Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-30 Thread Toerless Eckert
On Tue, Aug 30, 2022 at 06:26:41PM -0400, Michael Richardson wrote: > bc> Right. So I'm not yet convinced we should repurpose the session ID for > bc> this. If we're going to focus on signing objectives, maybe we need to > bc> decouple this aspect completely from the session ID? > > I

Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-30 Thread Michael Richardson
Brian E Carpenter wrote: tte> So, the question is what attack vector we would open up if we used tte> sequential session-ids. Given how the signature protects the tte> message, i will claim there is no new attack vector as long as the tte> signature is checked. But if GRASP forw

Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-30 Thread Michael Richardson
I think Toerless wrote: >> I don't really know what "all epoch" mechanisms would mean. Ideally we >> would look for the most easily adopted replay protection mechanism >> that had in some othr protocol passed IETF SEC standards >> approval. Whether its called epoch or not. Brian E

Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-29 Thread Brian E Carpenter
On 30-Aug-22 00:13, Toerless Eckert wrote: On Sat, Aug 27, 2022 at 09:41:20AM +1200, Brian E Carpenter wrote: The way i see it, whenever i hae to send another periodical instance of my own M_FLOOD(s), then i would use a new session-id, and that would perfectly be valid as a Epoch-ID... except th

Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-29 Thread Toerless Eckert
On Sat, Aug 27, 2022 at 09:41:20AM +1200, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > > The way i see it, whenever i hae to send another periodical instance of my > > own > > M_FLOOD(s), then i would use a new session-id, and that would perfectly be > > valid > > as a Epoch-ID... except that if i randomnly assign

Re: [Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-26 Thread Brian E Carpenter
On 26-Aug-22 21:26, Toerless Eckert wrote: On Thu, Aug 25, 2022 at 11:55:13AM -0400, Michael Richardson wrote: Ah. A trusted third party would rain Epoch IDs down on all nodes, both transmitters and receivers. They could use signed M_FLOODs.yes, that creates a circular problem, but the Epo

[Anima] session-id as epoch-id (was: Re: Signing GRASP objectives [Was: Extending GRASP messages and signing GRASP multicasts])

2022-08-26 Thread Toerless Eckert
On Thu, Aug 25, 2022 at 11:55:13AM -0400, Michael Richardson wrote: > Ah. > A trusted third party would rain Epoch IDs down on all nodes, both > transmitters and > receivers. They could use signed M_FLOODs.yes, that creates a circular > problem, but the EpochIDs could be arranged to be a hash