Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-05-09 Thread Alexander Lamaison
Surely Microsoft make their own internal builds on WiX for their
products anyway  Can the externally-released binary not be linked
against an earlier CRT?

In the mean time, could you point me to the C++ code that WiX MSI
installers include (the patch check thing? or is there more?).  I'd
like to see if it's possible to rewrite it so it doesn't even use the
CRT.

Alex

On 9 May 2012 06:43, Rob Mensching  wrote:
> To pass a security review at Microsoft, the VS2010 CRT must be used. The
> VS2010 CRT has the latest security defenses built in. Unfortunately, the
> VS2010 CRT does not run on Win2K.  The bad error message actually happens
> in the VS2010 CRT. Our code in Burn doesn't even have the opportunity to
> load.
>
> I expect the custom actions in the WiX toolset have similar issues to Burn.
>
> The root issue is that the VC++ team made the decision to cut backwards
> compatibility to only supported Windows OS's.
>
> Next version will be even more interesting since last I checked VS11 CRT
> only supports Win7+ (which I believe cuts support for WinXP SP3 and
> Vista before they are out of service).
>
>
> On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>
>> I remain confused how this problem has arisen in the first place.  WiX
>> was (obviously) being compiled with versions of VS that support Win2K,
>> Win XP.  So what's changed?
>>
>> Windows XP hasn't changed under our feet.  So that leaves WiX.  What
>> features of the newer versions of Windows and/or VS are so
>> indispensable that they force WiX to be platform-dependent?
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> P.S.  I'm happy to help restore backward comaptibility to the C++
>> parts of WiX but I would need someone else to do the same for the .net
>> code;  that's not my speciality.
>>
>>
>> On 2 May 2012 18:50, James Johnston  wrote:
>> >
>> http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=11&qp
>> > customb=0&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=149&qpnp=11
>> > ^-- Source of my data in this message...
>> >
>> > That is something that has been bugging me too while reading this
>> > discussion.  So my random thoughts on this topic of OS compatibility...
>> >
>> > The cryptic error originally reported by OP isn't good.  We only support
>> > Windows XP SP3+ as well, but if the user double-clicks the bootstrapper /
>> > self-extracting EXE, they need to get a messaging saying they need XP -
>> not
>> > some cryptic error that might turn a user away from our application.
>> > Unfortunately, with the way Visual C++ has been dumping support for older
>> > versions of Windows, it looks like we would need to retain an older
>> Visual
>> > C++ compiler (or find a competing compiler) for the sole purpose of
>> making
>> > our own custom bootstrapper that shows a reasonable error.  What a pain!
>> > Would be nice if WiX prevented this piece of overhead...
>> >
>> > >From that link, I would guess that Windows 2000 usage must be close to
>> zero
>> > (lumped into the 2.51% "Other" category).  I'm less worried about that.
>>  But
>> > there's still significant XP usage, and dumping support for pre-SP2
>> versions
>> > of XP is disturbing.  How can the bootstrapper request the user to
>> install
>> > SP3 if the bootstrapper itself requires SP2/SP3?
>> >
>> > >From what I have read, the situation gets much worse with VS11 since it
>> > drops XP support completely.  This is a problem, because apparently XP
>> still
>> > has 46% of the market.  I know many of our customers still use it.  We
>> can't
>> > drop support for it.  VS11 is out of touch with reality in this respect.
>>  If
>> > bootstrappers and/or custom actions start requiring Vista+, we'd have to
>> > avoid the newer versions of WiX.  We'll also have to avoid VS11 ourselves
>> > for the time being.  The improvements in VS11 might not justify dropping
>> > support for a lot of our customers, if it turns out not to be realistic
>> to
>> > ask them to upgrade.  And the concerns I already outlined about
>> > bootstrappers not failing gracefully apply doubly-so here - even if XP
>> drops
>> > to, say, 10% of the market and we decide to drop support, there's still
>> > enough out there that we need the bootstrapper to kindly request Vista+.
>> >
>> > It would be nice if XP suffered a precipitous drop in market share this
>> > year, but I doubt 

Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-05-02 Thread Alexander Lamaison
I remain confused how this problem has arisen in the first place.  WiX
was (obviously) being compiled with versions of VS that support Win2K,
Win XP.  So what's changed?

Windows XP hasn't changed under our feet.  So that leaves WiX.  What
features of the newer versions of Windows and/or VS are so
indispensable that they force WiX to be platform-dependent?

Alex

P.S.  I'm happy to help restore backward comaptibility to the C++
parts of WiX but I would need someone else to do the same for the .net
code;  that's not my speciality.


On 2 May 2012 18:50, James Johnston  wrote:
> http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=11&qp
> customb=0&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=149&qpnp=11
> ^-- Source of my data in this message...
>
> That is something that has been bugging me too while reading this
> discussion.  So my random thoughts on this topic of OS compatibility...
>
> The cryptic error originally reported by OP isn't good.  We only support
> Windows XP SP3+ as well, but if the user double-clicks the bootstrapper /
> self-extracting EXE, they need to get a messaging saying they need XP - not
> some cryptic error that might turn a user away from our application.
> Unfortunately, with the way Visual C++ has been dumping support for older
> versions of Windows, it looks like we would need to retain an older Visual
> C++ compiler (or find a competing compiler) for the sole purpose of making
> our own custom bootstrapper that shows a reasonable error.  What a pain!
> Would be nice if WiX prevented this piece of overhead...
>
> >From that link, I would guess that Windows 2000 usage must be close to zero
> (lumped into the 2.51% "Other" category).  I'm less worried about that.  But
> there's still significant XP usage, and dumping support for pre-SP2 versions
> of XP is disturbing.  How can the bootstrapper request the user to install
> SP3 if the bootstrapper itself requires SP2/SP3?
>
> >From what I have read, the situation gets much worse with VS11 since it
> drops XP support completely.  This is a problem, because apparently XP still
> has 46% of the market.  I know many of our customers still use it.  We can't
> drop support for it.  VS11 is out of touch with reality in this respect.  If
> bootstrappers and/or custom actions start requiring Vista+, we'd have to
> avoid the newer versions of WiX.  We'll also have to avoid VS11 ourselves
> for the time being.  The improvements in VS11 might not justify dropping
> support for a lot of our customers, if it turns out not to be realistic to
> ask them to upgrade.  And the concerns I already outlined about
> bootstrappers not failing gracefully apply doubly-so here - even if XP drops
> to, say, 10% of the market and we decide to drop support, there's still
> enough out there that we need the bootstrapper to kindly request Vista+.
>
> It would be nice if XP suffered a precipitous drop in market share this
> year, but I doubt it.  Hopefully it will go away soon.  I suspect it will
> still be common for another 2 years until companies are forced to move away
> from it when MS finally kills support (or suffer the security liability from
> an unpatched/unsupported OS).  Some people/companies tend to avoid change
> until their lack of planning forces them into it - and maybe MS dropping
> support will push them over the edge to get Win7/8.  By then, VS12 would be
> coming down the pipeline, and companies like us would still be stuck on
> VS2010 or older due to XP compatibility concerns if we decide not to drop
> support for XP just yet.  (XP is the energizer bunny or something... it
> keeps going and going.  I can't remember another consumer OS version that
> has had such a long life cycle!)
>
> James
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Neil Sleightholm [mailto:n...@x2systems.com]
>> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 15:57
>> To: General discussion for Windows Installer XML toolset.
>> Subject: Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a
> valid
>> Win32 application"
>>
>> I agree with dropping support for Win2k but what is a shame is that
> running
>> the exe doesn't display a more useful error message. I don't suppose there
> is
>> anything that can be done to change this?
>>
>> Neil
>
>
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Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-04-29 Thread Alexander Lamaison
Is that not the wrong question?  Rather than getting caught up in the
ins and outs of which version to support, why not adopt methods that
remove the decision entirely?

Have you considered using CMake, for example, which generates build
files for a vast range of build platforms (including VS 6 - 11)?
Basically, you outsource the burden of supporting the long tail to
CMake.

If a *project* limits itself to a certain platform, then so be it.
But its build tools certainly shouldn't.  WiX has the double problem
of being, itself, a build tool so should neither be limited to a
certain platform by its own build tools nor limit projects that use
it.

Alex

On 29 April 2012 18:24, Rob Mensching  wrote:
> No, we don't forget that. However, at some point you have to trim your tail
> or you end up with an enormous support burden that prevents you from moving
> forward.
>
> One of the big questions for us in WiX v3.7 is how many versions of VS
> should we support? It is expensive to keep VS2005 and VS2008 working
> because they use the inferior MSBuild 2.0 and MSBuild 3.5. Cutting VS2005
> and VS2008 cuts a big chunk of our tail and would allow us to do more stuff.
>
> In WiX v4.0 I'm pretty sure we support only VS2010 and VS11 (whatever they
> end up calling that).  In WiX v4.0 the big question is do we support
> Windows XP?  VC just dropped support for in in VS11.  I hesitate to cut
> Windows XP support because it is still very popular... but it too is going
> out of support very soon.
>
> These are never easy decisions.
>
> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 3:42 AM, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>
>> 'Out of support' is just a marketing term.  It doesn't mean it
>> magically stops working.  People forget that often.
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> On 29 April 2012 08:06, Rob Mensching  wrote:
>> > NOTE: Win2k was out of support before WiX v3.6 even started development.
>> We
>> > obviously don't test the code there so I really have no idea how much
>> work
>> > it will be to make any of the native code built by WiX (Burn, and
>> > CustomActions mainly) working on Win2k.
>> >
>> > On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Rob Mensching > >wrote:
>> >
>> >> If you vowed never to build WiX again, then it probably is not feasible.
>> >> Burn is in wix\src\burn (burn.build) and as Bob noted if you want
>> wixstdba
>> >> then you'll need to build wix\src\ext\BalExtension\wixsdtba.
>> >>
>> >> Both are in WiX so that will require breaking your vow. 
>> >> On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Alexander Lamaison > >wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> On 28 April 2012 21:18, Bob Arnson  wrote:
>> >>> > On 28-Apr-12 08:08, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>> >>> >> Is there a way round this?  Can I easily compile the bootstrapper
>> >>> >> application myself with VS 2005?
>> >>> > You'd have to do the same thing to all of Burn too.
>> >>>
>> >>> Is this feasible?  I once tried to build WiX and vowed never ever ever
>> >>> again.  Can Burn be built independently of the rest of WiX?
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> Swish - Easy SFTP for Windows Explorer (http://www.swish-sftp.org)
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> --
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>> >>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond.
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>> >>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in
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>> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/wix-users
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> virtually, Rob Mensching - http://RobMensching.com LLC
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
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>> >
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Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-04-29 Thread Alexander Lamaison
'Out of support' is just a marketing term.  It doesn't mean it
magically stops working.  People forget that often.

Alex

On 29 April 2012 08:06, Rob Mensching  wrote:
> NOTE: Win2k was out of support before WiX v3.6 even started development. We
> obviously don't test the code there so I really have no idea how much work
> it will be to make any of the native code built by WiX (Burn, and
> CustomActions mainly) working on Win2k.
>
> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Rob Mensching wrote:
>
>> If you vowed never to build WiX again, then it probably is not feasible.
>> Burn is in wix\src\burn (burn.build) and as Bob noted if you want wixstdba
>> then you'll need to build wix\src\ext\BalExtension\wixsdtba.
>>
>> Both are in WiX so that will require breaking your vow. 
>> On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>>
>>> On 28 April 2012 21:18, Bob Arnson  wrote:
>>> > On 28-Apr-12 08:08, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>>> >> Is there a way round this?  Can I easily compile the bootstrapper
>>> >> application myself with VS 2005?
>>> > You'd have to do the same thing to all of Burn too.
>>>
>>> Is this feasible?  I once tried to build WiX and vowed never ever ever
>>> again.  Can Burn be built independently of the rest of WiX?
>>>
>>> --
>>> Swish - Easy SFTP for Windows Explorer (http://www.swish-sftp.org)
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>>> ___
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>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/wix-users
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> virtually, Rob Mensching - http://RobMensching.com LLC
>>
>
>
>
> --
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Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-04-28 Thread Alexander Lamaison
On 28 April 2012 21:18, Bob Arnson  wrote:
> On 28-Apr-12 08:08, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>> Is there a way round this?  Can I easily compile the bootstrapper
>> application myself with VS 2005?
> You'd have to do the same thing to all of Burn too.

Is this feasible?  I once tried to build WiX and vowed never ever ever
again.  Can Burn be built independently of the rest of WiX?

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Re: [WiX-users] Bootstapper hangs

2012-04-28 Thread Alexander Lamaison
On 28 April 2012 21:18, Bob Arnson  wrote:
> On 28-Apr-12 16:07, Alexander Lamaison wrote:
>> I'm trying to create a custom no-UI bootstrap application by
>> subclassing CBalBaseBootstrapperApplication.  It gets as far as my
>> OnStartup method but then hangs.
>
> What are you doing in OnStartup? How are you calling Detect?

Err ... I wasn't.  I'd been working under the assumption the bootstrap
application just handled UI and the only way it 'instructed' the
engine was by returning ID codes from its methods.

Now I see that WixStdBA calls methods of the engine to drive it.  Is
the required sequence of interactions documented anywhere or do I just
have to pick WixStdBA apart?

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Re: [WiX-users] Bootstapper hangs

2012-04-28 Thread Alexander Lamaison
Also, the boostrapper .exe seems to spawn another instance of itself
and it is that instance that is waiting on NtReadFile.  Why would it
do this?

On 28 April 2012 21:07, Alexander Lamaison  wrote:
> I'm trying to create a custom no-UI bootstrap application by
> subclassing CBalBaseBootstrapperApplication.  It gets as far as my
> OnStartup method but then hangs.  According to the debugger it's
> waiting on NtReadFile but I'm not sure how reliable that is.
>
> This is the (very short) log file I get:
>
> [0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Burn v3.6.2803.0, Windows v6.1
> (Build 7601: Service Pack 1), path:
> C:\Users\awl03\Projects\swish\bin\Debug\swish-0.6.0.exe, cmdline:
> '-burn.unelevated BurnPipe.{2F11948A-9E0C-4CB6-B1F2-2D0BD2829C23}
> {1860FB45-3024-4AC3-AC64-7DDF6429C40B} 5092'
> [0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Setting string variable
> 'WixBundleLog' to value
> 'C:\Users\awl03\AppData\Local\Temp\Swish_20120428205957.log'
> [0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Setting string variable
> 'WixBundleOriginalSource' to value
> 'C:\Users\awl03\Projects\swish\bin\Debug\swish-0.6.0.exe'
> [0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:58]: Setting string variable
> 'WixBundleName' to value 'Swish'
>
> This is using the VS 2005 includes from the SDK.  Are they actively 
> maintained?
>
> Can someone shed some light on what is happening here?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Alex
>
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[WiX-users] Bootstapper hangs

2012-04-28 Thread Alexander Lamaison
I'm trying to create a custom no-UI bootstrap application by
subclassing CBalBaseBootstrapperApplication.  It gets as far as my
OnStartup method but then hangs.  According to the debugger it's
waiting on NtReadFile but I'm not sure how reliable that is.

This is the (very short) log file I get:

[0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Burn v3.6.2803.0, Windows v6.1
(Build 7601: Service Pack 1), path:
C:\Users\awl03\Projects\swish\bin\Debug\swish-0.6.0.exe, cmdline:
'-burn.unelevated BurnPipe.{2F11948A-9E0C-4CB6-B1F2-2D0BD2829C23}
{1860FB45-3024-4AC3-AC64-7DDF6429C40B} 5092'
[0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Setting string variable
'WixBundleLog' to value
'C:\Users\awl03\AppData\Local\Temp\Swish_20120428205957.log'
[0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:57]: Setting string variable
'WixBundleOriginalSource' to value
'C:\Users\awl03\Projects\swish\bin\Debug\swish-0.6.0.exe'
[0E00:12AC][2012-04-28T20:59:58]: Setting string variable
'WixBundleName' to value 'Swish'

This is using the VS 2005 includes from the SDK.  Are they actively maintained?

Can someone shed some light on what is happening here?

Thanks.

Alex

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Re: [WiX-users] Bundle fails on WIN2K machine ".exe is not a valid Win32 application"

2012-04-28 Thread Alexander Lamaison
That's just stopped me in my tracks.  I've been converting our
dotnetinstaller bootstrapper to use Burn but had no idea that would
kill our Win2k support.   Seriously not good.

Is there a way round this?  Can I easily compile the bootstrapper
application myself with VS 2005?

Thanks,

Alex

On 28 April 2012 05:05, Rob Mensching  wrote:
> No. Windows 2000 is not supported by the VS 2010 CRT. Windows XP (I think
> SP1+).
>
> On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Rich Dingle  wrote:
>
>> Is the WiX Standard Bootstrapper Application compatible with Windows 2000?
>> My individual MSI packages all work fine but all my bundles fail
>> immediately even if I save them to a local folder: "[bundleName].exe  is
>> not a valid Win32 application".
>>
>> Target Machine:
>> Win2K Pro SP4 w/KB891861 'roll up'
>> MSIEXEC.EXE v3.1.4000.1823
>>
>> Build Machine:
>> WiX 3.6.2823
>>  VS 2010
>>
>>
>> Rich Dingle
>>
>> Accelitec, Inc.
>> 2211 Rimland Drive, Suite 230
>> Bellingham, WA 98226
>>
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>
>
>
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[WiX-users] Single Add/Remove icon

2012-01-31 Thread Alexander Lamaison
My burn bootstrapper/bundle/thingiemagig is just a wrapper around my
MSI installer; it chooses between an x86 and an x64 version but will
only ever install one.  So I just want one entry for my program in
Add/Remove programs.

I seem to have achieved this by removing the Name attribute from the
Bundle tag but is this the right way?  It seems a bit odd.

Thanks,

Alex

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Re: [WiX-users] Burn without UI

2012-01-31 Thread Alexander Lamaison
On 31 January 2012 15:07, jhennessey  wrote:
> Looks like you need to write your own BA:
> http://windows-installer-xml-wix-toolset.687559.n2.nabble.com/Burn-bootstrap-a-single-MSI-not-showing-BA-UI-at-all-td6926187.html

Is this hard to do?  Can it be done in C++ or must I use .net?  Can
you point me to something to get me started (I've searched online and
in the source but can't find anything)?

Thanks,

Alex

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[WiX-users] Burn without UI

2012-01-31 Thread Alexander Lamaison
Is it possible to have a bootstrapper made with burn that doesn't show any UI?

All I want my bootstrapper to do is decide what platform it's running
on (x86 or x64), extract the appropriate MSI installer from within
itself and run it.  At the moment, the Burn UI takes over.  Is there a
no-UI option?

Thanks,

Alex

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