Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's report and learn from non-successes (more often)

[Ziko van Dijk]

Hello,
A great opportunity for this kind of reports is:
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WCA/Journal
Kind regards
Ziko



Ziko van Dijk
voorzitter / president Wikimedia Nederland
deputy chair Wikimedia Chapters Association Council

Vereniging Wikimedia Nederland
Postbus 167
3500 AD Utrecht
http://wikimedia.nl



2013/7/5 Asaf Bartov 

> Hi, Nemo.
>
> Certainly, this was an ENWP experiment, and it's not unreasonable that
> there would be "no learnings for other projects".  The post's audience was
> absolutely anyone in the movement who may care; after all, anyone can
> replicate this experiment or something like it, in other countries, other
> languages, etc.  We used community tools and no magic.  I'm not sure what
> question you consider unanswered on that link.
>
>A.
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 12:34 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo)  >wrote:
>
> > Thanks.
> > The problem of the blog post is IMHO that it's unclear what audience it's
> > directed to. The learnings and suggestions *might* be useful for some
> > en.wiki WikiProjects, but en.wiki is obviously the least suitable wiki
> for
> > such experiments. There are no learnings for other projects and I see no
> > answer e.g. to questions I had for a similar fr.wiki banner a few weeks
> > later.  > 3ARequests_for_help_from_a_**sysop_or_bureaucrat&diff=**
> > 5337142&oldid=5337118<
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Meta%3ARequests_for_help_from_a_sysop_or_bureaucrat&diff=5337142&oldid=5337118
> >
> > >
> > It will be for next time then. :)
> >
> > Nemo
> >
> > P.s.: It's not particularly surprising, I see that I had already
> predicted
> > this failure.  > CentralNotice/Calendar&oldid=**5337147#Philippines_**
> > recruitment_for_two_weeks<
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:CentralNotice/Calendar&oldid=5337147#Philippines_recruitment_for_two_weeks
> >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Asaf Bartov
> Wikimedia Foundation 
>
> Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the
> sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
> https://donate.wikimedia.org
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>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's report and learn from non-successes (more often)

[Asaf Bartov]

Hi, Nemo.

Certainly, this was an ENWP experiment, and it's not unreasonable that
there would be "no learnings for other projects".  The post's audience was
absolutely anyone in the movement who may care; after all, anyone can
replicate this experiment or something like it, in other countries, other
languages, etc.  We used community tools and no magic.  I'm not sure what
question you consider unanswered on that link.

   A.


On Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 12:34 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo) wrote:

> Thanks.
> The problem of the blog post is IMHO that it's unclear what audience it's
> directed to. The learnings and suggestions *might* be useful for some
> en.wiki WikiProjects, but en.wiki is obviously the least suitable wiki for
> such experiments. There are no learnings for other projects and I see no
> answer e.g. to questions I had for a similar fr.wiki banner a few weeks
> later.  3ARequests_for_help_from_a_**sysop_or_bureaucrat&diff=**
> 5337142&oldid=5337118
> >
> It will be for next time then. :)
>
> Nemo
>
> P.s.: It's not particularly surprising, I see that I had already predicted
> this failure.  CentralNotice/Calendar&oldid=**5337147#Philippines_**
> recruitment_for_two_weeks
> >
>



-- 
Asaf Bartov
Wikimedia Foundation 

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's report and learn from non-successes (more often)

[Jon Davies]

I am an audience! Thanks and it really makes some broader points.  We often
start from finding people who have a passion about a subject but don;t edit
yet. That at least solves the 'blank sheet of paper' fear. Liked the
discussion though.

On 4 July 2013 08:34, Federico Leva (Nemo)  wrote:

> Thanks.
> The problem of the blog post is IMHO that it's unclear what audience it's
> directed to. The learnings and suggestions *might* be useful for some
> en.wiki WikiProjects, but en.wiki is obviously the least suitable wiki for
> such experiments. There are no learnings for other projects and I see no
> answer e.g. to questions I had for a similar fr.wiki banner a few weeks
> later.  3ARequests_for_help_from_a_**sysop_or_bureaucrat&diff=**
> 5337142&oldid=5337118
> >
> It will be for next time then. :)
>
> Nemo
>
> P.s.: It's not particularly surprising, I see that I had already predicted
> this failure.  CentralNotice/Calendar&oldid=**5337147#Philippines_**
> recruitment_for_two_weeks
> >
>
>
> __**_
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> Unsubscribe: 
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>  ?subject=**unsubscribe>
>



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's report and learn from non-successes (more often)

[Federico Leva (Nemo)]

Thanks.
The problem of the blog post is IMHO that it's unclear what audience 
it's directed to. The learnings and suggestions *might* be useful for 
some en.wiki WikiProjects, but en.wiki is obviously the least suitable 
wiki for such experiments. There are no learnings for other projects and 
I see no answer e.g. to questions I had for a similar fr.wiki banner a 
few weeks later. 


It will be for next time then. :)

Nemo

P.s.: It's not particularly surprising, I see that I had already 
predicted this failure. 



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's report and learn from non-successes (more often)

[Maryana Pinchuk]

On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 5:05 PM, Asaf Bartov  wrote:

> Dear colleagues,
>
> I wanted to remind us all of the importance of learning from when our plans
> and efforts don't succeed, whether due to mistakes or just an experimental
> hypothesis turning out to not be the case.
>
> We at the Wikimedia Foundation have had such an experiment a few months
> ago, and an idea we thought had potential turned out to have none of the
> hoped-for impact.  We wrote it up and drew some (I think) interesting
> learning points from it, including possibly next steps for those who may
> want to experiment along similar lines.
>
> The learning is featured in a Wikimedia Blog post here:
>
> http://blog.wikimedia.org/2013/07/02/english-wikipedia-editor-pilot-philippines/
>
> which also links to the full report on Meta.  I am also pleased at the
> discussion the blog post has already generated.
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> 


Yes! Big plus-one! Though I would refer to it as "confirming the null
hypothesis"[1] rather than "non-success" :)

Publication bias[2] and systematic underreporting of non-significant
effects are huge problems in all scholarly fields, so it's not like we're
unusual in this respect. But we miss out on really great opportunities to
advance our institutional learning when we bury our non-successes.. err..
null hypothesis confirmations! Keep em' coming, folks.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Null_hypothesis
2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_bias

-- 
Maryana Pinchuk
Associate Product Manager, Wikimedia Foundation
wikimediafoundation.org
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