[Wikimediaindia-l] Re: India grants and communication to Wikimediaindia-l
Hello Tito, Thanks for the response. My issue is not mainly about agreement or disagreement, not at all about head count. I am concerned about vast majority of community members getting atleast informed about these kind of threads due to the very nature of mailing lists. (I am not entirely against mailing lists, but only when it becomes mandatory for Community members) This is not a Wiki and there are barriers for participation here on various levels. Language, privacy, and knowing that there is a list are a few. This platform allowed us to have this proposal, discussion and summary happening on very platform where many users who gets affected by changes are not even present. That is the concern I wanted to stress while I am writing that "This thread or any such future thread in no way represents Indian Wikimedia communities." May be wrong choice of words. I also just wanted to clarify and rest the case here. See you! Best, Pavan. 4 జన, 2022, మంగళ 20:51కి, Tito Dutta ఇలా వ్రాసారు: > Hello, > Thank you. > >> "This thread or any such future thread in no way represents Indian >> Wikimedia communities." >> > — This *does *represent a viewpoint. This argument may not show a > majority, a very large or unanimous representation, still this is a > particular viewpoint and the argument is represented here. My viewpoint as > a community member stays, so do your viewpoints, and so do other viewpoints. > If we count how many people voted or if everyone on a project agreed to > something, most of the proposals or plans on village pumps or noticeboards > will never go forward. > In a process, there are views and counter views, and finally the merit of > the arguments is checked generally. > The proposal is not entirely new, but most of the mentioned parts are > standard practice. > > Anyway, I have already shared my thoughts, and I do note that there are > other opinions also. > I'll rest here. > (Happy new year, stay safe...) > ইতি, > টিটো দত্ত/User:Titodutta > (মাতৃভাষা থাক জীবন জুড়ে) > > > > > ___ > Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe send an email to wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit
[Wikimediaindia-l] Re: India grants and communication to Wikimediaindia-l
Hello, Thank you. > "This thread or any such future thread in no way represents Indian > Wikimedia communities." > — This *does *represent a viewpoint. This argument may not show a majority, a very large or unanimous representation, still this is a particular viewpoint and the argument is represented here. My viewpoint as a community member stays, so do your viewpoints, and so do other viewpoints. If we count how many people voted or if everyone on a project agreed to something, most of the proposals or plans on village pumps or noticeboards will never go forward. In a process, there are views and counter views, and finally the merit of the arguments is checked generally. The proposal is not entirely new, but most of the mentioned parts are standard practice. Anyway, I have already shared my thoughts, and I do note that there are other opinions also. I'll rest here. (Happy new year, stay safe...) ইতি, টিটো দত্ত/User:Titodutta (মাতৃভাষা থাক জীবন জুড়ে) ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe send an email to wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit
[Wikimediaindia-l] Re: India grants and communication to Wikimediaindia-l
I strongly oppose this Idea, once again. Some more reasons are listed below: - This thread or any such future thread in no way represents Indian Wikimedia communities. For example, there are tens of Wikipedians who don't know that Tito proposed an idea to "Major Indian grant requests should come to India mailing list" & also trying to make it "mandatory". This list excludes several Indian Wikimedians who never voiced in this list. Essentially, this would increase barriers for community members instead of reducing it. - It would be an interesting idea for Tito individually or CIS-A2K institutionally to conduct a small study to map platforms that Indian language wikimedians discuss & understand how much they are missing/present in this "so called Indian mailing list". I believe several Wikimedians who are doing a lot of work on wikis are not here. - Instead of mandating grantees to publish their grant here and hoping that the members of the thread would follow some of the "best practices" which are very hard to impose, It would be better to see someone (not grantee, ofcourse) post links of relevant grants and encourage interested members of this list to comment on talk page itself. - You mentioned "excessive canvassing, votestacking, back-scratching, meatpuppetry" but not harassment, mockery, attacking grantees, etc., But, a range of policy violations do happen in mailing lists, and people easily got away with it. I don't see value in mandating people to have a discourse on Non-wiki platforms and then try to impose policies which are very difficult. This difficulty can not be mitigated after a level because this is not our platform (off-wiki platform). I see this as a futile exercise. - Food for thought: If we start asking people to post in mailing list, why not fb groups and whatsapp groups? Where should we start when we mandate using an off-wiki platform as an official channel for users? Is it just because some of us who are elite enough believe this as a decent platform? I just mentioned some of my objections in this mail and not articulate enough. But, please consider this idea is not acceptable for me and may be for many of the Wikimedians who are not still in this list. Until there is some sort of wider-discussion, consensus backed by strong study, This list is and should be just another useful discussion forum, nothing more and nothing less. Thanks, Pavan. 29 డిసెం, 2021, బుధ 10:31కి, Tito Dutta ఇలా వ్రాసారు: > Hello, > After the launch of the current grant process, formation of the Regional > Grants Committee, announcement and commencement of round 1 applications, it > is probably good to revisit this thread. I hope that the Wikimedia > Foundation grants team and Regional Grants Committee (SAARC) would kindly > consider these over-all process-related notes. > > Here are a few observations about the "over-all process"— > A > 1) Major Indian grant requests should come to India mailing list. The term > "major" can be defined by an amount (more than "₹" amount) or any other > criteria (region coverage, project coverage, duration etc). Possibly RGC > (SAARC) can kindly set up criteria? > 2) I would suggest separate email threads for "major" grant requests, > however if this list gets too many emails, I would suggest to please send > at least a digest email clearly briefing the grant proposals. > 3) Please consider making this step a mandatory one, and mark applications > "invalid" or "incomplete" unless the step is properly done. > 4) This should not be done only as formality, and the community should be > allowed at least 7 to 10 days' time to comment. I would request RGC to > start reviewing only after this period. > 5) There might be moderation and other issues in the list, and can be > handled separately. > > B > 1) Please consider working on an "Appropriate notification/canvassing > policy" (or guideline). This can be a document covering best practices, and > also possible inappropriate behaviours such as excessive canvassing, > votestacking, back-scratching, meatpuppetry etc. Please see a similar > thread I started on Wikimedia-l at [1] > 2) It would be good to have a direct communication option with RGC > (SAARC). I suggest kindly make this on-wiki. Possibly this can be created > in form of a noticeboard at Grants_talk:Regions/SAARC or at > Grants:Regions/SAARC/Noticeboard > > This or similar process may be replicated in other SAARC countries such as > Bangladesh, Nepal, and other regions also depending on the relevant > community request. > > I'll be happy to voluntarily add inputs or work on any of the things > mentioned above such as A1, B1 etc. > > Thanks, > User:Titodutta > (In volunteer capacity) > > Footnotes > [1] > https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org/thread/OUHBTWFZSPAG6V42AFBI56WBTIMRA3FX/#OUHBTWFZSPAG6V42AFBI56WBTIMRA3FX > > >
[Wikimediaindia-l] Re: India grants and communication to Wikimediaindia-l
Hello, After the launch of the current grant process, formation of the Regional Grants Committee, announcement and commencement of round 1 applications, it is probably good to revisit this thread. I hope that the Wikimedia Foundation grants team and Regional Grants Committee (SAARC) would kindly consider these over-all process-related notes. Here are a few observations about the "over-all process"— A 1) Major Indian grant requests should come to India mailing list. The term "major" can be defined by an amount (more than "₹" amount) or any other criteria (region coverage, project coverage, duration etc). Possibly RGC (SAARC) can kindly set up criteria? 2) I would suggest separate email threads for "major" grant requests, however if this list gets too many emails, I would suggest to please send at least a digest email clearly briefing the grant proposals. 3) Please consider making this step a mandatory one, and mark applications "invalid" or "incomplete" unless the step is properly done. 4) This should not be done only as formality, and the community should be allowed at least 7 to 10 days' time to comment. I would request RGC to start reviewing only after this period. 5) There might be moderation and other issues in the list, and can be handled separately. B 1) Please consider working on an "Appropriate notification/canvassing policy" (or guideline). This can be a document covering best practices, and also possible inappropriate behaviours such as excessive canvassing, votestacking, back-scratching, meatpuppetry etc. Please see a similar thread I started on Wikimedia-l at [1] 2) It would be good to have a direct communication option with RGC (SAARC). I suggest kindly make this on-wiki. Possibly this can be created in form of a noticeboard at Grants_talk:Regions/SAARC or at Grants:Regions/SAARC/Noticeboard This or similar process may be replicated in other SAARC countries such as Bangladesh, Nepal, and other regions also depending on the relevant community request. I'll be happy to voluntarily add inputs or work on any of the things mentioned above such as A1, B1 etc. Thanks, User:Titodutta (In volunteer capacity) Footnotes [1] https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org/thread/OUHBTWFZSPAG6V42AFBI56WBTIMRA3FX/#OUHBTWFZSPAG6V42AFBI56WBTIMRA3FX রবি, ১০ জানু, ২০২১ তারিখে ১০:৫৫ AM টায় তারিখে Tito Dutta < trulyt...@gmail.com> লিখেছেন: > Namaskara, > This might be some food for thought, and inputs are welcome. India mailing > list is the largest and most widely used Wikimedia mailing list for the > Indian community. Could we have a practice that all grant requests from the > country (or related to) are informed on the Wikimediaindia-l mailing list? > > Whether it is a state-level, project-level, language-level etc, or whether > it is a rapid grant, project grant etc it would be good to see the plan > details on this mailing list in advance. It will ensure greater visibility, > and it will also ensure the community's understanding/knowing of each > other's projects. > > If we can have a practice like this, we can inform Wikimedia, or CR team > or relevant support structure(s) as an India community practice. > > This post is in my personal capacity. Please assume good faith > Regards, > User:Titodutta > > ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe send an email to wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit
