Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Zefram
Ed Murphy wrote: iii. Every player has the right to submit a proposal and have it voted on in a timely fashion. ... and have it adopted if popular? Not sure how to phrase the condition, but we definitely need such a clause. iv. Every person has the right to invoke a

DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Kerim Aydin
Murphy wrote: iv. Every person has the right to invoke a judgement, appeal a judgement, appeal a sentencing or judicial order binding em, and receive judgement in a timely fashion. Looks good, for clarity, I'd suggest the receive clause right after invoke clause,

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Zefram
Ed Murphy wrote: Should be covered by the receive judgement clause. If you apply that to the appeal clause, that implies that a single appeal will have to result in an appeal judgement (where currently three are required). Also, possibly, that an appeal judgement can be appealed. -zefram

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Zefram
Kerim Aydin wrote: There's been a healthy history of proposal-killing/delaying procedures that we should keep that this would stop (e.g. vetoes, making undistributable, distribution costs in general). I think it's been unhealthy in places. Short delays (such as the Speaker's Veto in

DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Kerim Aydin
Zefram wrote: I think it's been unhealthy in places. Short delays (such as the Speaker's Veto in practice achieves) seem fine, but not the indefinite delays and dropping of proposals that resulted from P-Notes and artificially restricted distribution. Well, during the Papyri version of

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Zefram
Kerim Aydin wrote: I personally think we should be more restrictive about free proposing, people (in general) have gotten out of the habit of proto-ing. I don't see the connection here. Finally, the clause right to have it voted on is troubling. Is it voted on if a veto or guillotine ends the

DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Kerim Aydin
Zefram wrote: I personally think we should be more restrictive about free proposing, people (in general) have gotten out of the habit of proto-ing. I don't see the connection here. If it costs something tangible to get a proposal distributed, you don't pay that cost for a first draft. At

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Ed Murphy
Zefram wrote: Kerim Aydin wrote: If it costs something tangible to get a proposal distributed, Proposal distribution is not a scarce resource. I'm opposed to creating artificial scarcity here. Your support concept wouldn't offend in that way, but it sounds like quite a lot of extra work

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On May 7, 2007, at 4:45 PM, Ed Murphy wrote: Zefram wrote: Kerim Aydin wrote: If it costs something tangible to get a proposal distributed, Proposal distribution is not a scarce resource. I'm opposed to creating artificial scarcity here. Your support concept wouldn't offend in that

Re: DIS: Proto: Agora shall make no law...

2007-05-07 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/7/07, Zefram [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Never used within the range of the current mailing list archives (back to 2002-11-03). On 2002-11-26 you proposed its repeal, on the basis that it hadn't been used in recent memory. It was eventually repealed on 2005-05-15. On 18 July 2001, Murphy