In the POSIX shell standard, why are redirections mixed in with variable assignments and positional parameters?

2016-08-12 Thread Mark Galeck
Hello, the formal POSIX shell grammar for yacc symbol "simple_command" accepts commands which can be loosely summarized as: three parts, each optional, in order: variable assignments and redirections mixed togethercommand namecommand arguments and  redirections mixed together It seems to me, the

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001008]: 1. clarify iconv(3) reset usage; 2. truly support Unicode character input

2016-08-12 Thread Steffen Nurpmeso
|http://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=1008 | (0003335) geoffclare (manager) - 2016-08-11 15:23 | http://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=1008#c3335 |-- |http://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=1008#c3326 was edited during

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Vincent Lefevre
On 2016-08-12 13:16:09 +1000, Bruce Evans wrote: > On Thu, 11 Aug 2016, Austin Group Bug Tracker wrote: > > -- > > (0003344) Vincent Lefevre (reporter) - 2016-08-11 20:41 > > http://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=1066#c3344 > > --

Re: In the POSIX shell standard, why are redirections mixed in with variable assignments and positional parameters?

2016-08-12 Thread Geoff Clare
Mark Galeck wrote, on 12 Aug 2016: > > the formal POSIX shell grammar for yacc symbol "simple_command" accepts > commands which can be loosely summarized as: > three parts, each optional, in order: > variable assignments and redirections mixed together > command name > command arguments and redir

Re: In the POSIX shell standard, why are redirections mixed in with variable assignments and positional parameters?

2016-08-12 Thread Mark Galeck
Thank you!  Robert Elz also already explained the whole thing. In fact, I myself decided it would be better to put output redirections first -  the reason being, that is what happens at the system level, even before the command is execve'd, even before that the output file(s) are opened for writi

Event [Austin Group teleconference +1-888-426-6840 PIN: 2115756] 2016-08-18 at 11:00 America/New_York created

2016-08-12 Thread Single UNIX Specification
BEGIN:VCALENDAR VERSION:2.0 PRODID:-//opengroup.org//NONSGML kigkonsult.se iCalcreator 2.18// CALSCALE:GREGORIAN METHOD:REQUEST BEGIN:VTIMEZONE TZID:America/New_York X-LIC-LOCATION:America/New_York BEGIN:STANDARD DTSTART:20161106T02 TZOFFSETFROM:-0400 TZOFFSETTO:-0500 TZNAME:EST END:STANDARD BE

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Bruce Evans wrote: > The behaviour is undefined if the year is < 1970 or the value [of a > time_t] is negative. Thus there are no POSIX applications that > deal with dates before 25 Nov 1932, and breaking the non-POSIX ones > that do is not a problem for POSIX. This is a missinterpretation, not

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Vincent Lefevre wrote: > Note that we were talking about binary compatibility, not just > POSIX conformance. The behavior is undefined *by POSIX*. But an > implementation may define the behavior with negative time_t. In > such a case, the binary compatibility would be broken by a change > of beha

Minutes of the 11th August 2016 Teleconferencea

2016-08-12 Thread Andrew Josey
All These are the minutes from this weeks call. I have also posted the previous 2 weeks minutes to the document register The next call is next week regards Andrew Minutes of the 11th August 2016 Teleconference Austin-776 Page 1 of 1 Submitted by Andrew Josey, The Open Group. 12

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Geoff Clare
Joerg Schilling wrote, on 12 Aug 2016: > > Bruce Evans wrote: > > > The behaviour is undefined if the year is < 1970 or the value [of a > > time_t] is negative. Thus there are no POSIX applications that > > deal with dates before 25 Nov 1932, and breaking the non-POSIX ones > > that do is not a

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Geoff Clare
Joerg Schilling wrote, on 12 Aug 2016: > > Geoff Clare wrote: > > > > This is a missinterpretation, note that POSIX requires that Jan 1 1970 > > > 00:00 > > > work in any timenoze of the world. > > > > > > As a result, negative time_t vaules are required. > > > > Please point to the parts of t

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Geoff Clare wrote: > > This is a missinterpretation, note that POSIX requires that Jan 1 1970 00:00 > > work in any timenoze of the world. > > > > As a result, negative time_t vaules are required. > > Please point to the parts of the standard that you believe require this. > If there really are

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Geoff Clare wrote: > > There is e.g. some text in the standard for sccs related programs. > > There is no requirement that the SCCS utilities are implemented in C, > and if they are implemented in C there is no requirement that they > use the time_t type internally. SCCS is implemented in C sinc

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Shware Systems
As epoch is defined relative to UTC/GMT, he has a partial point that Jan 1, 1970 00:00 on the International Date Line would need negative 12*3600 seconds to represent it as the "actual time of day" of XBD 4.15, if midnight GMT assigned as (time_t) 0. To keep all values positive would mean midni

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Shware Systems wrote: > > As epoch is defined relative to UTC/GMT, he has a partial point that Jan 1, > 1970 00:00 on the International Date Line would need negative 12*3600 seconds > to represent it as the "actual time of day" of XBD 4.15, if midnight GMT > assigned as (time_t) 0. To keep all

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Joerg Schilling
Joerg Schilling wrote: > Shware Systems wrote: > > > > > As epoch is defined relative to UTC/GMT, he has a partial point that Jan 1, > > 1970 00:00 on the International Date Line would need negative 12*3600 > > seconds to represent it as the "actual time of day" of XBD 4.15, if > > midnight G

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0001066]: Solution proposal to the 2038 problem.

2016-08-12 Thread Geoff Clare
Joerg Schilling wrote, on 12 Aug 2016: > > Geoff Clare wrote: > > > > There is e.g. some text in the standard for sccs related programs. > > > > There is no requirement that the SCCS utilities are implemented in C, > > and if they are implemented in C there is no requirement that they > > use th