Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On 16 January 2016 at 23:18, Ken Taylor wrote: > On 01/16/2016 01:31 PM, Boudhayan Gupta wrote: >> >> Hi Ken and all, >> >>> I appreciate all of the input folks are providing. However, I asked the >>> simple question if separate X screens could be configured on Intel >>> integrated graphics. The discussion seems to have degenerated into "you >>> don't want to do" what I wish to do and "you should try something else." The usual pattern is that people ask about multiple screens but do not really want them. Having multiple screens only limits what you can do and gives you no meaningful benefits. >> >> There are legitimate use cases for this. I suspect Ken wants to do >> something like running a completely different X session on a second >> monitor. >> >> What you're looking for is Zaphod mode. There *is* a configuration >> option for this, but I have no idea whether the code paths are bug >> free or even implemented. >> >> An example for using Zaphod mode with nouveau is here at >> http://nouveau.freedesktop.org/wiki/MultiMonitorDesktop/. The same >> configuration tweaked for the intel driver should work. >> >> -- Boudhayan >> > I took the example xorg.conf in the link you provided and made these > changes: > > Changed Driver to "intel" from "nouveau" > Changed the BusID to "PCI:0:2.0" as obtained from lspci > Set the actual connectors: >Option "ZaphodHeads" "DP-1" >Option "ZaphodHeads" "HDMI-A-1" > You should probably check with xrandr what outputs you have. The output names vary between different drivers. Also you should look at the /var/log/Xorg.0.log for full X server output. HTH Michal ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On Sunday, January 17, 2016 08:10:38 AM you wrote: > The usual pattern is that people ask about multiple screens but do not > really want them. Having multiple screens only limits what you can do > and gives you no meaningful benefits. On my previous system (which I used for about 5 years) I used multiple screens (driven by an NVidia card) to great benefit. My current system (started using about 6 months ago) has a 32" monitor so I no longer feel the need for multiple screens. On some of the industrial (process control) systems I've been responsible for, we put up to 4 monitors (with different displays) driven by one computer in front of a single operator. I have to admit that the Linux / X window (and successor) terminology confurses me--when I say multiple screens, I mean multiple monitors driven by a single PC and different content on each, and, ideally (but not always the case) the ability to move content between displays and copy and paste to and from each. To say that nobody can get any meaningful benefits from multiple screens (or from anything else) implies a degree of omniscience (sp?) that I'm not sure you have. I probably should have written this and filed it in my drafts folder, but sometimes I don't do what is best for myself. ;-) ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On 01/17/2016 10:05 AM, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, January 17, 2016 08:10:38 AM you wrote: The usual pattern is that people ask about multiple screens but do not really want them. Having multiple screens only limits what you can do and gives you no meaningful benefits. On my previous system (which I used for about 5 years) I used multiple screens (driven by an NVidia card) to great benefit. My current system (started using about 6 months ago) has a 32" monitor so I no longer feel the need for multiple screens. On some of the industrial (process control) systems I've been responsible for, we put up to 4 monitors (with different displays) driven by one computer in front of a single operator. I have to admit that the Linux / X window (and successor) terminology confurses me--when I say multiple screens, I mean multiple monitors driven by a single PC and different content on each, and, ideally (but not always the case) the ability to move content between displays and copy and paste to and from each. To say that nobody can get any meaningful benefits from multiple screens (or from anything else) implies a degree of omniscience (sp?) that I'm not sure you have. I probably should have written this and filed it in my drafts folder, but sometimes I don't do what is best for myself. ;-) ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg Thanks rhkramer, I appreciate the vote of confidence. Perhaps "separate X screens" is something which only a small percentage of user are multi-tasking enough to take advantage of. However, I am one of them. I do appreciate assistance and suggestions from other users as to how to accomplish what I am working on. I do not necessarily appreciate being told I do not want to do what I want to do. As to a HUGE monitor... I had thought about that. I could run 4 virtual machines each taking up 1/4 of the display. But I just purchases two nice Dell 24" Ultrasharp 19:10 aspect ratio monitors. The left one is vertical and the right one horizontal. The vertical one is usually divided in half - Thunderbird on the top half and a virtual machine connected to my secure email at protonmail.ch on the bottom. I call up Firefox when I need it over top of the two or I may switch to another workspace first. On the right monitor I often have several things going on 3 or 4 workspaces. Ken ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On Fri, 2016-01-15 at 17:46 -0500, Ken Taylor wrote: > Separate X screens gives me EXACTLY what I am after. That is why I > asked the question. Please see this page: > http://jsmylinux.no-ip.org/basic-information/dual-monitors/ and have > a > look towards the bottom titled "Individual Panels". It seems to me a reasonable thing to want. I used to use a similar setup years ago on Sun hardware. But as far as I can tell the driver for the Intel integrated graphics doesn't support multiple X screens in that way. The NVidia driver does, but (of course) only for an NVidia graphics card. On the other hand, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XineramaHowTo has a configuration using xinerama and an intel card, so it may depend on the exact card you have (and I think in that case they're trying to get to a single desktop with multiple monitors, but disabling xinerama mode may get you closer to what you want). It might be easier to buy an NVidia or ATI graphics card (after checking for support)... which is even possible on some laptops. Liam -- Liam R. E. Quin Words and Pictures from Old Books - http://www.fromoldbooks.org/ ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On 01/17/2016 06:25 PM, Liam R. E. Quin wrote: On Fri, 2016-01-15 at 17:46 -0500, Ken Taylor wrote: Separate X screens gives me EXACTLY what I am after. That is why I asked the question. Please see this page: http://jsmylinux.no-ip.org/basic-information/dual-monitors/ and have a look towards the bottom titled "Individual Panels". It seems to me a reasonable thing to want. I used to use a similar setup years ago on Sun hardware. But as far as I can tell the driver for the Intel integrated graphics doesn't support multiple X screens in that way. The NVidia driver does, but (of course) only for an NVidia graphics card. On the other hand, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XineramaHowTo has a configuration using xinerama and an intel card, so it may depend on the exact card you have (and I think in that case they're trying to get to a single desktop with multiple monitors, but disabling xinerama mode may get you closer to what you want). It might be easier to buy an NVidia or ATI graphics card (after checking for support)... which is even possible on some laptops. Liam Thanks Liam, I will see what I can determine from the link you provided. From what I have read about Xinerama it is intended to put multiple screens back together - for example if they are on two discrete video cards - not to break one card into two screens. Still, there is an Intel specific xorg.conf example which I will study. As to purchasing a discrete card... I would certainly do that for a "real" PC or workstation. In fact I just replaced the obsolete Nvidia card which came in my Dell Studio XPS 8000 with a Quadro K420. It runs two 24" monitors separately just fine. The Inspiron 3050s are tiny toys - sort of like the Intel NUC. No room for ANY expansion. However, as they have two monitor connections... sort of a challenge. And considering that most processors Intel makes these days contain graphics... I hate to have to pay more for a Xeon just to avoid the built in graphics - sort of like having to pay for Windoze on a PC I plan to run Linux on :-( Regards, Ken ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
Ken Taylor writes: > I appreciate the vote of confidence. Perhaps "separate X screens" is > something which only a small percentage of user are multi-tasking enough > to take advantage of. As you know, in X, a "screen" is a pretty central abstraction, with Windows, Pixmaps and other graphics resources all specified in relation to a single "screen". You can't mix-n-match resources between screens, leading to the inability to move windows between them. Over the years, we've substituted that with a similar notion which offers functionality more similar to other window systems, the 'one screen, many monitors' plan as first implemented in PanoramiX (now Xinerama) and then RandR. Here's the differences I can think of between the 'one screen, many monitors' and 'many screens, one monitor each' configurations. If you've got others, I'd love to hear them. One screen, many monitors (Xinerama/RandR): * Move windows among monitors freely * Add/remove monitors on the fly Many screens, one monitor each (core X): * Specify which monitor an application will appear on via the command line (or environment variable). In both: * Resize monitors on the fly * Configure the desktop on each monitor separately * Specify the initial monitor setup in config files. As far as video driver support, the internal server support for multiple "screens" on a single graphics device is twisty, and very few people ever bother to test these setups. It's possible that it will be broken on your favorite card at some point. You can probably understand that supporting both of these models is extra work for all of the developers, and it would be nice if we could make a single model work for most people. -- -keith signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
On 17 January 2016 at 17:49, Ken Taylor wrote: > On 01/17/2016 10:05 AM, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: >> > Thanks rhkramer, > > I appreciate the vote of confidence. Perhaps "separate X screens" is > something which only a small percentage of user are multi-tasking enough to > take advantage of. However, I am one of them. I do appreciate assistance and > suggestions from other users as to how to accomplish what I am working on. > I do not necessarily appreciate being told I do not want to do what I want > to do. > > As to a HUGE monitor... I had thought about that. I could run 4 virtual > machines each taking up 1/4 of the display. But I just purchases two nice > Dell 24" Ultrasharp 19:10 aspect ratio monitors. The left one is vertical > and the right one horizontal. The vertical one is usually divided in half - > Thunderbird on the top half and a virtual machine connected to my secure > email at protonmail.ch on the bottom. I call up Firefox when I need it over > top of the two or I may switch to another workspace first. On the right > monitor I often have several things going on 3 or 4 workspaces. Well, I use multiple monitors with single X screen in pretty much the same way - except I can put any of the virtual desktops on any of the monitors. Since you have one portrait and one landscape monitor moving the virtual desktops between the two will probably not be flawless. Still that does not mean you need to configure the X server in such a way it is impossible - you can just not do it. As has been pointed out the Zaphod options should give you multiple X screens but since next to nobody uses these there may be issues. In fact, the very article you linked lists multiple issues when using multiple monitors with separate screens. Thanks Michal ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
Re: Separate X Screens - possible on Intel Integrated HD Graphics?
Ken Taylor composed on 2016-01-17 11:49 (UTC-0500): > Ultrasharp 19:10 aspect ratio Typo, right? If not, what's the model number? -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ ___ xdg mailing list xdg@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/xdg
