[ZWeb] re: it was fun :)
Jens Vagelpohl said: On 12 Oct 2006, at 20:26, Justizin wrote: > BTW.. > > I'll consider personal mails of chastisement to be illegal harassment > and will pursue abuse claims with ISPs and the law to the furthest > extent permitted. > > This is borderlining on slander and I just picked up a lawyer client > who wants a case management system. If I think that anyone's comments > may damage my business, I'll definitely have an attorney contact them. LOL Not necessary. You did enough to yourself to come out looking like a complete fool. jens ten points for using internet argument cliche #2, but the fact is, jens, that you have been harassing and chastising me for over a week as thanks for offering my time to the zope foundation. you will receive a cease and desist notice and you and the zope foundation will receive bills that will be sent to collections. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] statistical nonsense
On 10/13/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: > I hope you all curl up and die. I'm going to use TurboGears, since > apparently noone in the Zope community will fucking talk to me > anymore. I'm sure you will be sorely missed ;-) Seriously, you seemed like a well meaning, fairly clued up, if slightly arrogant guy when you offered to help, but these tirades of abuse are making you look like a clown - and I should know; Google can testify to several of my own clownish tirades... I am the one being abused here. I offered over 20 hours of my time as a volunteer and in exchange my name has been drug through the mud. FUCK YOU. Arrogant? It's easy to call anyone arrogant who says: "Please, trust me, I know what I'm talking about, we should be careful to avoid a problem." The fact is that you guys are continually accusing me of making a mistake that was not really part of the problem. You want a post-mortem? here it is: http://justizin.blogspot.com/2006/10/zopeorg-dns-post-mortem.html Justin, good luck with TurboGears, I hope none too many of your customers stumble across your postings here... My customers work with me because of my track record. They seek my sort of help. Heck, at my age, I could just go join a fucking band instead of spending most of my time volunteering to work with open-source software on behalf of non-profit foundations. I'll probably show this discussion to some of my customers when they ask me to rush on something. I am not afraid to be myself. Whatever, dude. This is the most disgusting display I've ever seen to someone who has volunteered to help with something complex. You can all rot in hell and die. I hope my customers will see that, while I went out of my way to help a community which we depend on, I did not hang onto this responsibility so tightly that I will let their projects fall on the floor. In fact, I will talk to the Association for Computing Machinery IS team about this entire incident as an example of a community who needs our resources, but will never accept them. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
[ZWeb] statistical nonsense
Lennart Regebro said: "Say that a server fails one day per month in average (which is way more than we really will have). One backup server located on anotehr continent then means that we will statistically have DNS outage only one day in 900. Thats one day every three years. Two backups located on different continents will give us a failure rate of one day per 27000 days. That's one day every seventy-fifth year." WHAT!?!? The internet hasn't even been around for seventy five years, and sites are down all the time. shut the fuck up. I hope you all curl up and die. I'm going to use TurboGears, since apparently noone in the Zope community will fucking talk to me anymore. You are the most childish fucks I have ever worked with. Way to show a guy thanks. ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
[ZWeb] Re: it was fun :)
BTW.. I'll consider personal mails of chastisement to be illegal harassment and will pursue abuse claims with ISPs and the law to the furthest extent permitted. This is borderlining on slander and I just picked up a lawyer client who wants a case management system. If I think that anyone's comments may damage my business, I'll definitely have an attorney contact them. Be nice or be quiet. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
[ZWeb] it was fun :)
Howdy guys.. I'm done. Glad I could be your scapegoat for this week. I'll continue serving as a DNS Slave until or unless I'm told that I am out of the rotation. E-mail me directly if you need my attention. I've turned list delivery off. Best, Justin -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: >> > This assumption really has nothing to do with what happened this week. >> >> I'm not convinced. >> > Then take over, Lennart. I do not care. OK, I've seen this enough. Justin, I volunteer to take over your DNS stewardship role. Then do something. Improve the situation somehow. You've got all the keys I've got. I'm also more than happy to do what I can on the Apache front. Sure. Please do. It certainly does not behoove me to volunteer my time for the Zope Foundation. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Apache config for lists.zope.org/mail.zope.org fubar?
lists.zope.org and mail.zope.org work OK for me. Maybe Apache was unhappy because it couldn't resolve the hostname locally. Did someone say we are on 1.3 Apache? On 10/12/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Going to lists.zope.org and mail.zope.org used to bring up the Mailman pages for the mailing lists. Now I see the buildbot web output. Something done got broke. jens -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFLnVyRAx5nvEhZLIRAioXAKCnd0HUE7Hky2mwtTCObAzCaZjpnACfYJ3X z2AfvLzPoPVdztl0X/QJ+a4= =P2gy -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12 Oct 2006, at 10:05, Lennart Regebro wrote: > But honestly, compare the likelyhood that all three of these would > fail at one time, together with the increasing likelyhood than one > server of them is misconfigured and starts disturbing the usage for a > minor part of the users, then we will quickly realize that the more > backups and failsafes we have the larger the likelyhood that something > of this will go wrong. > > 8 servers seems to be to be a complete overkill, and it will only > cause problems. I will change my mind on this the time all zone-edit > servers stop working at the same time as two of the backups fail. > > Don't overcomplicate things. It just makes them fail. Exactly. We are not building a carrier-grade solution here because, as the programmer idiom goes, it is YAGNI (you ain't gonna need it). Keeping a carrier-grade solution running correctly is always more effort than keeping the simple solution up. There's a diminishing return between upkeep/effort/maintenance/script-writing and "oops, DNS is gone for an hour". I seriously don't see the added value. It's not about "carrier-grade". That's a total misconception. Carriers have big systems, we want lots of alternates in case one of those big systems goes down. That's my opinion. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Lennart Regebro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 10/12/06, Justizin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It could cause problems, and that's why we aren't really using eight > servers right now, but it should not cause problems. Servers should not fail. This should not cause problems. But in reality, it will. Servers failing will not cause problems, the only real risk would be tampering. The reason for having many servers is to protect against failure. > It is a > challenge, also, that our DNS is not hosted in the same location as > the website. So, it's possible that DNS will be unreachable when an > outage occurs, i.e. a fibre being cut in the middle of the ocean, and > this outage may not actually affect our site. Which is why one or two backups on another continent is nice to have. "Three or more" is best. > > Don't overcomplicate things. It just makes them fail. > > This assumption really has nothing to do with what happened this week. I'm not convinced. Then take over, Lennart. I do not care. You don't have to be convinced. Explain to me how this problem is related to the outage, which was as simple as this: records served by three of five nameservers were incorrect. the other two were zope.com nameservers, and they don't delegate to zoneedit afaik. > So, if you want to only use two nameservers, that's okay with me. Please respons to what I write, and argue against what I argue, instead of making up arguments against things I have never said. I, explicitly in my last mail, said that one or two backups on other continents would be necssary, but that the previously mentioned *eight* backups would cause more problems than they solve. You said you don't understand why we don't just use zoneedit. What makes four servers less failure prone than eight, so long as they all agree that zoneedit is in charge. If you don't agree with this, you are welcome to explain to me why. But do NOT argue against me by implying that I have said something stupid, which I never said. Oh whatever. Look, I'm sick of this conversation. I did a better job than anyone else in the conversation would have, and problems happened because we spent a week on something that we should have spent 2-4 weeks on. We learned something. I think the real issue is that we ran into a problem, which I tried hard to avoid, and people are still arguing that I am proposing to take too many precautions. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Lennart Regebro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Just a couple of notes here. Although zoneedit has been running fine for me for years without a single problem, obviously it would be nice with some backup. Preferably something with another ISP and located on like another continent or something. Two of these backups would be even better. But honestly, compare the likelyhood that all three of these would fail at one time, together with the increasing likelyhood than one server of them is misconfigured and starts disturbing the usage for a minor part of the users, then we will quickly realize that the more backups and failsafes we have the larger the likelyhood that something of this will go wrong. the worst that happens is that some changes fail to propogate. changes to DNS should always be approached with the assumption that this will happen. What's worse is for there to be no copy of a zone available. It should never be necessary for an A record to change immediately, because this cannot be relied upon. The best defense to this is, however, to set TTLs at 300s, or 5 minutes, about a week in advance. 8 servers seems to be to be a complete overkill, and it will only cause problems. I will change my mind on this the time all zone-edit servers stop working at the same time as two of the backups fail. It could cause problems, and that's why we aren't really using eight servers right now, but it should not cause problems. It is a challenge, also, that our DNS is not hosted in the same location as the website. So, it's possible that DNS will be unreachable when an outage occurs, i.e. a fibre being cut in the middle of the ocean, and this outage may not actually affect our site. I bet ten bucks if we rely entirely on zoneedit's nameservers that this will happen once for at least twelve hours for some significant region of the world within the next year. Don't overcomplicate things. It just makes them fail. This assumption really has nothing to do with what happened this week. What happened this week was either: (a) a typo (b) an erroneously truncated string If there were only two nameservers, they would have pointed at the wrong IP, and the site would have been perceptually unavailable for a few hours to two days for various people. If there were eight, the same would happen, for about the same time frame. So, if you want to only use two nameservers, that's okay with me. Remember to wake me up when the zone is unreachable for someone and we want to run more. :) I always assume, if anything, that some machines, network connections, disk drives, etc.. will invariably fail, and that you can never have too many if they are available. I like the idea of a group of zope community members collectively providing DNS service. Maybe we should even talk about running multiple copies of the flat content in different places. If my site goes down, esp if one of my machines fail, I much prefer to feel comfortable that I can reach zope.org than rely on the possibility that i might have copies of recent releases in another location. if i'm going to keep copies of the releases around for myself, might as well mirror them, eh? While having a set of servers configured by various people sounds as if it would be overcomplicated, with proper planning and coordination, we should be able to keep it simple. When making changes to DNS, always assume that for 48 hours there will be between a 90-10 and 10-90 split between people who have your new records and people who have old records. When changing nameservers, double or triple this, because some people will have cached records from the old nameserver *and* more recently cached NS records, so they may continue querying the old nameserver until the cached NS record itself expires. When something critical like svn/cvs or the main website need to be changed, again, it is necessary to drop the TTL, on the entire zone, even, to something really short like 300s about a week in advance. This ensures that everyone in the world has a copy of the zone which says: "no copy of this zone and no records in this zone are good for longer than five minutes.". Just before a switch is made, you can proxy the old front-end apache server to the new host explicitly, and then update records. for five or ten minutes some people's requests will be slow because they are possibly doubling-back across the internet, but at least they can't really tell what's going on, just that for a few minutes it is a 'little bit slow'. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12 Oct 2006, at 09:15, Justizin wrote: > (a) I don't control the actual registrar records > > (b) Yes, these were listed in the zone itself as the NS, but noone > should be doing lookups via these servers, because ZoneEdit is not > authoritative for the NS records of this zone, the registrar is. To stay strictly on technical issues, I think you're constantly implying that the DNS servers for the zope.org zone that are listed by the registrar are not the same as the DNS servers the zone data itself contains. Can you explain why this discrepancy exists, or why it makes sense? I prepared a copy of the zone in ZoneEdit with small changes to reflect the plans for a new configuration, including new nameservers. I pulled the zone into ns.qutang.net early last week and sent out an e-mail which, surely, was just lost in the white noise. oh well. so, because we wanted to start modifying the zone really soon, i told rob page to change the registrar to point at: ns1.zoneedit.com ns7.zoneedit.com ns.qutang.net These nameservers all had the same data, including the same incorrect records. FWIW, three records with the same IP address went sour: www.zope.org cvs.zope.org zope.org This is curious, because I recall making an effort to individually copy each record from the zone file that Rob sent me, to avoid just this sort of mistake. whatever, these records pointed at .1 instead of .171 Nothing. I am describing the situation where you have a bind slave and you are configuring a slave zone for the first time. At that moment you don't have to manually pull the zone data, bind will magically fetch it. This was a hint for people who might want to set up a slave. Handy. I am writing a how-to for making djbdns comply with both ends of the NOTIFY chain. There are a bunch of tools for this, very simple djb-ish stuff, but nothing is part of the package. If someone running BIND wants to pull from zoneedit and send the rest of us NOTIFY requests when a change is detected, we can pretty much do that now. I should be set up to respond to NOTIFY. I have to add something into the tinydns-data chain which enacts changes to live configuration so that it spurs a NOTIFY to slaves. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: > I'd love to see more backups once they have copies of the zone. Why? zope.org has happily lived off two nameservers for years and years... All of a sudden, we "need" to have more backups, the upshot of which has been people in europe getting served bad dns from ns.qutang.net :-( This is a logical fallacy. Services were not unavailable because we have more than two nameservers, services were unavailable because we rushed. ns.qutang.net did not serve any bad dns that ns*.zoneedit.com were not serving. The errors were in ZoneEdit's copy of the Zone. I was thinking just now over a smoke about someone I used to work with at Rackspace, the datacenter engineer. Bob was a member of the NASA Challenge Safety Team. He personally recommended against launching the Challenger, which exploded, killing some astronauts. I learned from working with him that you should never tell someone with more experience to be less cautious. What's wrong with just having ns1.zoneedit.com and ns7.zoneedit.com (could we also use ns(2-6).zoneedit.com?) and be done with it? We can only use the nameservers that zoneedit allocates us. Yanno, people used to pay $75 per half hour for this expertise. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Re: [Zope-dev] svn.zope.org down?
That record comes from zoneedit.com, noone should be using those servers for lookups AFAIK because zoneedit.com is not authoritative for the NS records. These are slaves which have not coordinated with me to pull zones. I told Rob not to put them in the registrar update, but neglected to remove them from ZoneEdit. Look at a WHOIS and check those nameservers, they should all be kosher. On 10/12/06, Wichert Akkerman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I did a bit of checking: zope.org has a crazy number of DNS servers and they are not all in sync. Particularly seconly.rackspace.com (69.20.0.180) and cabana.palladion.com (64.34.177.88) are not authorative for the zope.org domain and will just refer back to the root servers. This shows some obvious DNS problems: [levante;~]-26> for i in 216.122.7.155 8.7.96.28 69.20.0.180 64.34.177.88 63.240.213.250 70.168.181.3 70.84.6.50 207.234.248.200 ; do dig zope.org soa @$i ; done | grep SOA | grep -v '^;' zope.org. 7200IN SOA ns1.zoneedit.com. soacontact.zoneedit.com. 1159817268 14400 7200 950400 7200 zope.org. 7200IN SOA ns1.zoneedit.com. soacontact.zoneedit.com. 1159817265 14400 7200 950400 7200 zope.org. 300 IN SOA ns2.zope.com. postmaster.zope.com. 2006092901 300 300 300 150 zope.org. 300 IN SOA ns2.zope.com. postmaster.zope.com. 2006092901 300 300 300 150 zope.org. 7200IN SOA ns1.zoneedit.com. soacontact.zoneedit.com. 1159817261 14400 7200 950400 7200 zope.org. 7200IN SOA ns1.zoneedit.com. soacontact.zoneedit.com. 1159817268 14400 7200 950400 7200 note how those answers differ wildly: there are four different versions of the zope.org domain going around. This will not clear up automatically: the domain registration, nameserver configuration and zone files seem to be need some updating. Wichert. Previously Justizin wrote: > Wichert - > > Use /etc/hosts. Clear local DNS caches if you can. > > 63.240.213.173 cvs.zope.org > > It resolves fine from the ten or so machines I can check it on, but > that's only 0.1% or so of the internet. > > If you see something other than hosts which point at 63.240.213.1, > please provide details. > > On 10/12/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >There still appear to be some outstanding dns issues... > > > >Chris > > > >Wichert Akkerman wrote: > >> Is something happening with svn.zope.org? I haven't been able to use > >> anonymous or authorized svn for two days. > >> > >> Wichert. > >> > > > >-- > >Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting > >- http://www.simplistix.co.uk > >___ > >Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org > >http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web > > > > > -- > Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect > ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter > http://www.siggraph.org/ -- Wichert Akkerman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>It is simple to make things. http://www.wiggy.net/ It is hard to make things simple. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
Yanno, people used to pay $75 per half hour for this expertise. .. and I am charging $3,000 for a server move / consolidation in the range of what zope.org wants to see happen in the next few months. Sometimes, even paying clients insist on the wrong approach, or think that I am overcomplicating things. That's why I require a large portion of payment up front. If someone wants to fire me before I have done much work and after I have received $1,500, that's always acceptable. Anyway, look, here's the deal - stop inferring that my suggested precautions are stupid, or zope.org will go down again soon, probably, and it will be YOUR fault, and I will laugh at you. As it's MY fault this time, I'm going to tell you, it doesn't feel great. I approached this change with nothing less than the expectation that I would like to be able to continue reaching zope.org on a daily basis, and it went badly. I could not be less pleased. Insofar as anyone who wants to flog me, look - if www.siggraph.org is unreacheable, I get flogged by the ACM SIGGRAPH President, because he uses it in his Human Computer Interface courses, and it makes him look like an asshole. Truth be told, I care about zope.org working for my own purposes a great deal more than siggraph.org. So, I wasn't intentionally sloppy. Yes, I could write a fifty step DNS migration tutorial, and I could point out a few steps that I skipped. The fact is, I would spend a month planning a DNS move if it were up to me. So let's all stop pointing fingers and move on. I just audited the DNS config, there was another small mistake for the secondary nameserver, which pointed at ns2.zope.org rather than ns2.zope.com, it's fixed. As long as mail.zope.org does not go down in the next couple of days, that should not cause any perceivable problems. Let's move on. What in the heck do we want to do about apache? If we want a dedicated environment for _just_ flat files served by apache, and not zope, I might suggest looking at a VPS. I know I can have one set up for about $20 with reasonable specs for running nothing but apache. Heck, I can take that out of pocket, esp if the Zope Foundation is 501(3)c. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Re: [Zope-dev] svn.zope.org down?
Wichert - Use /etc/hosts. Clear local DNS caches if you can. 63.240.213.173 cvs.zope.org It resolves fine from the ten or so machines I can check it on, but that's only 0.1% or so of the internet. If you see something other than hosts which point at 63.240.213.1, please provide details. On 10/12/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: There still appear to be some outstanding dns issues... Chris Wichert Akkerman wrote: > Is something happening with svn.zope.org? I haven't been able to use > anonymous or authorized svn for two days. > > Wichert. > -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12 Oct 2006, at 08:57, Justizin wrote: > Anyway, everything except these hosts need to be removed from the > rotation: > > ns1.zoneedit.com > ns7.zoneedit.com > ns.qutang.net > ns*.zope.com Then I suggest you do that and end the current confusion in regards to which server does what (and which server even has the correct data). (a) I don't control the actual registrar records (b) Yes, these were listed in the zone itself as the NS, but noone should be doing lookups via these servers, because ZoneEdit is not authoritative for the NS records of this zone, the registrar is. I've removed them, but I politely request that you stop being an asshole unless you want to wear this hat yourself. I'm sick, I was stranded in the middle of nowhere when this change took place, and I was rushed. It's all of our fault. Don't make me come over there. > I'd love to see more backups once they have copies of the zone. If > you want to grab a copy of the zone, you'll have to transfer manually > from ns1.zoneedit.com or ns7.zoneedit.com, from one of these IP > addresses: No you don't. Setting a machine up as a slave, in that terrible bind- centric world, will cause it to pull the data automatically. ZoneEdit apparently does not run BIND, or at least does not send NOTIFY requests. I don't know what you want me to do. > Three nameservers is fine for now. Eight would be far better. I still don't understand why we would need that many... but I don't want to discuss this any further. Matter of fact, since zoneedit does not support NOTIFY it is probably a bad thing to even have my server on the list. I suggest you limit the official servers to the ones you mentioned, the zoneedit/qutang/zope.com hosts until NOTIFY is working. jens You don't understand because you're an idiot, Jens, and you've never guaranteed 100% uptime. I was basically shut up by your whining when I tried to explain all of the precautions we should take in order to avoid what happened to zope.org this week. I won't respond to demands that I rush ever again. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
> On 12 Oct 2006, at 08:03, Justizin wrote: > > This is wrong, most of these slaves never coordinated with me to > > receive a copy of the zone. only ns.qutang.net has a copy. > > And this is my fault because ZoneEdit has these hosts listed as NS records. I've removed them until they grab copies of the zone. Root nameservers should not be looking to these NS records afaik, because they are authoritative for NS queries based on their own records. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12 Oct 2006, at 08:03, Justizin wrote: > This is wrong, most of these slaves never coordinated with me to > receive a copy of the zone. only ns.qutang.net has a copy. > > ns*.zope.com have semi-identical copies, but have not transferred the > latest zone from zoneedit afaik. What do you mean "never coordinated with you"? I never even got notified that my server is indeed on the list, and unless this works like "normal" DNS, how to manually get the zone. "normal" is subjective here. Of course, by "normal", you mean BIND-centric. In any case, ZoneEdit does not send NOTIFY requests. I tried to start a thread on this last tuesday or so and received no replies. Time marches on. Anyway, everything except these hosts need to be removed from the rotation: ns1.zoneedit.com ns7.zoneedit.com ns.qutang.net ns*.zope.com I'd love to see more backups once they have copies of the zone. If you want to grab a copy of the zone, you'll have to transfer manually from ns1.zoneedit.com or ns7.zoneedit.com, from one of these IP addresses: 64.34.177.88 69.20.0.180 8.7.96.28 70.84.6.50 63.240.213.250 70.168.181.3 I offered last week to try and set up a NOTIFY mechanism from my own system based on an hourly cronjob, but there was no interest, so I decided not to prioritize it. I'll have to write a couple of scripts for this, so it's not going to happen overnight anyway. Three nameservers is fine for now. Eight would be far better. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] DNS still fishy?
On 10/12/06, Christian Theune <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi, I think DNS is still (or again?) fishy. Currently cvs.zope.org resolves to .171 for me (which should be 173). That's what at least on of the community DNS servers tells me. Other community DNS servers seem not to know anything about zope.org at all. Some protocols: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ $ host svn.zope.org svn.zope.org is an alias for cvs.zope.org. cvs.zope.org has address 63.240.213.171 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ $ dig zope.org ... zope.org. 5739IN NS ns1.zoneedit.com. zope.org. 5739IN NS ns1.dataflake.org. zope.org. 5739IN NS ns7.zoneedit.com. zope.org. 5739IN NS cabana.palladion.com. zope.org. 5739IN NS seconly.rackspace.com. zope.org. 5739IN NS ns.qutang.net. ... This is wrong, most of these slaves never coordinated with me to receive a copy of the zone. only ns.qutang.net has a copy. ns*.zope.com have semi-identical copies, but have not transferred the latest zone from zoneedit afaik. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Fwd: zope.org DNS screwed up
I sent Andrew, Jens, and Chris the ZoneEdit welcome mail. On 10/10/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Andrew Sawyers wrote: > Can we get the access info spread to a larger group please. I believe jens > and myself are good candidates. I'm glad Justin is on it now. :) Sharing access is an important priority. I also listed Chris Withers as he showed an interest. Regards, Martijn -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Fwd: zope.org DNS screwed up
Yes. I'll forward you both the ZFoundation welcome mail. The biggest mistake I made was not asking Rob to double-check a few records before making the switch. I checked that all of our new NS were resolving records, but didn't test them against the correct records. Okay I'm going to peek at the rest of this thread. On 10/10/06, Andrew Sawyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Can we get the access info spread to a larger group please. I believe jens and myself are good candidates. Andrew On 10/10/06 12:00 PM, "Justizin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > whups. > > -- Forwarded message -- > From: Justin Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Oct 10, 2006 10:58 AM > Subject: Re: zope.org DNS screwed up > To: Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: Zope Web > > > Crap. > > I don't know what's up, it seems to be resolving OK, but I concur that > it is not loading. > > I'm checking in ZoneEdit now. Somehow the IP is wrong. > > Sorry, just woke up, worst road trip ever last night. I'm on it. > > On 10/10/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Hi there, >> >> I know you already got some messages in your inbox, but I figure I'd >> summarize it: >> >> * we think zope.org DNS got screwed up somewhere >> >> * please fix it if you can? >> >> Regards, >> >> Martijn >> > > > -- > Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect > ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter > http://www.siggraph.org/ > -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
[ZWeb] Fwd: zope.org DNS screwed up
whups. -- Forwarded message -- From: Justin Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Oct 10, 2006 10:58 AM Subject: Re: zope.org DNS screwed up To: Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: Zope Web Crap. I don't know what's up, it seems to be resolving OK, but I concur that it is not loading. I'm checking in ZoneEdit now. Somehow the IP is wrong. Sorry, just woke up, worst road trip ever last night. I'm on it. On 10/10/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi there, I know you already got some messages in your inbox, but I figure I'd summarize it: * we think zope.org DNS got screwed up somewhere * please fix it if you can? Regards, Martijn -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Re: Grrr. zope.org wikis are evil.
> Again, continuing with my naive thought experiments focussed on this one > issue, a zwiki upgrade, I would be thinking: (a) upgrading zwiki is not > going to break other parts of the site, and it's certainly not going to > require me to debug CMF; and (b) if I'm wrong, I've learned something, I > replace the old zwiki version and consider next steps. I don't know. Does ZWiki have any tendrils in CMF? Has the version of ZWiki used on zope.org been modified in any way to work with the CMF? I don't know. Very good questions. We can always start with a diff -urN of the live zwiki version vs. the latest release, and/or the zwiki version it reports itself as being. I volunteer. :) Oh, BTW, zope.org runs some revision of the Zope 2.6 branch. Does the latest ZWiki work with that? Yesh and why don't we look into moving to a modern version of Zope? A good first step would be to build a checklist of what's holding us back. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Re: Grrr. zope.org wikis are evil.
On 10/9/06, Jim Fulton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Sidnei da Silva wrote: > On Mon, Oct 09, 2006 at 02:00:24PM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote: > | I don't have any mystic power that allows me to understand any Zope > | application. I am also not a CMF developer. > > That's something I never understood. > > It's not only a problem with Jim, but people that can understand the > most obscure issues about memory management or deep C-level hackery, > or insane operating system level APIs or and Linux kernel issues, > sometimes with 5-10 years of Python experience, just state that they > don't have enough knowledge to debug a random application. > > C'mon. There's not any magic going on there. The hardest issues you > will face are Acquisition and Page Templates. Sometimes you have to > just do it. Several times I've found myself in this situation. There's > nothing that can't be understood by stepping through pdb all the way > from BaseRequest to the guts of an application. > > I know it's tedious, and that it might take several tries until you > realize what's exactly going on. But it is doable. There's a > difference between 'I can't do it' and 'I don't want to do it'. Being > in the latter group is fine, but I would say it's highly questionable > for an experienced developer to put himself in the first group without > a reasonable excuse. It's not a question of debugging some isolated problem. It's a question of making a change to a large system that has been fraught with problems. A system that most people who work on zope.org don't want to touch. A system that was abandoned by it's original author. Having said that, I said that I would be willing to work with someone familiar with the zope.org software yo update ZWiki. No one has stepped forward yet. I wonder why. Is there a reason you can't just see what happens when you bring up a copy of zope.org with the latest ZWiki? Is there a list of issues? I face this problem somewhat as well, though I can be blamed for most of siggraph.org, some of it is legacy and it has taken me up to a year to get some products out of the mix which were around before I started. Usually when new versions of upstream code come out, I bring them up in dev.siggraph.org, poke at anything flaky I can think of, and ask people to try it out for a month or so. Any time something is broken until we get this working, it's a sad state of affairs IMO, but it's better than being dead in the water. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] making planet.zope.org be planet.zope.org
On 10/9/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi there, I believe with our recent DNS adjustments we *might* be able to make planet.zope.org in fact *be* planet.zope.org, and not just a redirect to www.zope.org/Planet. Keep in mind the DNS will not stabilize until at least end of week. This reminds me to nag Rob to update the zope.org registrar today. What steps would need to be taken to make this possible? By itself not an interesting task, but it's a good test case if we want to expose other things like, say, wiki.zope.org or trac.zope.org in the future. So, we want to expose http://www.zope.org/Planet as http://planet.zope.org/ ? We can always proxy a rewrite to the existing page, but this will make the navigation a little bit awkward. It's a start, I suppose. BTW, what code is behind the Zope Planet? It looks like it is running in the zope.org site, not as something external like PlanetPlanet. (note that I still don't seem to have any volunteers who *actually* have access to the zope.org apache. This means signing a special ZC agreement that's not the contributor's agreement for entering their hosting environment. All this is temporary as we continue to look for ways to move gradually off that brittle setup) Yeah I'll get with rob on this agreement as well.. Best! Justin -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] serving up static files from www.zope.org
On 10/2/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Chris Withers wrote: > Justizin wrote: >> I will take the next opportunity I have to bring this up with ACM HQ. >> We have about fifty servers in Verizon / NYC, and this might be a good >> way for us to begin contributing to the community at an organizational >> level. :) > > OK, but what happens if you/they get bored of Zope? ACM is smart enough to discuss some eventualities, and the ZF would naturally as well should ACM make an offer. :) I'm working on a proposal which would make services generally available to F/OSS projects. It's going to take some time. The ACM itself isn't using Zope yet, so don't worry about us / them getting bored with it too quickly. Our big project is scheduled to launch in 2011. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] serving up static files from www.zope.org
On 9/29/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Martijn Faassen wrote: > On the medium to long term, I *would* like to pull in other hardware > besides ZC's, by the way. OK, but who apart from ZC is offering hardware of a similar resilience? Possibly the Association for Computing Machinery. ;) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] serving up static files from www.zope.org
On 9/28/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Chris Withers wrote: > Justizin wrote: >> I don't want to take all the cookies, but like I said, I already own a >> bunch of apaches, including siggraph.org and turing.acm.org, as a >> volunteer. > > I'd prefer the stuff we're talking about to live ideally on ZC's > hardware... I don't think Justizin was suggesting we run this stuff off other hardware. Nah, I simply meant that I don't mind being responsible for another Apache installation / configuration. On the medium to long term, I *would* like to pull in other hardware besides ZC's, by the way. Of course that would need to be on the basis of a well-supported machine. Eventually the ZF will want to take over the zope.org hosting, and probably not from within the context of ZC's hosting environment. I will take the next opportunity I have to bring this up with ACM HQ. We have about fifty servers in Verizon / NYC, and this might be a good way for us to begin contributing to the community at an organizational level. :) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] wiki.python.org - Zope
I believe that one or all of CGI, PCGI, and FastCGI have been deprecated in 2.10. On 9/27/06, Michael Haubenwallner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I've just added Zope release information at http://wiki.python.org/moin/Zope Anyone want to update the remaining information to be more current ? Michael -- http://zope.org/Members/d2m http://planetzope.org ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
Thanks to both of you. On 9/27/06, Andrew Sawyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: You didn't cc tres - but I'm sitting next to him, and informed him *we* volunteered cabana if we want it.Tres actually doesn't use cabana as a nameserver - mainly me (unless the other guys have changed how the have their domains setup). A On 9/27/06 3:52 AM, "Chris Withers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Justizin wrote: >> I haven't even got my responder up yet, to be honest. >> >> I'll be moving my domains to zoneedit at the same time as zope.org. >> >> I assume one of these is yours, and one of them jens' ? >> >> cabana.palladion.com 69.44.155.17 > > That'll be Tres (cc'ed in 'cos I don't know if he's on this list) > >> ns1.dataflake.org 8.7.96.28 > > That'll be Jens. > > cheers, > > Chris -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
On 9/27/06, tweeks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Wednesday 27 September 2006 10:37 am, Justizin wrote: > Tom - do you know if Rackspace's nameservers are capable of serving up > a slave copy of a zone which is managed at ZoneEdit.com? We don't do that any longer on our main geo-load balanced ns and ns2 nameservers. We do have a "sec-only" name server that we will slave off a customer's master. But a) it's not tied in with myrackspace/DNS tool (big deal).. and b) it is HA, but it's not geo-HA. That would benefit us, I think. > We'd like to > de-centralize the zope.org zone so that no one individual or > organization such as Zope Corp are responsible for / in control of it. Well I can't help you on the people side... zero to n individuals are always going to be responsible... But yes.. we can hook you guys up with our sec-only name service. Here's a KB article on the topic: Can Rackspace provide secondary DNS and let me control my own master server? https://my.rackspace.com/direct?view_kb_doc&ref_no=050803-0001&submit=view_article (requires a valid MyRS login) As the KB article states... our seconly DNS service - is legacy only offering.. but we do make acceptions. :) What account is this on? Who's the official PoC? Chris is the POC - Chris, you should be able to log in and view the link above. Slave to ns10/12.zoneedit.com -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
I'm taking this offline with Chris. I agree with the concerns about hosting in an individual personal account, although we are doing no better at ZoneEdit right now with JRyan36 or whatever the heck I am called. On 9/27/06, Andrew Sawyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 9/27/06 11:57 AM, "Chris Withers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Justizin wrote: >> Perhaps I am making a wild and sweeping assumption here, but I think >> that Chris is talking about the DNS servers which are controlled by >> software the team I worked on at Rackspace was responsible for, and >> look like ns.rackspace.com. ;) > > Yep, so you're responsible for that crappy ui? > Dotster's wins for ease of use so far... > >> So, I'm actually curious if they have implemented a feature which was >> not high priority when I worked there, and that is the ability to >> configure their nameservers as slaves. > > Don't think so, it's just that I can "host dns" there for stuff that > isn't hosted on their servers. > > I'd hope their nameservers are also pretty robust? > >> Tom - do you know if Rackspace's nameservers are capable of serving up >> a slave copy of a zone which is managed at ZoneEdit.com? > > When I wrote that email, I was actually proposing hosting the masters > there. I don't mind being "DNS boy" for zope.org and I'd hope > rackspace's nameservers would scale to the challenge... This is why I proposed using zoneedit > >> We'd like to >> de-centralize the zope.org zone so that no one individual or >> organization such as Zope Corp are responsible for / in control of it. > > If I ever did stop doing Zope stuff (hahahaha) then I'd happilly hand > the records on to someone else. Easily done at zoneedit (change pasword) and no pain in migrating. Bad idead IMNSHO putting this into a single persons control. > > If I dropped dead (or got taken out by that hitman Jens keeps on > promising), the DNS could similarly be moved elsewhere... > No need to be moved if it's on zoneedit. >> I presume one of our volunteers is a Rackspace customer, and is thus >> offering to host our domain as part of their account. > > That'd be me ;-) > > cheers, > > Chris This solution is already started, lets just put it to bed? Andrew -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
On 9/27/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: > Perhaps I am making a wild and sweeping assumption here, but I think > that Chris is talking about the DNS servers which are controlled by > software the team I worked on at Rackspace was responsible for, and > look like ns.rackspace.com. ;) Yep, so you're responsible for that crappy ui? Dotster's wins for ease of use so far... Not personally, but I will take the hit. ;) Actually, the UI that I worked on was AJAX before AJAX had a name, and was primarily directed toward employees. The tools were all written when the company was very young, and, eh, yeh, they have not been rewritten. Let's simply say that I felt rather strongly that we should have moved to Zope, and we didn't, so I don't work on that PHP anymore. It was an interesting project, however. > So, I'm actually curious if they have implemented a feature which was > not high priority when I worked there, and that is the ability to > configure their nameservers as slaves. Don't think so, it's just that I can "host dns" there for stuff that isn't hosted on their servers. I'd hope their nameservers are also pretty robust? When I left, I believe NS and NS2 were both load balanced clusters of three large machines, which probably sit behind PrevenTier, a patented DoS-aversion system, now. They may also have moved onto geographic load balancing. I wouldn't really know. > Tom - do you know if Rackspace's nameservers are capable of serving up > a slave copy of a zone which is managed at ZoneEdit.com? When I wrote that email, I was actually proposing hosting the masters there. I don't mind being "DNS boy" for zope.org and I'd hope rackspace's nameservers would scale to the challenge... If you want to do that, I don't object to losing Czar status. ;) I am concerned that we can't easily allow a team of people who aren't on your private customer account access to do this. I'm already concerned that with my ZoneEdit account I can't give anyone else access, and was going to propose opening a Zope Foundation account which several people could have access to. That said, concern raised, what do Martijin and others think? We could still slave to Rack's nameservers. > We'd like to > de-centralize the zope.org zone so that no one individual or > organization such as Zope Corp are responsible for / in control of it. If I ever did stop doing Zope stuff (hahahaha) then I'd happilly hand the records on to someone else. But of course, or the foundation would steal them back. :-P If I dropped dead (or got taken out by that hitman Jens keeps on promising), the DNS could similarly be moved elsewhere... > I presume one of our volunteers is a Rackspace customer, and is thus > offering to host our domain as part of their account. That'd be me ;-) cheers, Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] serving up static files from www.zope.org
On 9/27/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi there, The DNS situation is under control, so we should be able to do stuff with .zope.org soon. What it does need is servers that can actually host content, but that's not what I'm going to ask in this mail. What we need as a minimum very soon is a way to serve static files from www.zope.org/foundation. At first I thought there was no apache that could take of that, but then Chris Withers got out the real truth: there is. So, what's needed next to the DNS Czar (Justizin) is a Static Site Czar. What I need from the Static Site Czar is: * someone who has or gains access so they can configure static sites, and give the rest of us minimum access so we can upload pages. * a single point of contact I can just ask to do stuff. Like, we have www.zope.org/foundation, and this is the HTML that should go into it, please make it work. The expectation is that the Static Site Czar will have less work to do in the future, as we probably eventually will move these bits of zope.org to be hosted by a content management system. This just seems to be the most straightforward intermediate solution. So, who is volunteering to be Static Czar? I don't want to take all the cookies, but like I said, I already own a bunch of apaches, including siggraph.org and turing.acm.org, as a volunteer. The latter probably contains a thousand sites and requires very little attention - one more will barely weigh in. Does it have to be Czar? ;d -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
On 9/27/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 27 Sep 2006, at 17:01, Justizin wrote: > Will they slave a zone these days? ;) > > On 9/27/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Jens Vagelpohl wrote: >> > If DNS is a bottleneck I volunteer to host the zope.org zone on my >> > colocated servers (ns1.dataflake.org as primary, ns1.zetwork.com as >> > secondary). The data center they are in (in Richmond/VA) has >> redundant >> > internet connectivity and a sterling uptime record for their >> network. >> >> I can do the same using rackspace's DNS servers... If Chris runs a name server then Rackspace doesn't have any influence on Chris' decision to use it as a slave for someone else... Jens.. heh. Perhaps I am making a wild and sweeping assumption here, but I think that Chris is talking about the DNS servers which are controlled by software the team I worked on at Rackspace was responsible for, and look like ns.rackspace.com. ;) So, I'm actually curious if they have implemented a feature which was not high priority when I worked there, and that is the ability to configure their nameservers as slaves. The inverse was implemented Tom - do you know if Rackspace's nameservers are capable of serving up a slave copy of a zone which is managed at ZoneEdit.com? We'd like to de-centralize the zope.org zone so that no one individual or organization such as Zope Corp are responsible for / in control of it. I presume one of our volunteers is a Rackspace customer, and is thus offering to host our domain as part of their account. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
Will they slave a zone these days? ;) On 9/27/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Jens Vagelpohl wrote: > If DNS is a bottleneck I volunteer to host the zope.org zone on my > colocated servers (ns1.dataflake.org as primary, ns1.zetwork.com as > secondary). The data center they are in (in Richmond/VA) has redundant > internet connectivity and a sterling uptime record for their network. I can do the same using rackspace's DNS servers... cheers, Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
I haven't even got my responder up yet, to be honest. I'll be moving my domains to zoneedit at the same time as zope.org. I assume one of these is yours, and one of them jens' ? cabana.palladion.com 69.44.155.17 ns1.dataflake.org 8.7.96.28 On 9/26/06, Andrew Sawyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: If ya'll think 2's enough and your handling it; no worries. If we want another, I can do it also. Cheers, A On 9/26/06 8:00 PM, "Justizin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Okay. > > ZoneEdit's import is broken, but zope.org zone is imported into their > database. > > Who wants to run a slave? > > On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Justizin wrote: >>> On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> [snip] >>> I'm glad to be the lead, and I'm glad for either of the other guys to >>> be the lead. ;d >> >> You're the only one volunteering for this right now, as far as I can >> see, so if you think you and Jens can get along after this DNS >> initiation rite or whatever you two were having just now, you're now the >> official lead. :) Great, thanks! >> >>> Whoever you decide to nag, I think the three of us can hammer this out. >> >> Excellent. By the way, are you a Zope Foundation member in any way? I'm >> not sure whether it matters at this stage, just checking. >> >>>> * A plan of action worked out between the three of you. I basically need >>>> to know what needs to be done bureaucratically from the side of Zope >>>> Corporation and the Foundation to get this arranged. I'll leave the >>>> actual work to you all - I intend to only be there when stuff needs to >>>> be expedited somehow. >>> >>> Okay. We will need: >>> >>> * A copy of the existing zope.org zone files >>> * Cooperation from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to change the NS record pointers >>> * A list of people who need access in ZoneEdit >> >> I will contact Rob and try to get the ball rolling. I'll pass it back to >> you guys as soon as possible. >> >> Regards, >> >> Martijn >> >> >> > -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
Okay. ZoneEdit's import is broken, but zope.org zone is imported into their database. Who wants to run a slave? On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: > On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [snip] > I'm glad to be the lead, and I'm glad for either of the other guys to > be the lead. ;d You're the only one volunteering for this right now, as far as I can see, so if you think you and Jens can get along after this DNS initiation rite or whatever you two were having just now, you're now the official lead. :) Great, thanks! > Whoever you decide to nag, I think the three of us can hammer this out. Excellent. By the way, are you a Zope Foundation member in any way? I'm not sure whether it matters at this stage, just checking. >> * A plan of action worked out between the three of you. I basically need >> to know what needs to be done bureaucratically from the side of Zope >> Corporation and the Foundation to get this arranged. I'll leave the >> actual work to you all - I intend to only be there when stuff needs to >> be expedited somehow. > > Okay. We will need: > > * A copy of the existing zope.org zone files > * Cooperation from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to change the NS record pointers > * A list of people who need access in ZoneEdit I will contact Rob and try to get the ball rolling. I'll pass it back to you guys as soon as possible. Regards, Martijn -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
> Whoever you decide to nag, I think the three of us can hammer this out. Excellent. By the way, are you a Zope Foundation member in any way? I'm not sure whether it matters at this stage, just checking. Nope. Is there an organizational membership option? ;) >> * A plan of action worked out between the three of you. I basically need >> to know what needs to be done bureaucratically from the side of Zope >> Corporation and the Foundation to get this arranged. I'll leave the >> actual work to you all - I intend to only be there when stuff needs to >> be expedited somehow. > > Okay. We will need: > > * A copy of the existing zope.org zone files > * Cooperation from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to change the NS record pointers > * A list of people who need access in ZoneEdit I will contact Rob and try to get the ball rolling. I'll pass it back to you guys as soon as possible. Mille Grazie. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
I second the motion. On 9/26/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 26 Sep 2006, at 18:17, Lennart Regebro wrote: > I don't understand what you are debating, really. Could you clarify? This is about propagating data from the primary DNS server (which would be that service Andrew suggested) to the databases held on the secondary DNS servers. It is a fully automatic process, under normal circumstances. Except for initial configuration, which we are working on now. ;) There's also the question how many secondary servers we need, or how much DNS serving capacity. Most "normal" domains have one primary and one secondary server. I suggest one primary and two secondaries. I second this motion! -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 26 Sep 2006, at 18:00, Justizin wrote: >> Do you know how DNS works? Slaves don't just ask for a transfer >> willy- >> nilly. Slaves are known to the primary and they get told when to ask. >> > > I'm not sure this is correct. We should investigate before insulting > each other's intelligence. This is exactly how it has correctly worked for me for years working with bind-based nameservers. You can always set up "rogue" secondaries that purport to serve zope.org, which then would have to be allowed to manually pull zone data, but what would be the point of that..? Okay, that's not what I'm suggesting. Whether you run it by hand or not, with BIND, you would use named-xfer, which executes an AXFR request. So, if the master has to know about the slaves to *tell* them to grab the zone, then it knows about them to *allow* an AXFR, no? Why are we arguing this? It's pretty clear at this point that ZoneEdit can handle this need. I wasn't familiar with it off-hand. What I *do* know is that I can't pull an AXFR query of google.com and get the entire Zone, not from my local machine, which is not an approved DNS slave. > It's a sad logical fallacy for you to state that because you have > never seen this problem, it does not exist. I spent nearly three > years as an engineer at one of the world's largest provider of managed > internet services, and I can tell you that NS.RACKSPACE.COM and > NS2.RACKSPACE.COM are hit multiple times a year by 8MB/s or greater > DDoS attack. > > This was in a datacenter with 9GB/s of bandwidth via multiple OC-48 > connections. Sorry, I don't buy your argument. First of all, big companies like Rackspace will always be an attractive target. We're talking about one piddling open source project here. Secondly, you're omitting the need for economy/sanity. Rackspace has a strong economical need to be up 24/7. Yes, you could put 20 secondaries into the zope.org DNS structure, but what is the point? You will never need that capacity in your life. 3 total is plenty. With 20 secondaries you also have 20 cats to herd, meaning 20 people who own and manage those secondaries. (a) ZoneEdit probably has more zones than Rackspace, which is classified in Texas as a Small Business. ZoneEdit is well known enough that a handful of people on this small mailing list know of it. People don't quite always target Rackspace, they often targetted specific Rackspace customers. Someone might target ZoneEdit. (b) None of this matters because three of us offered to host slaves! Why are you arguing against doing something you volunteered to do? And why do you think I am trying to "sell" an argument? I'm telling you - it was my job to run a big DNS infrastructure. Judging by "ns12.zoneedit.com" and "ns10.zoneedit.com" which have been allocated to the zope.org zone I set up, ZoneEdit is running a similar magnitude of infrastructure. On the other side of the coin, btw, if ZoneEdit is small fries in comparison to Rackspace, maybe that's a good reason not to rely on them as the only nameservers for zope.org. If their provider goes out for a few hours, we want zope.org to be available to the world. I think you are exagerrating the extent to which my suggestion makes this complicated. My suggestion: "Since several of us volunteer to donate DNS services to zope.org, let's all provide services, as DNS servers are known, from time to time, for various reasons, to go down." If you disagree with that, then please, by all means, explain why. Otherwise, let go. We're all very smart. Let's make things happen. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
Okay. We will need: * A copy of the existing zope.org zone files * Cooperation from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to change the NS record pointers * A list of people who need access in ZoneEdit I have a fresh ZoneEdit account open with five free zones, and I can directly import an entire BIND Zone, so I suggest this path. It looks quick and easy. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 26 Sep 2006, at 17:48, Justizin wrote: > Well, since I don't know about the suggested provider, here's my > concern - let's say I manage your DNS on my servers, and you want to > provide your own local servers. How do you get a copy of the latest > zone? Your IP must be listed in my server so that it is allowd to > perform AXFR queries. Do you know how DNS works? Slaves don't just ask for a transfer willy- nilly. Slaves are known to the primary and they get told when to ask. I'm not sure this is correct. We should investigate before insulting each other's intelligence. I know a great deal about how DNS works, thank you very much. ;) > They will also probably provide us with 3-4 hosts which we can use for > DNS. If You, me, and one other person each contribute two IP > addresses on different network, that puts the zope.org zone in pretty > good shape, because various caching nameservers will handle the > trouble of determining which authoritative record is best for them to > use. > > DNS may seem like a low-load service, but if you were to run a DNS > provider yourself on a single machine, I challenge you to maintain 90% > uptime. The last time I worked on a large DNS implementation we had > twelve machines in each of two geographic locations - dual xeon > machines with lots of RAM that did nothing but handle round-robin DNS > queries. I have no idea what you are talking about. This is not some huge DNS service that we need. We need to serve exactly one zone. This can be done from a Palm Pilot, to be honest. I have run DNS services for years and years and don't share any of your doubts. Okay, let's please not make this an argument. *we* do not have large-scale DNS needs. However, if we use someone like ZoneEdit.com, their nameservers are highly loaded. So, as I said, if someone decides to launch a DNS attack on ns1.zoneedit.com or whatever, it can affect the availability of zope.org, unless there are alternates, which is what we all propose. It's a sad logical fallacy for you to state that because you have never seen this problem, it does not exist. I spent nearly three years as an engineer at one of the world's largest provider of managed internet services, and I can tell you that NS.RACKSPACE.COM and NS2.RACKSPACE.COM are hit multiple times a year by 8MB/s or greater DDoS attack. This was in a datacenter with 9GB/s of bandwidth via multiple OC-48 connections. It's important. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 26 Sep 2006, at 14:40, Martijn Faassen wrote: > We're currently investigating mechanisms by which we (as the > community) can manage the nameserver for zope.org - a requirement > to bring namespaces.zope.org into being. We're also trying to > figure out what could be listening on the other end. If DNS is a bottleneck I volunteer to host the zope.org zone on my colocated servers (ns1.dataflake.org as primary, ns1.zetwork.com as secondary). The data center they are in (in Richmond/VA) has redundant internet connectivity and a sterling uptime record for their network. We should totally figure out a solution for this. I also have resources available to host DNS. I am a volunteer for the Association for Computing Machinery, and we are beginning to use Zope and Plone pretty significantly. Perhaps we wouldn't mind owning this zone. We currently have no DNS management tool, but I have the source code to an old one laying around I could ressurect, ugly as it may be. One reason I like the idea of the ACM hosting this zone is that we are probably going to stick around, so Zope.org won't be likely to fall by the wayside. Perhaps we could devise a system whereby several organizations provide NS records for zope.org and replicate, either via AXFR or otherwise. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
This has nothing to do with a newbie friendly tool - but a third party to be the primary, so that a single person isn't the 'owner' of this - so those with appropriate access can manage this. I'm sure all of us on the list understand the importance of DNS and it's reliability. Since it's free and been around for years, I thought it was worthy of looking at for the group. Come to think of it, we are actually using http://dnsmadeeasy.com/ for the ACM. It isn't that we can't run a BIND or djbdns server, we are responsible for over fifty machines, but yanno, it's just easier. A provider who focuses on DNS can make sure there is uber redundancy, and can, as mentioned, keep a single point of failure from affecting the zone's future edit-ability. I definitely agree that it should be more difficult to get admin for Zope.org DNS than to get a Zope.org account for publishing content / filing bugs. ;) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Justizin wrote: > So.. > > I was talking to Philipp the other day on IRC, wondering why > >http://namespaces.zope.org/zope > > Doesn't actually exist on on the intarweb. At first I wondered if it > was a requirement, like for a DTD, and P says no, so I believe him. > We did agree that it would be nice if something lived here talking > about ZCML, which is what the w3c does for their namespaces, like: > > http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml > > Of course, I volunteer. First, thank you for volunteering! Right, it's indeed not a requirement, the namespace URL is just a way to get uniqueness, but it'd indeed be nice if something lived there. What I would propose if you write the documents you want to sit on the other end for the various ZCML namespaces, and put them up somewhere for us to review. Once we're happy with them, we'll work on putting them online. Right on. This will probably take some time, and, eh, anyone else who wants to help is more than welcome. Perhaps we should follow whatever process is set out for managing ZF content as ReST. Is there a place where Zope3 documentation is auto-generated via pydoc? I'm sure this doesn't quite cover documenting the ZCML namespace, but maybe it's a good place to start looking at where to pick up and fill in holes? -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Andrew Sawyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Yeah, definitely. And if we go with that tool I volunteer to be > hooked up as a secondary. > > jens > > As do I . Andrew I could slave as well. I believe a single DNS query over UDP can handle around 20-25 entries, depending on their size. Should be no problem for an 'NS' query for zope.org to point at ten or more hosts which run slave. The question is, does this tool allow that? I imagine so. I know that we set up a local slave in the convention center for SIGGRAPH in Boston this year from our cheapo DNS provider. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Re: [Zope] Re: Protocol question about ZopeBook typos
> > Current ZopeBook version is at http://www.plope.com/Books/2_7Edition > > Please check http://www.plope.com/Books/zb_signup for contact information. It'd be ral nice to bring the Zope Book back into one place under the zope.org banner somewhere... Following that, has there been any continued interest / development? It still says the pending version is the Zope 2.7 version. With all of what's out in the wild and around the corner now, it seems like there ought to be work in creating accurate documentation for as much of Zope 2.7 - 3.3 as possible. Some people will be tied to these older versions of Zope for a while, whether we like it or not, and may be low on midichlorians[0]. And as much as I enjoy Philipp's book, it would be nice if there were some effort at providing straight up z3 documentation, perhaps with less pizzazz. ;) [0] i.e. don't like hearing "UTSL" vs. "RTFM" ;) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Andrew Sawyers wrote: >> Yeah, definitely. And if we go with that tool I volunteer to be >> hooked up as a secondary. > As do I . All this DNS volunteering is great! Unfortunately, I'm a bit at a loss on how to proceed, as I'm not very familiar with DNS issues. So, what I need: * a single contact person for DNS issues that I can contact whenever something DNS related is needed, can advise me on these issues should I have questions, and who will arrange DNS matters among the three of you. I propose it's one of you three (Justizin, Jens, Andrew). Anyone volunteering for that? I'm glad to be the lead, and I'm glad for either of the other guys to be the lead. ;d Whoever you decide to nag, I think the three of us can hammer this out. * A plan of action worked out between the three of you. I basically need to know what needs to be done bureaucratically from the side of Zope Corporation and the Foundation to get this arranged. I'll leave the actual work to you all - I intend to only be there when stuff needs to be expedited somehow. Okay. We will need: * A copy of the existing zope.org zone files * Cooperation from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to change the NS record pointers * A list of people who need access in ZoneEdit -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: Zope.org DNS ( was Re: [ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope )
On 9/26/06, Jens Vagelpohl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 > I believe a single DNS query over UDP can handle around 20-25 entries, > depending on their size. > > Should be no problem for an 'NS' query for zope.org to point at ten or > more hosts which run slave. > > The question is, does this tool allow that? I imagine so. I know > that we set up a local slave in the convention center for SIGGRAPH in > Boston this year from our cheapo DNS provider. I'm not sure what you're trying to explain or ask here. Do you think there would be any problem in propagating updates? Well, there won't. And I don't see any need for more than 3 DNS servers (including the master). DNS is not resource-intensive in any way. Well, since I don't know about the suggested provider, here's my concern - let's say I manage your DNS on my servers, and you want to provide your own local servers. How do you get a copy of the latest zone? Your IP must be listed in my server so that it is allowd to perform AXFR queries. All I'm saying is, I assume, hopefully, that this provider will allow us to specify hosts which are allowed to perform AXFR. They will also probably provide us with 3-4 hosts which we can use for DNS. If You, me, and one other person each contribute two IP addresses on different network, that puts the zope.org zone in pretty good shape, because various caching nameservers will handle the trouble of determining which authoritative record is best for them to use. DNS may seem like a low-load service, but if you were to run a DNS provider yourself on a single machine, I challenge you to maintain 90% uptime. The last time I worked on a large DNS implementation we had twelve machines in each of two geographic locations - dual xeon machines with lots of RAM that did nothing but handle round-robin DNS queries. IIRC, we had about 100,000 zones, but still, let's think about this for a moment. Imagine: * I have www.stupidwebsiteforjerks.com * Someone hates my stupid website, because it's for jerks * My DNS records are in the same server as yours * Someone decides to launch an 8MB/s or so DDoS against my NS records and my webserver IP. * Your site starts failing to load for 30-60% of visitors after a few hours. ;) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
[ZWeb] http://namespaces.zope.org/zope
So.. I was talking to Philipp the other day on IRC, wondering why http://namespaces.zope.org/zope Doesn't actually exist on on the intarweb. At first I wondered if it was a requirement, like for a DTD, and P says no, so I believe him. We did agree that it would be nice if something lived here talking about ZCML, which is what the w3c does for their namespaces, like: http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml Of course, I volunteer. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Apache, anyone?
On 9/25/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Lennart Regebro wrote: > Personally, I don't care where www.zope.org is currently located, and > I also think we should replace it part by part with microsites, like > wiki.zope.org, bugs.zope.org, news.zope.org, products.zope.org and so > on, Be careful the multiple domain names, it prevents sensible cookie-based auth. For that reason alone, I'd prefer to see zope.org/wiki, zope.org/bugs, zope.org/news, etc instead. Isn't it possible to set a cookie for ".zope.org" vs, say, "www.zope.org" ? I'm pretty sure I know some people doing this at: http://linklink.timesys.com + http://builder.timesys.com and also: http://www.fsf.org/ + http://wiki.fsf.org/ It really feels like we need a foundation-admin'ed Apache in front of everything somewhere, just to handle rewriting/static content/etc. Is that a possiblity? I own a lot of Apaches already, I would not mind. -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] volunteer for transforming ReST + templates into HTML
> > I think there is already python code for doing this: > > http://www.zope.org/Members/k_vertigo/Products/CMFDeployment Thanks. This is assuming the data is already in Zope and specifically a CMF site, though. I'm trying to avoid the whole technology equation for the time being. I don't know how long I can keep this up. :) Sorry for being out of the loop, as I just joined the list yesterday. Could you elaborate on what content you're talking about? Would it be easier to write custom code outside of Zope to do this work than to import some ReST content into a CMF site of sorts, i.e. Zope.org? ;) -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." - Niels Bohr Am I helpful? http://rate.affero.net/justizin ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] volunteer for transforming ReST + templates into HTML
On 9/18/06, Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi there, I started doing some work on transforming the restructured text content + templates into HTML pages, but I didn't get very far, and I figured instead I ask a volunteer. So, the task: Write code (such as a Python script) that takes the restructured text files (that I will send you) and wraps the layout (that I will also send you) around it, making the menus and such work. The result should be a bunch of HTML pages that can be served by Apache. If you're interested, drop me a mail. I think there is already python code for doing this: http://www.zope.org/Members/k_vertigo/Products/CMFDeployment -- Justizin, Independent Interactivity Architect ACM SIGGRAPH SysMgr, Reporter http://www.siggraph.org/ "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." - Niels Bohr Am I helpful? http://rate.affero.net/justizin ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
