Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Andrea Zanni 
This is an ooold issue: Wikisource does not have proper metadata.

I'm one of the people that Nemo Was mentioning: I'm a digital librarian
working for MLOL, and in the past 2 years, among other dozens of digital
libraries, I've managed to import Wikisource metadata on MLOL in 3
languages (English, French, Italian):
http://openmlol.it/Media/Search?Publisher=620

It has been a pain in the ass because I actually had to web scrape the
websites, from lists derived from categories. There is no easy way to have
metadata about Wikisource books, at the moment.

There are prototypes like WS-search, from Sam Wilson:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/ws-search/

And I'm sure that Tpt has some scripts to parse Wikisource (also, there was
OPDS).

The Wikisource community tried somewhat to solve the issue via Wikidata,
but discovered another black hole: modelling books on Wikidata it's very
tricky, and even after 2 Wikicite conferences (with Tpt and other
Wikisource people) I must confess I'm still confused...
For personal reasons I've not worked on the matter in the last months,
hopefully, will do in the near future.

I remember Vigneron was braver than me and recently tried to revive the
discussion:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Books

IF (and it's a big IF) we find a workable solution with Wikidata
(theoretical and practical) and
IF (and it's a big IF) we find some skilled Wikidata people to help us with
customised queries and bots to help with the transition (we need to import
Wikisource data into Wikidata, and we need to clear existing Wikidata items
following the standard model, and we need to maintain them in the future),
then it's doable and we have solved the metadata problem.

Unfortunately, I spent most of my adult and professional life complaining
about this (also, I really tried),
and nothing really changed... ;-)

Aubrey


On Thu, Oct 12, 2017 at 3:05 PM, Sam Wilson  wrote:

> Sorry, Sam, the other thing I meant to say was: that's a brilliant idea!
> :-) I'd love to help make it happen, if I can be of any use. :)
>
>
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 08:51 PM, Sam Wilson wrote:
>
> It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated works,
> for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to their
> corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index pages have the
> status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as the work. There's
> P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the data for that isn't
> complete.
>
> We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool, which I
> think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the Wikisource
> catalogue with other systems. Once we have better structural support in
> Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for querying validation status)
> then we'll much more efficiently and easily be able to produce all sorts of
> output for sharing.
>
>
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 08:37 PM, Sam Walton wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
> passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
> and discovery tools into the library card platform (
> https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
> development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
> access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
> desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
> it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
> as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
> implemented.
>
> If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very
> welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it
> will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource community
> would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the likelihood
> we'll work on it.
>
> Best,
> Sam
>
> On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo) 
> wrote:
>
> Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
>
> Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I this
> demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
> reading public.
>
>
> In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
> books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
> ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
> collection", big kudos to them).
>
> Nemo
>
> ___
> Wikisource-l mailing list
> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sam Walton
> Partnerships Coordinator
> The Wikipedia Library
>
> s...@wikipedialibrary.org / swal...@wikimedia.org
> *___*
> Wikisource-l mailing

Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Sam Wilson 
Sorry, Sam, the other thing I meant to say was: that's a brilliant idea!
:-) I'd love to help make it happen, if I can be of any use. :)

On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 08:51 PM, Sam Wilson wrote:
> It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated
> works, for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to
> their corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index
> pages have the status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as
> the work. There's P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the
> data for that isn't complete.> 
> We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool,
> which I think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the
> Wikisource catalogue with other systems. Once we have better
> structural support in Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for
> querying validation status) then we'll much more efficiently and
> easily be able to produce all sorts of output for sharing.> 
> 
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 08:37 PM, Sam Walton wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
>> passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building
>> search and discovery tools into the library card platform
>> (https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under
>> ongoing development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled
>> resources we have access to, but also open access content. As part of
>> that process it's a desire of mine to index completed Wikisource
>> works, though I haven't given it much thought beyond 'that would be
>> nice'. This might be able to function as a kind of centralised search
>> for all completed Wikisource works, if implemented.>> 
>> If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
>> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are
>> very welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee
>> that it will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource
>> community would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the
>> likelihood we'll work on it.>> 
>> Best,
>> Sam
>> 
>> On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo)
>>  wrote:>>> Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
 Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource,
 I this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished
 books to a reading public.>>>
>>> In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the
>>> Wikisource books are included in the catalogs of many libraries
>>> (also via a local ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians
>>> to work on the "open collection", big kudos to them).>>> 
>>> Nemo
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> Wikisource-l mailing list
>>> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Sam Walton
>> Partnerships Coordinator
>> The Wikipedia Library
>> 
>> s...@wikipedialibrary.org / swal...@wikimedia.org
>> _
>> Wikisource-l mailing list
>> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
> 
> _
> Wikisource-l mailing list
> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Sam Wilson 
It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated works,
for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to their
corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index pages have
the status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as the work.
There's P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the data for
that isn't complete.
We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool, which
I think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the Wikisource
catalogue with other systems. Once we have better structural support in
Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for querying validation status)
then we'll much more efficiently and easily be able to produce all sorts
of output for sharing.

On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 08:37 PM, Sam Walton wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
> passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building
> search and discovery tools into the library card platform
> (https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
> development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
> access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's
> a desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't
> given it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able
> to function as a kind of centralised search for all completed
> Wikisource works, if implemented.> 
> If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are
> very welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee
> that it will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource
> community would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the
> likelihood we'll work on it.> 
> Best,
> Sam
> 
> On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo)
>  wrote:>> Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
>>> Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource,
>>> I this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished
>>> books to a reading public.>>
>> In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the
>> Wikisource books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also
>> via a local ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work
>> on the "open collection", big kudos to them).>> 
>>  Nemo
>> 
>>  ___
>>  Wikisource-l mailing list
>> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Sam Walton
> Partnerships Coordinator
> The Wikipedia Library
> 
> s...@wikipedialibrary.org / swal...@wikimedia.org
> _
> Wikisource-l mailing list
> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Gerard Meijssen 
Hoi,
In my opinion this is a service not only for editors but for the complete
Wikimedia reader public. So the notion of putting it in that platform is
great but we need to advertise the finished books of  Wikisource to the
whole world.
Thanks,
   GerardM

On 12 October 2017 at 14:37, Sam Walton  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
> passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
> and discovery tools into the library card platform (
> https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
> development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
> access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
> desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
> it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
> as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
> implemented.
>
> If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very
> welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it
> will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource community
> would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the likelihood
> we'll work on it.
>
> Best,
> Sam
>
> On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo) 
> wrote:
>
>> Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
>>
>>> Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I
>>> this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
>>> reading public.
>>>
>>
>> In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
>> books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
>> ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
>> collection", big kudos to them).
>>
>> Nemo
>>
>> ___
>> Wikisource-l mailing list
>> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Sam Walton
> Partnerships Coordinator
> The Wikipedia Library
>
> s...@wikipedialibrary.org / swal...@wikimedia.org
>
> ___
> Wikisource-l mailing list
> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
>
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Sam Walton 
Hi all,

I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
and discovery tools into the library card platform (
https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
implemented.

If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is https://phabricator.
wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very welcome. It won't be
worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it will definitely happen,
but if it's something the Wikisource community would benefit from, then
that would absolutely increase the likelihood we'll work on it.

Best,
Sam

On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo) 
wrote:

> Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
>
>> Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I
>> this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
>> reading public.
>>
>
> In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
> books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
> ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
> collection", big kudos to them).
>
> Nemo
>
> ___
> Wikisource-l mailing list
> Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
>



-- 
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo) 

Gerard Meijssen, 12/10/2017 15:04:
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I 
this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to 
a reading public.


In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource 
books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local 
ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open 
collection", big kudos to them).


Nemo

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[Wikisource-l] Proposal

2017-10-12 Thread Gerard Meijssen 
Hoi,
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I this
demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
reading public.

After all what is it that we do it for but for finding a public for the
transcribed books?
Thanks,
 GerardM

http://ultimategerardm.blogspot.nl/2017/10/wikisource-proof-of-pudding.html
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[Wikisource-l] Proposal to move the Oldwikisource projects to the Incubator

2013-06-24 Thread David Cuenca 
Someone (not me) has proposed to move the language projects hosted in
Oldwikisource to the Incubator
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meta:Babel#Move_betawikiversity_and_oldwikisource_to_Incubator

I'm not sure if is a good idea or if it is technically feasible at all, but
you can comment it on the link.

Thanks!
Micru
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal to move the Oldwikisource projects to the Incubator

2013-06-24 Thread Alex Brollo 
I posted there a very bold idea - to assign to oldwikisourcea new and
inspiring nick name: Common wikisource. :-)

Alex


2013/6/24 David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com

 Someone (not me) has proposed to move the language projects hosted in
 Oldwikisource to the Incubator

 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meta:Babel#Move_betawikiversity_and_oldwikisource_to_Incubator

 I'm not sure if is a good idea or if it is technically feasible at all,
 but you can comment it on the link.

 Thanks!
 Micru

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Proposal: two desirable ParserFunctions

2010-12-14 Thread Alex Brollo 
2010/12/14 Federico Leva (Nemo) nemow...@gmail.com

 Alex Brollo, 14/12/2010 09:10:

  1. I'd like to have a {{nbsp:string}}  function, to replace all spaces
  with nbsp; html entities into string. It would very useful to format
  table cell content where spaces must be avoided, while saving the
  original string.

 There's a class for this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Nowrap

 
  2. I'd like to generalize {{#titleparts:string}} transforming it into a
  general  str.split() function something like {{split:string|char}} where
  string is the string to split, and char is the splitting character). I
  use a lot #titleparts as a string-splitter, and I can manage difficult
  issues with ease (i.e.: how to pass multiple values into a single
  parameter  of a template) but sometimes I'd like to use a character
  different from /  (i.e. splitting a list of page/subpage names).

 This should be http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:StringFunctions ,
 which will never be implemented in Wikimedia projects.


1. Thank you Nemo!! Problem solved.
2. There are lots of string functions already implemented - lc, uc, lcfirs,
ucfirst, #titleparts... PAGENAME, FULLPAGENAME, BASEPAGENAME... - today.
IMHO a generalized *split* function would be great to extend just a little
bit the field of #titleparts to implement an efficient, simple way to manage
simple arrays. StringFunctions could fire fantasy - *split* function would
only increase efficiency to solve common issues.

Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] proposal to extend the ref tag syntax

2010-08-12 Thread ThomasV 
For the moment it is only a proposal.

Since the Cite extension is used at most wikimedia wikis,
it has to be discussed with the developers. This is why
I posted the original message to wikitech-l ; wikisource-l
was only in cc.

I realize now that it was not a good idea to send the same
message to wikisource-l, because users of this ML do not
know that there is a discussion at wikitech-l

Thomas




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[Wikisource-l] proposal to extend the ref tag syntax

2010-08-11 Thread ThomasV 
Sorry, I forgot a topic ; reposting the previous message:



I would like to extend the syntax of the ref tag (Cite extension), in
order to deal with footnotes that are spread on several transcluded
pages. Since the Cite extension is widely used, I guess I better ask
here first.

Here is an illustration of the problem :
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:Robert_the_Bruce_and_the_struggle_for_Scottish_independence_-_1909.djvu/49

On the bottom of the scan you can see the second half of a footnote.
That footnote begins at the previous page :
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:Robert_the_Bruce_and_the_struggle_for_Scottish_independence_-_1909.djvu/48

Wikisourcers currently have no way to deal with these cases in a clean
way. I have written a patch for this (the code is here :
http://dpaste.org/QOMH/ ). This patch extends the ref syntax by adding
a follow parameter, like this :

ref follow=foobar/ref

After two pages are transcluded, the wikitext passed to the parser will
look like this :

blah blah blah
blah blah blahref name=note1beginning of note 1/ref
blah blah blah
blah blah blah
blah blah blahref follow=note1end of note/ref
blah blah blah

This wikitext is rendered as a single footnote, located in the text at
the position of the parent ref. If the parent ref is not found (as
is the case when you render only the second page), then the text inside
the tag is rendered at the beginning of the list of references, with no
number and no link.

does this make sense ?

Thomas

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