Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
On 2010-06-05 18:42:06 +0930, Pablo Rodríguez said: Which will be those differences between podTeX and LuaTeX? I can't remember where it's talked about, but I think the relevant details are that there are minor incompatibilities in kerning and hyphenation and justification when typesetting paragraphs. Basically, on any arbitrarily large pdfTeX document, you can't guarantee you'll get the same output when typeset with LuaTeX. (As a change in hyphenation can change a single line break, which can change a page break, which can change a chapter break...) Of course, there's also some differences in extended funtionality, such as the pdfTeX primitives that are only available with Lua in LuaTeX, but Heiko Oberdiek's pdftexcmds provides a unified interface to this (and to the relevant XeTeX primitives as well). Certainly nothing to worry about (especially because hyphenation patterns aren't as constant in the TeX world as TeX itelf), but necessary to be aware of. Cheers, Will -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
On 06/04/2010 01:42 PM, Arthur Reutenauer wrote: In a recent thread here, luaTeX was said to be the intended eventual replacement for pdfTeX. This piece of information is based on earlier plans of the pdfTeX and LuaTeX teams, when the intention was indeed that LuaTeX would become pdfTeX 2.0 when it reached maturity. Now the plans have changed somewhat: pdfTeX development has been resumed by its original developer, Hàn Thế Thành, while the pdfTeX developers from 1 or 2 years ago now work mostly on LuaTeX; but it's not foreseen anymore the LuaTeX will be a 100% compatible replacement for pdfTeX. Which will be those differences between podTeX and LuaTeX? Thanks, Pablo -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
2010/6/4 Kirk Lowery : > future of XeTeX? Will XeTeX continue to be developed? Should we be I have faith that there will be XeTeX 1.0 eventually. :-) Best Martin -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
On 2010-06-04 22:36:14 +0930, Arthur Reutenauer said: Maybe Will wants to say a word about fontspec for LuaTeX at this point :-) Nothing more right now than to say: When you get your hands on TeX Live 2010, give it try :) W -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
> Is there any kind of feature comparison between XeTeX and luaTeX? None that I know of. > My primary needs are, besides > general (La)TeX functionality, Unicode processing of combining > characters and handling of OpenType fonts. The output should be > standard PDF. XeTeX can do that: Unicode and OpenType support are built-in, and you can do Unicode normalization with the macro \XeTeXinputnormalization (see http://www.gust.org.pl/bachotex/2008/presentations/XeTeX-BachoTeX2008-pres.pdf page 9, for example). > For me personally, I haven't had the need to seek any > special features. OpenType handling and combining characters were part of what I dubbed “advanced features” in my first mail (they're advanced with respect to pdfTeX), but they're already there anyway. > I guess I need to learn a bit more about luaTeX so I'll know when or > if I need to use it instead of XeTeX. In my opinion, it's too early to be using LuaTeX for production with LaTeX (in contrary to ConTeXt, where developement is already a couple of years old). The packages are still very recent, you should give them some time. In particular, Unicode normalization won't work out of the box with LuaTeX. Maybe Will wants to say a word about fontspec for LuaTeX at this point :-) > Thanks again for the very useful brief on luaTeX. You're welcome! Arthur -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
On Fri, Jun 4, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Arthur Reutenauer wrote: > This shouldn't of course discourage you from experimenting with > LuaTeX, especially now that it's easier to combine its advanced features > with LaTeX thanks to the lualatex-dev team :-) But it's simply a > different program, in my opinion. Is there any kind of feature comparison between XeTeX and luaTeX? I'm a believer in "right tool for the job." My primary needs are, besides general (La)TeX functionality, Unicode processing of combining characters and handling of OpenType fonts. The output should be standard PDF. For me personally, I haven't had the need to seek any special features. So I assume either engine would work for me. I guess I need to learn a bit more about luaTeX so I'll know when or if I need to use it instead of XeTeX. BTW, I'm not at all dissatisfied with XeTeX! I'm just interested in keeping up with changes and developments... Thanks again for the very useful brief on luaTeX. Kirk -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
Re: [XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
> In a recent thread here, luaTeX was said to be the intended eventual > replacement for pdfTeX. This piece of information is based on earlier plans of the pdfTeX and LuaTeX teams, when the intention was indeed that LuaTeX would become pdfTeX 2.0 when it reached maturity. Now the plans have changed somewhat: pdfTeX development has been resumed by its original developer, Hàn Thế Thành, while the pdfTeX developers from 1 or 2 years ago now work mostly on LuaTeX; but it's not foreseen anymore the LuaTeX will be a 100% compatible replacement for pdfTeX. > Since luaTeX is Unicode-based, and handles OpenType fonts, what is the > future of XeTeX? Will XeTeX continue to be developed? I leave it for Jonathan to answer that question, but I'm sure the answer will be yes, to some extent :-) > Should we be > following and experimenting with luaTeX in anticipation of a move to > that engine? If you're already using XeTeX and using its advanced features, I'd really say no, you shouldn't anticipate a move to LuaTeX. Note that the latter is an extension of *pdfTeX*, not XeTeX, and is simply too different from XeTeX with respect to OpenType font handling, Unicode, etc. LuaTeX and XeTeX have had completely different development paths from the beginning (apart from their common origin as extensions of Knuth's TeX), and they serve different needs. I personally use both for completely different purposes (through the macro package ConTeXt, not LaTeX), and I don't envision abandoning either of them (basically: I prefer XeTeX for documents with complex scripts and fonts, especially on the Mac, and LuaTeX when I want to play with TeX's internal -- and the language Lua, of course. And sometimes I don't need any special features, I can just use pdfTeX). The obvious question that is often raised in reaction to the opinion expressed in the above paragraph is why there are no plans for merging LuaTeX and XeTeX. The simple answer is that the developers are already busy enough as it is (and too few people); I'd also say that it might not completely make sense on a technical level, for example because XeTeX uses a lot of external libraries to implement its advanced features, while LuaTeX leaves the same features to be implemented by the macro package: it gives hooks into the TeX engine, whose parts can be reprogrammed in Lua (by the user / macro package writer); what should a "XeLuaTeX" program do? This is not clear to me (I could imagine having both options available in the engine, and choosing them with a switch while typesetting, but then again, you can also make the same choice before by simply deciding to use either of LuaTeX or XeTeX). This shouldn't of course discourage you from experimenting with LuaTeX, especially now that it's easier to combine its advanced features with LaTeX thanks to the lualatex-dev team :-) But it's simply a different program, in my opinion. Arthur -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
[XeTeX] XeTeX and luaTeX
In a recent thread here, luaTeX was said to be the intended eventual replacement for pdfTeX. Since luaTeX is Unicode-based, and handles OpenType fonts, what is the future of XeTeX? Will XeTeX continue to be developed? Should we be following and experimenting with luaTeX in anticipation of a move to that engine? If this has been discussed elsewhere, please point me to it. Thanks! Kirk -- Subscriptions, Archive, and List information, etc.: http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/xetex
