[Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Hi All, I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is just incidental. Thanks Raghu ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
RE: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Bret sums it up nicely here: http://www.io.com/~wazmo/blog/archives/2004_08.html#000221 Bret will be able to explain things better than I can. Bret Pettichord and Brian Marick are really responsible for bringing Ruby into the forefront in the testing community. If it weren't for them, I probably wouldn't have tried Ruby. >From my point of view, Ruby has a nice object model, and is a language that non-programmers seem to find intuitive to learn. That makes it ideal for teaching testers programming basics. For example, my wife is a non-programmer and finds Ruby's looping constructs make sense. She looks at the C-style "for" loop and says it looks like a complication of a simple concept. Perl looks like gibberish to her compared to using objects and messages in Ruby. Perl, Python and Ruby are all powerful languages with strengths and weaknesses. At the end of the day, it probably boils down to personal preference and what your goals are with a language. My goal with Ruby is to script what I can to help me in computer-assisted testing. Ruby fits that need. I also enjoy teaching programming basics to testers using Ruby. It works well, and I can express ideas in Ruby in a way that is intuitive for me. Non-programming testers seem to respond to the language when learning, and I enjoy seeing eyes light up when a tester discovers something new and expresses it with a programming language. -Jonathan > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wtr-general- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Raghu Venkataramana > Sent: July 31, 2005 11:26 AM > To: wtr-general@rubyforge.org > Subject: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby? > > Hi All, > > I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. > In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses > Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting > languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is > just incidental. > > Thanks > Raghu > ___ > Wtr-general mailing list > Wtr-general@rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Perl encourages cryptic code, which makes it a bad choice. It also lacks an interactive shell. Python could work. Ruby was Brian Marick's choice and he was convinced to switch from Python to Ruby when he sat with Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt on a bus. At 12:26 PM 7/31/2005, Raghu Venkataramana wrote: Hi All, I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is just incidental. Thanks Raghu ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general _ Bret Pettichord www.pettichord.com ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Bret Pettichord wrote: Python could work. Ruby was Brian Marick's choice and he was convinced to switch from Python to Ruby when he sat with Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt on a bus. Oh! Being a devote Ruby hacker, I don't even want to imagine the possibilities of that bus ride not happening... :) Seriously though, the Python vs Ruby theme is rehashed once in a while on ruby-talk and in other forums. The general consensus seems that qualities of both languages are quite similar to each other, and a choice between the two is a subjective choice more than anything else. In other words, there are many enough people who strongly prefer Ruby over Python (and vice versa), but they have a hard time try to explain the reason. :) See also: http://bluebones.net/news/default.asp?action=view_story&story_id=81 Best regards, Alexey Verkhovsky ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Bret, Jonathan: Thanks for these notes. I personally like Ruby's object oriented approach. The only 'flip' I found about ruby that I find is the relatively scarce resources / documentation when compared to Python. Almost all searches point to a different version of the 'pragmatic programmer'. Are there other online resources that you guys could point me to? For example, when trying to do something with the Win32 API callbacks, I couldn't find much help. Thanks Raghu Bret Pettichord wrote: Perl encourages cryptic code, which makes it a bad choice. It also lacks an interactive shell. Python could work. Ruby was Brian Marick's choice and he was convinced to switch from Python to Ruby when he sat with Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt on a bus. At 12:26 PM 7/31/2005, Raghu Venkataramana wrote: Hi All, I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is just incidental. Thanks Raghu ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general _ Bret Pettichord www.pettichord.com ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
RE: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
My 2 cents...for whatever it is worth. I started using Python's PAMIE framework to automate. However, the support was sporadic (the guy working on it was very busy and couldn't devote enough time to support the framework). Eventually I ran into a roadblock with popups (ironic given the volume of messages on this subject)--the framework had not evolved enough to support this activity yet. I also looked at SAMIE (way too cryptic), IEUnit (same roadblock as PAMIE) as well as a bout 15 other frameworks all boasting to have what I needed at a price. Enter Ruby. WATIR is by far the most complete web testing framework out here--that doesn't cost an arm and a leg. And this forum is the most active and well supported that I have seen. You can post a question and is just a short period of time get someone (most of the time the architects of the framework!) who will steer you in the right direct, give you a work around to get over any roadblocks, or add it to the framework if it doesn't currently exist. That is the reason I switched and tell everyone interest (and those not) that Ruby is the way to go! Save your money, get WATIR! --Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Raghu Venkataramana Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 8:28 PM To: wtr-general@rubyforge.org Subject: Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby? Bret, Jonathan: Thanks for these notes. I personally like Ruby's object oriented approach. The only 'flip' I found about ruby that I find is the relatively scarce resources / documentation when compared to Python. Almost all searches point to a different version of the 'pragmatic programmer'. Are there other online resources that you guys could point me to? For example, when trying to do something with the Win32 API callbacks, I couldn't find much help. Thanks Raghu Bret Pettichord wrote: > Perl encourages cryptic code, which makes it a bad choice. It also > lacks an interactive shell. > > Python could work. Ruby was Brian Marick's choice and he was convinced > to switch from Python to Ruby when he sat with Dave Thomas and Andy > Hunt on a bus. > > At 12:26 PM 7/31/2005, Raghu Venkataramana wrote: > >> Hi All, >> >> I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. >> In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses >> Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting >> languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is >> just incidental. >> >> Thanks >> Raghu >> ___ >> Wtr-general mailing list >> Wtr-general@rubyforge.org >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general > > > _ > Bret Pettichord > www.pettichord.com > > ___ > Wtr-general mailing list > Wtr-general@rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general > ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Raghu Venkataramana wrote: Are there other online resources that you guys could point me to? For example, when trying to do something with the Win32 API callbacks, I couldn't find much help. Not a specific answer, but the Ruby list (comp.lang.ruby mirrored on the main Ruby mailing list, which you can get subscribe info from www.ruby-lang.org) is a great place to get help of any sort. Usually very responsive and informative. It's where I go if a quick Google doesn't turn up much. -- Chris http://clabs.org/blogki ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
RE: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby?
Title: Message NB: This email and its contents are subject to our email legal noticewhich can be viewed at http://www.sars.gov.za/Email_Disclaimer.pdf I have a similar story. I was fortunate enough to be able to use Robot, SAMIE and WATiR on the same project. A few months down the line and the scripts that run everyday are...WATiR ! Michael Kelly's article really got me using Ruby. SAMIE is also very good, and the best about it is that Perl already has very mature supprt for DBI and it has Win32::GUITest. I still use Perl for all the database stuff. Ruby's DBI is not there yet. But I would like to use WATiR and Ruby more and more in the future. Unfortunately Ruby is as cryptic to me as Perl is to most people. I have looked at PAMIE too, as I am doing a series of tool reviews for the TestFOCUS magazine. krgds Walter -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 01 August 2005 04:31To: wtr-general@rubyforge.orgSubject: RE: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby? My 2 cents...for whatever it is worth. I started using Python's PAMIE framework to automate. However, the support was sporadic (the guy working on it was very busy and couldn't devote enough time to support the framework). Eventually I ran into a roadblock with popups (ironic given the volume of messages on this subject)--the framework had not evolved enough to support this activity yet. I also looked at SAMIE (way too cryptic), IEUnit (same roadblock as PAMIE) as well as a bout 15 other frameworks all boasting to have what I needed at a price. Enter Ruby. WATIR is by far the most complete web testing framework out here--that doesn't cost an arm and a leg. And this forum is the most active and well supported that I have seen. You can post a question and is just a short period of time get someone (most of the time the architects of the framework!) who will steer you in the right direct, give you a work around to get over any roadblocks, or add it to the framework if it doesn't currently exist. That is the reason I switched and tell everyone interest (and those not) that Ruby is the way to go! Save your money, get WATIR! --Mark -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Raghu VenkataramanaSent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 8:28 PMTo: wtr-general@rubyforge.orgSubject: Re: [Wtr-general] Question - Why ruby? Bret, Jonathan: Thanks for these notes. I personally like Ruby's object oriented approach. The only 'flip' I found about ruby that I find is the relatively scarce resources / documentation when compared to Python. Almost all searches point to a different version of the 'pragmatic programmer'. Are there other online resources that you guys could point me to? For example, when trying to do something with the Win32 API callbacks, I couldn't find much help. Thanks Raghu Bret Pettichord wrote: > Perl encourages cryptic code, which makes it a bad choice. It also > lacks an interactive shell. > > Python could work. Ruby was Brian Marick's choice and he was convinced > to switch from Python to Ruby when he sat with Dave Thomas and Andy > Hunt on a bus. > > At 12:26 PM 7/31/2005, Raghu Venkataramana wrote: > >> Hi All, >> >> I was explaining to my friend about Watir and its nice capabilities. >> In the middle of the conversation he asked me as to why Watir uses >> Ruby, which is not as well known as Perl, Python or other scripting >> languages. Is there a special reason why Ruby is being used or is >> just incidental. >> >> Thanks >> Raghu >> ___ >> Wtr-general mailing list >> Wtr-general@rubyforge.org >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general > > > _ > Bret Pettichord > www.pettichord.com > > ___ > Wtr-general mailing list > Wtr-general@rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general > ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general ___ Wtr-general mailing list Wtr-general@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-general
