Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
Sure I agree with you also, that is just a head ache. but if your txt is scalable proportionally as a complete block without any width restriction and the surrounding content division also scales proportionally like in elastic layouts i think this works great! If the initial design width at 100% is made viewable without scroll bars for a browser set to 800px or equivalent on say a 17" screen, as most people are viewing with a higher resolution say 1024x768 on the same screen there is plenty of room for proportional scaling without introducing that awful side scroll bar! unless of cause the persons site is so bad that they are scaling to a size that no design with ever be able to cope with! >From: "Joseph Ortenzi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>I agree with Rick here. >> >> Having to scroll horizontally is not only an accessibility issue but a >> serious design issue. I challenge AI to find proof people don't mind this >> as all my research and experience says otherwise. > >Hi Joseph, > >I have no incentive to do formal research as I don't work as a usability >consultant. As I stated in another post to this thread, an important >criteria is the target audience. > >-- >Al Sparber - PVII >http://www.projectseven.com >Fully Automated Menu Systems | Galleries | Widgets >http://www.projectseven.com/go/Elevators > > > > >*** >List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm >Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm >Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >*** > -- Barry Wardrop redRoute Creative t: +44 01502506832 w: www.redroutecreative.co.uk e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Hi,
Hi, How are u doing these days?Yesterday I found a web of a large trading company from china,which is an agent of all the well-known digital product factories,and facing to both wholesalers,retailsalers,and personal customer all over the world. They export all kinds of digital products and offer most competitive and reasonable price and high quality goods for our clients,so i think we you make a big profit if we do business with them.And they promise they will provide the best after-sales-service.In my opinion we can make a trial order to test that. Look forward to your early reply! The Web address:http://www.mwhdy.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
From: "Joseph Ortenzi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I agree with Rick here. Having to scroll horizontally is not only an accessibility issue but a serious design issue. I challenge AI to find proof people don't mind this as all my research and experience says otherwise. Hi Joseph, I have no incentive to do formal research as I don't work as a usability consultant. As I stated in another post to this thread, an important criteria is the target audience. -- Al Sparber - PVII http://www.projectseven.com Fully Automated Menu Systems | Galleries | Widgets http://www.projectseven.com/go/Elevators *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
From: "Rick Lecoat" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On 3 Jul 2008, at 22:16, Al Sparber wrote: When a block of text exceeds the viewport width, that means horizontal scrolling for *each line* - a royal PITA. I kid of think you are speaking for yourself ;-) Well, he's speaking for me as well. Al, do you really *not* find having to continuously scroll back and forth horizontally (because the width of the text block is wider than the viewport) to be an annoyance? Hi Rick, If a single or main text block is wider than my window, then that is a problem. Far more typical is that one or more sidebar or ancillary columns go off screen. In that case, I use my keyboard's arrow/navigation keys or make my window wider. It doesn't really annoy me though. I tend to get annoyed at other things ;-) -- Al Sparber - PVII http://www.projectseven.com Fully Automated Menu Systems | Galleries | Widgets http://www.projectseven.com/go/Elevators *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
See if this helps: http://www.eatons.net/sandbox/Greenwich.html On Jul 3, 2008, at 11:58 PM, Hayden's Harness Attachment wrote: Talking about zooming. I am trying to use PHP to create a web page that has a default font size (layout_medium.css). As it stands, I have broken everything since I am so new to PHP. There are two ways to use PHP in your page: 1/ As an "include" file: NOTE: the first part of the above comment should look like this:
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
On 3 Jul 2008, at 23:01, Felix Miata wrote: When you measure the whole design in characters, or fractions thereof, resolution does not matter. [...snip...] When a design is _properly_ made using character measurements, users don't need to zoom. Hi Felix; Assuming that I'm not misunderstanding you, then I'm not sure I agree. What you are describing sounds like an em-based design, and if the width of your design is specified in ems then it will still have a defined width -- it's just that the on-screen width is defined by the combination of the default text size [1] and the user's monitor setup. Assuming the user doesn't change the latter, then changes to text size *will* change the on-screen width of the design since that measurement is proportionally tied to the text size. And if the resultant on-screen width of the design exceeds the viewport size then you get our friend the horizontal scrollbar. However, you're already on-record as being extremely well versed in the intricacies of text size vs monitor resolutions, which makes me think that I might have misunderstood what you meant by "[measuring] the whole design in characters". I have assumed that you are referring to an elastic design; if not then please set me straight. Best regards; -- Rick Lecoat www.sharkattack.co.uk [1] irrespective of whether that's set by the designer or the user *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
At the end of the day, this whole question is a no-brainer: On the one hand you can annoy [a few .. most] people by forcing them to scroll horizontally, Or you can keep everyone happy by not allowing a horizontal scroll bar. Whether it is a major issue or a trivial issue is irrelevant as there is no compromise required: I absolutely guarantee that no genuine usability trial is ever going to find someone complaining that the site _doesn't_ expand beyond the view port! Mike >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Lecoat >Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 11:27 AM >To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org >Subject: Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming > >On 3 Jul 2008, at 22:16, Al Sparber wrote: > >>> When a block of text exceeds the viewport width, that means >>> horizontal scrolling for *each line* - a royal PITA. >> >> I kid of think you are speaking for yourself ;-) > >Well, he's speaking for me as well. >Al, do you really *not* find having to continuously scroll >back and forth horizontally (because the width of the text >block is wider than the viewport) to be an annoyance? > >If so then okay, but I do not believe that you are typical in >this regard. >-- >Rick Lecoat >www.sharkattack.co.uk > *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
I agree with Rick here. Having to scroll horizontally is not only an accessibility issue but a serious design issue. I challenge AI to find proof people don't mind this as all my research and experience says otherwise. Joe On Jul 04, 2008, at 11:27, Rick Lecoat wrote: On 3 Jul 2008, at 22:16, Al Sparber wrote: When a block of text exceeds the viewport width, that means horizontal scrolling for *each line* - a royal PITA. I kid of think you are speaking for yourself ;-) Well, he's speaking for me as well. Al, do you really *not* find having to continuously scroll back and forth horizontally (because the width of the text block is wider than the viewport) to be an annoyance? If so then okay, but I do not believe that you are typical in this regard. -- Rick Lecoat www.sharkattack.co.uk *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** == Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.typingthevoid.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
On 3 Jul 2008, at 22:16, Al Sparber wrote: >> When a block of text exceeds the viewport width, that means >> horizontal scrolling for *each line* - a royal PITA. > > I kid of think you are speaking for yourself ;-) Rick Lecoat replied: > Well, he's speaking for me as well. Me too. I find that incredibly annoying, and it seems to happen in Bloglines a lot. Long lines are difficult enough to read without having to scroll. Chris This message has been scanned for malware by SurfControl plc. www.surfcontrol.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browsers and Zooming
On 3 Jul 2008, at 22:16, Al Sparber wrote: When a block of text exceeds the viewport width, that means horizontal scrolling for *each line* - a royal PITA. I kid of think you are speaking for yourself ;-) Well, he's speaking for me as well. Al, do you really *not* find having to continuously scroll back and forth horizontally (because the width of the text block is wider than the viewport) to be an annoyance? If so then okay, but I do not believe that you are typical in this regard. -- Rick Lecoat www.sharkattack.co.uk *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
