Re: Debugging Wine thoughts
On Wednesday 10 September 2008 10:44:09 pm Damjan Jovanovic wrote:
For example applications don't expect to see pointers into the upper
1-2 GB of the 4 GB virtual memory address space because on Windows the
kernel's memory is mapped there. But, ld-linux.so.2 could load
libraries there, including libraries hosting Wine's DLLs, and pointers
to memory in those would leak into the Windows code.
AFAIK, Wine doesn't load .dll.so files using the standard dl lib functions. At
least, the dlopen/dlsym functions don't recognize the .dll.so files in a
winelib app. What it does, again AFAIK, is mmap the lower 2-3GB range so it
can put kernel32/etc where some apps expect it to be, and to mimick Windows'
allocation algorithms.
However, because it's all premapped, further libc malloc calls can't use that
same range, and will quickly run out of allocatable memory. This causes
problems particularly with video cards that have 512MB VRAM or more, since
there's not enough room to map and/or mirror the card resources.
An idea I had and mentioned on IRC a couple times is to have libwine expose
functions that can be used by drivers and other native modules to
allocate win32 memory instead of using the standard libc functions. It
would be pretty easy for a driver or such to do:
void *hdl = dlopen(libwine.so, RTLD_NOLOAD);
void *(*mallocfunc)(size_t) = (hdl ? dlsym(hdl, wine_malloc) : NULL);
void (*freefunc)(void*) = (hdl ? dlsym(hdl, wine_free) : NULL);
if(!mallocfunc || !freefunc || dlerror() != NULL)
{
mallocfunc = malloc;
freefunc = free;
}
..use mallocfunc/freefunc for memory..
This will, of course, rely on drivers to be aware of Wine and handle it.
An alternative idea Alexandre had was to override libc's mmap, so anything
loaded in the process would automatically use the new function (and thus not
need any Wine-specific code). However, my attempts at doing that caused glibc
to crash on init.
Re: Debugging Wine thoughts
Am 10.09.2008 um 17:32 schrieb Stefan Dösinger: You can attach any debugger to a Win32 process running in Wine. This includes Linux debuggers like gdb, [...] As I didn't find hints on how to do this I tried myself: ** First, start gdb in the C: directory [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/otherubuntu/home/mah/.wine/drive_c$ gdb GNU gdb 6.8-debian Copyright [...] This GDB was configured as x86_64-linux-gnu. (gdb) file wine Reading symbols from /usr/local/bin/wine...done. (gdb) directory /otherubuntu/home/mah/wine/ Source directories searched: /otherubuntu/home/mah/wine:$cdir:$cwd (gdb) ** Then, run the app (gdb) run windows/notepad.exe Starting program: /usr/local/bin/wine windows/notepad.exe [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] [New Thread 0xf7c628c0 (LWP 793)] [New Thread 0xf7c61b90 (LWP 796)] [Thread 0xf7c61b90 (LWP 796) exited] [New process 793] Executing new program: /usr/local/bin/wine-preloader warning: Cannot initialize thread debugging library: generic error warning: Cannot initialize thread debugging library: generic error [New process 793] Fontconfig warning: /etc/fonts/conf.d/53-monospace-lcd-filter.conf, line 17: invalid constant used : lcdlegacy Fontconfig warning: /etc/fonts/conf.d/53-monospace-lcd-filter.conf, line 17: invalid constant used : lcdlegacy Fontconfig warning: /etc/fonts/conf.d/53-monospace-lcd-filter.conf, line 17: invalid constant used : lcdlegacy ** Notepad should be running here. Interrupt it from the command line to have a look: ^C Program received signal SIGINT, Interrupt. 0xf7fec430 in ?? () (gdb) bt #0 0xf7fec430 in ?? () #1 0x0008 in ?? () #2 0x7bc76516 in ?? () #3 [...] (gdb) list 1 /* 2* Preloader for ld.so 3* 4* Copyright (C) [...] As you see, listing appears to work in principle, while symbol lookup doesn't. It's no secret Wine runs multiple processes and Windows applications run multiple threads, so you might want to look up how to handle this in gdb: http://sources.redhat.com/gdb/current/onlinedocs/gdb_5.html My tries to break not into the preloader, but the actual Windows application weren't successful so far, gdb's console appears to lock up somehow when setting follow-fork-mode friends. MarKus - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Dipl. Ing. Markus Hitter http://www.jump-ing.de/
RE: Debugging Wine thoughts
You can attach any debugger to a Win32 process running in Wine. This includes Linux debuggers like gdb, or any graphical frontends, as well as Windows debuggers like visual studio. If you built wine from source, the Linux debuggers will see the Wine source. Probably they can also read the Windows apps source if you have it. I'm not sure if Windows debuggers can access the Wine source, but maybe dbghelp.dll can do that From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 10:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: wine-devel@winehq.org Subject: Debugging Wine thoughts Dan / All, I think what the guy was asking on improving winedbg is to have some sort of visual debugger much like VC/C++ , Eclipse, Borland C++ or the like... Where you can step through the code (seeing the whole thing like any visual debugger). Then when looking at stacks you click on a variable or stack and it either winds it back or display's it. Below is my thoughts on what would be a nice to have in some form of Debugger / Gui Debugger for Wine So my wish list would be: 1) Some form of a Standard Gui Debugger 2) A way to select the debug flags used with an explanation of what each is for... +sed is for this +relay does that...etc 3) When you do +relay you could open separate output windows for each thread 4) The ability to turn each of the +relay wine thread output on or off... 4) Currently Wading through a relay log is a real pain and in some cases it prevents the problem from occuring. Time outs because of too much data being collected and then having to wade through and determine what to and not to turn off. So a note or best practice somewhere showing the heavy hitters in a +relay log and turn them off by default. However, note somewhere saying if +relay doesnt give enough information then turn on just these flags and run. That way we are not managing flag lists when trying to figure out whats going wrong in an application. IMHO +relay is too unweldly and turning each flag on individually is as well, so there needs to be some sort of happy medium somewhere. 5) A window with a list of the important wine structures or resources that can be watched as the application runs. 6) Source code debugging in the GUI with step through, break points, etc..( not like now in winedbg but more like one of the GUI's mentioned before) 7) Loading of application from gui debugger and run it 8) Ability to look at a stack and backtrace in the GUI 9) Value Watches within the GUI. 10) Code Checking Some sort of bounds checking... Uninitialized variable checking Unreachable Code Checking 11) Use the GUI to help enforce the Wine Coding standard.. most modern GUI environments let you specify a style of coding. This would help the new people understand and follow the coding standards set up... instead of guessing like they do now. 12) Online help / Context help... point to the IC in the wiki... lots of good stuff there... just hard to find sometimes 13) Integration with bugzilla... they find a bug... they create it in the GUI.. dump out the screen, stack and the like... so some of the base information is collected instead of wasting time back and forth and having so many invalid bugs. Again this format can be enforced through coding style templates... you want to submit a bug here is what you do... check boxes to include things... like I said screen shots... logs, traces, variables, hardware config, etc... 14) Integration with GIT... check and see if there is a new tree out there.. if so... flag it and git it... 15) Link to whats fixed in the new GIT tree... or a list of it... 16) Link to Dan's patchwatcher status... (kinda a workflow sort of thing) to know whats good and bad... 17) Generation of the GIT patch and then mail it to the list through a button... 18) GIT integration You have to remember guy's alot of the new people coming in are not old timers like some of us who grew up in a non-gui world.. Like it or not they are used to doing things in certain ways and I think we could get alot more people looking at bugs and helping fix them if we started thinking of something along these lines. This of course is not a complete list... And I am sure this is going to start a flame war or something close to it.. But I think this might be a good next step for something like the summer of code people to do.. or whomever maintains the wine debugger to think seriously about. Most of these things I think could be implemented using the current wine debugger with some form of pipe between it and the GUI. That way the 'purists' can still debug using winedebug like now and the new people who choose to can use the GUI? Thoughts Problems I have noticed when debugging... If I kill (press the X button or close it from the task bar) the wine application, Wine does not clean up from itself... it leaves
Re: Debugging Wine thoughts
Is there any documentation on the wine site how to set this up stefan??? It may be a start to what I am thinking. chris -Original Message- From: Stefan Dösinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: wine-devel@winehq.org Sent: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:32 am Subject: RE: Debugging Wine thoughts You can attach any debugger to a Win32 process running in Wine. This includes Linux debuggers like gdb, or any graphical frontends, as well as Windows debuggers like visual studio. If you built wine from source, the Linux debuggers will see the Wine source. Probably they can also read the Windows apps source if you have it. I'm not sure if Windows debuggers can access the Wine source, but maybe dbghelp.dll can do that From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 10:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: wine-devel@winehq.org Subject: Debugging Wine thoughts Dan / All, I think what the guy was asking on improving winedbg is to have some sort of visual debugger much like VC/C++ , Eclipse, Borland C++ or the like... Where you can step through the code (seeing the whole thing like any visual debugger). Then when looking at stacks you click on a variable or stack and it either winds it back or display's it. Below is my thoughts on what would be a nice to have in some form of Debugger / Gui Debugger for Wine So my wish list would be: 1) Some form of a Standard Gui Debugger 2) A way to select the debug flags used with an explanation of what each is for... +sed is for this +relay does that...etc 3) When you do +relay you could open separate output windows for each thread 4) The ability to turn each of the +relay wine thread output on or off... 4) Currently Wading through a relay log is a real pain and in some cases it prevents the problem from occuring. Time outs because of too much data being collected and then having to wade through and determine what to and not to turn off. So a note or best practice somewhere showing the heavy hitters in a +relay log and turn them off by default. However, note somewhere saying if +relay doesnt give enough information then turn on just these flags and run. That way we are not managing flag lists when trying to figure out whats going wrong in an application. IMHO +relay is too unweldly and turning each flag on individually is as well, so there needs to be some sort of happy medium somewhere. 5) A window with a list of the important wine structures or resources that can be watched as the application runs. 6) Source code debugging in the GUI with step through, break points, etc..( not like no w in winedbg but more like one of the GUI's mentioned before) 7) Loading of application from gui debugger and run it 8) Ability to look at a stack and backtrace in the GUI 9) Value Watches within the GUI. 10) Code Checking Some sort of bounds checking... Uninitialized variable checking Unreachable Code Checking 11) Use the GUI to help enforce the Wine Coding standard.. most modern GUI environments let you specify a style of coding. This would help the new people understand and follow the coding standards set up... instead of guessing like they do now. 12) Online help / Context help... point to the IC in the wiki... lots of good stuff there... just hard to find sometimes 13) Integration with bugzilla... they find a bug... they create it in the GUI.. dump out the screen, stack and the like... so some of the base information is collected instead of wasting time back and forth and having so many invalid bugs. Again this format can be enforced through coding style templates... you want to submit a bug here is what you do... check boxes to include things... like I said screen shots... logs, traces, variables, hardware config, etc... 14) Integration with GIT... check and see if there is a new tree out there.. if so... flag it and git it... 15) Link to whats fixed in the new GIT tree... or a list of it... 16) Link to Dan's patchwatcher status... (kinda a workflow sort of thing) to know whats good and bad... 17) Generation of the GIT patch and then mail it to the list through a button... 18) GIT integration You have to remember guy's alot of the new people coming in are not old timers like some of us who grew up in a non-gui world.. Like it or not they are used to doing things in certain ways and I think we could get alot more people looking at bugs and helping fix them if we started thinking of something along these lines. This of course is not a complete list... And I am sure this is going to start a flame war or something close to it.. But I think this might be a good next step for something like the summer of code people to do.. or whomever maintains the wine debugger to think seriously about. Most of these things I think could
Re: Debugging Wine thoughts
dbghelp supports both linux debug formats (stabs, dwarf) as well as microsoft's one so any debugger using dbghelp as it's debug info provide should debug with all bells whistles native builtin applications I had some success with windbg (with a an 'e' between n d ;-) unfortunately, http://www.winehq.org/site/docs/winedev-guide/dbg-others isn't fully uptodate A+ -- Eric Pouech The problem with designing something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of a complete idiot. (Douglas Adams)
Re: Debugging Wine thoughts
On Wed, Sep 10, 2008 at 8:17 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Question : Why does wine have to allocate all its memory at startup? re... the issue that is causing the ATI drivers to have such a fuss why not just allocate as needed? or have the ability (if its not there already) to specify the total amount of memory which is available to the wine process and limit wine to just that ammount of memory (kind of like the way most VM machines have the option of setting the maximum amount of memory which is available). Windows applications assume a certain memory layout, which sometimes conflicts with what *nix does. For example applications don't expect to see pointers into the upper 1-2 GB of the 4 GB virtual memory address space because on Windows the kernel's memory is mapped there. But, ld-linux.so.2 could load libraries there, including libraries hosting Wine's DLLs, and pointers to memory in those would leak into the Windows code. So Wine prevents the special areas of Windows memory from being used by *nix libraries and functions like malloc() by mmap()ing that memory in advance. In my opinion, it would be better if we used a custom dynamic linker (ie. an ld-wine.so) that could control where all libraries get loaded so we wouldn't have to steal memory in advance and go through one of the most elaborate startup processes in existence, where an assembly _start routine in wine-preloader loads before ld-linux.so.2 and then pretends to be the kernel. Bye Damjan Jovanovic
