Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
Lennart Regebro wrote: > The result of this was that yesterday it looked like almost no Zope > talks would be accepted, because during the last weeding out of talks > (there was WAY too many really good talks this year) they all ended up > in different groups, and got voted out. This is mainly because those > who did the grouping didn't understand that talks about to various > Zope-related technologies like Repoze, BFG and the component > architecture are at least somewhat related, so they ended up in > different groups, and then they don't understand why things like > component architectures are important, so the talks get voted out. It would be unfortunate if talks about the framework that seems to generate the majority of traffic on the various RSS planets, and has arguably the largest *committer* community was omitted due to reviewer fiat. > I was unfortunately on a Plane during the last meeting yesterday, back > home from the PloneConf, so I wasn't on that meeting, but what I > gather from todays emails and the stats on the talks site, the > situation has been ameliorated, so there will be at least some Zope > talks, I think. But it was a close call. Excellent, thank you, thank you, Lennart. > What to do? Easy: We need more people from the Zope community on the > PyCon program committee. Next year, when the talks for 2011 gets > decided, there seriously have to be more Zope people in the PC, > especially people in US timezone and involved with or closely > following all the new things that's happening. The Zope community is > pushing a lot of the development in the Python world and is continuing > to be the source of much innovation, we shouldn't let that run out in > the sand just because the rest of the Python community lags behind us > a year. ;-) > > Obviously, if you join next year, you should still keep a cool head > and look at it objectively, we do not want the PC being swamped by > people who only will vote for Zope talks. We just need a couple of > more people who know what the Zope/BFG/ZTK talks are about and have > time to sit through the meetings (who are on IRC). Another way to avoid this in the future besides joining the committee would be for notable members of the Zope community to reach out on a regular (daily) basis to other Python-using communities. Offer them well-documented software, visit their sprints and conferences, try their alphas, join their IRC channels, participate in their maillists and so on. It's harder to do intercommunity politics daily in this way as opposed to "facing off" yearly, but it will have a higher, more lasting payoff. It's "who you know", not "what you know" unfortunately, even in open source, as much as we like to believe in meritocracy. - C ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
Am 02.11.2009, 14:44 Uhr, schrieb Chris McDonough : > It's "who you know", not "what you know" unfortunately, even in open > source, as > much as we like to believe in meritocracy. Arguably even more so in open source - egos matter. Anyway we did some evangelizing of BFG at the Plone Conference and I'm going to do my best to make sure the Zope is better represented at next year's Europython. Charlie -- Charlie Clark Managing Director Clark Consulting & Research German Office Helmholtzstr. 20 Düsseldorf D- 40215 Tel: +49-211-600-3657 Mobile: +49-178-782-6226 ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
I also proposed a Grok tutorial, but I've had no word about its acceptance or declination. My zope talk where I would discuss Grok, buildout and zope.component was rejected. Carlos de la Guardia On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 1:13 PM, Chris McDonough wrote: > So were any Zope talks/tutorials accepted? > > FWIW, Tres had a BFG talk accepted, and Carlos had a BFG talk and a BFG > tutorial accepted. I proposed a talk about profiling that didn't make it. > > The TG guys had one talk accepted. > > Not sure about Pylons. > > I assume Django had a bunch, but I don't know for sure. > > - C > > > Martijn Faassen wrote: >> Chris McDonough wrote: >> [snip] >>> Another way to avoid this in the future besides joining the committee would >>> be >>> for notable members of the Zope community to reach out on a regular (daily) >>> basis to other Python-using communities. Offer them well-documented >>> software, >>> visit their sprints and conferences, try their alphas, join their IRC >>> channels, >>> participate in their maillists and so on. It's harder to do intercommunity >>> politics daily in this way as opposed to "facing off" yearly, but it will >>> have >>> a higher, more lasting payoff. >> >> I'm very much in agreement on this. Blogging is another way to reach >> out. Reach out and interact. >> >> It's indeed hard work to do this right. I am sitting on a few pieces of >> software that are either interesting to non-Zope people or in fact >> directly usable, but I haven't had the time yet to blog about them. I >> intend to start blogging on a more regular basis again soon. >> >>> It's "who you know", not "what you know" unfortunately, even in open >>> source, as >>> much as we like to believe in meritocracy. >> >> That's true too. I'm a natural noise-maker, and I discovered that while >> as a result of this I embarrass myself in public on a regular basis, it >> also means a lot of people know who I am. That's a good thing. >> >> Regards, >> >> Martijn >> >> ___ >> Zope-Dev maillist - zope-...@zope.org >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev >> ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** >> (Related lists - >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) >> > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - zope-...@zope.org > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) > ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
On Nov 3, 2009, at 4:48 PM, Chris McDonough wrote: > Gary Poster wrote: ... >> It is an advocacy piece only in the sense that we are saying that, >> by-and-large, we like what the packages give us, but it is more >> challenging than that. It's an interesting pairing to Jeff Shell's >> invited talk, which appears to cover some of the same ground from >> more of an advocacy/tutorial perspective. I was honestly a bit >> surprised that mine was accepted when Jeff's was already scheduled, >> but maybe mine is "the dark side" version of his talk. :-) > > It's Jeff Rush.. Bah, I knew that. Thanks for the correction. Sorry, Jeffs. Gary ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
I had a "rethinking interfaces" talk accepted. It's about the positives and negatives of zope.interface and zope.component, driven primarily from the perspective and experience of the Launchpad team, and myself in particular; and about changes that might be made or differences we are interested in. It is an advocacy piece only in the sense that we are saying that, by- and-large, we like what the packages give us, but it is more challenging than that. It's an interesting pairing to Jeff Shell's invited talk, which appears to cover some of the same ground from more of an advocacy/tutorial perspective. I was honestly a bit surprised that mine was accepted when Jeff's was already scheduled, but maybe mine is "the dark side" version of his talk. :-) Gary On Nov 3, 2009, at 2:13 PM, Chris McDonough wrote: > So were any Zope talks/tutorials accepted? > > FWIW, Tres had a BFG talk accepted, and Carlos had a BFG talk and a > BFG > tutorial accepted. I proposed a talk about profiling that didn't > make it. > > The TG guys had one talk accepted. > > Not sure about Pylons. > > I assume Django had a bunch, but I don't know for sure. > > - C > > > Martijn Faassen wrote: >> Chris McDonough wrote: >> [snip] >>> Another way to avoid this in the future besides joining the >>> committee would be >>> for notable members of the Zope community to reach out on a >>> regular (daily) >>> basis to other Python-using communities. Offer them well- >>> documented software, >>> visit their sprints and conferences, try their alphas, join their >>> IRC channels, >>> participate in their maillists and so on. It's harder to do >>> intercommunity >>> politics daily in this way as opposed to "facing off" yearly, but >>> it will have >>> a higher, more lasting payoff. >> >> I'm very much in agreement on this. Blogging is another way to reach >> out. Reach out and interact. >> >> It's indeed hard work to do this right. I am sitting on a few >> pieces of >> software that are either interesting to non-Zope people or in fact >> directly usable, but I haven't had the time yet to blog about them. I >> intend to start blogging on a more regular basis again soon. >> >>> It's "who you know", not "what you know" unfortunately, even in >>> open source, as >>> much as we like to believe in meritocracy. >> >> That's true too. I'm a natural noise-maker, and I discovered that >> while >> as a result of this I embarrass myself in public on a regular >> basis, it >> also means a lot of people know who I am. That's a good thing. >> >> Regards, >> >> Martijn >> >> ___ >> Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev >> ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** >> (Related lists - >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce >> https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) >> > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
So were any Zope talks/tutorials accepted? FWIW, Tres had a BFG talk accepted, and Carlos had a BFG talk and a BFG tutorial accepted. I proposed a talk about profiling that didn't make it. The TG guys had one talk accepted. Not sure about Pylons. I assume Django had a bunch, but I don't know for sure. - C Martijn Faassen wrote: > Chris McDonough wrote: > [snip] >> Another way to avoid this in the future besides joining the committee would >> be >> for notable members of the Zope community to reach out on a regular (daily) >> basis to other Python-using communities. Offer them well-documented >> software, >> visit their sprints and conferences, try their alphas, join their IRC >> channels, >> participate in their maillists and so on. It's harder to do intercommunity >> politics daily in this way as opposed to "facing off" yearly, but it will >> have >> a higher, more lasting payoff. > > I'm very much in agreement on this. Blogging is another way to reach > out. Reach out and interact. > > It's indeed hard work to do this right. I am sitting on a few pieces of > software that are either interesting to non-Zope people or in fact > directly usable, but I haven't had the time yet to blog about them. I > intend to start blogging on a more regular basis again soon. > >> It's "who you know", not "what you know" unfortunately, even in open source, >> as >> much as we like to believe in meritocracy. > > That's true too. I'm a natural noise-maker, and I discovered that while > as a result of this I embarrass myself in public on a regular basis, it > also means a lot of people know who I am. That's a good thing. > > Regards, > > Martijn > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) > ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
Chris McDonough wrote: > So were any Zope talks/tutorials accepted? I have no idea, besides BFG, which is at the very least Zope related. :) Lennart? Regards, Martijn ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
2009/11/3 Gary Poster : > I had a "rethinking interfaces" talk accepted. It's about the > positives and negatives of zope.interface and zope.component, driven > primarily from the perspective and experience of the Launchpad team, > and myself in particular; and about changes that might be made or > differences we are interested in. > > It is an advocacy piece only in the sense that we are saying that, by- > and-large, we like what the packages give us, but it is more > challenging than that. It's an interesting pairing to Jeff Shell's > invited talk, which appears to cover some of the same ground from more > of an advocacy/tutorial perspective. I was honestly a bit surprised > that mine was accepted when Jeff's was already scheduled, but maybe > mine is "the dark side" version of his talk. :-) Well, if you cover the good and bad sides, as your great OSCON talk did, but then also proposes what can be done about the bad sides, your talk would be of narrower interest, but also more important. :-) I'm really sorry I can't go to PyCon this year, the talks are going to be awesome. Hopefully I can see the talk online at some stage. :) -- Lennart Regebro: Python, Zope, Plone, Grok http://regebro.wordpress.com/ +33 661 58 14 64 ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
On Nov 3, 2009, at 3:28 PM, Lennart Regebro wrote: > 2009/11/3 Gary Poster : >> I had a "rethinking interfaces" talk accepted. It's about the >> positives and negatives of zope.interface and zope.component, driven >> primarily from the perspective and experience of the Launchpad team, >> and myself in particular; and about changes that might be made or >> differences we are interested in. >> >> It is an advocacy piece only in the sense that we are saying that, >> by- >> and-large, we like what the packages give us, but it is more >> challenging than that. It's an interesting pairing to Jeff Shell's >> invited talk, which appears to cover some of the same ground from >> more >> of an advocacy/tutorial perspective. I was honestly a bit surprised >> that mine was accepted when Jeff's was already scheduled, but maybe >> mine is "the dark side" version of his talk. :-) > > Well, if you cover the good and bad sides, as your great OSCON talk > did, but then also proposes what can be done about the bad sides, your > talk would be of narrower interest, but also more important. :-) Cool, I'll aim for that. :-) > I'm really sorry I can't go to PyCon this year, the talks are going to > be awesome. Hopefully I can see the talk online at some stage. :) I'm sorry you won't be there too, but thank you! Gary ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] A note on the PyCon Program committee.
Gary Poster wrote: > I had a "rethinking interfaces" talk accepted. It's about the positives > and negatives of zope.interface and zope.component, driven primarily > from the perspective and experience of the Launchpad team, and myself in > particular; and about changes that might be made or differences we are > interested in. That should be interesting. > > It is an advocacy piece only in the sense that we are saying that, > by-and-large, we like what the packages give us, but it is more > challenging than that. It's an interesting pairing to Jeff Shell's > invited talk, which appears to cover some of the same ground from more > of an advocacy/tutorial perspective. I was honestly a bit surprised > that mine was accepted when Jeff's was already scheduled, but maybe mine > is "the dark side" version of his talk. :-) It's Jeff Rush.. - C ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
