Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[David Dorward]

James Farrell wrote:
> Is it necessary to put titles on links for the purpose of accessibility?
> 

No.

It can be helpful to clarify the link destination...

Webpages are generally written in http://w3.org/TR/html4/";
title="The latest HTML 4 Specification">HTML.

... but usually isn't needed for accessibility.

-- 
David Dorward
http://dorward.me.uk/



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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[James Farrell]

Hi Guys,

Is it necessary to put titles on links for the purpose of accessibility?


James

2008/10/21 Dave Lane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> Hello Susan,
>
> If you're doing a lot of Drupal development, and you don't already have
> it, I strongly recommend getting a copy of "Pro Drupal Development" by
> John K. VanDyk - the 6.x version of the book is ISBN: 978-1-4302-0989-8
> - there's also a previous version focusing on 5.x which is equally
> indespensible for learning the "drupal way" of doing things.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave
>
> Susan Grossman wrote:
> >
> >
> > Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML
> 1.0
> > strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> > Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> > various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> > pliable with regard to those changes.
> >
> > Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> > definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> > learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> > both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> > world).
> >
> >
> > ... 
> >
> >
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
> > modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.
> >
> > Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have
> > to do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all
> > modules seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more
> > research and see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done
> > anything in multi-site mode.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Susan R. Grossman
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> >
> > ***
> > List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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>
> --
> Dave Lane = Egressive Ltd = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = m: +64 21 229 8147
> p: +64 3 9633733 = Linux: it just tastes better = nosoftwarepatents
> http://egressive.com  we only use open standards: http://w3.org
> Effusion Group Founding Member === http://effusiongroup.com
>
>
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>


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Dave Lane]

Hello Susan,

If you're doing a lot of Drupal development, and you don't already have
it, I strongly recommend getting a copy of "Pro Drupal Development" by
John K. VanDyk - the 6.x version of the book is ISBN: 978-1-4302-0989-8
- there's also a previous version focusing on 5.x which is equally
indespensible for learning the "drupal way" of doing things.

Cheers,

Dave

Susan Grossman wrote:
> 
> 
> Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
> strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> pliable with regard to those changes.
> 
> Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> world). 
> 
> 
> ... 
> 
>  
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
> modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.
> 
> Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have
> to do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all
> modules seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more
> research and see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done
> anything in multi-site mode. 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Susan R. Grossman
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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-- 
Dave Lane = Egressive Ltd = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = m: +64 21 229 8147
p: +64 3 9633733 = Linux: it just tastes better = nosoftwarepatents
http://egressive.com  we only use open standards: http://w3.org
Effusion Group Founding Member === http://effusiongroup.com


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Susan Grossman]

>
>
>
> Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
> strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> pliable with regard to those changes.
>
> Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> world).


... 



> Kind regards,
>
> Dave



Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.

Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have to
do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all modules
seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more research and
see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done anything in multi-site
mode.


-- 
Susan R. Grossman
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Dave Lane]

Hi Susan,

Yes, some very useful modules are written by people sometimes don't have
a full appreciation of how they can take advantage of Drupal's
capabilities - and fair enough too (I'm sure we did that too, when we
started, and probably still do from time to time)...

Ideally, if you have to tweak a module to make it standards compliant,
etc. then you can create a "diff" (i.e. a patch - instructions on
drupal.org) of the module changes and submit it to the module maintainer
for consideration.  If the Drupal community deems the improvement
valuable, there's little reason to think it won't be wrapped into the
next release.  That way, you don't have to maintain the code yourself,
and you won't have problems with upgrades.

It's cool how open source works.

Cheers,

Dave

Susan Grossman wrote:
> 
> 
> Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
> strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> pliable with regard to those changes.
> 
> Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> world). 
> 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
> modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.
> 
> Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have
> to do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all
> modules seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more
> research and see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done
> anything in multi-site mode. 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Susan R. Grossman
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***

-- 
Dave Lane = Egressive Ltd = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = m: +64 21 229 8147
p: +64 3 9633733 = Linux: it just tastes better = nosoftwarepatents
http://egressive.com  we only use open standards: http://w3.org
Effusion Group Founding Member === http://effusiongroup.com


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Dave Lane]

Hi Susan,

Yes, some very useful modules are written by people sometimes don't have
a full appreciation of how they can take advantage of Drupal's
capabilities - and fair enough too (I'm sure we did that too, when we
started, and probably still do from time to time)...

Ideally, if you have to tweak a module to make it standards compliant,
etc. then you can create a "diff" (i.e. a patch - instructions on
drupal.org) of the module changes and submit it to the module maintainer
for consideration.  If the Drupal community deems the improvement
valuable, there's little reason to think it won't be wrapped into the
next release.  That way, you don't have to maintain the code yourself,
and you won't have problems with upgrades.

It's cool how open source works.

Cheers,

Dave

Susan Grossman wrote:
> 
> 
> Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
> strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> pliable with regard to those changes.
> 
> Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> world). 
> 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
> modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.
> 
> Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have
> to do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all
> modules seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more
> research and see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done
> anything in multi-site mode. 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Susan R. Grossman
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***

-- 
Dave Lane = Egressive Ltd = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = m: +64 21 229 8147
p: +64 3 9633733 = Linux: it just tastes better = nosoftwarepatents
http://egressive.com  we only use open standards: http://w3.org
Effusion Group Founding Member === http://effusiongroup.com


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Susan Grossman]

>
>
>
> Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
> strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
> Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
> various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
> pliable with regard to those changes.
>
> Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
> definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
> learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
> both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
> world).


 



> Kind regards,
>
> Dave



Thanks Dave for the input on hooks, which I have used in a few of the
modules and they're real effective and I should've mentioned them.

Unfortunately some of the modules I'm trying to use I find I still have to
do some changing to.  I guess it's my lack of knowledge, but not all modules
seem to be equal to me.  I'll take your suggestion and do more research and
see how I can avoid this entirely, and I haven't done anything in multi-site
mode.


-- 
Susan R. Grossman
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Dave Lane]

To Susan and Jim,

Our core business is building sites with Drupal.  We focus on XHTML 1.0
strict compliance and are striving towards full adherence of the New
Zealand e-government web guidelines which cover accessibility, and
various other considerations.  We've found Drupal to be remarkably
pliable with regard to those changes.

Susan, the approach of altering modules that you described will
definitely cause you maintenance headaches.  I would encourage you to
learn as much as possible about Drupal's very sophisticated system of
both theme and functionality overrides (called "hooks" in the Drupal
world).

By judicious use of theme and module overrides and by building sites in
"multi-site" mode, you can achieve any sort of markup and form
alterations while simultaneously completely avoiding changes to Drupal
core code or 3rd party modules you might employ.  That makes future
updates of core and modules much much less painful.

Drupal also makes it easy to replace any interface text, either with
Drupal's full-blown internationalisation framework, or by using the
string replacement functionality introduced with Drupal 6.x (see your
settings.php file).

We (Egressive) actually chose Drupal as our core platform because of
it's community's surprisingly high awareness of web standards, and
because of the degree to which Drupal - by design - allows us to tweak
markup and user interface elements to comply with our preferred
standards.  It's an incredibly powerful, versatile system.

Hope that helps you.

Kind regards,

Dave

James O'Neill wrote:
> Susan,
> 
> That give me an idea. I am just starting to learn PHP and Drupal so
> making changes on my own will be fun. I am looking forward to tacking some.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Jim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am currently working on a large Drupal project using lots of
> modules.   I have created my own Theme that is 508 compliant (and
> semantic) that I use to start with - headers, footers, content area
> titles, main site navigation  that is based off the Garland theme.
>No problem there.
> 
> Each module though that I work with I asses the code and then make
> modifications to the base files if necessary to be compliant, and
> most times it is necessary, though sometimes its only a couple of
> little things.   It's not hard to do, but later upgrades are going
> to be a b---  so I document every change hopefully to make it easier
> later on.
> 
> It also depends on what "Ajax" functionality you choose to use, or
> not use.  The more you use, the less compliant it becomes.
> 
> This is all so simplistic, don't know if any of it will help you.
> 
> -- 
> Susan R. Grossman
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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-- 
Dave Lane = Egressive Ltd = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = m: +64 21 229 8147
p: +64 3 9633733 = Linux: it just tastes better = nosoftwarepatents
http://egressive.com  we only use open standards: http://w3.org
Effusion Group Founding Member === http://effusiongroup.com


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[James O'Neill]

Susan,
That give me an idea. I am just starting to learn PHP and Drupal so making
changes on my own will be fun. I am looking forward to tacking some.

Thanks,

Jim




I am currently working on a large Drupal project using lots of modules.   I
> have created my own Theme that is 508 compliant (and semantic) that I use to
> start with - headers, footers, content area titles, main site navigation
> that is based off the Garland theme.No problem there.
>
> Each module though that I work with I asses the code and then make
> modifications to the base files if necessary to be compliant, and most times
> it is necessary, though sometimes its only a couple of little things.   It's
> not hard to do, but later upgrades are going to be a b---  so I document
> every change hopefully to make it easier later on.
>
> It also depends on what "Ajax" functionality you choose to use, or not
> use.  The more you use, the less compliant it becomes.
>
> This is all so simplistic, don't know if any of it will help you.
>
> --
> Susan R. Grossman
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>


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Re: [WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[Susan Grossman]

>
> I am in the process of working with a developer on a Drupal project and I
> was wondering if there was any Standards Compliant and/or Semantically
> Correct widgets for Drupal out there... specifically for dropdown navigation
> (which is a primary concern of mine) or other things...
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
I am currently working on a large Drupal project using lots of modules.   I
have created my own Theme that is 508 compliant (and semantic) that I use to
start with - headers, footers, content area titles, main site navigation
that is based off the Garland theme.No problem there.

Each module though that I work with I asses the code and then make
modifications to the base files if necessary to be compliant, and most times
it is necessary, though sometimes its only a couple of little things.   It's
not hard to do, but later upgrades are going to be a b---  so I document
every change hopefully to make it easier later on.

It also depends on what "Ajax" functionality you choose to use, or not use.
The more you use, the less compliant it becomes.

This is all so simplistic, don't know if any of it will help you.

-- 
Susan R. Grossman
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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[WSG] Drupal - Standards Compliant and Crossbrowser Dropdown Navigation Widget?

[James O'Neill]

Greetings all,

I am in the process of working with a developer on a Drupal project and I
was wondering if there was any Standards Compliant and/or Semantically
Correct widgets for Drupal out there... specifically for dropdown navigation
(which is a primary concern of mine) or other things...

I am a bit paranoid about general widget code quality since Web Standards
developers are the exception, so I am assume that so are the the people that
make OS CMS widgets. Perhaps the fact that we are working with OSS that the
code quality will be better. A bit naive perhaps, but there you go.


Thanks,

Jim


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