendations/9

We might find ourselves discussing here only one specific recommendation
while the other working groups' recommendations might fade in shadows of
this particular discussion.



Philip Kopetzky  writes:

> Please don't generalise frustration with your conduct on this list. You're
> the only one telling people to shut up here.
>
> And just to keep this on track, what is your view on how we can incorporate
> indigenous knowledge without it becoming commercialised by the current
> licensing scheme?
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> 

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Movement Strategy: Draft recommendations are here!

[Yury Bulka]

Todd Allen  writes:

> There does not seem to be anywhere to comment on these, which there should
> be. I saw at least one which is highly objectionable and which I would like
> to object to.
The Recommendations page contains a "How to Share Your Feedback"
section.

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

I don't see any position from Mozilla on this yet:
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1567114
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/mozilla.dev.security.policy/wnuKAhACo3E

Couldn't find anything about Google Chrome.

Meanwhile, I have emailed secur...@wikimedia.org with a link to this
discussion (hope it's not a terribly inappropriate thing to do).

I'd be great to hear from WMF about their view on this.

Best,
Yury.

Yury Bulka  writes:

> I'm not in Kazakhstan and am not in directly touch with any of
> wikimedians there, so I don't know their position.
>
> However, I'm not sure how much freedom they have in expressing their
> honest opinion about this publicly. Simply because it is always a
> pros-and-cons calculation to criticise your local goverment in such
> situations.
>
> Yaroslav Blanter  writes:
>
>> I do not think Kazakhstan has a chapter. In the past, some Kazakh
>> Wikimedians enjoyed close collaboration with the government (for example,
>> the Kazakhstani Encyclopedia has been released under a free license and
>> verbatim copied to the Kazakh Wikipedia, so that I do not expect much.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Yaroslav
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 12:45 PM Thomas Townsend 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yury
>>>
>>> What is the position of the Kazakhstan chapter on this?
>>>
>>> The Turnip
>>>
>>> On Sun, 21 Jul 2019 at 11:36, Yury Bulka
>>>  wrote:
>>> >
>>> > I'm sure many have heard about this:
>>> >
>>> https://thehackernews.com/2019/07/kazakhstan-https-security-certificate.html
>>> >
>>> > Essentially, the government in Kazakhstan started forcing citizens into
>>> > installing a root TLS certificate on their devices that would allow the
>>> > government to intercept, decrypt and manipulate all HTTPS traffic.
>>> >
>>> > Without the centificate, it seems, citizens can't access HTTPS pages (at
>>> > least on some ISPs).
>>> >
>>> > I think this has serious implications for Wikipedia & Wikimedia, as not
>>> > only they would be easily able to see which articles people read, but
>>> > also steal login credentials, depseudonymize people and even hijack
>>> > admin accounts.
>>> >
>>> > Another danger is that if this effort by Kazakhstan will succeed, other
>>> > governments may start doing the same.
>>> >
>>> > I wonder if WMF has any position on this yet?
>>> >
>>> > Best,
>>> > Yury.
>>> >
>>> > ___
>>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

I'm not in Kazakhstan and am not in directly touch with any of
wikimedians there, so I don't know their position.

However, I'm not sure how much freedom they have in expressing their
honest opinion about this publicly. Simply because it is always a
pros-and-cons calculation to criticise your local goverment in such
situations.

Yaroslav Blanter  writes:

> I do not think Kazakhstan has a chapter. In the past, some Kazakh
> Wikimedians enjoyed close collaboration with the government (for example,
> the Kazakhstani Encyclopedia has been released under a free license and
> verbatim copied to the Kazakh Wikipedia, so that I do not expect much.
>
> Cheers
> Yaroslav
>
> On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 12:45 PM Thomas Townsend 
> wrote:
>
>> Yury
>>
>> What is the position of the Kazakhstan chapter on this?
>>
>> The Turnip
>>
>> On Sun, 21 Jul 2019 at 11:36, Yury Bulka
>>  wrote:
>> >
>> > I'm sure many have heard about this:
>> >
>> https://thehackernews.com/2019/07/kazakhstan-https-security-certificate.html
>> >
>> > Essentially, the government in Kazakhstan started forcing citizens into
>> > installing a root TLS certificate on their devices that would allow the
>> > government to intercept, decrypt and manipulate all HTTPS traffic.
>> >
>> > Without the centificate, it seems, citizens can't access HTTPS pages (at
>> > least on some ISPs).
>> >
>> > I think this has serious implications for Wikipedia & Wikimedia, as not
>> > only they would be easily able to see which articles people read, but
>> > also steal login credentials, depseudonymize people and even hijack
>> > admin accounts.
>> >
>> > Another danger is that if this effort by Kazakhstan will succeed, other
>> > governments may start doing the same.
>> >
>> > I wonder if WMF has any position on this yet?
>> >
>> > Best,
>> > Yury.
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

Honestly, I am not sure what actions would be appropriate.

My initial reaction was - Wikipedia (and all Wikimedia sites) is
HTTPS-only, and this undermines HTTPS as such.

So if Wikipedia should only be accessible over (real, no
man-in-the-middle) HTTPS, perhaps requests that don't meet this criteria
should not be allowed. (Maybe a landing page displayed explaining the
security implications).

Another thought that poped up in my mind was to make it read-only over
unsecure connections.

I'm not very familiar with the circumstances of the 2015 decision to
move to mandatory HTTPS and if that implied being blocked or
inaccessible in whole countries as a consequence of this policy. But if
that was the case, Kazakhstan perhaps falls into a similar category?

The technical difference (no HTTPS vs a HTTPS only if users allow
government man-in-the-middle) is just a technical detail in my opinion,
as the effects are the same as if Wikipedia was made only accessible
over unencrypted HTTP in Kazakhstan.

Showing warnings is of course an option, but I am not sure if this is an
effective security measure if users are forced by the goverment to
install a backdoor.

Maybe it's better if Wikipedia would only be accessible over VPN or Tor
if direct HTTPS is undermined this way. This would of course only work
if users can have a secure connection to a VPN...

Hopefully, browsers do blacklist the certificate. And hopefully, they
will not start a cat-and-mouse game by rotating their certificate...

rupert THURNER  writes:

> displaying a warning that there is a MITM which reads all passwords and
> banking information sounds nice, yuri. there even seems to be ways to
> detect this client-server side:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/7ldypq/is_it_possible_to_detect_mitm_by_javascript_in_a/
> -
> you mean something like this would do, yury?
>
> george, the trusted root certificates would be configurable, usually, like
> for chrome here:
> https://support.securly.com/hc/en-us/articles/206081828-How-to-manually-install-the-Securly-SSL-certificate-in-Chrome
> companies pay money to get into this list, so they can easier sell their
> website certificates. closing down the list for sure leads to some
> anti-trust legal action in other countries.
>
> btw, recently there was a blog post from a developer in iran, saying the
> same :
> https://shahinsorkh.ir/2019/07/20/how-is-it-like-to-be-a-dev-in-iran
>
> this had an even more surprising aspect - not only would the country block
> access to some site - but sites itself decided to remove users having a
> relationship with that country:
> "Slack team, decided to join the sanctions. They simply deleted every
> single user who they found out is Iranian! With no real prior notices! Many
> people has lost their data on Slack and no one was going to do anything!"
>
> rupert
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 22, 2019 at 7:05 PM George Herbert 
> wrote:
>
>> Browser vendors could revoke the root that Kazakh authorities are using for
>> the scheme.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 22, 2019 at 5:35 AM Yuri Astrakhan 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I don't think browser vendors will block the ability to install a custom
>> > root certificate because some corp clients may use it for exactly the
>> same
>> > reason -- creating an HTTPS proxy with fake certs in order to analyze
>> > internal traffic (in the name of monitoring/security).
>> >
>> > Browser vendors could make it more difficult to install, so that it would
>> > require the corp IT department to do some magic, or even release two
>> > versions of the browser - corp and general (with blocked uncertified root
>> > certs), but at the end of the day those could be worked around.
>> >
>> > The biggest deterrent in my opinion is to educating the users of the
>> > dangers such certs would do (i.e. all your passwords and bank info will
>> be
>> > viewable by ISPs) - thus it would be social rather than purely technical
>> > solution.
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jul 22, 2019 at 1:33 PM Steinsplitter Wiki <
>> > steinsplit...@wikipedia.de> wrote:
>> >
>> > > That's shocking...
>> > >
>> > > >> I think this has serious implications for Wikipedia & Wikimedia, as
>> > not
>> > > >> only they would be easily able to see which articles people read,
>> but
>> > > >> also steal login credentials, depseudonymize people and even hijack
>> > > >> admin accounts.
>> > >
>> > > Yes, they can de-crypt the traffic. Hopefully browser vendors will
>> > > disallow the root certificate.
>> > > IMHO there isn't much WP can do, expect

[Wikimedia-l] Universal forced HTTPS backdoor in Kazakhstan

[Yury Bulka]

I'm sure many have heard about this:
https://thehackernews.com/2019/07/kazakhstan-https-security-certificate.html

Essentially, the government in Kazakhstan started forcing citizens into
installing a root TLS certificate on their devices that would allow the
government to intercept, decrypt and manipulate all HTTPS traffic.

Without the centificate, it seems, citizens can't access HTTPS pages (at
least on some ISPs).

I think this has serious implications for Wikipedia & Wikimedia, as not
only they would be easily able to see which articles people read, but
also steal login credentials, depseudonymize people and even hijack
admin accounts.

Another danger is that if this effort by Kazakhstan will succeed, other
governments may start doing the same.

I wonder if WMF has any position on this yet?

Best,
Yury.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Interpretation of CC NC from SUISA

[Yury Bulka]

> From: Lane Rasberry 
>
> In 2009 Creative Commons published "Defining Noncommercial", a 250-page
> report presenting survey data on what people consider to be
> "noncommercial". There is a copy of the report at
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Commons_NonCommercial_license
Thanks a lot, I didn't know about this report.

> Creative Commons calls NC licenses "non-free", which I think is a great
> place to start any conversation about them.
Good point.

Best,
Yury.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Interpretation of CC NC from SUISA

[Yury Bulka]

> From: Mister Thrapostibongles 
>
> I'm not quite sure what you mean here.  Firstly, this isn't the right venue
> for a discussion of the general principle of non-commercial licensing,
> especially as the Foundation has decided on the use of licences that permit
> commercial reuse.
In my opition it's not a terribly offtopic subject for this list, but
let my clarify that my intent is not to revisit the current licensing
policy of Wikimedia projects.

I just thought that this could be useful to someone advocating for the
use of fully libre licenses (the ones without any non-commercial
clauses) outside Wikimedia projects, as it shows how the non-commercial
clause could be interpreted by some actors that have resources and
rights to go to court over your use of the work.

> And secondly, there's nothing to prevent a rights owner
> from granting a full/libre licence if they want to for the works they own:
> so why would one need to advocate for it, here or anywhere else?
Because many people think that non-commercial is good enough, for
instance MPs establishing laws touching Freedom of Panorama.

Best,
Yury.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

[Wikimedia-l] Interpretation of CC NC from SUISA

[Yury Bulka]

Hello everyone,

Just stumbled upon an page where Swiss collecting society SUISA lists
things which they consider commercial use within CC NC licenses, as
applied to works they have copyright on (delegated from authors who are
their members). It's quite interesting and I think it is a very good
example for advocating for fully free/libre licensing of works.

Here's the page:
https://www.suisa.ch/en/members/authors/how-to-register-a-work/creative-commons.html

The list of uses that they consider commercial use is quite
interesting. For instance, it includes things like:

- involving a counterpart, of a financial or other nature, regardless of the 
beneficiary, title or grounds;
- in exchange for other goods, whether or not the exchange generates
  direct or indirect revenues or gives rise to a payment of any nature
  whatsoever;
- at places of work;

Best,
Yury.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Social: non-profit social networking service ?

[Yury Bulka]

If we want to improve the situation, I think one of the simplest things
to do would be to increase the presence of WMF and Wikipedia on the
Federation and Fediverse networks-of-networks. For a start, we could
just be cross-posting from the WMF blog officially.

And I don't think we need a non-Zuckerberg clone of Facebook, owned by WMF
of whoever.

I really support the idea of decentralization, open source code and
gradual improvement. If the existing open-source decentralized solutions
don't seem good enough, the best thing to do is to work on improving
them instead of reinventing the wheel.

Best,
User:Yury Bulka
https://diasp.eu/u/yurb

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all

[Yury Bulka]

Great to hear!

I have one caveat with it though - if I understand it correctly, it is
currently in a man-in-the-middle position between the visitor and WMF,
as it provides its own self-signed https certificate and performs
various URL rewriting on the traffic to change the URLs to the onion
domain.

Isn't it more secure, then, to just use Tor to access the main
(clearnet) Wikipedia, since it enforces correct HTTPS?

Using Tor <-> clearnet WMF (HTTPS) still provides:
1) censorship circumvention;
2) location anonymity;
3) opaque encryption between the visitor and the WMF;

The #3 is missing if the onion service is not operated by the WMF
itself.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I do think it's very good that such effort is taking place - but we need
to make sure there's no weak points security-wise that aren't
communicated prominently enough to the users.

Best,
Yury.

wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org writes:
> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 09:35:24 +0100
> From: Dariusz Jemielniak 
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all
>   Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett
> Message-ID:
>   
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
> use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
> as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
> but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
> choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
> transparent for users.
>
> I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least we
> can evaluate this approach as a possibility.
>
> best,
>
> Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Facebook as a discussion mediam

[Yury Bulka]

For instant messaging (faster communication) there's IRC if a group
discussion that's meant to be open for anyone is considered. Of course,
IRC is a bit archaic, but it doesn't force one to agree to Facebook's
TOS.

IRC is still quite popular in the wikimedia and free software universe.

Of course, if the only people you want to talk to are already on
Facebook, it's one thing. But if you wants to create a discussion that
anyone could join, Facebook is not an ideal choice.

Best,
Yury Bulka
board member
Wikimedia Ukraine

Nikola Kalchev <nikola.kalc...@gmail.com> writes:

> For my part I can say that I've moved some discussions to Facebook, because
> there the communication flow is faster. In a group chat there are no edit
> conflicts and, since Wikipedians tend to write fast, the conversation goes
> almost with the speed of talking.
>
> Another usage of Facebook is for communication in a hidden group. We use a
> hidden group for discussing our social media posts and blog posts which we
> do not want to discuss publicly, in order to not spoil the surprise in
> them.
>
> For some documents like grant proposals or reports I, among others, have
> tended to use Google Docs as a platform for the creation of a draft of a
> certain document, which was then discussed by a core team before it went
> public on meta or elsewhere.
>
> So, the two reasons for moving discussions out of the wikiverse are *faster
> communication* and the *possibility to discuss stuff in a private
> environment*. I would be really glad if there were a good chat function in
> the wikiverse or if we started using namespaces, which are already part of
> MediaWiki, but are not being used as a place for private discussions, at
> least in my environment.
>
> Best regards,
> Nikola (User:Лорд Бъмбъри)
> Wikimedians of Bulgaria
>
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 1:35 AM, Pete Forsyth <petefors...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I think the discussion about post-mortems is vitally important, so I'm
>> adding a new subject line for the discussion about the venue. I was one of
>> the people involved in the discussion of post-mortems, and I'll add my
>> comments to the original thread (and summarize what others have said) in a
>> moment.
>> -Pete
>> [[User:Peteforsyth]]
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Risker <risker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I can agree with what you're saying, Craig.  I can also understand what
>> > Brandon is saying - that some people prefer that interface.
>> >
>> > Unlike many Facebook pages, though, this one is not public and cannot be
>> > viewed by anyone who does not have a FB account.  It's the one venue that
>> > many interested parties cannot even read, let alone participate in,
>> unless
>> > they're willing to give up some fairly significant privacy.  I am
>> > disappointed, but I do not hold it against anyone for preferring to
>> discuss
>> > issues in a venue not associated with Wikimedia.
>> >
>> > Risker/Anne
>> >
>> > On 21 February 2016 at 19:01, Craig Franklin <cfrank...@halonetwork.net>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > People will have discussions at a location that is personally
>> convenient
>> > > for them.  Unless you're going to reprogram human nature, I don't see
>> > that
>> > > there's anything to be done about the resulting balkanisation of the
>> > > discussion.
>> > >
>> > > Cheers,
>> > > Craig
>> > >
>> > > On 22 February 2016 at 09:54, Thyge <ltl.pri...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > I really wonder why wikimedia discussions have migrated to FB. Are we
>> > > > applying for a grant?
>> > > >
>> > > > Thyge
>> > > >
>> > > > 2016-02-22 0:51 GMT+01:00 Newyorkbrad <newyorkb...@gmail.com>:
>> > > >
>> > > > > I too am one of those people who is not to be found on Facebook.  I
>> > > > > only have room in my life for one online timesink ... and I already
>> > > > > have Wikipedia :)
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Newyorkbrad
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On 2/21/16, Risker <risker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > > > As has already been explained on this list, many people do not
>> have
>> > > > > access
>> > > > > > to Facebook.  If this is something germane and useful to a lot of
>> > > > people
>> > > > > on
>> > > > > > this l

Re: [Wikimedia-l] An Open Letter to Wikimedia Foundation BoT

[Yury Bulka]

Shani <shani.e...@gmail.com> writes:

> Yury, this is a very important example, but indeed off-topic. It deserves a
> separate thread, but not before addressing the current main crisis, which
> all others stem from.
I agree. This was just a random example of a "side-effect" of the
crisis.

Best,
Yury

>
> On 19 Feb 2016 01:46, "Yury Bulka" <setthemf...@privacyrequired.com> wrote:
>
>> There are certain things that affect many volunteers
>> directly. A slightly off-topic example:
>> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T59608#1637250
>>
>> The fact that:
>> > "the WMF education team has no engineering resources"
>>
>> ...affects volunteers.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Yury Bulka
>> (Wikimedia Ukraine)
>>
>> Craig Franklin <cfrank...@halonetwork.net> writes:
>>
>> > Yaroslav,
>> >
>> > You're correct in that most volunteers don't care directly.  The problem
>> is
>> > that a lot of the BoT's recent difficulties have crossed the line from
>> > "angry encyclopedia people venting on a mailing list" to "serious and
>> > negative attention from the mainstream press".  If there is too much of
>> the
>> > latter, it may create a perception amongst the general public than even
>> if
>> > Wikipedia is a useful resource, that it is incompetent with handling
>> > money.  As a result, donations dry up, and difficult and unpleasant
>> choices
>> > have to be made around budget.
>> >
>> > So yes, this sort of thing can influence rank and file editors most
>> > seriously, albeit indirectly.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Craig
>> >
>> >
>> > On 19 February 2016 at 07:52, Yaroslav M. Blanter <pute...@mccme.ru>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> To be honest, most volunteers do not care. We understand of course that
>> if
>> >> things would go really wrong, for example, servers stop running, or
>> money
>> >> runs out and ads are introduced, or English Wikipedia admins continue
>> >> resigning/being desysopped without proper replacement, so that we have
>> ten
>> >> active admins, then we are in serious trouble. But as far as things are
>> >> running quasi-normal, we just continue. I was making 50 to 100 edits per
>> >> day five years ago, I am making 50 to 100 edits per day now, I will
>> >> probably still be making 50 to 100 edits per day in five years, unless I
>> >> die or leave because of a serious demotivation - and this demotivation
>> is
>> >> unlikely to be related to WMF. I think staff are way more vulnerable to
>> all
>> >> kinds of events.
>> >>
>> > ___
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
>> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] An Open Letter to Wikimedia Foundation BoT

[Yury Bulka]

There are certain things that affect many volunteers
directly. A slightly off-topic example:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T59608#1637250

The fact that:
> "the WMF education team has no engineering resources"

...affects volunteers.

Sincerely,
Yury Bulka
(Wikimedia Ukraine)

Craig Franklin <cfrank...@halonetwork.net> writes:

> Yaroslav,
>
> You're correct in that most volunteers don't care directly.  The problem is
> that a lot of the BoT's recent difficulties have crossed the line from
> "angry encyclopedia people venting on a mailing list" to "serious and
> negative attention from the mainstream press".  If there is too much of the
> latter, it may create a perception amongst the general public than even if
> Wikipedia is a useful resource, that it is incompetent with handling
> money.  As a result, donations dry up, and difficult and unpleasant choices
> have to be made around budget.
>
> So yes, this sort of thing can influence rank and file editors most
> seriously, albeit indirectly.
>
> Cheers,
> Craig
>
>
> On 19 February 2016 at 07:52, Yaroslav M. Blanter <pute...@mccme.ru> wrote:
>
>>
>> To be honest, most volunteers do not care. We understand of course that if
>> things would go really wrong, for example, servers stop running, or money
>> runs out and ads are introduced, or English Wikipedia admins continue
>> resigning/being desysopped without proper replacement, so that we have ten
>> active admins, then we are in serious trouble. But as far as things are
>> running quasi-normal, we just continue. I was making 50 to 100 edits per
>> day five years ago, I am making 50 to 100 edits per day now, I will
>> probably still be making 50 to 100 edits per day in five years, unless I
>> die or leave because of a serious demotivation - and this demotivation is
>> unlikely to be related to WMF. I think staff are way more vulnerable to all
>> kinds of events.
>>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>



___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The conversation is happening elsewhere :(

[Yury Bulka]

I can't access it too (I don't have an account on Facebook).

Adam Wight  writes:

> Thanks for the note!  Fwiw, I can't read that without a login.  Feel free
> to urge the owners to make the thread public, if base crook even supports
> such a thing.
> On Feb 16, 2016 4:47 PM, "Asaf Bartov"  wrote:
>
>> Dear colleagues,
>>
>> These are difficult and confusing times.  Many of you are puzzled or
>> receiving partial and possibly contradictory bits and pieces of news.
>>
>> As a service to the community, I feel I must point out that significantly
>> more conversation is taking place -- for whatever reason -- on the (public)
>> Wikipedia Weekly facebook group[1].
>>
>> Without endorsing that choice of venue (the issues with Facebook are fairly
>> well-known), it does appear that if you want significantly more
>> information, you should head on over there and read through the last couple
>> of weeks' posts. (much information is in the comments)
>>
>> (if you are inspired to collect and preserve useful information from there
>> on Meta, that would be best.)
>>
>> In solidarity,
>>
>>Asaf
>>
>> [1] https://www.facebook.com/groups/wikipediaweekly/
>>
>> --
>> Asaf Bartov
>> Wikimedia Foundation 
>>
>> Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the
>> sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> 
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> 

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] US Copyright Law Forces Wikimedia to remove Public Domain Anne Frank Diary

[Yury Bulka]

WereSpielChequers <werespielchequ...@gmail.com> writes:

> I may have an unpopular view here, but when an author has been
> murdered, especially one so young, I find it distasteful to try to
> make that a test case re copyright. If Anne Frank hadn't been murdered
> she might well still be alive today, and presumably her work would
> still be in copyright.
>

This is one of the reasons why I believe that the current copyright
system (where the copyright term is determined by the date of author's
death) is flawed.

It results in a situation where certain works belonging to the same
historical period may have insanely different copyright terms.

-- 
Юрко Булка | Yury Bulka | gpg:
36DD 7515 B47D E2C9 9057 D440 D834 635C A947 0CA2

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Yury Bulka]

Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.

At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
Commons policies.

Also there's an item without a license stated:
Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
http://www.mobygratis.com/faq

There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.

Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
URLs to works if possible).

[[User:Yuriy Bulka]]



Ricordisamoa  writes:

> I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
> at the end :-(
>
> Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
>> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
>>
>> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the 15th
>> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in Argentina,
>> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
>>
>> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
>>
>> Wikimedia Commons->
>> In spanish:  here
>> 
>> In english -> here
>> 
>>
>> Youtube->here 
>>
>> Vimeo:here 
>>
>> Hope you like it
>>
>
>
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> 

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Yury Bulka]

Anna Torres <d...@wikimedia.org.ar> writes:

> Hi!!
>
> We are looking at it and we are trying to fix it :) Thanks to all!
Thank you, glad to hear:)

Best,
Yury.

>
> 2016-01-22 9:01 GMT-03:00 Yury Bulka <setthemf...@privacyrequired.com>:
>
>> Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
>> should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
>> current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.
>>
>> At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
>> license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
>> Commons policies.
>>
>> Also there's an item without a license stated:
>> Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
>> mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
>> with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
>> http://www.mobygratis.com/faq
>>
>> There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
>> including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
>> allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.
>>
>> Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
>> video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
>> URLs to works if possible).
>>
>> [[User:Yuriy Bulka]]
>>
>>
>>
>> Ricordisamoa <ricordisa...@openmailbox.org> writes:
>>
>> > I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
>> > at the end :-(
>> >
>> > Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
>> >> Dear all,
>> >>
>> >> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
>> >> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
>> >>
>> >> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the
>> 15th
>> >> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in
>> Argentina,
>> >> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
>> >>
>> >> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
>> >>
>> >> Wikimedia Commons->
>> >> In spanish:  here
>> >> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Soy_Wikipedista.webm>
>> >> In english -> here
>> >> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:I_am_a_Wikipedian.webm>
>> >>
>> >> Youtube->here <
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXokeuQFJnM=youtu.be>
>> >>
>> >> Vimeo:here <https://vimeo.com/151929233>
>> >>
>> >> Hope you like it
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
>>

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Yury Bulka]

Fantastic work, Anna!

Do you have the subtitles (*.srt) file so we can start translating the
subtitles? I'd like to translate in into Ukrainian and share here)

Best,
Yury Bulka
from Wikimedia Ukraine

Anna Torres <d...@wikimedia.org.ar> writes:

> Dear all,
>
> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
>
> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the 15th
> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in Argentina,
> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
>
> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
>
> Wikimedia Commons->
> In spanish:  here
> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Soy_Wikipedista.webm>
> In english -> here
> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:I_am_a_Wikipedian.webm>
>
> Youtube->here <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXokeuQFJnM=youtu.be>
>
> Vimeo:here <https://vimeo.com/151929233>
>
> Hope you like it

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement about changes to the Board

[Yury Bulka]

MZMcBride  writes:

> A few years ago, the Wikimedia Foundation switched over to the Google Apps
> platform, which means that most e-mail sent on the wikimedia.org domain is
> now hosted by Google.
Are you sure? It doesn't look like wikimedia.org's MX point to google's servers:
https://starttls.info/check/wikimedia.org

Yury

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] How To Recover From Having Made A Mistake [a reminder]

[Yury Bulka]

Michael Peel <em...@mikepeel.net> writes:

>> On 11 Jan 2016, at 18:47, Yaroslav M. Blanter <pute...@mccme.ru> wrote:
>> 
>> On 2016-01-11 19:37, Asaf Bartov wrote:
>>> Hello, everyone.
>>> It occurs to me this might be a good time to recycle this piece of advice I
>>> have had some past occasions to offer some newcomers to the movement:
>> 
>> <...>
>> 
>>> Q: Are you suggesting this applies to current goings-on?
>>> A: I suggest it applies to every situation involving humans.
>>> Cheers,
>>>A.
>> 
>> That was absolutely fabulous, thanks Asaf.
>
> +1, that's a great post, Asaf! All very sensible advice. Can I suggest that 
> you put a copy on Meta somewhere, so it doesn't get (too) lost over time / 
> for easy future reference?
+1

Yury Bulka
[[User:Юрій Булка]]

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>