Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
Hey, Dan Korostelev wrote: [snip] > Well, I simply didn't mention the removal of zcml slug, I know that > it's not related to zpkg. Bunch of nitpickers we are. :) Anyway, removing zcml slugs is now official policy. Carry on! Regards, Martijn ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
2009/3/5 Benji York :
> On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Tres Seaver wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Martijn Faassen wrote:
>>> Baiju M wrote:
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Dan Korostelev wrote:
> 2009/3/2 Tres Seaver :
-
>>> I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above.
>> They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to
>> allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the
>> pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install).
>>
>> I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit,
>> granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to
>> implicit (aka "majyk") tools.
>>
>> Please revert this part of the change.
> I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug"
> files are useful anymore.
I cannot see similar slugs in other packages either.
>>>
>>> Agreed. I don't understand Tres's or Benji's point either; thanks to
>>> buildout we've left such slugs long behind us I thought. Typically
>>> people would symlink these into an old old installation of Zope 3 (or
>>> copy them over).
>>>
>>> Explicit granular configuration isn't broken at all; if you want to
>>> explicitly include zope.file, you include its configure.zcml, not its
>>> "zope.file-configure.zcml".
>>>
>>> Unless Tres comes back with some convincing explanation soon, please do
>>> get rid of this stuff.
>>
>> Those files exist to allow for a use case we may have abandoned, which
>> is allowing packages to be installed in such a way that a tool could
>> help users enable / disable their configurations, without mutating
>> something like 'site.zcml'. The folks who might have that usecase are
>> those who package zope3 components for deployment outside buildout (as
>> .deb / .rpm, etc.)
>
>> I don't know if there is such an audience; Benji also pointed out that
>> he thought there were such folks.
>
> I don't doubt there are still at least a few, but I also don't think we
> are supporting that use case very well moving forward. We just need to
> make an explicit decision to drop support, and then we can remove the
> slug files.
Can we have an "official desicion from The Steering Group" on that?
>> My initial reaction to Dan's removal
>> was that the checkin message ("remove zpkg stuff") had nothing to do
>> with that particular change: 'zpkg' was entirely separate from slugs.
>
> Same here.
Well, I simply didn't mention the removal of zcml slug, I know that
it's not related to zpkg.
--
WBR, Dan Korostelev
___
Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev
** No cross posts or HTML encoding! **
(Related lists -
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Tres Seaver wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Martijn Faassen wrote:
>> Baiju M wrote:
>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Dan Korostelev wrote:
2009/3/2 Tres Seaver :
>>> -
>> I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above.
> They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to
> allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the
> pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install).
>
> I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit,
> granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to
> implicit (aka "majyk") tools.
>
> Please revert this part of the change.
I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug"
files are useful anymore.
>>> I cannot see similar slugs in other packages either.
>>
>> Agreed. I don't understand Tres's or Benji's point either; thanks to
>> buildout we've left such slugs long behind us I thought. Typically
>> people would symlink these into an old old installation of Zope 3 (or
>> copy them over).
>>
>> Explicit granular configuration isn't broken at all; if you want to
>> explicitly include zope.file, you include its configure.zcml, not its
>> "zope.file-configure.zcml".
>>
>> Unless Tres comes back with some convincing explanation soon, please do
>> get rid of this stuff.
>
> Those files exist to allow for a use case we may have abandoned, which
> is allowing packages to be installed in such a way that a tool could
> help users enable / disable their configurations, without mutating
> something like 'site.zcml'. The folks who might have that usecase are
> those who package zope3 components for deployment outside buildout (as
> .deb / .rpm, etc.)
> I don't know if there is such an audience; Benji also pointed out that
> he thought there were such folks.
I don't doubt there are still at least a few, but I also don't think we
are supporting that use case very well moving forward. We just need to
make an explicit decision to drop support, and then we can remove the
slug files.
> My initial reaction to Dan's removal
> was that the checkin message ("remove zpkg stuff") had nothing to do
> with that particular change: 'zpkg' was entirely separate from slugs.
Same here.
--
Benji York
Senior Software Engineer
Zope Corporation
___
Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev
** No cross posts or HTML encoding! **
(Related lists -
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Martijn Faassen wrote:
> Baiju M wrote:
>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Dan Korostelev wrote:
>>> 2009/3/2 Tres Seaver :
>> -
> I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above.
They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to
allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the
pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install).
I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit,
granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to
implicit (aka "majyk") tools.
Please revert this part of the change.
>>> I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug"
>>> files are useful anymore.
>> I cannot see similar slugs in other packages either.
>
> Agreed. I don't understand Tres's or Benji's point either; thanks to
> buildout we've left such slugs long behind us I thought. Typically
> people would symlink these into an old old installation of Zope 3 (or
> copy them over).
>
> Explicit granular configuration isn't broken at all; if you want to
> explicitly include zope.file, you include its configure.zcml, not its
> "zope.file-configure.zcml".
>
> Unless Tres comes back with some convincing explanation soon, please do
> get rid of this stuff.
Those files exist to allow for a use case we may have abandoned, which
is allowing packages to be installed in such a way that a tool could
help users enable / disable their configurations, without mutating
something like 'site.zcml'. The folks who might have that usecase are
those who package zope3 components for deployment outside buildout (as
.deb / .rpm, etc.)
I don't know if there is such an audience; Benji also pointed out that
he thought there were such folks. My initial reaction to Dan's removal
was that the checkin message ("remove zpkg stuff") had nothing to do
with that particular change: 'zpkg' was entirely separate from slugs.
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFJrxCW+gerLs4ltQ4RAlKOAJ4iMu+SQUceUq0w5Fh9+bmBNeALlACfTPAG
N2Uc9sTzSBFXvy2Vh5LGw/g=
=13vt
-END PGP SIGNATURE-
___
Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev
** No cross posts or HTML encoding! **
(Related lists -
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
Baiju M wrote: > On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Dan Korostelev wrote: >> 2009/3/2 Tres Seaver : > - I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above. >>> They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to >>> allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the >>> pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install). >>> >>> I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit, >>> granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to >>> implicit (aka "majyk") tools. >>> >>> Please revert this part of the change. >> I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug" >> files are useful anymore. > > I cannot see similar slugs in other packages either. Agreed. I don't understand Tres's or Benji's point either; thanks to buildout we've left such slugs long behind us I thought. Typically people would symlink these into an old old installation of Zope 3 (or copy them over). Explicit granular configuration isn't broken at all; if you want to explicitly include zope.file, you include its configure.zcml, not its "zope.file-configure.zcml". Unless Tres comes back with some convincing explanation soon, please do get rid of this stuff. Regards, Martijn ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Dan Korostelev wrote: > 2009/3/2 Tres Seaver : - >>> I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above. >> >> They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to >> allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the >> pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install). >> >> I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit, >> granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to >> implicit (aka "majyk") tools. >> >> Please revert this part of the change. > > I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug" > files are useful anymore. I cannot see similar slugs in other packages either. -- Baiju M ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
2009/3/2 Tres Seaver : >>> - >> I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above. > > They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to > allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the > pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install). > > I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit, > granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to > implicit (aka "majyk") tools. > > Please revert this part of the change. I just reverted the change, however, I don't think that the "slug" files are useful anymore. They were used when we had "the zope3 application server" and we plugged some components into it, like sites are plugged into debian apache/nginx setups, but now-a-days, when it seems that most people just build their own applications using their custom app configuration files, I don't think that there's much sense for package-includes for including components like zope.file. I can think of a use for package-includes for some CMS application that include "website configuration" (like debian apache), but not the "component configuration". -- WBR, Dan Korostelev ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Benji York wrote: > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Dan Korostelev wrote: >> Log message for revision 97423: >> Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff. > >> Deleted: zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml >> === >> --- zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml 2009-03-02 >> 16:09:01 UTC (rev 97422) >> +++ zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml 2009-03-02 >> 16:38:27 UTC (rev 97423) >> @@ -1 +0,0 @@ >> - > > I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above. They certainly aren't related to 'zpkg'. The intent of the slugs was to allow for something like 'sites-available' / 'sites-enabled' (the pattern in a stock Debian Apache2 install). I think it is particularly unfortunate to remove support for explicit, granular configuration at the same time as folks seem to be jumping to implicit (aka "majyk") tools. Please revert this part of the change. Tres. - -- === Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFJrBIu+gerLs4ltQ4RArBSAKDZjWeQPStzXjtnyDUcBpB2kWTxOgCfcNQO J5ocqql0fkyFShEQD1ofQTg= =WWX+ -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.file/trunk/ Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff.
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Dan Korostelev wrote: > Log message for revision 97423: > Update package mailing list address. Remove zpkg stuff. > Deleted: zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml > === > --- zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml 2009-03-02 > 16:09:01 UTC (rev 97422) > +++ zope.file/trunk/src/zope/file/zope.file-configure.zcml 2009-03-02 > 16:38:27 UTC (rev 97423) > @@ -1 +0,0 @@ > - I believe people still use the ZCML "slug" files like the above. -- Benji York Senior Software Engineer Zope Corporation ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
