Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 2 April 2014 20:25, Andy Mabbett  wrote:
...
> Success may be measured in other ways, depending on the aims of the
> exercise.

True, this is why defining measurements for success on all our
projects (at least the ones that spend the donor's money and rely on
employee time) is something we should do as standard. Without this,
nobody will ever agree whether the outcome is a success we should
repeat, or a ... let's try the popular Realpolitik ... "not-success"
that we should learn from.

Fae
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Andy Mabbett]

On Apr 2, 2014 2:52 PM, "Fæ"  wrote:
>
> On 2 April 2014 14:17, Stevie Benton 
wrote:
> ...
> > Just an update on this. We've received four messages of support so far
and I
> > anticipate more will follow. Two Lib-Dems, one Conservative and one
Labour
> > MEP have been in touch so far. Please do feel free to contact your local
> > representatives to remind them of the benefits of change to copyright!
>
> Thanks for the update on your letter. I make that about a 5% success
> rate though this may be explained as it was only sent 12 days ago.

No, that's a ~5% /response/ rate.

Success may be measured in other ways, depending on the aims of the
exercise.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Richard Nevell]

That may well explain it


On 2 April 2014 14:52, Fæ  wrote:

> On 2 April 2014 14:17, Stevie Benton 
> wrote:
> ...
> > Just an update on this. We've received four messages of support so far
> and I
> > anticipate more will follow. Two Lib-Dems, one Conservative and one
> Labour
> > MEP have been in touch so far. Please do feel free to contact your local
> > representatives to remind them of the benefits of change to copyright!
>
> Thanks for the update on your letter. I make that about a 5% success
> rate though this may be explained as it was only sent 12 days ago.
>
> Fae
>
> ___
> Wikimedia UK mailing list
> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>



-- 
Richard Nevell
Assistant Office Manager
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0753

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 2 April 2014 14:17, Stevie Benton  wrote:
...
> Just an update on this. We've received four messages of support so far and I
> anticipate more will follow. Two Lib-Dems, one Conservative and one Labour
> MEP have been in touch so far. Please do feel free to contact your local
> representatives to remind them of the benefits of change to copyright!

Thanks for the update on your letter. I make that about a 5% success
rate though this may be explained as it was only sent 12 days ago.

Fae

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

Hello folks,

Just an update on this. We've received four messages of support so far and
I anticipate more will follow. Two Lib-Dems, one Conservative and one
Labour MEP have been in touch so far. Please do feel free to contact your
local representatives to remind them of the benefits of change to copyright!

Many thanks,

Stevie


On 21 March 2014 17:57, Fæ  wrote:

> On 21 March 2014 16:21, Stevie Benton 
> wrote:
> > The feedback from international community was via the Advocacy mailing
> list
>
> The comments can be read in the archive at
> <
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/advocacy_advisors/2014-March/000425.html
> >.
>
> I note this message
> <
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/advocacy_advisors/2014-March/000432.html
> >
> which I had not seen before, and is presumably why the letter was
> afterwards sent to this list, so that the members of the charity could
> have a few days to say something about your letter before you sent it.
>
> Fae
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
> ___
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> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>



-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 21 March 2014 16:21, Stevie Benton  wrote:
> The feedback from international community was via the Advocacy mailing list

The comments can be read in the archive at
.

I note this message

which I had not seen before, and is presumably why the letter was
afterwards sent to this list, so that the members of the charity could
have a few days to say something about your letter before you sent it.

Fae
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

The feedback from international community was via the Advocacy mailing list
which is, as far as I am aware, open for sign-ups.

Also, I wanted to add a note of thanks to a volunteer called Emily Sorensen
who helped me put together the letter, sourced good examples and is also
going to help me with the follow-up. her support was extremely useful.

Thanks,

Stevie


On 21 March 2014 16:17, Fæ  wrote:

> On 21 March 2014 16:11, Stevie Benton 
> wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >
> > Just to follow this up, the final version of the letter has now been sent
> > and takes into account some of the suggested revisions. It can be seen at
> > https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/File:Letter_to_MEPs_with_images.pdf -
> thanks
> > again for the useful feedback.
> >
> > Stevie
>
> I hope it goes well. What was the feedback from international
> community members you mentioned on the Watercooler, is that available
> as open discussion somewhere?
>
> Fae
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
> ___
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> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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>



-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 21 March 2014 16:11, Stevie Benton  wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> Just to follow this up, the final version of the letter has now been sent
> and takes into account some of the suggested revisions. It can be seen at
> https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/File:Letter_to_MEPs_with_images.pdf - thanks
> again for the useful feedback.
>
> Stevie

I hope it goes well. What was the feedback from international
community members you mentioned on the Watercooler, is that available
as open discussion somewhere?

Fae
-- 
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

Hello all,

Just to follow this up, the final version of the letter has now been sent
and takes into account some of the suggested revisions. It can be seen at
https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/File:Letter_to_MEPs_with_images.pdf - thanks
again for the useful feedback.

Stevie


On 19 March 2014 13:32, Fæ  wrote:

> On 19 March 2014 12:40, Stevie Benton 
> wrote:
> > Just reviewing this feedback there's a couple of specific points I want
> to
> > address.
> >
> > "Copy violations" for images. I am going to link to them in the digital
> > version and give an accreditation in the printed version.
> > Links are included for the digital version. They will be added as
> citations
> > for the print version.
> > With reference to "groups of MEPs" - Mike, this is pretty standard. Each
> MEP
> > represents either a political party or are independent. Each party /
> > independent (in almost every case) is a part of a wider, cross-Europe
> > grouping. For example, UK Independence Party MEPs are mostly members of
> the
> > wider "Europe of Freedom and Democracy Group".
> > Andy, your comment about the House of Commons is noted. I shall replace
> that
> > image.
> > Mike, I'm pretty certain we have discussed the mention of start-ups
> before.
> > It is about noting that many different groups will benefit from change.
> > Competition, particularly in tech, is very important to Europe on a
> global
> > level. Noting that these changes benefit start-ups as well as other
> groups
> > is really speaking to them in a language they will understand and respond
> > to.
> > Andy, your point about the reply address is sensible. We are now
> > establishing a new email address specifically for this project.
> >
> > I will share a final version later in the week once the letter has been
> > posted. Thanks for the constructive viewpoints.
> >
> > Stevie
>
> Thanks for answering some of the points in this email thread.
>
> It is pretty obvious that you have chosen to ignore mine. I guess this
> is your call as it is your letter.
>
> Fae
>
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> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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>



-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
___
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wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 19 March 2014 12:40, Stevie Benton  wrote:
> Just reviewing this feedback there's a couple of specific points I want to
> address.
>
> "Copy violations" for images. I am going to link to them in the digital
> version and give an accreditation in the printed version.
> Links are included for the digital version. They will be added as citations
> for the print version.
> With reference to "groups of MEPs" - Mike, this is pretty standard. Each MEP
> represents either a political party or are independent. Each party /
> independent (in almost every case) is a part of a wider, cross-Europe
> grouping. For example, UK Independence Party MEPs are mostly members of the
> wider "Europe of Freedom and Democracy Group".
> Andy, your comment about the House of Commons is noted. I shall replace that
> image.
> Mike, I'm pretty certain we have discussed the mention of start-ups before.
> It is about noting that many different groups will benefit from change.
> Competition, particularly in tech, is very important to Europe on a global
> level. Noting that these changes benefit start-ups as well as other groups
> is really speaking to them in a language they will understand and respond
> to.
> Andy, your point about the reply address is sensible. We are now
> establishing a new email address specifically for this project.
>
> I will share a final version later in the week once the letter has been
> posted. Thanks for the constructive viewpoints.
>
> Stevie

Thanks for answering some of the points in this email thread.

It is pretty obvious that you have chosen to ignore mine. I guess this
is your call as it is your letter.

Fae

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

Just reviewing this feedback there's a couple of specific points I want to
address.


   - "Copy violations" for images. I am going to link to them in the
   digital version and give an accreditation in the printed version.
   - Links are included for the digital version. They will be added as
   citations for the print version.
   - With reference to "groups of MEPs" - Mike, this is pretty standard.
   Each MEP represents either a political party or are independent. Each party
   / independent (in almost every case) is a part of a wider, cross-Europe
   grouping. For example, UK Independence Party MEPs are mostly members of the
   wider "Europe of Freedom and Democracy Group".
   - Andy, your comment about the House of Commons is noted. I shall
   replace that image.
   - Mike, I'm pretty certain we have discussed the mention of start-ups
   before. It is about noting that many different groups will benefit from
   change. Competition, particularly in tech, is very important to Europe on a
   global level. Noting that these changes benefit start-ups as well as other
   groups is really speaking to them in a language they will understand and
   respond to.
   - Andy, your point about the reply address is sensible. We are now
   establishing a new email address specifically for this project.

I will share a final version later in the week once the letter has been
posted. Thanks for the constructive viewpoints.

Stevie


On 18 March 2014 15:11, Stevie Benton wrote:

> That's really helpful feedback Andy, thank you. Will certainly take into
> account. And it's very nice to be thanked, I appreciate it and you're very
> welcome.
>
> Stevie
>
>
> On 18 March 2014 14:45, Richard Nevell wrote:
>
>> Sounds to me like using a non-individual email is a good idea. I'll look
>> into getting something set up.
>>
>>
>> On 18 March 2014 14:36, Andy Mabbett  wrote:
>>
>>> On 14 March 2014 17:11, Stevie Benton 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Wikimedia UK is writing to all 73 UK MEPs regarding copyright
>>>
>>> I would expect to see such a letter signed by the Chair of the board
>>> rather than the CEx, or at least by both.
>>>
>>> The reply address should be copyright@, or some other role-based name,
>>> rather than an individual (no offence to Stevie; this is a general
>>> point).
>>>
>>> The FoP image pair is misleading, as the HoP would be out of
>>> copyright; a modern building in the UK should be used, perhaps the
>>> Welsh Assembly, or the Gherkin?
>>>
>>> I suggest the reference to pictures taken in Strasbourg be expanded
>>> slightly to mention the "WikiLovesParliaments" event; many MEPs
>>> participated and will recall it, hopefully favourably.
>>>
>>> Thanks for making these representations on our behalf,
>>>
>>> --
>>> Andy Mabbett
>>> @pigsonthewing
>>> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Wikimedia UK mailing list
>>> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
>>> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
>>> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Richard Nevell
>> Assistant Office Manager
>> Wikimedia UK
>> +44 (0) 20 7065 0753
>>
>> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
>> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
>> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
>> United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
>> movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
>> operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).
>>
>> *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
>> over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia UK mailing list
>> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
>> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
>> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Stevie Benton
> Head of External Relations
> Wikimedia UK
> +44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
> @StevieBenton
>
> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and 
> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered 
> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT. 
> United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia 
> movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who 
> operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).
>
> *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control over 
> Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
>
>


-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

That's really helpful feedback Andy, thank you. Will certainly take into
account. And it's very nice to be thanked, I appreciate it and you're very
welcome.

Stevie


On 18 March 2014 14:45, Richard Nevell wrote:

> Sounds to me like using a non-individual email is a good idea. I'll look
> into getting something set up.
>
>
> On 18 March 2014 14:36, Andy Mabbett  wrote:
>
>> On 14 March 2014 17:11, Stevie Benton 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Wikimedia UK is writing to all 73 UK MEPs regarding copyright
>>
>> I would expect to see such a letter signed by the Chair of the board
>> rather than the CEx, or at least by both.
>>
>> The reply address should be copyright@, or some other role-based name,
>> rather than an individual (no offence to Stevie; this is a general
>> point).
>>
>> The FoP image pair is misleading, as the HoP would be out of
>> copyright; a modern building in the UK should be used, perhaps the
>> Welsh Assembly, or the Gherkin?
>>
>> I suggest the reference to pictures taken in Strasbourg be expanded
>> slightly to mention the "WikiLovesParliaments" event; many MEPs
>> participated and will recall it, hopefully favourably.
>>
>> Thanks for making these representations on our behalf,
>>
>> --
>> Andy Mabbett
>> @pigsonthewing
>> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia UK mailing list
>> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
>> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
>> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Richard Nevell
> Assistant Office Manager
> Wikimedia UK
> +44 (0) 20 7065 0753
>
> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
> United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
> movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
> operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).
>
> *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
> over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
>
> ___
> Wikimedia UK mailing list
> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>



-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
___
Wikimedia UK mailing list
wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Richard Nevell]

Sounds to me like using a non-individual email is a good idea. I'll look
into getting something set up.


On 18 March 2014 14:36, Andy Mabbett  wrote:

> On 14 March 2014 17:11, Stevie Benton 
> wrote:
>
> > Wikimedia UK is writing to all 73 UK MEPs regarding copyright
>
> I would expect to see such a letter signed by the Chair of the board
> rather than the CEx, or at least by both.
>
> The reply address should be copyright@, or some other role-based name,
> rather than an individual (no offence to Stevie; this is a general
> point).
>
> The FoP image pair is misleading, as the HoP would be out of
> copyright; a modern building in the UK should be used, perhaps the
> Welsh Assembly, or the Gherkin?
>
> I suggest the reference to pictures taken in Strasbourg be expanded
> slightly to mention the "WikiLovesParliaments" event; many MEPs
> participated and will recall it, hopefully favourably.
>
> Thanks for making these representations on our behalf,
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
> ___
> Wikimedia UK mailing list
> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>



-- 
Richard Nevell
Assistant Office Manager
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0753

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
___
Wikimedia UK mailing list
wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Andy Mabbett]

On 14 March 2014 17:11, Stevie Benton  wrote:

> Wikimedia UK is writing to all 73 UK MEPs regarding copyright

I would expect to see such a letter signed by the Chair of the board
rather than the CEx, or at least by both.

The reply address should be copyright@, or some other role-based name,
rather than an individual (no offence to Stevie; this is a general
point).

The FoP image pair is misleading, as the HoP would be out of
copyright; a modern building in the UK should be used, perhaps the
Welsh Assembly, or the Gherkin?

I suggest the reference to pictures taken in Strasbourg be expanded
slightly to mention the "WikiLovesParliaments" event; many MEPs
participated and will recall it, hopefully favourably.

Thanks for making these representations on our behalf,

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 18 March 2014 13:28, Stevie Benton  wrote:
> Just to be clear, it has been 1.5 working days. The document was posted on
> the wiki late on Friday afternoon.
>
> Thank you to those volunteers who have provided useful feedback. The letter
> has not yet been sent and amends will be made. A final version will be
> posted on the wiki when it is sent out.
>
> Stevie

Thanks for making us aware of your plan. What was the reason for
choosing to write the letter off-wiki and in a non-open format, where
volunteers cannot actively help?

I was under the impression that the Free Knowledge Advocacy Group was
intended to be driven by Wikimedians rather than this being left to
Chapter board members and employees who then choose how and whether to
consult with volunteers. The process being followed right now seems
the opposite of volunteer-centric.

PS Gordo - if by her you mean Stevie, then as he posted here, it is
reasonable to assume he follows the discussion.

Fae

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Gordon Joly]

On 18/03/14 13:21, Fæ wrote:
> Sorry Gordo, but until there is some acknowledgement that the feedback
> that members and volunteers are providing might result in the letter
> being improved, there does not seem much point in spending our
> volunteer time discussing it.


OK. Does that include posting her on the topic?

Gordo


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

Just to be clear, it has been 1.5 working days. The document was posted on
the wiki late on Friday afternoon.

Thank you to those volunteers who have provided useful feedback. The letter
has not yet been sent and amends will be made. A final version will be
posted on the wiki when it is sent out.

Stevie


On 18 March 2014 13:21, Fæ  wrote:

> On 15 March 2014 14:18, Gordon Joly  wrote:
> > On 14/03/14 17:54, Fæ wrote:
> >> I note that the letter appears to state that the Free Knowledge
> >> Advocacy Group EU is a UK charity, it might be an idea to get the
> >> prose slightly more specific.
> > Where exactly?
> > Gordo
>
> It's been 4 days, for all I know the letter has already been sent.
>
> Sorry Gordo, but until there is some acknowledgement that the feedback
> that members and volunteers are providing might result in the letter
> being improved, there does not seem much point in spending our
> volunteer time discussing it.
>
> Fae
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
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>



-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

On 15 March 2014 14:18, Gordon Joly  wrote:
> On 14/03/14 17:54, Fæ wrote:
>> I note that the letter appears to state that the Free Knowledge
>> Advocacy Group EU is a UK charity, it might be an idea to get the
>> prose slightly more specific.
> Where exactly?
> Gordo

It's been 4 days, for all I know the letter has already been sent.

Sorry Gordo, but until there is some acknowledgement that the feedback
that members and volunteers are providing might result in the letter
being improved, there does not seem much point in spending our
volunteer time discussing it.

Fae
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Gordon Joly]

On 14/03/14 17:54, Fæ wrote:
> 1.
> I note that the letter appears to state that the Free Knowledge
> Advocacy Group EU is a UK charity, it might be an idea to get the
> prose slightly more specific.



Where exactly?

Gordo


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Michael Peel]

Hi Stevie,

Thanks from me also for sharing this. Some points:

# The images you are using all appear to be copyright violations - not the best 
move! Why not attribute the images, or link to where they're available on 
Commons or elsewhere? For the image not covered by FoP, why not do something 
like the photos in 
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Censored_by_lack_of_FOP ?
# I'm never sure about how orphan works should relate to free licenses. I'm 
sure that a number of my CC licensed photos could now be claimed by others to 
be orphan works as people have taken them from Wikipedia and reused them 
without attribution. I'd actually suggest removing this point completely unless 
you can explain how it might work in this sort of case or better nuance the 
text here.
# "As can be seen in this article" won't work once you print the letter out!
# What does it mean by 'on your group of MEPs'? Aren't you addressing them 
individually with this? Are you meaning UK MEPs?
# If you want the MEPs to read through to the end, then I'd recommend 
condensing it down to two sides (and print it double-sided) so that they only 
have to flip the page over rather than flip through pages. Also, you only need 
the disclaimer on the first page rather than all three.
# I still don't understand why 'start-ups' are mentioned here (as I asked at 
https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Talk:Free_Knowledge_Advocacy_Group_EU_statement_of_intent#Query
 but with no reply).
# I agree with Fæ's points below.

Thanks,
Mike

On 14 Mar 2014, at 17:54, Fæ  wrote:

> Thanks for letting people know that the UK chapter is sending this letter.
> 
> It is a shame that so few Wikimedians in the UK have contributed to
> the process, I think it is correct to say that even after counting
> employees and trustees, the number is fewer than could be counted on
> the fingers of one hand.
> 
> I am assuming that the UK charity is open to receiving feedback,
> though your email here, nor your equivalent notice on the UK wiki does
> not invite comment. My apologies if my assumption is unfounded, please
> ignore the following points if that is the case.
> 
> Three points:
> 1.
> I note that the letter appears to state that the Free Knowledge
> Advocacy Group EU is a UK charity, it might be an idea to get the
> prose slightly more specific.
> 
> 2.
> The lead paragraph states "We are the UK based charity that supports
> and promotes Wikipedia and its sister websites such as Wikimedia
> Commons". This is quite different from the WMUK Mission as recently
> approved by the board of trustees which does not mention Wikipedia or
> Commons. I suggest that in an official letter of this type, that the
> charity is described as accurately as possible, even in a plain
> English summary.
> 
> 3.
> Were I the recipient I would be unclear if in emailing back, I were
> responding to the WMUK charity or the Free Knowledge Advocacy Group
> EU. The Royal "we" used throughout the letter is more than a little
> confusing as it is signed by the CEO of possibly either (or both) of
> WMUK and the Advocacy Group and correspondence email is a different
> personal address. Is the letter intended to be from the UK charity or
> the group of organizations in the Advocacy Group?
> 
> Good luck with the letter. I'm sure that Jon Davies' practical
> experience in the world of politics will prove useful if any MEP would
> benefit from a follow-up, such as a discussion over lunch.
> 
> Fae
> -- 
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
> 
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Fæ]

Thanks for letting people know that the UK chapter is sending this letter.

It is a shame that so few Wikimedians in the UK have contributed to
the process, I think it is correct to say that even after counting
employees and trustees, the number is fewer than could be counted on
the fingers of one hand.

I am assuming that the UK charity is open to receiving feedback,
though your email here, nor your equivalent notice on the UK wiki does
not invite comment. My apologies if my assumption is unfounded, please
ignore the following points if that is the case.

Three points:
1.
I note that the letter appears to state that the Free Knowledge
Advocacy Group EU is a UK charity, it might be an idea to get the
prose slightly more specific.

2.
The lead paragraph states "We are the UK based charity that supports
and promotes Wikipedia and its sister websites such as Wikimedia
Commons". This is quite different from the WMUK Mission as recently
approved by the board of trustees which does not mention Wikipedia or
Commons. I suggest that in an official letter of this type, that the
charity is described as accurately as possible, even in a plain
English summary.

3.
Were I the recipient I would be unclear if in emailing back, I were
responding to the WMUK charity or the Free Knowledge Advocacy Group
EU. The Royal "we" used throughout the letter is more than a little
confusing as it is signed by the CEO of possibly either (or both) of
WMUK and the Advocacy Group and correspondence email is a different
personal address. Is the letter intended to be from the UK charity or
the group of organizations in the Advocacy Group?

Good luck with the letter. I'm sure that Jon Davies' practical
experience in the world of politics will prove useful if any MEP would
benefit from a follow-up, such as a discussion over lunch.

Fae
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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[Wikimediauk-l] Letter to MEPs on copyright

[Stevie Benton]

Hello everyone.

You may be interested to note that Wikimedia UK is writing to all 73 UK
MEPs regarding copyright. In line with the work we've done with the Free
Knowledge Advocacy Group EU (group of European Wikimedia chapters) we are
looking for support for change in three areas: freedom of panorama; public
domain of publicly-funded works; and use of orphan works. If you'd like to
see the letter, it's
here.
It will be going out next week (with a couple of minor modifications) in
the post and also by email.

Thank you,

Stevie

-- 

Stevie Benton
Head of External Relations
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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