Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Hi Gautham, Here are two ways: 1. Chapter shall conduct IRC discussions with each langauge community at least once in few months. It is best done one community at a time to give more time and space for each of them. Not all language community members are in India and not all can become chapter members. 2. For Wikimedia India newsletter efforts, we shall encourage people to share similar stories and proposals. A newsletter need not contain statistics alone :) Ravi On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Gautam John gau...@prathambooks.orgwrote: You know, these are excellent ideas and it does highlight an issue we have faced. How does the wider community and the Chapter find out what is happening in each language community and geography? If we can't discover this, then we can't engage and support it either, right? ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Hi Naveen, Srikanth Lakshmanan is already active in Tamil Wikimedia informing about WikiConference India happenings. http://ta.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VP will be a good place to leave further messages. Thanks, Ravi On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 2:12 PM, Naveen Francis navee...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Ravi, Can we please have some kind of online activity as a runup event for WCI 2011 from Tamil Community ? http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiConference_India_2011/Wiki_Outreach Naveen Francis ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Dear Ravi: 1. Chapter shall conduct IRC discussions with each langauge community at least once in few months. It is best done one community at a time to give more time and space for each of them. Not all language community members are in India and not all can become chapter members. This is a great idea - not just for language and geographic communities but for general engagement too. Thank you. 2. For Wikimedia India newsletter efforts, we shall encourage people to share similar stories and proposals. A newsletter need not contain statistics alone :) Indeed. I'm sure Tinu is excited by the possibilities! Thank you. Best, Gautam http://blog.prathambooks.org/p/social-media.html ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Off the cuff, I want to appreciate the great ideas put forth, Ravi. Thanks for taking the effort. These ideas need to be preserved even if we are not able to use them right now. Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur -- On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 1:29 PM, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, I appreciate the transparent, detailed and professional planning of conference and I am sorry I couldn't take part in WikiConference related planning earlier. For those who don't know, I am a Tamil Wikimedian since 2005 with 20,000+ edits. My major interest lies in outreach and policy decisions concerning Tamil Wikimedia projects. http://toolserver.org/~quentinv57/sulinfo/Ravidreams Am I qualified to express my opinions now ? ;) I have two major concerns: 1. The overall budget. It is huge even if we get 100% commercial sponsorship. We could do more useful things with this budget. 2. The amount of money that is being granted from the foundation. Given the indication that this may be an annual event, here are my ideas on *how a WikiConference shall be arranged. * * WikiConference need not be an annual event. * It should be planned well in advance ( a year in advance at least to allow time for planning and fund-raising ) * Let's not have an ambitious plan and wonder for funding. We should have a realistic estimate for non-grant funding and plan accordingly. *Bidding city / community should show guarantee to meet at least half the budget by means of commercial sponsors and other revenue sources.* If they cannot provide this guarantee, they should revise the budget. * Tie up with local universities / academic institutions for free venue / dorms and look for the dates when these can be available. WikiConference is a media event and I am sure there will be many hosting partners for a brand like Wikipedia. If we can convince schools to run campus ambassador programs why not they be convinced to host this? * Need not be a 3 day event. Even a 1 or 2 day event will be good. (will cut down logistics, accommodation costs) . *What if this is 2001 with no WMF and grants? How will we plan and organize?* *This is not a corporate conference to have 100% professional and rocking experience at any cost. This is a community conference and that spirit should be kept. * *Here are some ways to minimise expense and generate revenue:* * We are getting lakhs of eyeballs for sponsorship / participation announcement and they all land in WikiConference India home page. But http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiConference_India_2011/Sponsorship has no info and I couldn't find sponsorship related info anywhere else. This should be the highlighted info in conference homepage asking for sponsors. * Why not convert the conference itself into a fund-raiser? Open a donation booth. Have an agreement with chapter / foundation to get 50% donations for conference expenses and donate the rest to the movement. Can we place a banner of this budget in the conference venue? Will our expenses be justified to a common man? Will people be motivated to donate? If not, we are doing something the wrong way. * Registration cost should be at least 300 INR per day. ( The current budget allots 200 INR plus per day for food alone). The value of the conference is in the knowledge they gain and not in the goodies we give. Meritorious candidates can apply for sponsorships. We don't need a crowd. The local crowd may come and forget it as yet another event. The prime focus should be to bring together best minds already active in Wikimedia at one place. The attendees party can be free for scholarship recipients but others can pay. If you compare that a movie going experience in Mumbai should cost at least 200 INR per head, we need not feel shy to charge where it is due. * Sell Wikipedia souvenirs including T-Shirts, mugs etc.,. Or give them as a freebie when people make large donations. * If we can make the event a two-day conference, we can cut down logistics and accommodation costs. Even an international event like Wikimania has some less quality presentations. Have four tracks: Language Wikipedia projects, English Wikipedia, Tech and General. ( I found only two seminar rooms in the budget and assume only 2 or 3 tracks) Have only the best papers and move the rest to lighting talks. Personally, I am not so happy with some of the ways WMF, chapters are spending the donated money and I know there are more people feeling this way. If even regular Wikipedians feel like this, we should be more responsible in how we project ourselves for the public. I have been a regular donor to WMF but will reconsider from this year on. A good idea will be to apply to join the grants committee or take part in the discussions there. So, this is nothing personal against WikiConference India. Personally, I have experiences running a whole day blog camp for
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
On 25 August 2011 13:29, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Ravi - thank you very much for your email - much appreciated. We shall look for unconventional ways to invest wisely which will have maximum ROI. Here are some examples: You know, these are excellent ideas and it does highlight an issue we have faced. How does the wider community and the Chapter find out what is happening in each language community and geography? If we can't discover this, then we can't engage and support it either, right? ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Just one not about the subject: If WMIN don't use that money to WCI, it needs to be returned to WMF. This money was not given to WMIN for no reason, was given *to be used in WCI* - if that would not be the case anymore, the money need to be returned. So all those arguments that We have better things to do with that money are not true. _ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/(351) 925 171 484 *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. É isso o que estamos a fazer http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Nossos_projetos.* On 25 August 2011 08:59, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, I appreciate the transparent, detailed and professional planning of conference and I am sorry I couldn't take part in WikiConference related planning earlier. For those who don't know, I am a Tamil Wikimedian since 2005 with 20,000+ edits. My major interest lies in outreach and policy decisions concerning Tamil Wikimedia projects. http://toolserver.org/~quentinv57/sulinfo/Ravidreams Am I qualified to express my opinions now ? ;) I have two major concerns: 1. The overall budget. It is huge even if we get 100% commercial sponsorship. We could do more useful things with this budget. 2. The amount of money that is being granted from the foundation. Given the indication that this may be an annual event, here are my ideas on *how a WikiConference shall be arranged. * * WikiConference need not be an annual event. * It should be planned well in advance ( a year in advance at least to allow time for planning and fund-raising ) * Let's not have an ambitious plan and wonder for funding. We should have a realistic estimate for non-grant funding and plan accordingly. *Bidding city / community should show guarantee to meet at least half the budget by means of commercial sponsors and other revenue sources.* If they cannot provide this guarantee, they should revise the budget. * Tie up with local universities / academic institutions for free venue / dorms and look for the dates when these can be available. WikiConference is a media event and I am sure there will be many hosting partners for a brand like Wikipedia. If we can convince schools to run campus ambassador programs why not they be convinced to host this? * Need not be a 3 day event. Even a 1 or 2 day event will be good. (will cut down logistics, accommodation costs) . *What if this is 2001 with no WMF and grants? How will we plan and organize?* *This is not a corporate conference to have 100% professional and rocking experience at any cost. This is a community conference and that spirit should be kept. * *Here are some ways to minimise expense and generate revenue:* * We are getting lakhs of eyeballs for sponsorship / participation announcement and they all land in WikiConference India home page. But http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiConference_India_2011/Sponsorship has no info and I couldn't find sponsorship related info anywhere else. This should be the highlighted info in conference homepage asking for sponsors. * Why not convert the conference itself into a fund-raiser? Open a donation booth. Have an agreement with chapter / foundation to get 50% donations for conference expenses and donate the rest to the movement. Can we place a banner of this budget in the conference venue? Will our expenses be justified to a common man? Will people be motivated to donate? If not, we are doing something the wrong way. * Registration cost should be at least 300 INR per day. ( The current budget allots 200 INR plus per day for food alone). The value of the conference is in the knowledge they gain and not in the goodies we give. Meritorious candidates can apply for sponsorships. We don't need a crowd. The local crowd may come and forget it as yet another event. The prime focus should be to bring together best minds already active in Wikimedia at one place. The attendees party can be free for scholarship recipients but others can pay. If you compare that a movie going experience in Mumbai should cost at least 200 INR per head, we need not feel shy to charge where it is due. * Sell Wikipedia souvenirs including T-Shirts, mugs etc.,. Or give them as a freebie when people make large donations. * If we can make the event a two-day conference, we can cut down logistics and accommodation costs. Even an international event like Wikimania has some less quality presentations. Have four tracks: Language Wikipedia projects, English Wikipedia, Tech and General. ( I found only two seminar rooms in the budget and assume only 2 or 3 tracks) Have only the best papers and move the rest to lighting talks. Personally, I am not so happy with some of the ways WMF, chapters are spending the donated money and I know there are more people feeling this way. If even regular Wikipedians feel like this, we should be more responsible in how we
[Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Hello Everyone: I'd like to share two pieces of good news. 1. The Chapter grant has been approved. More details here: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:WM_IN/Bootstrap_Grant 2. The Conference grant has also been approved. More details here: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:WM_IN/WikiConference_India_2011 We are really hoping that Chapter members come forward to fill the empty EC positions and actively participate in the functioning of the EC and help the Chapter expand its reach and impact in India. Further, we hope that community members also become members of the Chapter - an FAQ is here: http://wiki.wikimedia.in/Membership-FAQ Further, the process for nominations for the EC Elections have been put up as well: http://members.wikimedia.in/Executive_Committee_Elections_2011 [This is a members only page.] We are grateful to the Nominations Committee: http://wiki.wikimedia.in/Announcements/Nominations_Committee_appointment We are also hoping that there is active participation in the WikiConference India - this is our community Conference and it is up to us to make it a success. Best, Gautam John ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Theo, Although I may not agree with Ravi or Ashwin completely, I feel that open-minded discussion about this doesn't hurt. The grant and its details are public, and Ravi has expressed his opinion on it. Ravi is a longtime Wikipedian on Tamil Wikipedia, and one of the authors of this: http://www.archive.org/details/BadriSeshadriAnIntroductiontoTamilWikipediabyRavisankar_KizhakkuMottaimaadi (Personally, I don't think his mail intended to denigrate anyone's work. I've known him as a really committed Wikipedian - he's done some amazing work in Tamil Nadu) Ashwin does have a point though when he says that it is quite a task getting sponsorship for event of this scale. Event organizers hunting for sponsors almost an year before the event isn't uncommon. Cheers, On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:10 PM, Theo10011 de10...@gmail.com wrote: lol +1 to Ashwin. Ravishankar, I dont know who you are but please dont denigrate the work of my friends and fellow community members with statements like those. No one stopped you from getting or anyone else involved, you still can. Go get us the in-kind donation please. You have our blessing. Theo On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:06 PM, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.comwrote: Ravi, Thank God someone feels like this. Be our guest, please prove us wrong by getting us a great big sponsorship. We really welcome help in this field. I'm sure if you are succesful, and we have enough funds, we could reduce the grant or use it elsewhere than for the Wiki Conference. Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:01 PM, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, I am not so glad to see the huge grant for Wikiconference and the way it is spent. With all due respect for the organising community and volunteers, more effort should have gone in getting donation in kind ( example: venues ) / commercial sponsors. That is how most of the events of this scale are run. This is huge money if directly invested in resources for any Wikipedia project will give great meassurable results. Ravi -- Hari Prasad Nadig http://hpnadig.net http://twitter.com/hpnadig http://flickr.com/hpnadig ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
Someone much wiser than me said that if you're community doesn't disagree within itself, it's dead and I think he is right. Ravi: I see your point of view and it would be great if you could help us with a Project plan: http://wiki.wikimedia.in/Projects:2011-12 In which case, we'll at least have the basis for raising funding for it. And I do hope you'll be at the Conference too. Thank you. Best, Gautam http://blog.prathambooks.org/p/social-media.html ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] News from the Chapter and the Conference
My apologies for the gentle dig at you, Ravi. :) You set yourself up and I just couldn't resist but it was not meant any way in bad faith. I sincerely hope you are not offended. Or if you are, I hope that you are magnanimous to forgive me. Good to know that you are a great Wikipedian. :) Hari has given you quite a character reference. Hari does have a point that these issues should be open to debate. And, of course, your question/POV is valid. A few submissions from my side. Ravi, this is the first time we are organising Wiki Conference and we are facing any challenges. The road is much rockier than we thought it would be. Unflagging optimism on behalf of Working Group is our greatest asset and we are slowly overcoming our worries. This news of the grant being approved has relieved us as without this, there would have had to be major restructuring of the Conference. A very large chunk of it is going for scholarships - for 150 people, all said and done which includes travel lodging. After that we are giving more than the money's worth in registration fees to all attendees. Besides this the operating expenses are quite large for a 400+ sized conference. In the future, when the standard operating procedure is developed, when the Chapter is on firm footing - it has just stood up the first time in January, they will be able to support us better as time passes. Then things will be easier. Also, the WMF is in the process of establishing itself in India. When all these happen, the Conferences will be easier to organise and focus will shift from just trying to do it, as we are involved in at present, to doing it more efficiently and more effectively. So what you say will automatically happen. My view is that money asked for this purpose does not preclude you for asking funds for any Wikimedia project. Please do not feel that this grant will hinder that. If not now, then definitely next year, I'm sure your grant request will be honoured, of course assuming it meets all necessary requirements in all ways. Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur -- On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:51 PM, Hari Prasad Nadig hpna...@gmail.comwrote: Theo, Although I may not agree with Ravi or Ashwin completely, I feel that open-minded discussion about this doesn't hurt. The grant and its details are public, and Ravi has expressed his opinion on it. Ravi is a longtime Wikipedian on Tamil Wikipedia, and one of the authors of this: http://www.archive.org/details/BadriSeshadriAnIntroductiontoTamilWikipediabyRavisankar_KizhakkuMottaimaadi (Personally, I don't think his mail intended to denigrate anyone's work. I've known him as a really committed Wikipedian - he's done some amazing work in Tamil Nadu) Ashwin does have a point though when he says that it is quite a task getting sponsorship for event of this scale. Event organizers hunting for sponsors almost an year before the event isn't uncommon. Cheers, On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:10 PM, Theo10011 de10...@gmail.com wrote: lol +1 to Ashwin. Ravishankar, I dont know who you are but please dont denigrate the work of my friends and fellow community members with statements like those. No one stopped you from getting or anyone else involved, you still can. Go get us the in-kind donation please. You have our blessing. Theo On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:06 PM, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com wrote: Ravi, Thank God someone feels like this. Be our guest, please prove us wrong by getting us a great big sponsorship. We really welcome help in this field. I'm sure if you are succesful, and we have enough funds, we could reduce the grant or use it elsewhere than for the Wiki Conference. Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 8:01 PM, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, I am not so glad to see the huge grant for Wikiconference and the way it is spent. With all due respect for the organising community and volunteers, more effort should have gone in getting donation in kind ( example: venues ) / commercial sponsors. That is how most of the events of this scale are run. This is huge money if directly invested in resources for any Wikipedia project will give great meassurable results. Ravi -- Hari Prasad Nadig http://hpnadig.net http://twitter.com/hpnadig http://flickr.com/hpnadig ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
